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[Ominym]

I was pretty surprised that one guy who picked up the police baton didn't get shot. Isn't that a felony, or could at least be intent to assault an officer?

 

[Laieon]

Officers yelled "drop the gun."

Let's wait for all the facts to come out first. I don't think this is a clear case of police misconduct.

Boom, this. If the homeless guy actually had a gun (or was reaching for a gun), I see nothing wrong with that the cops did. Completely justifiable.

I'm only going off the article and the reactions in this thread though. I'm at work, so I can't watch the video right now.

 

[Extollere]

Damn, bystanders are pretty damn calm about the entire thing all things considered, I'd be booking it.



Hahaha

Its fucking LA. I've seen people open fire on cars in traffic. Last month a guy got shot three in the chest when I was checking the mail. You don't know how desensitized we are to gun shots around here.

 

[Frog-fu]

Drop the gun! I just hope the cops remembered to at least sprinkle some crack on him.

Frankly, when six cops fail to restrain a single homeless man and have to 'more' resort to deadly force after shooting him at point blank range... whatever their official word is becomes a hard sell.

They tried tasing him first. It didn't work. Then when they took him down, the officer on top repeatedly shouted something along the lines of "gun!"

Now bearing in mind these officers were trying to restrain the man and that the man in question was mentally ill, which is more likely, that these officers are just scummy murderers or that the situation got out of hand and they were forced to use lethal force?

Maybe next time, and there will be a next time, you shouldn't come into a thread with your mind already made up on who are the guilty parties regardless of the facts.

 

[Dead Man]

They tried tasking him first. It didn't work. Then when they took him down, the officer on top repeatedly shouted something along the lines of "gun!"

Now bearing in mind these officers were trying to restrain the man and that the man in question was mentally ill, which is more likely, that these officers are just scummy murderers or that the situation got out of hand and they were forced to use lethal force?

Maybe next time, and there will be a next time, you shouldn't come into a thread with your mind already made up on who are the guilty parties regardless of the facts.

Or maybe option C, they are just stupid fuckwits who never should have had the job in the first place, so therefore the situation got out of hand, and they are still cops who need to be covered up for? Next time try and account for all possibilities before you come into a thread trying to swing your dick.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

I can understand 4 armed and trained police officers fearing for their lives against one homeless dude. Completely reasonable force...

 

[Skeletron]

Damn, bystanders are pretty damn calm about the entire thing all things considered, I'd be booking it.



Hahaha

Yeah, that guy with the pink shirt in the background with his hands in his pockets doesn't move an inch when the shots go off. Chill as fuck.

 

[Volimar]

Or maybe option C, they are just stupid fuckwits who never should have had the job in the first place, so therefore the situation got out of hand, and they are still cops who need to be covered up for? Next time try and account for all possibilities before you come into a thread trying to swing your dick.

Wow, what are you doing? You need a nap or a snickers or something?

 

[Laieon]

Or maybe option C, they are just stupid fuckwits who never should have had the job in the first place, so therefore the situation got out of hand, and they are still cops who need to be covered up for? Next time try and account for all possibilities before you come into a thread trying to swing your dick.

I feel like people who try non-lethal methods like a taser before pulling out the real gun are the exact kind of people you want to have the job.

 

[Frog-fu]

Or maybe option C, they are just stupid fuckwits who never should have had the job in the first place, so therefore the situation got out of hand, and they are still cops who need to be covered up for? Next time try and account for all possibilities before you come into a thread trying to swing your dick.

You're suggesting all six officers involved were incompetent and that's why the homeless man was killed, really? That isn't taking into account possibilities, it's delusion.

No one is covering up anything. That's next to impossible considering we have video footage of the incident.

 

[Dead Man]

Wow, what are you doing? You need a nap or a snickers or something?

? Sorry, the post just shit me. And to me, letting yourself get put in that position when there are that many cops around supporting you is a failure.

I feel like people who try non-lethal methods like a taser before pulling out the real gun are the exact kind of people you want to have the job.

I think tasers are great, they are not a panacea. I would like to have seen them use other non lethal methods too, like appropriate restraint when beating up someone. One unarmed person should not end up dead when that many cops are on the scene.

You're suggesting all six officers involved were incompetent and that's why the homeless man was killed, really? That isn't taking into account possibilities, it's delusion.

No one is covering up anything. That's next to impossible considering we have video footage of the incident.

Nope. I am suggesting it is possible one of them was stupid enough to get their gun taken while beating a person, and therefore he will be protected by his buddies in blue.

I am suggesting it is possible. I am not saying it is what happened or will happen.

Can't wait for your next sensationalist failure at summarising a post you don't agree with.

 

[LeeRoyBrown]

So while being held down by 4 people. Getting taser gunned.

A homeless mentally ill man, managed to get his hand to undo a gun holster, and then take off the safety, at which point the officers shot him. ( I bet both of which didnt actually happen.)

I fucking love all the Americans comments in this thread and on youtube, who simply can't comprehend the officers being in the wrong.

MURICAH!

Maybe if they simply you know, fucking restrained him, instead of spending most of the time trying to punch him he would have just been held down.

 

[wachie]

Or maybe option C, they are just stupid fuckwits who never should have had the job in the first place, so therefore the situation got out of hand, and they are still cops who need to be covered up for? Next time try and account for all possibilities before you come into a thread trying to swing your dick.

there is a defense force for everything.

 

[Frog-fu]

Considering an officer likely had their firearm nearly taken from them whilst placing a suspect under arrest, I doubt anyone will argue mistakes weren't made. Like I posted earlier, the officers can still potentially be at fault for misconduct insofar as allowing the situation to escalate to the point it did.

 

[LabouredSubterfuge]

"He's coming right for us"

 

[Laieon]

So while being held down by 4 people. Getting taser gunned.

A homeless mentally ill man, managed to get his hand to undo a gun holster, and then take off the safety, at which point the officers shot him. ( I bet both of which didnt actually happen.)

I fucking love all the Americans comments in this thread and on youtube, who simply can't comprehend the officers being in the wrong.

MURICAH!

Maybe if they simply you know, fucking restrained him, instead of spending most of the time trying to punch him he would have just been held down.

Why does it have to be black and white? What if both sides are in the wrong? The cops could be in the wrong, but so could the homeless guy. This isn't a book, it's real life. It's okay to have grey areas. Sure, maybe the cops could've approached the situation differently so that it didn't escalate to the point that it did, but the homeless guy could've also chose not to reach for that gun.

I love all the comments in this thread and on youtube who simply can't comprehend that sometimes officers are in the right.

 

[Volimar]

Why does it have to be black and white? What if both sides are in the wrong? The cops could be in the wrong, but so could the homeless guy. This isn't a book, it's real life. It's okay to have great areas. Sure, maybe the cops could've approached the situation differently so that it didn't escalate to the point that it did, but the homeless guy could've also chose not to reach for that gun.

I love all the comments in this thread and on youtube who simply can't comprehend that sometimes officers are in the right.

Something something higher standard something something mental illness. I do wish people wouldn't jump the gun, but it's hard to argue that the police haven't given them good reason to.

 

[LeeRoyBrown]

Why does it have to be black and white? What if both sides are in the wrong? The cops could be in the wrong, but so could the homeless guy. This isn't a book, it's real life. It's okay to have great areas. Sure, maybe the cops could've approached the situation differently so that it didn't escalate to the point that it did, but the homeless guy could've also chose not to reach for that gun.

I love all the comments in this thread and on youtube who simply can't comprehend that sometimes officers are in the right.

Because it's 4 men on 1 are you blind?

I appologise for coming from a country where horseshit like this doesnt happen and half the users sit there watching a man die and say...well...he deserved it.

If I can restrain 1 man on my own, I would expect 4 men, that look similar size and build, who do this shit for a living to hold down 1 fucking guy.

1 guy. Their job is to protect the public, what if the shot misses and kills someone?

They royally fucked up what they were supposed to be doing.

Restrain the fucker, with your hands, when you have that done, taser him if he's being a shit.

I watched 1 security guard absolutely destroy a guy in a mall just the other day. With his hands.

It's not that hard.

 

[Chariot]

No officers were injured during the altercation, Montgomery said.

Well thank god, I was afraid that one of them broke a nail.

 

[RBK]

Too hard to tell what went down.

This

 

[Dead Man]

Considering an officer likely had their firearm nearly taken from them whilst placing a suspect under arrest, I doubt anyone will argue mistakes weren't made. Like I posted earlier, the officers can still potentially be at fault for misconduct insofar as allowing the situation to escalate to the point it did.

Very true. But there will be people who will argue no mistakes were made, sadly.

 

[Maitiú]

Sounds to me like the officer says "He's goin' for my gun! He's goin' for my gun!" I can't make out as well what he says after, but I think he says "he has my gun" and it looks like from these two frames I grabbed that the assailant did take the officer's gun (top: before gun was being grabbed. bottom: only a couple of frames before the first shot was fired.):

edit: nevermind, he didn't get his gun.. the full video shows the officer pulling out his gun moments after the man was killed.

 

[panty]

That's a legit murder.

And nothing happens to the officers.

USA

*shrugs*

 

[patapuf]

They tried tasing him first. It didn't work. Then when they took him down, the officer on top repeatedly shouted something along the lines of "gun!"

Now bearing in mind these officers were trying to restrain the man and that the man in question was mentally ill, which is more likely, that these officers are just scummy murderers or that the situation got out of hand and they were forced to use lethal force?

Maybe next time, and there will be a next time, you shouldn't come into a thread with your mind already made up on who are the guilty parties regardless of the facts.

Yeah no, if 4 police officers are forced to kill a mentally ill man because they can't deal with him they have nothing to do in the police force.

That's called being grossly incompetent.

 

[Laieon]

Because it's 4 men on 1 are you blind?

I appologise for coming from a country where horseshit like this doesnt happen and half the users sit there watching a man die and say...well...he deserved it.

If I can restrain 1 man on my own, I would expect 4 men, that look similar size and build, who do this shit for a living to hold down 1 fucking guy.

1 guy. Their job is to protect the public, what if the shot misses and kills someone?

They royally fucked up what they were supposed to be doing.

Restrain the fucker, with your hands, when you have that done, taser him if he's being a shit.

I watched 1 security guard absolutely destroy a guy in a mall just the other day. With his hands.

It's not that hard.

Did you miss the part where they tased him and it didn't seem to do anything? Again, it doesn't need to be black and white. Maybe the cops could've approached the situation differently. That doesn't mean the homeless guy was entirely in the right though, he could've done things differently too.

I don't care if you live in a country where this doesn't happen. I do too. Where I live, all cops really do is drive around and take naps in alleys. I still say this situation wasn't entirely unjustifiable, even if it could've been approached differently.

 

[ChainedMaster]

I virtually always side against cops. Yet I don't understand why people expect them to be perfect. So what if 4 cops were against one guy? All it takes is one slip for his hand to reach one of their guns. I'd hardly call that a mistake. Also, it kind of looks like the suspect fired the first shot? It doesn't look like any of the police drew their weapon yet when the first shot is heard.

 

[DrNeroCF]

The cop looks like he's swatting the guy's hand away from his gun a few times, and shifts his waist away from him. That freaking idiot on the street also takes it away from his reach (Thought she was going to grab it and give it to the cop, but it looks like she instead holds it up in a threatening manner, I think? Have a hard time believing anyone can be that stupid.)

If the cop had the baton, I'd imagine he would have had an easier time subduing the guy (yeah yeah, that's a nice way of saying beaten him unconscious), the 'eff the police' attitude really could have gotten that guy shot.

 

[patapuf]

I virtually always side against cops. Yet I don't understand why people expect them to be perfect. So what if 4 cops were against one guy? All it takes is one slip for his hand to reach one of their guns. I'd hardly call that a mistake.

"being perfect" in this case means not killing citizens. I think that's a fair expectation to have.

They can make mistakes when handing out parking tickets but not when pulling their gun.

 

[ChainedMaster]

"being perfect" in this case means not killing citizens. I think that's a fair expectation to have.

They can make mistakes when handing out parking tickets but not when pulling their gun.

If he obtained a gun, I don't see how the officers reacted incorrectly. The video shows what looks like him reaching for their weapon. So let's not go on assuming things before we know what happened because we really don't.

 

[Frog-fu]

Very true. But there will be people who will argue no mistakes were made, sadly.

Those people are dipshits not worth paying attention to.

One thing is for sure, calling these officers murderers is premature at best and malicious at worst.

Yeah no, if 4 police officers are forced to kill a mentally ill man because they can't deal with him they have nothing to do in the police force.

That's called being grossly incompetent.

Mistakes and incompetence are harmonious, not mutually inclusive.

 

[Drensch]

Just Curious, because this thread is already going the way of any thread on GAF with police, can police use deadly force ever?

It's not like this guy was walking down the street minding his own business, he was engaged in fisticuffs with several officers, had been tased. It was clearly hard for them to even get him close to restrained. If he got a gun, do you think he's not a threat?

 

[RBK]

can police use deadly force ever?

Of course yes, but it's usually a last resort tactic.

If the victim(or suspect) was reaching for or did obtain the gun, the actions are validated. The angle of the video doesn't show enough for me at least to say that's the case.

 

[NotBacon]

1. Are we REALLY going to start jumping to conclusions when we don't even have a clear picture of what happened? This can easily go either way. But I guess GAF gonna GAF.

2. Four cops should easily be able to subdue a homeless man

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

You have clear video evidence of officers attempting to subdue the man. We know they tried tasering the man first. You hear at least one of them shout several warnings for the man to "drop the gun." We also know the man had a history of mental illness.

By what evidence can you confidently accuse the officers of murder?

Just cause they say he's going for the gun doesn't mean the homeless actually did. Maybe he was trying to scramble up and was grabbing on to anything he could.

I feel like people who try non-lethal methods like a taser before pulling out the real gun are the exact kind of people you want to have the job.

I'd rather have cops who don't use a taser or gun as their first two options. How about recognizing that the guy is mentally ill and violence of any kind won't solve the problem.

Just Curious, because this thread is already going the way of any thread on GAF with police, can police use deadly force ever?

It's not like this guy was walking down the street minding his own business, he was engaged in fisticuffs with several officers, had been tased. It was clearly hard for them to even get him close to restrained. If he got a gun, do you think he's not a threat?

Mentally ill people are more a threat to themselves.

 

[Zok310]

Surprised that 4 cops could not restrain a deranged vagrant.
Sucks that guy had to lose his life.

 

[patapuf]

If he obtained a gun, I don't see how the officers reacted incorrectly. The video shows what looks like him reaching for their weapon. So let's not go on assuming things before we know what happened because we really don't.

And if you are 4 on 1 and the guy gets a gun from one of the police officers i don't get how anyone can argue that no mistakes were made, sorry.

I get getting scared in a 1 on 1. But here? nope.

If you are grossly negligent in any job, you have to own up to the consequences. If a mechanic fucks up repairing your car and it results in an accident he is liable.

I don't see why police officers would be exempt.

 

[Frog-fu]

Just cause they say he's going for the gun doesn't mean the homeless actually did. Maybe he was trying to scramble up and was grabbing on to anything he could.

I'm inclined to believe the suspect was reaching for the gun, otherwise the officer on top of him wouldn't have reacted as though he were.

Regardless of whether he was successful or not or wasn't even reaching for it, all that is necessary is that the officers believed he had.

 

[ChainedMaster]

And if you are 4 on 1 and the guy gets a gun from one of the police officers i don't get how anyone can argue that no mistakes were made, sorry.

I get getting scared in a 1 on 1. But here? nope.

If you are grossly negligent in any job, you have to own up to the consequences. If a mechanic fucks up repairing your car and it results in an accident he is liable.

I don't see why police officers would be exempt.

I never said it wasn't a mistake. I said letting someone's hand slip through is hardly a mistake. Expecting to always perfectly subdue a crazed suspect is unrealistic.

 

[Nappuccino]

We need to have better video surveillance. The guy might have gone for the gun, but it's hard to tell for sure. Cops shouting "he's going for my gun" shouldn't be evidence alone because they seem to shout that any time they want to be sure everything they do is "justified."

I'm sure this doesn't happen all the time, but c'mon-- http://www.nydailynews.com/news/cri...ates-nj-man-implicates-cops-article-1.1701763

 

[Coffee Dog]

I'm inclined to believe the suspect was reaching for the gun, otherwise the officer on top of him wouldn't have reacted as though he were.

Regardless of whether he was successful or not or wasn't even reaching for it, all that is necessary is that the officers believed he had.

Uh, what

 

[Nappuccino]

Uh, what

Yeah . . . that's not how "innocent until proven guilty" works.

 

[patapuf]

I never said it wasn't a mistake. I said letting someone's hand slip through is hardly a mistake. Expecting to always perfectly subdue a crazed suspect is unrealistic.

i'm not expecting perfect. i expect that they can do it without killing the person they are arresting.

 

[Dhuie]

Woah,

Also why do so many of the USA police look like they all played high school football. ie, they're big as fuk. Do they recruit at games OR are they wearing some vest that makes them look bigger... do they all bulk up at the police gym ?

Just an observation.

 

[Frog-fu]

Uh, what

That's how most legal systems I know of work and I believe that is the case in the US. It would place an onerous burden on law enforcement officers to be 100% certain they are in danger every time they act. It's an unreasonable expectation that would make LEO second guess themselves and open themselves to greater odds of injury and death.

Similarly, in most legal systems, self defence is applicable where you believe you are in danger.

 

[ramuh]

Damn. Everything was going so fast. Wasn't he being arrested or questioned based on the fact of suspicion of robbery? And what was that crazy girl doing grabbing a nightstick. TBH I think pulling a gun was a excessive. I always go to what President Roosevelt would have done. He would have use the nightstick until the suspect couldn't resist anymore. The nightstick is a Bad Bad weapon that has been used for a LONG time to subdue criminals etc.

Not shoot him.

 

[Ghostage]

How the fuck can't 4 cops hold one man down, they should easily be able to handle that situation.
Then again, why the fuck would you try to grab a cops gun, seriously, you always have a choice to just be calm and co-operate with the cops.

 

[theignoramus]

Larger picture, it's quite disgusting a simple case of vagrancy ends with a man being mugged, then shot like a dog. Why in the fuck were the cops even involved in a violent confrontation with this man? So what if dude wasnt being cooperative about packing up his shit and leaving, they have to respond to every belligerent drifter and squatter with brute force?

 

[M.Bluth]

Larger picture, it's quite disgusting a simple case of vagrancy ends with a man being mugged, then shot like a dog. Why in the fuck were the cops even involved in a violent confrontation with this man? So what if dude wasnt being cooperative about packing up his shit and leaving, they have to respond to every belligerent drifter and squatter with brute force?

These repeating stories just goes to show that there's a serious problem with America's police having a large number of unprofessional violent thugs in the force.

 

[dc89]

We're seeing stuff like this every week now. Disgrace.

 

[GrizzleBoy]

Too many guns. Too many poorly trained gang members (police). Too many civilians treated as enemy soldiers(or enemy gang members "someone like YOU shouldn't be in THIS side of town). Too many pointless killings.

And it will never stop.

GG.