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Dota 2 Beta Thread V: Real Talk Strikes Back [Tutorials]
- Thread starter Artanisix
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Technosteve
Banned
DD picked CHEN.
SteveWinwood
Member
I was using auto-spectate all yesterday, and today it still says my courier only has 2 views. And I have him equipped. So hmmm.
Anyone else using this had their views count?
Courier views are broken right now. We'll probably get a fix Monday.
Courier views are broken right now. We'll probably get a fix Monday.
Cool cool.
I guess it doesn't matter either way. I've actually been watching these games, and have been really enjoying them. Just figured I would ask.
Nah I was at the bar getting some drinks. Lol people booing pl pick, hope he gets crushed ( probably won't) . A lot of people here it's pretty cool.
yo gimme a shoutout next time randy phandy
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Good way to kill time between the matches.
http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueofleg...can_league_of_legends_learn_from_dota/ca1sdgr
This is amazing. Its like stockholm syndromePeople are still enjoying the game for what it is. Farming is a part of gaming which most players find appealing and makes them motivated(works for me at least). And you obviously can't make a company throw so much content away for free when they could be making money out of it. Riot(like every company) is there to make money, not just make players happy with free stuff.
This is amazing. Its like stockholm syndrome
Reminds me of the weekly dota vs lol threads.
SteveWinwood
Member
This is amazing. Its like stockholm syndrome
no you don't understand this clearly shitty thing is actually good!
okay
yo gimme a shoutout next time randy phandy
Sorry, shoutout rights go to honGAF.
Sorry, shoutout rights go to honGAF.
fu
you called it.sigh shoulda picked pl
they might lose tho.
why is pl so hard to kill, 5/4/1 20 minutes in
dopplewalk needs to be more obvious
The fact that he is having a bad game doesnt invalidate our point.
The fact that he is having a bad game doesnt invalidate our point.
Yes it does, he didn't have a bad game, he got countered.
He started out 3 and 0, but Mouz gave him no room to farm, and they picked heroes which are ready to go earlier.
That was PL with absolutely optimal supporting cast, and he is getting shat on.
Yes it does, he didn't have a bad game, he got countered.
He started out 3 and 0, but Mouz gave him no room to farm, and they picked heroes which are ready to go earlier.
That was PL with absolutely optimal supporting cast, and he is getting shat on.
An offensive jungle Chen isn't exactly the best supporting cast for a safe lane pl vs a trilane.
close to the edge
Member
An offensive jungle Chen isn't exactly the best supporting cast for a safe lane pl vs a trilane.
Mouz forced the Chen to offensive jungle because they blocked 3 of his camps. They just played that lane pretty much perfectly.
Mouz forced the Chen to offensive jungle because they blocked 3 of his camps. They just played that lane pretty much perfectly.
Yes, mouz playing really well. Definitly the best way to deal with Chen. Just saying pl did not have an optimal start.
Yes it does, he didn't have a bad game, he got countered.
He started out 3 and 0, but Mouz gave him no room to farm, and they picked heroes which are ready to go earlier.
That was PL with absolutely optimal supporting cast, and he is getting shat on.
We have 3 pages of why some think PL is unbalanced now, and even with some nice changes that could be made to make things more even. If you think this only battle invalidates everything, fine, probably nothing I say will change that. You're right, PL is fine, I'm sure no revisions will be made on him.
Yes, mouz playing really well. Definitly the best way to deal with Chen. Just saying pl did not have an optimal start.
I didn't say he had an optimal start, I said he did not have a bad start, and that he has pretty close to the optimal teammates to give him room to farm. Mouz is still not giving him room to farm even with the advantage of having such great heroes around him.
We have 3 pages of why some think PL is unbalanced now, and even with some nice changes that could be made to make things more even. If you think this only battle invalidates everything, fine, probably nothing I say will change that. You're right, PL is fine, I'm sure no revisions will be made on him.
You used a relevant sample size of 2 yesterday trying to prove your point yesterday, writing shit like that isn't gonna make your argument any stronger.
SteveWinwood
Member
Just because the conversation happens doesn't mean it's worth discussing. I'm not saying your wrong or right, just that that point doesn't matter by itself.We have 3 pages of why some think PL is unbalanced now, and even with some nice changes that could be made to make things more even.
Pureauthor
Member
We have 3 pages of why some think PL is unbalanced now, and even with some nice changes that could be made to make things more even. If you think this only battle invalidates everything, fine, probably nothing I say will change that. You're right, PL is fine, I'm sure no revisions will be made on him.
Pst. Icefrog considered Drow more deserving of a nerf than PL.
Drow.
We have 3 pages of why some think PL is unbalanced now, and even with some nice changes that could be made to make things more even. If you think this only battle invalidates everything, fine, probably nothing I say will change that. You're right, PL is fine, I'm sure no revisions will be made on him.
People can 'think' whatever they want to 'think', but PL is objectively and factually not unbalanced at all. Not even at pub levels.
He's not that strong early, and certainly isn't the strongest late game hero. He is as easily countered as any other hard carry, and easier than some.
He may not be fun to play against, but that is subjective and ephemeral, and has nothing to do with balance.
Technosteve
Banned
SYND feed like a Pro, Mouz won ward wars on radiant jungle forced chen to go dire jungle.
If Chen got the early creeps Mouz would of lost Bot lane easily.
If Chen got the early creeps Mouz would of lost Bot lane easily.
Mouz is running away with it! Anyone else put mouz in first place?
I think I had them for second.
Feels bad, didn't bet on them this morning
Maleficence
Member
Tried playing invoker for the first time v bots.
God this is dota on the next level, so hard to get it all right without checking each time. Amazing in the right hands, sure, but I don't think I can be bothered to put the effort in to practice him.
God this is dota on the next level, so hard to get it all right without checking each time. Amazing in the right hands, sure, but I don't think I can be bothered to put the effort in to practice him.
I don't think pl is op in the pro scene, didn't Bruno have the stat where gyro has like a 60% win rate against him?
Pl can be stopped, like all hard carries. It requires coordination. Where he's really strong is in pubs where you have 2/5 of your team chat banned or not speaking the same language, or just being bad. Then it's almost impossible for 3 people to stop him. I think it makes him a little stronger than heros like am and Luna.
You can more easily kill heros like Luna with 2-3 people, as opposed to pl who is gonna runaway from your sentries, purge the dust, and you can't by a gem because the retards on your team won't group to protect it. Just some examples of why I think he's strong. I think he's easier to deal with if you have 5 people working together, which is less common in pubs.
Pl can be stopped, like all hard carries. It requires coordination. Where he's really strong is in pubs where you have 2/5 of your team chat banned or not speaking the same language, or just being bad. Then it's almost impossible for 3 people to stop him. I think it makes him a little stronger than heros like am and Luna.
You can more easily kill heros like Luna with 2-3 people, as opposed to pl who is gonna runaway from your sentries, purge the dust, and you can't by a gem because the retards on your team won't group to protect it. Just some examples of why I think he's strong. I think he's easier to deal with if you have 5 people working together, which is less common in pubs.
I don't think pl is op in the pro scene, didn't Bruno have the stat where gyro has like a 60% win rate against him?
PL has a pretty solid 50% win rate in Pro games. So he does seem to be in a decent spot there.
Edit: Actually, it is a 46% winrate for the year. 248 Picks, 116 Wins, 132 Loses.
Unless you think all that we discussed is equal to nothing, I think it's fair to show that he can read 3 pages of people showing arguments on why they think PL needs a revision. It's no "shit I'm writing", it's just easier than writing everything all over again.You used a relevant sample size of 2 yesterday trying to prove your point yesterday, writing shit like that isn't gonna make your argument any stronger.
And? They changed other heroes before "fixing" Lycan and Morphling, that doesnt mean those were more imba than them.Pst. Icefrog considered Drow more deserving of a nerf than PL.
Drow.
People can 'think' whatever they want to 'think', but PL is objectively and factually not unbalanced at all. Not even at pub levels.
He's not that strong early, and certainly isn't the strongest late game hero. He is as easily countered as any other hard carry, and easier than some.
As you said, people can 'think' whatever they want to 'think', and if you 'think' your opinion is a fact by telling me that he was countered this game, nice for you.
close to the edge
Member
I don't think pl is op in the pro scene, didn't Bruno have the stat where gyro has like a 60% win rate against him?
Pl can be stopped, like all hard carries. It requires coordination. Where he's really strong is in pubs where you have 2/5 of your team chat banned or not speaking the same language, or just being bad. Then it's almost impossible for 3 people to stop him. I think it makes him a little stronger than heros like am and Luna.
You can more easily kill heros like Luna with 2-3 people, as opposed to pl who is gonna runaway from your sentries, purge the dust, and you can't by a gem because the retards on your team won't group to protect it. Just some examples of why I think he's strong. I think he's easier to deal with if you have 5 people working together, which is less common in pubs.
With a team like that, you're not killing an Anti-Mage either.
edit: But yes, I get your point. PL is really damn annoying in pubs, especially with a KotL.
Technosteve
Banned
DD was playing Chinese Dota, but they did a real bad job securing farm for him and protecting him.
Unless you think all that we discussed is equal to nothing, I think it's fair to show that he can read 3 pages of people showing arguments on why they think PL needs a revision. It's no "shit I'm writing", it's just easier than writing everything all over again.
And? They changed other heroes before "fixing" Lycan and Morphling, that doesnt mean those were more imba than them.
As you said, people can 'think' whatever they want to 'think', and if you 'think' your opinion is a fact by telling me that he was countered this game, nice for you.
There are actual statistics on my side, it has been shown over and over than PL does not win an unreasonable percentage of games and that he can be shut down completely with proper strategy.
He is a good hard carry, but he is clearly not OP.
The only reason there is so much anti PL fervor is because of the visceral emotional response seeing an army of PL clones causes, but when you put the emotions away and look at the numbers, it's not really that scary.
Siding with Bruno on this one, this was more Mouz's draft and execution doing work. Pulled the Chen all over the map and was able to have a really fast-leveling and fluid trilane as a result, ganked Phantom Lancer consistently well until the end of the game, and just generally fared better in teamfights with the level and gold advantage. DD were stretched to the breaking point and shattered.DD was playing Chinese Dota, but they did a real bad job securing farm for him and protecting him.
With a team like that, you're not killing an Anti-Mage either.
edit: But yes, I get your point. PL is really damn annoying in pubs, especially with a KotL.
I agree, I guess I should have added I assumed the following which may not always be true.
In pubs pl gets tranqs and diffusal.
In pubs am gets battle fury treads then manta. Once he has the manta he's probably just as hard to kill because he can split out of the silence, but I feel like pl is am slippery with just the diffusal, which comes out faster than bf and manta.
The tranquil boots nerf was a really good nerf against pl, especially in pubs IMO.
As you said, people can 'think' whatever they want to 'think', and if you 'think' your opinion is a fact by telling me that he was countered this game, nice for you.
So a game where a team [mouz] actually bothered to counter PL doesn't count, but a game where a team [Rox.Kis] doesn't do anything to counter PL, it shows that PL is super imba broken?
ok.
There are actual statistics on my side, it has been shown over and over than PL does not win an unreasonable percentage of games and that he can be shut down completely with proper strategy.
He is a good hard carry, but he is clearly not OP.
When I say he is unbalanced, I don't say that every time he's picked it'll be a 100% win. I mean that once he is given some space, its amost impossible to counter. You can say: just counter him early on! But in my opinion, no carry should be like that, except those ones that take a lot more time to be useful. If both teams are somewhat farming equally, once PL has a diffusal and manta or even Yasha, it's really, really hard to recover. If you think this isnt the case, nice, I'd love to have you on my team whenever I face other PL.
SteveWinwood
Member
The amount of discussion means nothing to the validity of it.Unless you think all that we discussed is equal to nothing, I think it's fair to show that he can read 3 pages of people showing arguments on why they think PL needs a revision. It's no "shit I'm writing", it's just easier than writing everything all over again.
Unless you think creationists have a point as well, because they sure talk a lot! Must be right then.
The amount of discussion means nothing to the validity of it.
Unless you think creationists have a point as well, because they sure talk a lot! Must be right then.
I'm starting to not get what you're trying to say. What I mean: "just look back at the arguments we made, this one fight invalidates all of them?"
Also: sorry for the english mistakes, it's not my first language and I'm writing so much that there are going to be a lot of 'Engrish' in my posts.
Technosteve
Banned
wtf is going on, on the GD stream
When I say he is unbalanced, I don't say that every time he's picked it'll be a 100% win. I mean that once he is given some space, its amost impossible to counter. You can say: just counter him early on! But in my opinion, no carry should be like that, except those ones that take a lot more time to be useful. If both teams are somewhat farming equally, once PL has a diffusal and manta or even Yasha, it's really, really hard to recover. If you think this isnt the case, nice, I'd love to have you on my team whenever I face other PL.
People have given numerous examples of heroes that can 1v1 even a fed 6 slot PL and other hard carries that are similarly hard to counter when given free farm. A gyro, sven, tiny or a luna can beat a PL with MORE farm than they have. A 6 slot Medusa or Void WILL solo entire teams including an equally farmed carry(even a PL).
He is not almost impossible to counter, and he does not require substantially less farm than other carries to be effective. A Luna with boots and drums and level 7 is basically good to go for team fighting and pushing, and at that point in the game PL will be food for her. Simply stating repeatedly that it is hard to counter PL doesn't make that the case when the statistic tell a different story.
Drow needed a nerf but not as huge as the one she got.Pst. Icefrog considered Drow more deserving of a nerf than PL.
Drow.
Campfire songs, jokes in Swedish, interview in French.wtf is going on, on the GD stream
MurkyZebra2417
Member
GD Stream is totally lagging for me?
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