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[12Goblins]

See, you're projecting. No one has any idea why he declined to get vaccinated. We need to stop putting people into boxes to fit narratives. It's counterproductive.

I just don't think COVID, as serious as it is, is serious enough to treat it like it's the plague in this case. Makes it seem like with a heart transplant and not being vaccinated, he might as well be walking into the Chernobyl reactor during the meltdown.

He may not even catch COVID. And I'm sure he and his family will take precautions to keep him safe from exposing himself to illnesses.

how am I projecting? it says in the article he doesn't believe in it, and they took him off the list because he refused to get the shot. you don't have to be some prophet to see what's going on here

it's a good point though, we could make a case where the vaccine should not be necessary for a newly immunocompromised organ transplant recipient because of family efforts to keep said patient from being exposed to foreign pathogens,

no one is conspiring to discriminate against the unvaccinated -- I can guarantee that multiple doctors sat down with him in good faith and detailed why being vaccinated is one of the many requirements for eligibility and that it is in his best interest to do so, and he still turned them down. you can try to drum up as much sympathy from the media as you like, but now he will leave 2 children and a pregnant wife without a father, and for what? a few misguided principles? I'll go out on a limb and say faith is also involved. absolutely infuriating

 

[Dr.Guru of Peru]

If somehow there was some calculation that if patient X got a heart transplant, but didn't do Y, when released back into the populace he has an 80% chance of dying, I might agree with their decision. But in this instance, I'm not sure that percentage can even be calculated, and if it could I'm not sure how high it would be. Seems like an extreme measure for something that is a total projection and even given the circumstances if you factor in that not only does the person have to catch COVID(which is no guarantee, especially when your lifestyle can be adjusted to mitigate risk) and then also die from it... it seems extreme.

For all we know, this dude plans to live like a hermit until COVID rates plummet, and not go near anyone and essentially put himself at no risk. We simply have no idea.

He'll be in a hospital for weeks after his transplant, so no. He can't live like a hermit.

 

[Jsisto]

To me it makes more sense if you take away the human aspect. This donor heart is an incredibly limited resource and great care must be taken to ensure its usefulness is maximized. I'm not knowledgeable about this at all, but given what some have been saying, I wouldn't at all be surprised if other vaccinations have typically been required for organ transplants. Also, let's keep in mind this is an article and it's doubtful were getting the full story. I'm sure this man knew for a long time, before he was at the top of the list, that he would ultimately have to make this decision. I doubt this is some last minute change or slight. I'm sad he felt he had to throw his life away for this very specific belief, but thankfully the heart will go to someone who did what was expected of them in this incredibly rare circumstance that I'm sure has dozens of other requirements that ask for some lifestyle sacrifice.

 

[RoyalLaFlame]

China's zero-covid policy is not actual zero covid cases. It's about maintaining a level of cases that doesn't spread like wildfire without knowing its origin. Xi'an is the most recent example - December 9th they started having some cases but the city didn't shut down right away. There were some situations in the past where one or two districts were closed for like 2 weeks because they managed to contain the virus to that specific area. But suddenly, cases start appearing in different parts of the city without them actually knowing where it was coming from. When they noticed hundreds of people were getting infected so they locked it down until they can find the source (which took one month). Shanghai is having more and more cases and the city didn't close yet (more than Xi'an I think), Tianjin as well, Hong Kong as well, Henan area as well. If they can trace back the infection origin, then they don't close it. If they can't, they will close it. The lockdown actually lasted 1 month, not three weeks like this guy says.

As recent episodes in the city of Xi’an showed, Chinese hospitals fearful of the virus may deny care to those in need.

Once again, another opinion piece that doesn't know what the hell they're talking about. Hospitals were not fearful of the virus - the city had designated hospitals and temporary places to take care of people. Hospitals have a limited number of beds, require doctors to be spread throughout the city. So they designated local points where people go in their communities by using specialised hospitals with the equipment needed and temporary places for the less severe cases. They don't deny anything, once again trying to dehumanise China for some fucking reason.


China's Zero-covid policy is about tracing the origin of infection and tackling it as quickly as possible, not actual zero-covid cases (they even call it dynamic). Another thing I've heard but it's yet to be confirmed, China is planning on creating places in designated cities (like Xi'an and Shanghai) for international flights arrivals, where they will have camps for quarantine. People will come, stay on those places for a few days, and then they can continue their lives normally. Xi'an just lifted lockdown 3 days ago, and everything is back to normal.

Just to give some insight to people here, from a foreigner living in Xi'an. I don't agree with the limitations they've put regarding overseas travel, but it's working for them - they have a population of 1.3 billion, so they do need to be more careful.

 

[It's all in the wrist]

Yes - https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/chronic-fatigue-syndrome-cfs/

They didn't mention Covid in there once though.

 

[xellos2099alpha]

China's zero-covid policy is not actual zero covid cases. It's about maintaining a level of cases that doesn't spread like wildfire without knowing its origin. Xi'an is the most recent example - December 9th they started having some cases but the city didn't shut down right away. There were some situations in the past where one or two districts were closed for like 2 weeks because they managed to contain the virus to that specific area. But suddenly, cases start appearing in different parts of the city without them actually knowing where it was coming from. When they noticed hundreds of people were getting infected so they locked it down until they can find the source (which took one month). Shanghai is having more and more cases and the city didn't close yet (more than Xi'an I think), Tianjin as well, Hong Kong as well, Henan area as well. If they can trace back the infection origin, then they don't close it. If they can't, they will close it. The lockdown actually lasted 1 month, not three weeks like this guy says.


Once again, another opinion piece that doesn't know what the hell they're talking about. Hospitals were not fearful of the virus - the city had designated hospitals and temporary places to take care of people. Hospitals have a limited number of beds, require doctors to be spread throughout the city. So they designated local points where people go in their communities by using specialised hospitals with the equipment needed and temporary places for the less severe cases. They don't deny anything, once again trying to dehumanise China for some fucking reason.


China's Zero-covid policy is about tracing the origin of infection and tackling it as quickly as possible, not actual zero-covid cases (they even call it dynamic). Another thing I've heard but it's yet to be confirmed, China is planning on creating places in designated cities (like Xi'an and Shanghai) for international flights arrivals, where they will have camps for quarantine. People will come, stay on those places for a few days, and then they can continue their lives normally. Xi'an just lifted lockdown 3 days ago, and everything is back to normal.

Just to give some insight to people here, from a foreigner living in Xi'an. I don't agree with the limitations they've put regarding overseas travel, but it's working for them - they have a population of 1.3 billion, so they do need to be more careful.

Sometime i wonder why usa suck so bad at real contract tracting. Most of the asian country does it really well.

 

[prinz_valium]

Sometime i wonder why usa suck so bad at real contract tracting. Most of the asian country does it really well.

Europe, too.
But it's stupid to do from the government.

I know who i had contact with. I can tell those people 5 days before the government knows I'm positive.

 

[Chaplain]

 

[betrayal]

It will be interesting to see when the last people will come to the conclusion that the effect of the boosters against infections is negligible.

Even the only very slightly higher protection against severe disease is actually not justifiable, because the basic immunization with two doses already protects very well against that.

Oh, and by the way...the total number of cases worldwide is already declining. Let's hope that some people can find a few more absurd individual fates for themselves in order to continue to hold on to the pandemic that is coming to an end.

 

[prinz_valium]

3 people super close to me have Covid now.
I'm still likely, but no positive test.

It will only grow.

 

[tommolb]

They didn't mention Covid in there once though.

You asked "first time I've heard of anything like this. I never gave much thought to the after effects of an illness that seems to have "gone away"."

The symptoms of long covid are often likened to chronic fatigue syndrome;

Common symptoms of ME/CFS include

• feeling extremely tired all the time – you may find it very hard to do daily activities
• still feeling tired after resting or sleeping
• taking a long time to recover after physical activity
• problems sleeping, such as waking up often during the night
• problems with thinking, memory and concentration

Some people with ME/CFS may also have other symptoms, including:

• muscle or joint pain
• headaches
• a sore throat
• flu-like symptoms
• feeling dizzy or sick
• fast or irregular heartbeats (heart palpitations)

..while a suspect cause of chronic fatigue syndrome is;

• viral infections, such as glandular fever

So in answer to your question around whether anything like long covid has been seen before, yes chronic fatigue syndrome. Viral illness triggering long term ill health, even after the original illness has "gone away".

 

[prinz_valium]

You asked "first time I've heard of anything like this. I never gave much thought to the after effects of an illness that seems to have "gone away"."

The symptoms of long covid are often likened to chronic fatigue syndrome;

Common symptoms of ME/CFS include

• feeling extremely tired all the time – you may find it very hard to do daily activities
• still feeling tired after resting or sleeping
• taking a long time to recover after physical activity
• problems sleeping, such as waking up often during the night
• problems with thinking, memory and concentration

Some people with ME/CFS may also have other symptoms, including:

• muscle or joint pain
• headaches
• a sore throat
• flu-like symptoms
• feeling dizzy or sick
• fast or irregular heartbeats (heart palpitations)

..while a suspect cause of chronic fatigue syndrome is;

• viral infections, such as glandular fever

So in answer to your question around whether anything like long covid has been seen before, yes chronic fatigue syndrome. Viral illness triggering long term ill health, even after the original illness has "gone away".

Yeah. Had that after a really bad flu.
Not for 2 years, but months.
I thought it might have been psychosomatic.
But it's both?

I don't know.

 

[arkhamguy123]

3 people super close to me have Covid now.
I'm still likely, but no positive test.

It will only grow.

Didn't you just have it? Trust your immune system.

 

[prinz_valium]

Didn't you just have it? Trust your immune system.

I'm suspected to have it. Not confirmed. Still waiting for PCR test result.

It's hard to trust with all the negativ shit you hear and read all the time. But sure the odds are heavily in my favor.

 

[Nobody_Important]

Omicron Deaths in U.S. Exceed Delta’s Peak as Covid-19 Optimism Rises in Europe

More signs emerged that the Omicron wave is taking a less serious human toll in Europe, while U.S. data showed daily average deaths from the disease exceeding the peak reached during the surge driven by the Delta variant.

www.wsj.com

In the U.S., the seven-day average for newly reported Covid-19 deaths reached 2,258 a day on Tuesday, up about 1,000 from daily death counts two months ago, data from Johns Hopkins University show. That is the highest since February 2021 as the country was emerging from the worst of last winter’s wave.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

So the childcare is closed for 7 days even though my kid tested negative because....reasons? I dont know, maybe someone is unvaccinated and their special kind of snowflake needs to be protected, I see no other reasoning. Hopefully with France still getting more than 400k cases per day and everyone getting Covid sooner or later they will just follow UK way and get rid of all the stupid quarantine. You had a year to get vaccinated, you will get a running nose for 2 days, you will be fine.

 

[Kraz]

That was the plan I was going to go with.
4th being the Omicron update this summer.
Then see where it goes from there. My current quick speculation is they get integrated into a routine of bi-annual shots with flu, colds and such. Then once a workflow is developed that most everyone is going with preventatives, medical prepared as best as possible, everyone doing their thing optimally and choices made. A firm triage will be set and they(medical) won't stop other procedures for anyone with covid vaxxed or not, they'll handle what they handle. Most restrictions be dropped to a minimum with some adjustment. Endemic and recovery.

 

[RoadHazard]

I made it two years, but today I tested positive. Haven't been around a lot of people, but this omicron shit seems impossible to avoid unless you go for absolute isolation.

It's not too bad though, feels like a common cold.

 

[Shai-Tan]

You asked "first time I've heard of anything like this. I never gave much thought to the after effects of an illness that seems to have "gone away"."

The symptoms of long covid are often likened to chronic fatigue syndrome;

Common symptoms of ME/CFS include

• feeling extremely tired all the time – you may find it very hard to do daily activities
• still feeling tired after resting or sleeping
• taking a long time to recover after physical activity
• problems sleeping, such as waking up often during the night
• problems with thinking, memory and concentration

Some people with ME/CFS may also have other symptoms, including:

• muscle or joint pain
• headaches
• a sore throat
• flu-like symptoms
• feeling dizzy or sick
• fast or irregular heartbeats (heart palpitations)

..while a suspect cause of chronic fatigue syndrome is;

• viral infections, such as glandular fever

So in answer to your question around whether anything like long covid has been seen before, yes chronic fatigue syndrome. Viral illness triggering long term ill health, even after the original illness has "gone away".

Still an open question how long term (as in not necessarily chronic). Depends on the injury I suppose. For example I got covid early in March 2020 and had elevated heart rate and palpitations for some time but it went away by Jan 2021. Maybe more severe case lead to a chronic injury for some subset.

 

[prinz_valium]

Omicron Deaths in U.S. Exceed Delta’s Peak as Covid-19 Optimism Rises in Europe

More signs emerged that the Omicron wave is taking a less serious human toll in Europe, while U.S. data showed daily average deaths from the disease exceeding the peak reached during the surge driven by the Delta variant.

www.wsj.com

And that is not vaccination. Is has to be something else. Europe and the US have both some region with super high vaccination rates, lower rater and very low rates.

I don't know why the discrepancy is so huge.

 

[Rentahamster]

They have a high case rate yet have a relatively low death rate, which means the vaccine is doing exactly what it needs to do. Compare with the USA which has less infections per capita, yet more deaths per capita.

COVID-19 Data Explorer

Explore global data on COVID-19.

ourworldindata.org

COVID-19 Data Explorer

Explore global data on COVID-19.

ourworldindata.org

Half of Israelis boostered, compared to a quarter of Americans.

COVID-19 Data Explorer

Explore global data on COVID-19.

ourworldindata.org

 

[Rentahamster]

And that is not vaccination. Is has to be something else. Europe and the US have both some region with super high vaccination rates, lower rater and very low rates.

I don't know why the discrepancy is so huge.

Vaccination is a huge factor, and local behavior accounts for the differences. Generally speaking, higher vaccinated regions experience lower death rates. Areas with high levels of natural immunity also experience lower death rates too, but that comes at the cost of higher death rates from the initial infections.

 

[chromhound]

3 people super close to me have Covid now.
I'm still likely, but no positive test.

It will only grow.

You might be lucky and not catch it. I haven't caught it yet but plenty people around me caught it

 

[TaylorSwiftFan]

They have a high case rate yet have a relatively low death rate, which means the vaccine is doing exactly what it needs to do. Compare with the USA which has less infections per capita, yet more deaths per capita.

If the vaccine was doing what it needs to, it would be efficient for more than 6 months.

 

[Rentahamster]

If the vaccine was doing what it needs to, it would be efficient for more than 6 months.

It is. It provides long term protection against severe illness and death for more than 6 months.

Just because it doesn't live up to your unrealistic standard to what a vaccine should be doesn't mean it's not effective. It is very effective, even by historical standards.

 

[Chittagong]

So was the initial vaccines preventing 95% of og Covid infections really a fluke that can’t be repeated by updating the vaccine?

 

[GHG]

So was the initial vaccines preventing 95% of og Covid infections really a fluke that can’t be repeated by updating the vaccine?

It wasn't a fluke but this is the nature of viruses - they mutate. The only way around this would be to vaccinate every single person at exactly the same time which is unrealistic for obvious reasons and even then it wouldn't be fool proof. Also it's important to note that the amount of time the antibodies from the vaccine lasts varies from person to person. Boosters every 3-6 months anyone?

So, this is it, we are forever going to be chasing. New strains, new boosters, to infinity. But, if it continues to mutate in the direction it has been (becoming less severe) then it will just fade away into the background.

 

[Rentahamster]

So was the initial vaccines preventing 95% of og Covid infections really a fluke that can’t be repeated by updating the vaccine?

Not a fluke. The OG vaccine was designed for the original strain of sarscov2, so the antibodies your body generates from exposure to the vaccine targets that strain extremely well. However, the new strains are different enough that our antibodies don't "fit" as well on the new variants so it's harder to neutralize them.

We could update the vaccine to target the new variants, but development and testing takes about a year, and these variants are popping up sooner than that. We need to expedite our vaccine development, or slow the reach of new variants, or hope that future variants are less dangerous.

 

[TaylorSwiftFan]

It is. It provides long term protection against severe illness and death for more than 6 months.

Just because it doesn't live up to your unrealistic standard to what a vaccine should be doesn't mean it's not effective. It is very effective, even by historical standards.

So the polio vaccine efficacy is unrealistic? The MMR vaccine?

Studies have shown that the efficacy drops with time. Get ready for the yearly booster.

 

[prinz_valium]

Just because it doesn't live up to your unrealistic standard to what a vaccine should be doesn't mean it's not effective

So the standard basically any other vaccine provides is unrealistic?
Measles, chicken pox, rubella, polio, tetanus, hep a-c, mumps, diphtheria, etc.

How could one just expect similar performing vaccines. Stupid normal people who don't know how science work.

We also don't have to go back to the "95% effective at preventing covid" talk in late 2020 and early 2021

 

[Clear]

They have a high case rate yet have a relatively low death rate, which means the vaccine is doing exactly what it needs to do. Compare with the USA which has less infections per capita, yet more deaths per capita.

Why would you put that disparity down to vaccine effectiveness over say prevalence of co-morbidities? The US is the most obese country in the industrialized world, which in turn has an impact on other co-morbidity factors associated with bad Covid outcomes such as diabetes and heart disease.

 

[poppabk]

So the standard basically any other vaccine provides is unrealistic?
Measles, chicken pox, rubella, polio, tetanus, hep a-c, mumps, diphtheria, etc.

How could one just expect similar performing vaccines. Stupid normal people who don't know how science work.

We also don't have to go back to the "95% effective at preventing covid" talk in late 2020 and early 2021

Several of those you listed require several shots and/or boosters throughout your life.
I've mentioned the pertussis vaccine multiple times as a good corrolary.

 

[Rentahamster]

So the polio vaccine efficacy is unrealistic? The MMR vaccine?

Studies have shown that the efficacy drops with time. Get ready for the yearly booster.

Polio has seen 3 major variants in all of its recorded history with us. They are different enough that previous infection with one provides little to no immunity against the others. SARSCOV2 is way past 3 at this point. This has a lot to do with how easy it is for SARSCOV2 to mutate relative to the polio virus. Measles also mutates less and has a hard time mutating into a harmful form since mutations to the measles virus tends to make it less harmful to humans. You can just compare these viruses and vaccines to each other one for one. There's significant differences here. Furthermore, one of the main reasons those vaccines have a high success rate is because everyone got them as a kid and they have 90+% uptake in the community. Also, believe it or not, those shots also require boosters.

Here is some light reading that should get you caught up on the relevant information I went over in my post.

Vaccination - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

U.S. Vaccine Safety - Overview, History, and How It Works | CDC

Safety is a priority during the development and use of all vaccines in the United States. Learn more about the history of vaccine safety, current safety programs, and how they work.

www.cdc.gov

Immunization Schedules for 18 & Younger

View and print CDC recommended immunization schedules.

www.cdc.gov

Disease factsheet about poliomyelitis

Poliovirus is highly contagious and infected individuals shed virus in the faeces and from oral secretions, thus the mode of transmission is person-to-person, both via the faecal-oral and the oral-oral routes.

www.ecdc.europa.eu

Researchers Clarify Why Measles Doesn't Evolve to Escape Immunity - Mayo Clinic News Network

Unlike SARS-CoV-2, which mutated into new strains in its first year as a human disease-causing virus, measles virus does not mutate in a comparable way. A person who is fully vaccinated against the measles virus will usually be protected for life. Now, with a Cell Reports Medicine publication...

discoverysedge.mayo.edu

 

[Rentahamster]

So the standard basically any other vaccine provides is unrealistic?
Measles, chicken pox, rubella, polio, tetanus, hep a-c, mumps, diphtheria, etc.

How could one just expect similar performing vaccines. Stupid normal people who don't know how science work.

There are significant differences when you compare the COVID vaccine with those other vaccines. You are comparing vaccines which have extremely high levels of acceptance over decades with a vaccine that hasn't had enough time to reach the same levels of acceptance. We're still only at around 50% worldwide. You're also comparing vaccines that target viruses that are very different from SARSCOV2. You can't just lump them all into the same category because they're all viruses. They work differently. The other vaccines don't works as well when not enough people are vaccinated to reach herd immunity. This is why measles outbreaks still happen in anti-vax communities. The other viruses also don't mutate as much asSARSCOV2 does except for the flu virus, which is why we still need yearly flu shots. We also still need booster shots for most if not all of those vaccines that you are comparing the COVID vaccine to.

Don't talk about not knowing how science works if you aren't familiar with the details.

We also don't have to go back to the "95% effective at preventing covid" talk in late 2020 and early 2021

What do you mean by this?

 

[Rentahamster]

Why would you put that disparity down to vaccine effectiveness over say prevalence of co-morbidities? The US is the most obese country in the industrialized world, which in turn has an impact on other co-morbidity factors associated with bad Covid outcomes such as diabetes and heart disease.

Because vaccination is by far the biggest factor when tabulating who lived and who died. Also because while the US is very very fat, we're not so fat that it's an overwhelming factor compared to other countries like Israel.

https://www.jpost.com/health-science/over-half-of-the-israeli-population-is-overweight-report-finds-657579

Among the findings, the researchers found that about 62% of men and 55% of women ages 20-64 were overweight or obese and that the numbers are trending upward. Moreover, almost one out of five Israelis smoke, and one out of 10 has diabetes.

https://www.euro.who.int/__data/assets/pdf_file/0017/243305/Israel-WHO-Country-Profile.pdf

 

[prinz_valium]

You're also comparing vaccines that target viruses that are very different from SARSCOV2. You can't just lump them all into the same category because they're all viruses. They work differently

That's my point. Those vaccines against those viruses make sense to use. The current covid vaccines against a virus like covid don't unless you're a risk person. It's like the yearly flu shot. And no one is advocating to vaccinated 100% of the world every year against the flu, because it makes no sense. It's not practical and won't work great anyways.

And please stop with not widespread enough. And bring up 50% WW vaccination status only. The WW vaccination rate for measles and rubella is also just 70%. And we have plenty of 90 and 95% vaccination rate countries and regions who still have hundred of thousand of break trough infections.

This was the fastest and broadest vaccination event in human history with the least success. Any other new vaccine rollouts were slower and patchyier and ad a instantly bigger impact on combating the virus that was targeted.

 

[chromhound]

Pfizer’s Paxlovid pill is here. Can it get to the people who need it?

“The drug works and the data is very good.” But the limited supply and the need for quick diagnoses will complicate prescriptions.

www.thestar.com

 

[ntropy]

Sweden anti-vax confirmed

https://www.reuters.com/world/europ...ing-covid-vaccines-kids-aged-5-12-2022-01-27/

 

[Rentahamster]

That's my point. Those vaccines against those viruses make sense to use. The current covid vaccines against a virus like covid don't unless you're a risk person.

This COVID vaccine ALSO makes sense to use. How can you look at the data that shows how protective it is and not come to that conclusion?

COVID-19 Breakthrough Data

Cases and hospitalizations by vaccination status

coronavirus.health.ny.gov

https://www.doh.wa.gov/Portals/1/Documents/1600/coronavirus/data-tables/421-010-CasesInNotFullyVaccinated.pdf

The benefit does not only apply to "at risk" people.

It's like the yearly flu shot. And no one is advocating to vaccinated 100% of the world every year against the flu, because it makes no sense. It's not practical and won't work great anyways.

If COVID19 plays out like the flu in terms of vaccine efficacy and spread, then yes, it'll be like the yearly flu shot logistically. However, it is even more important to get than the flu shot because COVID19 infection is still much more dangerous than a flu infection. It is practical, and it does work great, demonstrated by the data I showed you.

And please stop with not widespread enough. And bring up 50% WW vaccination status only. The WW vaccination rate for measles and rubella is also just 70%. And we have plenty of 90 and 95% vaccination rate countries and regions who still have hundred of thousand of break trough infections.

Go look up the news articles about those breakthrough measles infections. They broke out in anti-vax communities.

This was the fastest and broadest vaccination event in human history with the least success. Any other new vaccine rollouts were slower and patchyier and ad a instantly bigger impact on combating the virus that was targeted.

You have a skewed understanding of history. The previous vaccine campaigns that you think were faster and more impactful had decades to work. The COVID19 vaccine was rolled out in a year and has already saved millions of lives.

 

[ManaByte]

Omicron cases declining? Don't worry here's STEALTH OMICRON!

Here’s what’s known about the ‘stealth’ version of omicron

Scientists and health officials around the world are keeping their eyes on a descendant of the omicron variant that has been found in at least 40 countries, including the United States. This versio…

ktla.com

 

[Chittagong]

Omicron cases declining? Don't worry here's STEALTH OMICRON!

Here’s what’s known about the ‘stealth’ version of omicron

Scientists and health officials around the world are keeping their eyes on a descendant of the omicron variant that has been found in at least 40 countries, including the United States. This versio…

ktla.com

PLEASE BE AFRAID

Small print

The two versions of omicron have enough in common that it’s possible that infection with the original mutant “will give you cross-protection against BA.2,” said Dr. Daniel Kuritzkes, an infectious diseases expert at Brigham and Women’s Hospital.

Scientists will be conducting tests to see if antibodies from an infection with the original omicron “are able to neutralize BA.2 in the laboratory and then extrapolate from there,” he said.

 

[funkygunther]

Sweden anti-vax confirmed

https://www.reuters.com/world/europ...ing-covid-vaccines-kids-aged-5-12-2022-01-27/

Been like that for UK since the first rollout. More like Sweden late to every sensible decision.

 

[Liljagare]

nm!

 

[Clear]

Because vaccination is by far the biggest factor when tabulating who lived and who died. Also because while the US is very very fat, we're not so fat that it's an overwhelming factor compared to other countries like Israel.

Its pretty substantial. If I recall its like 36% vs 26%. Which factoring in the massive disparity in population size is a lot of people with co-morbidities. Especially given the widespread use HFCS as opposed to sugar, because that shit is a massive causal agent for type-2 diabetes.

Look, I'm sorry, but there are lot more specificities about the US health-wise than just vaccination rates. The US is infected by the same strains as the rest of the world, and employs the same vaccines, so if the results are different than in other nations I'd say its extremely arguable that its a result of demographics as opposed to medication/health policy.

 

[Rentahamster]

Its pretty substantial. If I recall its like 36% vs 26%. Which factoring in the massive disparity in population size is a lot of people with co-morbidities. Especially given the widespread use HFCS as opposed to sugar, because that shit is a massive causal agent for type-2 diabetes.

Look, I'm sorry, but there are lot more specificities about the US health-wise than just vaccination rates. The US is infected by the same strains as the rest of the world, and employs the same vaccines, so if the results are different than in other nations I'd say its extremely arguable that its a result of demographics as opposed to medication/health policy.

Top 5 vaccinated countries in the world VS the United States.

COVID-19 Data Explorer

Explore global data on COVID-19.

ourworldindata.org

US only analysis in case you think that country specific differences are the big difference.

Top 3 vaccinated states vs bottom 3 vaccinated states with at least 3 million population.

4. Connecticut
Number of people fully vaccinated: 2,720,695
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 76.31

5. Massachusetts
Number of people fully vaccinated: 5,250,029
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 76.17

7. New York
Number of people fully vaccinated: 14,357,890
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 73.81

vs

48. Louisiana
Number of people fully vaccinated: 2,397,954
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 51.58

49. Mississippi
Number of people fully vaccinated: 1,484,838
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 49.89

51. Alabama
Number of people fully vaccinated: 2,417,639
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 49.31

COVID Data Tracker

CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.

covid.cdc.gov

Demographics plays a part, but none of them have as high an association with death and illness than the vaccine.

 

[Clear]

Top 5 vaccinated countries in the world VS the United States.

COVID-19 Data Explorer

Explore global data on COVID-19.

ourworldindata.org

US only analysis in case you think that country specific differences are the big difference.

Top 3 vaccinated states vs bottom 3 vaccinated states with at least 3 million population.

4. Connecticut
Number of people fully vaccinated: 2,720,695
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 76.31

5. Massachusetts
Number of people fully vaccinated: 5,250,029
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 76.17

7. New York
Number of people fully vaccinated: 14,357,890
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 73.81

vs

48. Louisiana
Number of people fully vaccinated: 2,397,954
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 51.58

49. Mississippi
Number of people fully vaccinated: 1,484,838
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 49.89

51. Alabama
Number of people fully vaccinated: 2,417,639
Percentage of population fully vaccinated: 49.31

COVID Data Tracker

CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.

covid.cdc.gov

Demographics plays a part, but none of them have as high an association with death and illness than the vaccine.

Nope. Shockingly states with a higher per capita income like CT do better than the worst MI. That correlates with diet too, and more co-morbidites especially among the elderly where I'd bet the vast majority of fatalities are concentrated.

Also, define "fully vaccinated" because that's a moving target that doesn't track perfectly with actual vaccination uptake and the accepted science that any immunity acquired from any source wanes over time.

 

[Rentahamster]

Nope. Shockingly states with a higher per capita income like CT do better than the worst MI. That correlates with diet too, and more co-morbidites especially among the elderly where I'd bet the vast majority of fatalities are concentrated.

Also, define "fully vaccinated" because that's a moving target that doesn't track perfectly with actual vaccination uptake and the accepted science that any immunity acquired from any source wanes over time.

Stop moving the goalposts.

New Mexico (68%), Guam (77%), and Maine (77%) are within $10K per capita income of Mississippi (50%) , are more highly vaccinated, and have less deaths.

Puerto Rico (79%) is even poorer than Mississippi and has less deaths, probably because it is very highly vaccinated.

 

[Clear]

Stop moving the goalposts.

What are you on about?

Ehhhh... Whatever. Just trying to add some nuance to the discussion. Just tired of vaccination status being treated as the totality of debate around this pandemic.

 

[Rentahamster]

What are you on about?

I gave you some solid info and then you quickly dismissed it with unsupported evidence and moved on to "but what about this"

 

[Chittagong]

Me and the Mrs finally got our omicron to gtfo. 15 days from first symptoms, symptom-free day 9.