Crap, my CRT just died...time for an upgrade! Help!

x3n05 said:
Not unless you want to only use it in dark settings.
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Yeah, it's really more of a dedicated home theater room thing (no windows, preferably painted flat black) since it's pretty dim, so it's not for me currently. It's mind-blowing, though. <$7,000 in perfect condition with low hours now, not counting screen.
There are some lesser 9" models that are still better than almost anything that are probably really cheap now. I haven't looked into it lately.
 
big_z said:
agreed but as plasmas get brighter and produce better blacks the phosphor trails get worse. that's really the main thing someone looking at plasma should be worried about... do the trails bother you or not.
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are they even present in the panny/pios? i havent experienced it. i have seen it a little on the samsung plasmas in-store displays. its nothing like ghosting on an lcd though
 
TAJ said:
Yeah, it's really more of a dedicated home theater room thing (no windows, preferably painted flat black) since it's pretty dim, so it's not for me currently. It's mind-blowing, though. <$7,000 in perfect condition with low hours now, not counting screen.
There are some lesser 9" models that are still better than almost anything that are probably really cheap now. I haven't looked into it lately.
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It's definitely an awesome bit of kit and just the thing I will be looking for when I build a dedicated theatre room.
 
big_z said:
agreed but as plasmas get brighter and produce better blacks the phosphor trails get worse. that's really the main thing someone looking at plasma should be worried about... do the trails bother you or not.
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vindieselgaf.jpg


Newer plasmas have fixed this and Your avatar scares the fuck out of me.
 
donkey show said:
I love my baby GDM-FW900. Greatest CRT ever... EVER!!!
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I found a recent-ish model Sony CRT laying around a Goodwill for $20 and I couldn't pass it up. The thing had to weigh at least 80lbs though. Not fun walking that up that stairs.

I'm still rocking AGP so it was worth it for the scaling alone. 1024x768 on a CRT looks almost as good as 1280x1024 on an LCD.
 
Gonna gather more info on the Kuro 5020FD and take a test drive at the store tomorrow. :)

What lower cost similar Panny's do you people recommend I look at as well while I am there?
 
Brandon F said:
Gonna gather more info on the Kuro 5020FD and take a test drive at the store tomorrow. :)

What lower cost similar Panny's do you people recommend I look at as well while I am there?
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The PZ800U is the best version of their 1080p line right now. But honestly, if you have the dosh for the Kuro, just buy that. You won't be disappointed.
 
If you can afford a Kuro, by all means do it. I just picked up one of these Pansonic plasmas (returned a defective vizio). Now that its got a couple hundred hours on it the colors are awesome. Very pleased with it all around.
 
Brandon F said:
Gonna gather more info on the Kuro 5020FD and take a test drive at the store tomorrow. :)

What lower cost similar Panny's do you people recommend I look at as well while I am there?
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the one that was posted earlier in the thread (with link and pics).
also, when you view an in-store kuro, ask them to turn off the auto-image tuning feature, ive seen a lot of stores make kuros look absolutely rubbish because they have it set to auto-picture to adjust the image automatically to suit lighting conditions. it ends up looking like one of the worst tvs on display.
 
Brandon F said:
Gonna gather more info on the Kuro 5020FD and take a test drive at the store tomorrow. :)

What lower cost similar Panny's do you people recommend I look at as well while I am there?
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Check out the 5080 if you can find one, they're not much more than a $1000.00 and last year they went for $4000.00. I know it' 720p but you wont be dissapointed.
 
kiUNiT said:
vindieselgaf.jpg


Newer plasmas have fixed this and Your avatar scares the fuck out of me.
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just like lcd has fixed motion blur.... the issue is still there and worse than ever imo.

We have a 50" Panny Plasma from 2006 and a 42PZ800. I took some pics of my PZ800. The blue/green trails are a duller shade in person but otherwise it looks exactly like in the picture.

plasmatrails.jpg
 
kiUNiT said:
Check out the 5080 if you can find one, they're not much more than a $1000.00 and last year they went for $4000.00. I know it' 720p but you wont be dissapointed.
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i think he wants 1080p
 
big_z said:
just like lcd has fixed motion blur.... the issue is still there and worse than ever imo.

We have a 50" Panny Plasma from 2006 and a 42PZ800. I took some pics of my PZ800. The blue/green trails are a duller shade in person but otherwise it looks exactly like in the picture.
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you do realize that those were taken with a camera, and cameras have lag when you take images irl, and that is only made worse when taking photos of something on your tv...


ghosting/streaking on an lcd doesnt even look like that, what your showing is the camera lag, not the tv.
 
rod said:
you do realize that those were taken with a camera, and cameras have lag when you take images irl, and that is only made worse when taking photos of something on your tv...


ghosting/streaking on an lcd doesnt even look like that, what your showing is the camera lag, not the tv.
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that's a plasma not lcd.
 
big_z said:
thats a plasma.
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i know, what im saying is, even where ghosting on an LCD is MUCH more prominent than ANY plasma, it still doesnt look as bad as what you posted. get me?
 
rod said:
i know, what im saying is, even where ghosting on an LCD is MUCH more prominent than ANY plasma, it still doesnt look as bad as what you posted. get me?
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i understand your post but that doesnt change the fact that the pictures i posted are what you see in real life. like i said the only difference is that the blue/green is a duller shade in person.
 
big_z said:
i understand your post but that doesnt change the fact that the pictures i posted are what you see in real life. like i said the only difference is that the blue/green is a duller shade in person.
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thats bizzare, because i, like im sure a lot of people will agree, have never noticed anything as drastic on a tv as you have posted. unless the tv is broken, of course, but i doubt it.
 
As said many times in this thread, Panasonic and Pioneer plasmas are the best TV's out there. Panasonic was actually leading for quite a while, but the Kuro series is incredible (and you'll pay for every second of the experience). Really though, you can't go wrong with either. Its like bickering over buying a Ferrari or a Lamborghini.
 
rod said:
thats bizzare, because i, like im sure a lot of people will agree, have never noticed anything as drastic on a tv as you have posted. unless the tv is broken, of course, but i doubt it.
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if you have a plasma you can give it a shot yourself with any of those games. i can tell you exactly where i took the pictures. some games the problem is less noticeable... but the ones i used are heavy offenders to the point i find them almost unplayable. it's like having someone flash blue/green in your eyes constantly.

the condemmed 2 demo is the easiest to reproduce... black and white wall turns green via very slow side step.
 
big_z said:
if you have a plasma you can give it a shot yourself with any of those games. i can tell you exactly where i took the pictures.

the condemmed 2 demo is the easiest to reproduce... black and white wall turns green via very slow side step.
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i have the pioneer LX508A and can safely say i didnt notice anything like that. i do consider to be a pretty fussy IQ person too. so i definitely wouldve noticed it playing though condemned 2 entirely.

i didnt play burnout revenge long enough, and gears, well, i played that for nearly 6 months straight. cant say i saw that at all.
 
Dragona Akehi said:
The PZ800U is the best version of their 1080p line right now. But honestly, if you have the dosh for the Kuro, just buy that. You won't be disappointed.
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This is incorrect, the best model of them all is PZ85U. The only difference betweens the 800U and the 85U are THX, which is, in my opinion, completely useless, and $350. If you go with the 85U you can put that extra $350 you saved towards having the bad boy professionally calibrated. There is technically no difference in picture quality between the two sets. So on virtue of value/performance the PZ85U is the best unit in Panasonic's Viera line.
 
Brandon F said:
36" Sony XBR800 purchased 2002 - RIP 2008.

So what should I look at for my 360/PS3 experiences. What's a solid LCD 1080p TV that is recommendable? I haven't paid much attention for awhile...

Actually what's the status of LCD?(ghosting, etc...) Should I be looking at other tech? Help me GAF! I want to continue playing Vesperia!!
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I suggest spending your money on fixing your CRT. LCD and Plasma are both crap technologies.
 
*reads through thread*.....*hugs mys 34" XBR CRT*

I think it'll be awhile before I'll upgrade....this T.V. has spoiled me
 
plasma
-dithering
-color banding
-somewhat grey whites
-yellow/blue fringing and flashing on moving objects
-picture blurs onces the picture moves fairly fast
-dead pixels
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Dithering and color banding doesn't really apply to the Pioneer Kuro series, though. There is some PWM noise when viewed up close, but no actual dithering (though this remains an issue with most other plasmas). Same for banding. It's possible to create situation that may result in minor color banding, but in general, it's so minor that it's basically not even there. It's very comparable to my CRT in that regard.
 
Going from CRT to ANYTHING else is what you'd call a downgrade, not an upgrade...

But yes, if you can afford it, a Kuro is the next best thing you can get otherwise by far...

This is why I treasure my CRT greatly myself, and it's one of the big reasons as to why I enjoy my games so much...
 
Skilotonn said:
Going from CRT to ANYTHING else is what you'd call a downgrade, not an upgrade...

But yes, if you can afford it, a Kuro is the next best thing you can get otherwise by far...

This is why I treasure my CRT greatly myself, and it's one of the big reasons as to why I enjoy my games so much...
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Having slightly better picture quality at the expense of having a military sized anchor in your living room must really let you tap into games.
 
I have seen small OLED TV on display in local Sony store here. I swear it made everything else in the store look like crap. It made everything I've seen before, including CRTs, look like crap.

As for Brandon F - unless you have money for Sony XBR8 or Samsung Series 9 (LCD TVs that have local LED dimming and thus perfect black reproduction) go with Plasma, as instructed in Dragona's post.
 
Skilotonn said:
Going from CRT to ANYTHING else is what you'd call a downgrade, not an upgrade...

But yes, if you can afford it, a Kuro is the next best thing you can get otherwise by far...

This is why I treasure my CRT greatly myself, and it's one of the big reasons as to why I enjoy my games so much...
Click to expand...
Well, yes and no. The problem with CRTs is simply size. For my living room, the largest widescreen CRT is just too small. Not only that, they are terrible computer displays (which my Kuro serves as) due to overscan, geometry, and other issues.

The best displays out there are those high-end PC CRTs with insane resolution support, but they are only worthwhile in a close PC environment.

So, you lose some CRT benefits with a good plasma, but you gain size, clarity, and flawless geometry. Also, the ANSI contrast ratio is higher so there is a perfect contrast between lighting and dark. On a CRT, a bright box in the middle of a dark screen will cause the black areas to glow while this contrast is very stark on the plasma.

LCD TVs that have local LED dimming and thus perfect black reproduction
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They do not have perfect black reproduction, though. The LED panels can only produce black when that is the only color being shown. I think the old mouse cursor test is the best example of why those LED LCDs are flawed (if you move a mouse cursor around an otherwise black screen you get a large halo-like effect around the cursor). The black levels remain typical of LCD in lit areas.
 
Marconelly said:
(thus perfect black reproduction)
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no LCDs have anything close to it. the closest TV to have anything close to "perfect" black reproduction is the 9th gen kuro.
 
rod said:
no LCDs have anything close to it. the closest TV to have anything close to "perfect" black reproduction is the 9th gen kuro.
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XBR8 and Series 9 have local dimming / disabling of arrays of LED lights behind the screen. Which means no light coming from the black areas of the screen. Which means perfect black :-D

These two TVs are out now or should be later in september, but they are very expensive.

dark10x said:
They do not have perfect black reproduction, though. The LED panels can only produce black when that is the only color being shown. I think the old mouse cursor test is the best example of why those LED LCDs are flawed (if you move a mouse cursor around an otherwise black screen you get a large halo-like effect around the cursor). The black levels remain typical of LCD in lit areas.
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Not just LED backlight - but local LED dimming. Very different! They show black in the areas that's completely black, not just if the whole screen is black. As for the mouse cursor test, CRT fails that too as there's a glowing halo on CRT as well, but I wouldn't call that failing as the rest of the screen except for a bit around the cursor is unlit.
 
TheHeretic said:
Having slightly better picture quality at the expense of having a military sized anchor in your living room must really let you tap into games.
Click to expand...

dark10x said:
Well, yes and no. The problem with CRTs is simply size. For my living room, the largest widescreen CRT is just too small. Not only that, they are terrible computer displays (which my Kuro serves as) due to overscan, geometry, and other issues.

The best displays out there are those high-end PC CRTs with insane resolution support, but they are only worthwhile in a close PC environment.

So, you lose some CRT benefits with a good plasma, but you gain size, clarity, and flawless geometry. Also, the ANSI contrast ratio is higher so there is a perfect contrast between lighting and dark. On a CRT, a bright box in the middle of a dark screen will cause the black areas to glow while this contrast is very stark on the plasma.
Click to expand...

I don't own one of those living room sets, I own a 20" Philips 109 E5 - thin frame around the screen and small footprint - I love it since it doesn't look like one of those huge humpback CRTs with the huge frame around the screen... best of all it looks nice style-wise to this day...

So I use pretty much what you're suggesting dark10x, and I play at my desk so the distance is perfect for me with a screen this size, with no space issues either

6jddte.jpg


Gorgeous in 1080p, lovely colors...
 
AzureNightmareXE said:
This is incorrect, the best model of them all is PZ85U. The only difference betweens the 800U and the 85U are THX, which is, in my opinion, completely useless, and $350. If you go with the 85U you can put that extra $350 you saved towards having the bad boy professionally calibrated. There is technically no difference in picture quality between the two sets. So on virtue of value/performance the PZ85U is the best unit in Panasonic's Viera line.
Click to expand...

The 85U, like the 80U, has a terrible, terrible red push problem. The 800U (and *not* the 850U) is the only model which is widely regarded to be free from Panny's red push problem.

Do not get an 85U. The extra cash for the 800U is worth it. You can grab one for $1800-$1900 these days. Dooooo it.
 
You should take a look at this one. I bought it last week and it's awesome, really. And it's the only LCD I've seen that passes every single calibration tests. You can set basically everything picture-related, the refresh rate is 5ms so no need to worry about ghosting (and it displays 60fps correctly), it's 1080p, it has 1:1 "just scan" pixel display (which is awesome) aaand so much more.
 
I'm off to BestBuy to take a look at all these suggestions. I'm leaning towards the Pioneer 5020FD, but even with a 25% discount at $3k...I'm still not certain.

I'll definately check into the Samsung and Panny suggestions as well. Thanks everyone! Oh and I'll post pics of whatever I go with when its all setup. :)
 
Brandon F said:
I wanna cry now...

I'm leaning towards the Pioneer/Panny plasma since most of you are less hateful of them, but yeesh.
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this is what you get asking advice to GAF.

i opened a thread for a good jrpg for the ps2 (i already had some ideas in my mind) and ended up not buying anything.
 
dark10x said:
Dithering and color banding doesn't really apply to the Pioneer Kuro series, though. There is some PWM noise when viewed up close, but no actual dithering (though this remains an issue with most other plasmas). Same for banding. It's possible to create situation that may result in minor color banding, but in general, it's so minor that it's basically not even there. It's very comparable to my CRT in that regard.
Click to expand...


there's a color pattern on avs where it has all red, blue, green gradients in the picture. put that on the kuro and you will see the dithering and unsmooth color gradients. no flat panel seems to be able to pass that thing.

you'll never see dithering to that extent during normal viewing but it is there.
 
Afrikan said:
*reads through thread*.....*hugs mys 34" XBR CRT*

I think it'll be awhile before I'll upgrade....this T.V. has spoiled me
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Heh I still have my big-ass 36" Sony Wega CRT except now it's in the basement with my old systems hooked up to it. For my 360 in the living room, I went for the Sammy 46" 550 series. Very, very happy with it. I like that the screen is semi-matte so reflections/glare aren't an issue and I still haven't noticed any lag.
 
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