Coffee |OT| Taste as good as it smells
- Thread starter NewFresh
- Start date
I just picked up at Bonavita 1900TS for my office. It is definitely the best drip coffee maker that I have ever used and I am looking for some suggestions on tasty coffees for myself and my office mates.
Lately I have been trying out Peete's ground coffee's (pre-ground stuff is just so much easier for an office space) and am liking Cafe Luminosa a lot. We tend to stick to and like the light and medium roast stuff (most Starbuck's is roasted too long) so any suggestions would be much appreciated.
Lately I have been trying out Peete's ground coffee's (pre-ground stuff is just so much easier for an office space) and am liking Cafe Luminosa a lot. We tend to stick to and like the light and medium roast stuff (most Starbuck's is roasted too long) so any suggestions would be much appreciated.
Union Carbine
Member
If you can go local, they can grind the beans right there for you. Not all online roasters will grind for you, though a fair number will. As for suggestions, I've been big lately on George Howell's offerings. Everything I've had has been good.
whatsinaname
Member
Was using the Aeropress for a couple of years. Worked well but my parents appropriated it when I was visiting with them. Wanted to try something new so I bought the Gaggia Classic. Still struggling to find the correct grind/tamp combination but will hopefully get the hang of it soon.
(Or maybe I should just use the pressurised portafilter configuration. :/)
(Or maybe I should just use the pressurised portafilter configuration. :/)
Union Carbine
Member
Congrats! Espresso is a whole different world than drip.
Stay away from the pressurized portafilter-- it won't help you get better at making espresso. The "crema" it creates isn't real so it can only fool you into thinking you've got things dialed in when you don't. It's worth it to learn how to use the standard portafilter.
Also, the grind is super important with espresso so make sure you get a decent burr grinder if you don't have one already. If you can't get a consistent, repeatable grind, you'll never get a consistent, repeatable shot. It will drive you mad.
whatsinaname
Member
Yeah, that was just me being a little pessimistic. I'll figure it out.
I only have a Hario Skeleton grinder for now. A little bit inconsistent but at least a burr grinder. A better grinder is on my list, but a couple of months out I think.
Union Carbine
Member
I don't think the Skerton is going to cut it. It's effectively stepped and the steps might be too big to find the right setting for your machine. I've got one and I'm pretty sure I tried it for espresso and I couldn't make it work. Though you may very well be able to get close enough and tweak other variables from there-- coffee amount, tamp pressure. Oh that reminds me: weigh your beans. Buy a scale if you need to.
Back to grinding, if you can swing it, something like Orphan Espresso's Lido 2 is much better suited to espresso.
whatsinaname
Member
I've been using a mod similar to this.
http://www.home-barista.com/grinders/kyocera-cm-50-hario-skerton-stepless-precision-mod-t21905.html
Because I didn't need to vary my grind size once set, it worked reasonably well with my old setup. Am hoping I can find a setting that will hold me over for a couple of months.
TarpitCarnivore
Member
Skerton is not going to cut it regardless of mods.
Union Carbine
Member
Yeah. I've got the modded Skerton. The wobble hurts (and the mod works fine to mitigate it) but the killer is the lack of usable steps in the espresso range. There's a good chance that there isn't a step that is close enough to work with and get decent results.
whatsinaname
Member
After trying a few more shots this evening, it is looking this way.
The mod I posted is a stepless mod actually. But the unevenness is the problem I think. Got it down to a 20s shot. Still a little sour.
Will the baratza encore work at all? Anything more expensive will have to wait a bit.
Union Carbine
Member
Ah, didn't follow the link because I didn't know there was another mod beyond the stabilization. Even stepless, it's not a great burr set.
How are you counting your shot times, from the start, from first drops? Sour is a symptom of under-extraction so I'd say your shot is too fast, not too slow. I usually aim for a 25 - 30 second total shot time with the first drops at about seven seconds. Of course taste is the final arbiter.
The Baratzas are very popular but I'm not sure about the Encore and espresso-- what do they say on home-barista?
Yeah consistency is key, when you get good you can almost recognize a good grind on how the particles stick together. If you have a bathroom scale you can use this to measure how hard you have to tamp. 12-15kg i would think is good.
You don't have to stick super hard to the "rules" on the run time, 18-24 second(from first drip) can all be ok, it all depends on the coffee/roast/age/batch and what taste you like the best.
One thing most espresso machines gets wrong is water temprature. A method you can try is to run the machine before making your cup, let 1-2sec water go into the tray, letting cold water into the boiler(cooling it), make sure you stop before the boiler starts up again(otherwise start over) . Mount the portafilter start your coffee during the process the boiler should turn on to keep the new water warm. This can have a big impact on the taste.
It will work, but most likely you will have to take it apart and adjust it.
Here is a video with two lovely older ladies doing it. (adjusting the grinder)
https://youtube.com/watch?v=P_MTpN3gYqw
whatsinaname
Member
I am going by general internet forum advice at this point. I am aiming for 25s from first drops to give me a baseline of what to expect.
I thought the grind size and tamp force are both variables here? If there is a recommended tamp force, does that means the only real controllable variable is supposed to be the grind size?
Hmm, I could try this. Refurbished Encores are $100 or so, should be doable soon.
Pops Maellard
Member
How do you feel about it so far? My barista girlfriend is more obsessed with coffee than I am and really wants espresso machine, but I've been having a hard time finding something good but not $1,000+.
Only vary the tamp if you have trouble timing the grind. I would keep tamp as a constant to make the rest easier.
Union Carbine
Member
There's a pretty huge jump in quality from the sub-$1k machines to the $1k+ machines. That said, the most important piece of equipment is actually the grinder.
Not that you can't get good things out of a Sylvia or similar machine but it can be a lot of work and you end up learning more about how to wrestle with that particular machine than how to generally make good espresso. Some people don't mind that and, once they've fought the wars and emerged victorious, it works for them but it can be a tough slog that is totally negated once you move to a better machine.
TarpitCarnivore
Member
The Rancilio, from what I've read/been told, is rather outdated at this point. Them or the Gaggia Classic still seem to be the go-to if you can find them used. Crossland CC1 are slightly cheaper than the Silva and have better internals, but I've been told quality control is hit or miss.
Scouring craigslist is your best bet really. I found a barely used Breville for $300 ($800 retail) in my area. I didn't buy it, but I'm hoping when time comes I can find a better deal on something.
Union Carbine
Member
I just don't trust the Brevilles-- they look cheap to me and, while they have a lot of bells and whistles, I'd be concerned that the internals are up to snuff. I haven't read any reviews on them, this is just me talking from seeing them on shelves, so it's by far not an informed opinion.
Pops Maellard
Member
Fair point, will definitely consider doing so.
Haven't seen that Crossland machine before, looks good and has PID control.. would consider this for myself.
But cant see it for sale anywhere in Europe or am i just blind :-( also if i had to import it then there would be no spare parts to get or anyone to service it if anything major went wrong with it.
Union Carbine
Member
Got a Mistobox gift subscription for Xmas but somehow got the first two shipments all at once:
I guess I've got some coffee to get through...
I've been reading thro this thread for awhile now and finally made the jump to a french press. It's definitely better tasting than a drip machine. I'm still learning and tweaking the process but it's been really fun. Looking to buy an aeropress to keep at work now. I used to be a lots of sugar lots of creamer guy my SO got me to ditch it and drink it black and coffee gaf has led me to superior brew methods so big thank you to coffee gaf!
Union Carbine
Member
Sweet! Not all drip machines are bad but the good ones can be a bit expensive, particularly compared with the mas market versions. Some are, in fact, quite good.
Tried out the La Colombe from the sampler:
Tastes pretty good with milk but, man, is it roasted dark. It's probably too dark for my tastes, particularly if I was going to make brewed coffee.
Union Carbine
Member
I'm not very good... I feel like I've plateaued and I'm not sure, barring taking a class, what to do to get over the hump.
Made an iced coffee with the Panther (Clever + half water, other half in ice in the cup, brew into ice) and it was really nice. I'm a big fan right now of the fruity notes in my brewed coffee. It makes it easy for me to forgo adding any milk.
Rudimental
Member
I'm busy drinking coffee with egg yolk in it.
It's... interesting. The taste is fine, but that eggy smell.
It's... interesting. The taste is fine, but that eggy smell.
whatsinaname
Member
Yeah, I think I will definitely need a grinder to get anything decent out of the Gaggia Classic.
(I even tried the prpressurised portafilter out of desperation).
I got a quarter pound ground at the shop I get my coffee at and got something good out of my first attempt.
Looking at a used Baratza Preciso for $200.
The machine is good. But as you may have seen in my posts on this page, it is definitely not as forgiving as an Aeropress.
(I even tried the prpressurised portafilter out of desperation).
I got a quarter pound ground at the shop I get my coffee at and got something good out of my first attempt.
Looking at a used Baratza Preciso for $200.
The machine is good. But as you may have seen in my posts on this page, it is definitely not as forgiving as an Aeropress.
longdi
Banned
I noted my place has imported Folger roast, and thanks to the incest ad I saw here, bought a small tub home.
Tried with cold and hot brew using aeropress. Both outcome tasted like bad shit, there is some really weird chemical aftertaste that lingers on the back my tongue for the whole day. Easily worse than instant granules coffee. Threw the whole tub away after that. My theory is because it is stored in a plastic tub, the coffee absorbed the cheimcal over time?
I don't understand how it got raving reviews across the Internet? >4.5/5 afaics...am i doing it wrong pro-coffee GAF?
Tried with cold and hot brew using aeropress. Both outcome tasted like bad shit, there is some really weird chemical aftertaste that lingers on the back my tongue for the whole day. Easily worse than instant granules coffee. Threw the whole tub away after that. My theory is because it is stored in a plastic tub, the coffee absorbed the cheimcal over time?
I don't understand how it got raving reviews across the Internet? >4.5/5 afaics...am i doing it wrong pro-coffee GAF?
Union Carbine
Member
Espresso is very different from other brew modes in regards to grinding. There isn't one setting that's going to work for every bean and every machine. Beans require different grinds. Different machines will require different grinds. You won't be able to grind beans in a shop and have it work for you. Likewise you won't be able to lock in a single grinder setting and have it work. That's why it's important to have either a stepless grinder or one with many steps in the espresso range. And this is just the shallow end of the very deep rabbit hole that is grinding.
Dialing in for espresso isn't a one time thing, it's a near constant. It's definitely the least forgiving of any brew method-- a slight shift in the grind, pull time, temperature, coffee amount, etc. can have a significant effect on the output.
So I wanna take the step in to the coffee world, but I have no idea where to start.
Kettle coffee and Tassimo just does NOT cut it.
I only have a small budget for now (£100) maybe could stretch a little bit more.
I was looking at something like:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00PY6NGZQ/
Are these types of machine any good?
Kettle coffee and Tassimo just does NOT cut it.
I only have a small budget for now (£100) maybe could stretch a little bit more.
I was looking at something like:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00PY6NGZQ/
Are these types of machine any good?
Union Carbine
Member
No, they're not. Are you set on espresso or are you open to drip/pourover? It's easy and fairly inexpensive to set up a manual pourover rig.
Personally would want an espresso machine, if that comes with milk frother even better. Was then going to buy a grinder seperate.
SlaughterX
Banned
I bought a cappichino machine from TJ Maxx for $40... One of the best investments I've ever made. No more $5 cups,and they don't seem to fuck with my stomach as much as store bought coffees. I got some red velvet cupcake coffee when I bought it that I haven't been able to find again in store since but it was awesome. I was a bit overwhelmed when I first read the instructions on how to make the Damn things because there are so many steps but it actually not very hard.
InfiniteBento
Member
Panther coffee is great ! They are located in Miami. I went there once on a trip with friends. I'm so jealous ;____;
update in my coffee world:
I've been in charge of the coffee at the new restaurant I'm now a pastry cook at. I altered a lot of their procedures and have been whipping out latte art for the guests. It's been a really solid hit considering guests have been seen photographing my drinks and compliment it all the time. I'm hoping to up the quality in the restaurant and make it so they not only have impeccable service and food but their coffee will also stand out. Most restaurants have shit coffee so I want this place to really shine in the Fulton Market.
WonkyPanda
Member
Just got a Chemex pour over. Been working on perfecting the art and experimenting with different things (to stir or not to stir?).
However, I have an issue where the grinds will stick to the side of the filter once the water starts draining. Am I adding too much water? I feel like this will, overall, get a less efficient extraction from those grinds that end up sticking to the sides.
However, I have an issue where the grinds will stick to the side of the filter once the water starts draining. Am I adding too much water? I feel like this will, overall, get a less efficient extraction from those grinds that end up sticking to the sides.
InfiniteBento
Member
You want a funnel'd bed of grounds so them sticking to the side isn't necessarily a bad thing. If you can post a picture, I can better tell you how your pour is altering your brew.
Also with stirring, are you talking after you remove the filter? If so, stir it. At Intelligentsia, we experimented with not stirring vs stirring. It makes a big difference. You want to stir your coffee after brewing it because the initial extraction from the first moment you pour is more saturated than when you finish your brew. The heaviest solids in your coffee will be at the bottom, where as the lightest will be at the top. Stirring with mix the two layers and distribute them evenly creating a more overall balanced cup
WonkyPanda
Member
You want a funnel'd bed of grounds so them sticking to the side isn't necessarily a bad thing. If you can post a picture, I can better tell you how your pour is altering your brew.
Also with stirring, are you talking after you remove the filter? If so, stir it. At Intelligentsia, we experimented with not stirring vs stirring. It makes a big difference. You want to stir your coffee after brewing it because the initial extraction from the first moment you pour is more saturated than when you finish your brew. The heaviest solids in your coffee will be at the bottom, where as the lightest will be at the top. Stirring with mix the two layers and distribute them evenly creating a more overall balanced cup
It seems that some people like to stir the grounds after you've bloomed the coffee before you add the water. Some people also like to stir the coffee after the final pour of water, and others do both of the aforementioned.
I'll get a photo next time I brew a cup. Funny enough, I was brewing with Intelligentsia's Yirgacheffe (great roast). Barista recommended it last time I dropped in.
TarpitCarnivore
Member
Depends on how much is sticking. You can always circle back around above them to re-add them to the bed but then you run the risk of up-ending the bed and letting more fines settle to the bottom.
Union Carbine
Member
Unfortunately, espresso is expensive. The lowest end machines that are worth considering are all $500+ and it definitely requires a grinder ($200+). There's a big jump in quality in the machine once you go $1k and above. Brands to check out: Lelit, Breville, Rancilio, Baratza for the grinder.
WonkyPanda
Member
Yeah, have a Jura Z9 and freaking love it. Not cheap by any means.
whatsinaname
Member
My grinder finally arrives tomorrow, hope it does the job.
Have been using the pressurised portafilter as a stop-gap for the last few days.
Have been using the pressurised portafilter as a stop-gap for the last few days.
MixedBeverage
Member
Oh look, a coffee thread. Gaf has everything.
I usually use a chemex, but I've been really sick and tired lately of all the screwing around before work in the morning. And just doing things in the morning. There's been so much talk lately about these SCAA certified coffee makers that I picked up one of these. It has a brew timer and pretty good all around reviews. Also, hooray Bed Bath & Beyond 20% off coupon:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00YEYKK8U/?tag=neogaf0e-20
I've only used it twice, just with some Trader Joe's beans, and I was pretty impressed with the coffee! Highly recommended so far. Going to try some local freshly roasted beans this weekend. Let me say that waking up to a full pot of hot coffee was pure bliss. BLISS.
I usually use a chemex, but I've been really sick and tired lately of all the screwing around before work in the morning. And just doing things in the morning. There's been so much talk lately about these SCAA certified coffee makers that I picked up one of these. It has a brew timer and pretty good all around reviews. Also, hooray Bed Bath & Beyond 20% off coupon:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00YEYKK8U/?tag=neogaf0e-20
I've only used it twice, just with some Trader Joe's beans, and I was pretty impressed with the coffee! Highly recommended so far. Going to try some local freshly roasted beans this weekend. Let me say that waking up to a full pot of hot coffee was pure bliss. BLISS.
whatsinaname
Member
My Baratza Preciso arrived today. I can finally make a tolerable double shot!
A possibly silly question about blends for espresso. I've mainly been using single origins. How does grinding at home work when you are grinding blends? Wouldn't there possibly be a large variation from cup to cup?
A possibly silly question about blends for espresso. I've mainly been using single origins. How does grinding at home work when you are grinding blends? Wouldn't there possibly be a large variation from cup to cup?
Union Carbine
Member
Congrats!
Nope. You should be good to go once you've dialed it in.
whatsinaname
Member
Union, another question about grinding. Do you ever have to drastically change grind size for espresso when you try a different bean (but keep dose/tamping/temperature etc constant)?
Union Carbine
Member
Yeah, it happens sometimes.
I had always thought it was a just random chance but I read somewhere that it could indicate that there's something off in that particular roast batch if you have a bunch of coffees that all brew well ground within a sweet spot range and then a coffee comes along that becomes a massive outlier.
That said, it can happen (and its probably not always that coffee's "fault") so don't sweat it and just roll with it.