Deadly LAPD shooting of homeless man on skidrow is caught on video

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JackLongRod

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_BJYUnptes

In a dramatic confrontation caught on video, Los Angeles police shot and killed a homeless man in the heart of downtown's bustling skid row Sunday.

A video of the incident posted on Facebook (contains foul language) shows a group of officers getting into a scuffle with a man standing on a sidewalk littered with tents and other debris.

During the struggle, one officer drops his nightstick, which is picked up by a woman on the street. Two officers handcuff the woman.
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The man continues to scuffle with four of the officers, even after he's wrestled to the ground. One of the officers is heard saying "Drop the gun. Drop the gun."

Then, at least one of the officers opens fire on the man, who remained on the ground with at least two officers near him.

Five gunshots are heard on the recording.

Police have not identified the dead man or said how many officers were involved, or how many shots were fired. The man was declared dead at a hospital shortly after the shooting, which occurred about noon, according to police spokesman Sgt. Barry Montgomery.

The officers had responded to a robbery call in the 500 block of San Pedro Street, Montgomery said. He added that at one point during the struggle a Taser had been deployed, but investigators did not know if it struck the man who was subsequently shot.
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No officers were injured during the altercation, Montgomery said.

Witnesses at the scene identified the victim by his street name, “Africa”, and gave conflicting accounts of what they saw.

Dennis Horne, 29, said Africa had been fighting with someone else in his tent when police arrived.

When Africa refused to comply with a police order to come out of the tent, officers used the Taser on him and dragged him out, Horne said. The officers tackled Africa to the ground, where he continued to fight, which led to the fatal shooting, according to Horne.

“It's sad ,” Horne said. “There's no justification to take somebody's life.”Another witness, Lonnie Franklin, 53, said five to six officers pulled up in three to four cars as Africa was lying face down on the sidewalk. The officers approached with guns drawn yelling, ”down, down”, according to Franklin.

When Africa got up and started fighting, the officers “went straight to lethal force,” Franklin said.

But Jose Gil, 38 , said he saw the man swinging at the police and then heard one of the officers say, “Gun, gun, he's got my gun!” before police fired multiple shots.

Another witness, who asked not to be identified, said the man punched and kicked the officers and reached for one of their service weapons before the officers fired at least seven times.

An area resident, who identified himself as Booker T. Washington, said police had come by repeatedly to ask Africa to take down his tent. People are allowed to sleep on the streets from 9 p.m to 6 a.m., but they are supposed to remove their tents in the daytime, under a court agreement.

“This man got shot over a tent,” Washington said.

Ina Murphy, who lives in an apartment nearby, said Africa had arrived in the area about four or five months ago. He told her he had recently been released after spending 10 years in a mental facility, Murphy said.

Police Commission President Steve Soboroff first saw the video of the shooting via social media. He was watching it again when reached by a Times reporter Sunday evening, trying to hear what exactly the officers said to the man.

"My heart just started pounding just watching it," Soboroff said. "I feel the adrenaline. These situations are just so horrific."

Soboroff said a key issue would be whether the man did in fact try to grab the officer's gun, as some witnesses have told reporters. Otherwise, he said, it's unclear what might have prompted the use of deadly force.

"To me, that would be the only explanation that something would happen that quickly," Soboroff said. "It escalated. It escalated right in front of our eyes."

Soboroff acknowledged the video of the events leading up to the shooting — as well as its aftermath — was "dramatic." He stressed that the LAPD, its independent inspector general and the district attorney's office would all investigate the shooting "very, very carefully."

"Of course I would encourage people not to rush to judgement. It's not fair to anybody. It's not fair to the family of the victim or the victim or the officers," he said. "We'll find out what happened."
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Did he reach for the gun? To do this point blank in such a populated area during the day seems insanely stupid. Fucked up video.

You can hear them say drop the gun. I'm trying to see where he could have grabbed the gun.
 
A video of the incident posted on Facebook (contains foul language)
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Well I was all set to watch a video of a man being murdered but whoooooa, not if I have to deal with foul language!
 
MWS Natural said:
FUCK THE FUCKING POLICE


I can't wait for the "he was going for my gun" BS.
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Don't start this shit. You contribute nothing of value to any discussion like this.

hwalker84 said:
I thought he was saying. Stop touching my gun.
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I believe he said "drop the gun" but it could have been that. Something was going on during that struggle. Considering the officers used their tasers first, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they were trying to subdue the man.
 
hwalker84 said:
I thought he was saying. Stop touching my gun.
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Police lie about that so often that "Stop reaching for my gun." is a meme at this point.
 
Frog-fu said:
Don't start this shit. You contribute nothing of value to any discussion like this.



I believe he said "drop the gun" but it could have been that. Something was going on during that struggle. Considering the officers used their tasers first, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they were trying to subdue the man.
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Again...FUCK THE POLICE. You have a problem deal with that shit. Too many people have been murdered a the drop of a hat. I don't care what the officer said, too many incidents of them yelling BS out loud to give them probable cause to kill people.
 
MWS Natural said:
Again...FUCK THE POLICE. You have a problem deal with that shit. Too many people have been murdered a the drop of a hat. I don't care what the officer said, too many incidents of them yelling BS out loud to give them probable cause to kill people.
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You have clear video evidence of officers attempting to subdue the man. We know they tried tasering the man first. You hear at least one of them shout several warnings for the man to "drop the gun." We also know the man had a history of mental illness.

By what evidence can you confidently accuse the officers of murder?
 
you can hear the black officer yelling get off my gun in the scuffle and then he gets up to check his weapons utility belt. The homeless guy might have actually been trying to get a hold of the officers gun in this case.
 
EASTC0AST_GH05T said:
you can hear the black officer yelling get off my gun in the scuffle and then he gets up to check his weapons utility belt. The homeless guy might have actually been trying to get a hold of the officers gun in this case.
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At 17 seconds you can see the man holding tightly to the officer's weapon holster. And the black officer throwing punches, then trying to get the man off his holster. Ultimately shots are fired by the supervisor.

The question will be, did he actually get possession of the officer's gun?
 
TheJLC said:
At 17 seconds you can see the man holding tightly to the officer's weapon holster. And the black officer throwing punches, then trying to get the man off his holster. Ultimately shots are fired by the supervisor.

The question will be, did he actually get possession of the officer's gun?
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Whether he got the gun or not doesn't matter. No one is gonna condemn an officer for shooting to kill a violent suspect that went for their gun.

I'm more concerned with whether the officers escalated the situation rather than its conclusion. Yeah, the man was mentally ill and thus likely volatile, however, that doesn't mean the officers are automatically blameless of the way events unfolded.
 
wouldnt blame the cops to much if he really grabbed the gun.

case isnt 100% clear, it does look like he is reachin out for the gun on the left cop when he is on the ground. cant see if he had it or not. but the cop also looks like he is picking something up.

footage in better quality or another viewpoint would be needed...

rip :(
 
If the suspect was truly reaching for one of the officer's firearm and got a hold of it, things could have easily spiraled out of control, and even more people could have been injured or killed. The officer used the reasonable amount of force for the situation, in this case, it was deadly force.

I might seem a little biased on this, but I have a background in law enforcement. So I can easily see why the officer would do this. Was it the right call? It's hard to say from the short and unclear video. We also don't know all the facts, so I can't be one to judge.
 
TheJLC said:
At 17 seconds you can see the man holding tightly to the officer's weapon holster. And the black officer throwing punches, then trying to get the man off his holster. Ultimately shots are fired by the supervisor.

The question will be, did he actually get possession of the officer's gun?
Click to expand...

He was obviously working on it, so the shooting will be justified.
 
Fucking hell, here we go again. Either he had his own gun (unlikely,) he was going for another Officer's gun (possible,) or they just shot the guy and killed him cold blooded because they couldn't properly restrain him and overreacted like usual.

However this turns out, another tragedy involving Police and Guns in America.
 
TheJLC said:
At 17 seconds you can see the man holding tightly to the officer's weapon holster. And the black officer throwing punches, then trying to get the man off his holster. Ultimately shots are fired by the supervisor.

The question will be, did he actually get possession of the officer's gun?
Click to expand...
Just grabbing at a holstered weapon while being subdued justifies lethal force. I would not want to risk allowing someone to get full possession of my firearm before reacting. You are absolutely insane if you decide to do that while being subdued.
 
Wow at the differing eyewitness accounts. Goes to show how unreliable they can be. An unfortunate situation but it really does look like he was going for the officer's gun.
 
Frog-fu said:
Whether he got the gun or not doesn't matter. No one is gonna condemn an officer for shooting to kill a violent suspect that went for their gun.

I'm more concerned with whether the officers escalated the situation rather than its conclusion. Yeah, the man was mentally ill and thus likely volatile, however, that doesn't mean the officers are automatically blameless of the way events unfolded.
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Oh I'm aware of that, I'm talking merely wondering of the facts. Rather than, "this man got shot for no reason."

Oscar said:
He was obviously working on it, so the shooting will be justified.
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Absolutely. I'm just wondering if he did in fact disarm the officer.
 
Volimar said:
Wow at the differing eyewitness accounts. Goes to show how unreliable they can be. An unfortunate situation but it really does look like he was going for the officer's gun.
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I've had a gun put to my head while being robbed before. I barely remember the event other than constantly begging for my life and negotiating so they would leave me alone. When people go through trama, details can be fuzzy at best.
 
MWS Natural said:
FUCK THE FUCKING POLICE


I can't wait for the "he was going for my gun" BS.
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Did you watch the video or read the article? You can see him grabbing the cops holster clear as day. You also have witnesses who said he went for and grabbed the gun. Why not wait before flipping out.
 
Looks like the homeless guy reached for the police officer's gun. Seems to me like he was going to try to get back up because he turned his body and get an advantage on the officers. Obviously, an officer won't risk his life at all. That's my view.
 
So one of the witnesses say the suspect has been in the area for 4-5 month and told them he was in a mental institution for 10 years. If he did indeed reach for the officers gun that explains everything on such a bold risky insane move to make while being arrested.
 
EASTC0AST_GH05T said:
So one of the witnesses say the suspect has been in the area for 4-5 month and told them he was in a mental institution for 10 years. If he did indeed reach for the officers gun that explains everything on such a bold risky insane move to make while being arrested.
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I really wish smart gun technology would become more accepted.
 
Yikes, this is a tough one. I'm against the idea of execution without due process, but if the man had a gun (and he was acting erratically enough that I would not be surprised), it's hard to fault the officers. That being said, shooting more than once seems ridiculous, especially at such a close range.

This isn't as cut-and-dry as Tamir Rice or Michael Brown, but there should certainly be an investigation.

Was the woman connected in any way to the homeless man? Why did she pick up the nightstick?
 
The_Inquisitor said:
I really wish smart gun technology would become more accepted.
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yeah, i dont think it would be smart to have a gun that explodes in the wrong users arm judge dredd style. and it wouldn't have helped in this situation. /jk

yes an inteligent smartlock for the gun could be really helpfull.
 
Jenenser said:
yeah, i dont think it would be smart to have a gun that explodes in the wrong users arm judge dredd style. and it wouldn't have helped in this situation. /jk

yes an inteligent smartlock for the gun could be really helpfull.
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I can imagine a smartlock feature glitching out on a officer and locking up on him right before a intense gun battle with bad guys takes place.
 
Jenenser said:
yeah, i dont think it would be smart to have a gun that explodes in the wrong users arm judge dredd style. and it wouldn't have helped in this situation. /jk

yes an inteligent smartlock for the gun could be really helpfull.
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Oh man I really have to rematch that movie again.
 
I heard 'He has my gun! He has my gun!'.

If the person made a grab for the gun, then...yeah an officer might have overreacted and shot him despite the 4-5 officers on him. Still...I doubt anything well happen. Oh well.
 
So many bad situations that people aren't even reading the article or watching/listening to the video before flipping out anymore.
 
If he had the gun I completely understand (though with four of five people holding him down how are you just gonna let that happen?), however if he was just reaching for it...really lets shoot him up.
 
If he did grab a gun from a cop the cops are still partially at fault for failing to secure their weapons and how the fuck do 5 cops not control one guy?
 
Drop the gun! I just hope the cops remembered to at least sprinkle some crack on him.

Frankly, when six cops fail to restrain a single homeless man and have to 'more' resort to deadly force after shooting him at point blank range... whatever their official word is becomes a hard sell.
 
EloquentM said:
If he had the gun I completely understand (though with four of five people holding him down how are you just gonna let that happen?), however if he was just reaching for it...really lets shoot him up.
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Oh rest assured, the investigation will produce a gun. This you can be sure of.
 
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