Cosplayer being labeled ‘Racist’ for her blackface Michonne From ‘The Walking Dead'

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I can't see this as being racist.

She did this to cosplay a character with no racist intention in mind. The excuse that "some things you just don't do" doesn't really apply here.

My opinion of course.
 
Gustav said:
As far as I can tell she's German. She probably had no concept of Blackface.
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Yeah, I am from Germany, and I would not have thought that there is anything wrong with that costume. I had to go to Wikipedia to see what this is all about.

Maybe that's just my personal ignorance, and even Germans should know this, but it's at least not something that is obvious to everybody here.
 
freeofgreed said:
Again not comparable. Avatar is a work of fiction. Please stop trying to compare aliens to black people.
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i compared them to native americans. I'm just asking if you would deny anyone from native american origin to be offended at people cosplaying na'vi. It might be a work of fiction, but it's too heavily reliant on a cruel episode of human history,
 
freeofgreed said:
What are you even talking about?
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Your opinion, like you were talking about my opinion. I'm not trying to change people's feelings. I stated my opinion, and pointed out a couple times where others have had the same, with some people getting upset that a black person had a differing opinion than their own.
 
Acerac said:
Apologies if this was answered somewhere in the last ten pages, but does anyone mind telling me why this is inherently offensive? This makeup was done not to mock the character, but to pay tribute to it. I can understand if the cosplayer was trying to make a mockery of the character in question, but she seems to have crafted it with respect.

Is it offensive because people have painted themselves black to mock others? Does the intent not matter? I can understand there being a link, like when people say something is gay to mean it's negative, but as this costume seems to have no negative intent behind it, I admit I'm confused.
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For many black people, the act of painting yourself to appear black is offensive. Period.

There are certain cases when it's allowed, but those are rare and basically boil down to "making fun of people who paint themselves to look black."
 
DY_nasty said:
Everyone is dumber than you.

Obviously
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I'm simply asking you to back up the claim that my argument is circular. I don't want to hear arguments of authority that just pass the responsibility. I don't want to hear an argument of popular opinion. I want to hear the actual argument. Why don't you just finally admit that you can't explain why my examples are bad and my logic is circular because it isn't?
 
besada said:
Well, you're welcome to waste your time attempting to objectively argue an entirely subjective emotional response if you want to, but it's not going to get you anywhere. The entire idea that you are capable of deciding what the correct response is to this event suggests you don't understand how people work.

But feel free to beat your head against a wall if that entertains you.
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There are appropriate responses to most, if not all situations. That's why we have words like "Overreact". Because there is an obvious social gauge on what is an appropriate way to react to situations. If there weren't no one would be seen as overreacting to anything, because there is no correct response on how people should react to situations.
ishibear said:
No one can tell a person of another race why they should or should not be offended by something.

Especially not with black people in regards to this.
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I didn't say anyone should tell anyone what to be offended at. I said that you being offended is not a conversation stopper, and you simply being offended shouldn't be something that makes people stop what they're doing if you don't have a reasonable reason for being offended in the first place.

But I wasn't speaking in regards to this, because I can see why some people might be offended by it. I'm just speaking in generalities about the idea that someone being offended automatically means that they're justified in that offense.
 
Two Words said:
You're simply claiming the default opinion arbitrarily.
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the default opinion of its hard to explain why its bullshit that the offended should have to kindly explain why while being talked down to and patronized?
 
Acerac said:
Apologies if this was answered somewhere in the last ten pages, but does anyone mind telling me why this is inherently offensive? This makeup was done not to mock the character, but to pay tribute to it. I can understand if the cosplayer was trying to make a mockery of the character in question, but she seems to have crafted it with respect.

Is it offensive because people have painted themselves black to mock others? Does the intent not matter? I can understand there being a link, like when people say something is gay to mean it's negative, but as this costume seems to have no negative intent behind it, I admit I'm confused.
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When other races cosplay white characters, their skin is never painted white. But when a white person cosplays another race, they always have to exaggerate features, skin tone,etc. I stated earlier how they tape their eyes slanted to be Asian, etc. These are very racist depictions of other races.

By her exaggeration of the nose here along with the skin paint, her initial intent may not have been to be racist, but that's what her cosplay presents. That isn't appropriate under any circumstances and she should alter her cosplay in regards to this coming to light.
 
Alligatorjandro said:
It doesn't have to be crayon black and bright red lips to be blackface

And you don't have to intend to be racist or offensive for something to be either.
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Simply painting your face isn't blackface. I also believe that you're right, you don't need to intend for it to be offensive, but there is some level of intent needed for it to be racist.
 
blitzcloud said:
i compared them to native americans. I'm just asking if you would deny anyone from native american origin to be offended at people cosplaying na'vi. It might be a work of fiction, but it's too heavily reliant on a cruel episode of human history,
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Oh ok I see what you meant. To answer your question absolutely. If native Americans found Avatar offensive I would be 100% behind them, because even though I may not personally find it offensive. I am not native American so I have no idea how, from the perspective of a NA, they might view the film, and it is better to just listen to the more informed party than to be an ignorant asshole and tell them they are being too sensitive.
 
what about Eli Wallach playing Tuco? Is that offensive for a Jewish man to pretend to play a Mexican? He bronzed his skin for the role. Is that offensive?
 
Anustart said:
Your opinion, like you were talking about my opinion. I'm not trying to change people's feelings. I stated my opinion, and pointed out a couple times where others have had the same, with some people getting upset that a black person had a differing opinion than their own.
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Where did I get upset that a black person had a different opinion than me?
 
Zen_Arcade said:
There are appropriate responses to most, if not all situations. That's why we have words like "Overreact". Because there is an obvious social gauge on what is an appropriate way to react to situations. If there weren't no one would be seen as overreacting to anything, because there is no correct response on how people should react to situations.
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Yes, and those appropriate responses are subjective, as is the concept of "overreaction." You aren't the arbiter of what is or isn't an overreaction, no matter how much you believe that you are.
 
Mighty Chin said:
The character is black, the actress playing the character is black. Limiting her costume to just what the character wears is ridiculous. So she can't have dreadlocks either?
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Nobody is born with dreadlocks. You have to treat your hair a certain way to get them. White people can get them too, if they so decide too. Same with afros. She can cut off her hair, if she decided too.
 
Thanks for the replies! :)
ishibear said:
When other races cosplay white characters, their skin is never painted white. But when a white person cosplays another race, they always have to exaggerate features, skin tone,etc. I stated earlier how they tape their eyes slanted to be Asian, etc. These are very racist depictions of other races.

By her exaggeration of the nose here along with the skin paint, her initial intent may not have been to be racist, but that's what her cosplay presents. That isn't appropriate under any circumstances and she should alter her cosplay in regards to this coming to light.
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Funny, I'd always noticed the exaggerated features for portrayals of other races, but I've been blind to the fact that it's true, painting oneself white to represent a white character is practically unheard of. The nose did stick out to me, and I think I see where you're coming from. It might not have been done out of hatred, but ignorance can still be painful.

Spork4000 said:
For many black people, the act of painting yourself to appear black is offensive. Period.

There are certain cases when it's allowed, but those are rare and basically boil down to "making fun of people who paint themselves to look black."
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I'd imagine it's significantly linked to the history behind the act? I can understand that. It was a very ugly period of American history and having it brought up could be all sorts of frustrating.
 
Oldschoolgamer said:
Nobody is born with dreadlocks. You have to treat your hair a certain way to get them. White people can get them too, if they so decide too. Same with afros. She can cut off her hair, if she decided too.
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And people can sun tan too. With certain chemicals they can even darken their skin permanently
 
You guys do know there's a difference between doing something racist and being racist right?

Everyone has done at least something racist in their life. That doesn't make you a racist, but your actions were. Most people learn from their mistakes and move on. It says a lot about a person who would rather fight for their right to do racist things than just apologize and move on.
 
Courage said:
Do you know what blackface is? What you're saying isn't comparable.
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So it's only offensive to change your white appearance to look more like a black person? That seems pretty arbitrary. White people used to give themselves a Latin appearance to not hire Latin actors. You see far less non-black stereotypes because a lot of early cinema was also being marketed to Europeans.
 
Camp Lo said:
And there you have it, folks.
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I think answering this with satire might not sit well, so i'll ask politely...

which tanning colors are exclusive to a race? because indian people, middle west people, spanish people (me included)... can have a similar tone of skin to the one used by her.
 
Courage said:
Do you know what blackface is? What you're saying isn't comparable.
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This is a big point of contention in the thread. I thought blackface was a cartoonish exaggeration of skin tone and lips to portray black people in a negative light. Many people don't see that in the OP, they see a girl with a painted black face. Is a painted black face blackface?
 
Two Words said:
what about Eli Wallach playing Tuco? Is that offensive for a Jewish man to pretend to play a Mexican? He bronzed his skin for the role. Is that offensive?
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Well for one thing that movie came out nearly 50 years ago. America was a very different place back then and you can't compare what was acceptable then to what is now. And IDK ask some Mexicans if they find it offense. My view of this is that the views of the offended party hold more weight because as the offendee they have a completely different perspective of the situation then some one who is just an onlooker.
 
besada said:
Yes, and those appropriate responses are subjective, as is the concept of "overreaction." You aren't the arbiter of what is or isn't an overreaction, no matter how much you believe that you are.
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The concept of overreaction is not very subjective. You can get arrested and jailed for overreacting to situations. There are quite clearly rules in our society of what you can and can't do in situations. So obviously, the things you can't do can pass the line of what society as a collective thinks as an over reaction and can get you in trouble.
 
Mighty Chin said:
The character is black, the actress playing the character is black. Limiting her costume to just what the character wears is ridiculous. So she can't have dreadlocks either?
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How is it ridiculous? How do you think every other person who isn't white cosplays as white characters? They don't throw a bunch of makeup on themselves to look white.

How is a hair style equivalent to the skin colour youre born with?
 
DY_nasty said:
the default opinion of its hard to explain why its bullshit that the offended should have to kindly explain why while being talked down to and patronized?
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Thanks for proving my point. It appears you are in fact willing to point out when I am wrong. So it is even more strange that you won't back up your other claims about my argument.
 
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