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[The Chairman]

In a recent interview at TGS he expressed his frustration about US influence affecting his games like removing main character genders as well as censorship of many female characters in the game.



Glad to see they are confirming everything that people has been calling out for these last years.

 

[gokurho]

I am a Type 1

 

[TheDarkPhantom]

We need more legends in the industry speaking out, particularly in the West where the well is being poisoned from.

 

[mansoor1980]

he has balls of a dragon

 

[ManaByte]

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

Yes, good. Let them fight in public, under the bright light of the sun. That's a step in the right direction.

 

[StereoVsn]

What’s dumb is that SE allowed those influences in DQ3. Their audience doesn’t care about the culture wars and the “Modern Audience” won’t buy the game either way.

They upset their core customers for no gain. Yea, it’s the influence of dumb shit from the West, but it’s on SE to succumb to that for a remake of 35 year old game.

 

[kizito]

Damn, these guys spoke facts, quite impressive to see them talk so openly about that. And nice to see the female presentator being on the same page.

 

[Kurotri]

This needs to happen more and more. People need to bring this up and not be afraid. I fully believe trends can be reversed in time. Good on him.

 

[Ridicululzz]

So the costume being changed for the age rating I can understand, but who told them you can't have male/female anymore? Their localization team?

 

[Luipadre]

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

Imagine having such strict regulations as to touch on details like body types for character selection screens, while at the same time being absolutely ok with bug ridden, underperforming stutter fests of games releasing on your digital store front without question. Priorities, man.

 

[GHG]

Who wants to tell them?

 

[Fabieter]

Weird western people.

 

[lh032]

What’s dumb is that SE allowed those influences in DQ3. Their audience doesn’t care about the culture wars and the “Modern Audience” won’t buy the game either way.

They upset their core customers for no gain. Yea, it’s the influence of dumb shit from the West, but it’s on SE to succumb to that for a remake of 35 year old game.

Just like Totoki. FU SIE.

 

[Bloobs]

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

What’s dumb is that SE allowed those influences in DQ3. Their audience doesn’t care about the culture wars and the “Modern Audience” won’t buy the game either way.

They upset their core customers for no gain. Yea, it’s the influence of dumb shit from the West, but it’s on SE to succumb to that for a remake of 35 year old game.

It's not on SE at all.

Companies have no means to understand what the vast majority of consumers care about, other than what the media chirps on and social media analytics.

Only now is it becoming clear that 2/3rds of people in the real world don't share the same views as those who dominate social media. What has happened in the past half decade is that a small but very vocal minority has bullied the majority into silence online so that only their views represent the absolute majority of online discourse. What this led to was a picture, transcribed by the social media algorithms and data analytics, of a majority set of views that in actual fact was only representative by a small minority on the far left.

Thankfully, all that is coming to light and the silent majority is starting to speak up. But major online platforms like Reddit still vociferously moderate non-compliant views. So, if you were to take Reddit, for example, as a representative sample of the wider populace's views, you would end up with a radically left skewed viewpoint, because all the mods on the site ban everyone espousing anything any further right than even a centre-left position.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Let's look at the things bought up in the interview

• First they say its about age ratings so that they can sell more copies, but we all know that the game with the highest sales in the world is rated mature
• They mention for the male and female options they changed them to Type 1 and Type 2 and then proceed to say they don't even know who is complaining about that, so why did they make they change? Other games certainly still allow you to choose male or female.

So it seems like they're self-censoring in hopes of selling more units and blaming the decision process on the West.

 

[Mister Wolf]

They are cowards for relenting.

 

[StereoVsn]

It's not on SE at all.

Companies have no means to understand what the vast majority of consumers care about, other than what the media chirps on and social media analytics.

Only now is it becoming clear that 2/3rds of people in the real world don't share the same views as those who dominate social media. What has happened in the past half decade is that a small but very vocal minority has bullied the majority into silence online so that only their views represent the absolute majority of online discourse. What this led to was a picture, transcribed by the social media algorithms and data analytics, of a majority set of views that in actual fact was only representative by a small minority on the far left.

Thankfully, all that is coming to light and the silent majority is starting to speak up. But major online platforms like Reddit still vociferously moderate non-compliant views. So, if you were to take Reddit, for example, as a representative sample of the wider populace's views, you would end up with a radically left skewed viewpoint, because all the mods on the site ban everyone espousing anything any further right than even a centre-left position.

It is ok SE. You don’t base your sales on god damn Reddit.

Who are going to be the core audience? Realistically older gamers nostalgic for those 90s RPGs (yes, it was technically released in 1987). Would these people want these stupid changes? Not really.

So SE chose to piss off the core audience for …. very small chance of expanding the audience to people who would care about Male and Female as available genders or want censorship on tiny sprites?

A modicum of critical thinking would have told them that this audience either doesn’t exist or is tiny and it’s not worth f-by with their core customers.

But SE has been known to lack any sort of business acumen or critical thinking for years.

 

[Fake]

We are reaching the limit here. Danjin44 Is not so silly think to talk about, the guy have spoke. Is stupid those modifications.

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

Pulling no punches here. Amazing.

 

[StereoVsn]

They are cowards for relenting.

It’s not even that they are trying to appease anyone.

They are doing it in the hope to increase sales to the modern audience which doesn’t exist for this game. The people they are making changes for won’t buy this game.

 

[Alexios]

I mean, wanting a lower age rating for the sales is their own decision (and it probably influences a ton more than just showing skin but the whole story, themes etc.), clearly games can look way sexier than any Dragon Quest if they don't care about that, see Stellar Blade. I guess extra art assets have a given (miniscule when it comes to just a few edits) cost but how does any western localization require different gender/type labels in Japanese? I don't think folks want 90 year old dudes from Japan ideals enforced worldwide, or should underaged girl panty shots be the norm in all our media now? Maybe some rules are ridiculous when it comes to marketing stuff to children (murder is a-ok) but it's Japan that has a major issue with a declining age of the population and that's not due to any imported western woke culture but whatever the culture these aging people cultivated before that was.

 

[Fake]

I so glad the man speak out about this. And is really good knowing that even him is tired of this censor bullshit that some folks here keep trying to downplay.

Its his artwork that have being damage by west mentality. I know his frustation.

 

[envyzeal]

This video should be mandatory in every studio

 

[Alexios]

Its his artwork that have being damage by west mentality. I know his frustation.

I don't think he does the artwork, surely that's mostly on Akira Toriyama and probably since then an army of artists at Level 5, Square etc. that simply imitate his designs for most content while he maybe did main characters or something, and they will continue to imitate him long past his death too...

 

[Saber]

The guy is a legend, no wonder he is the DQ creator.

You guys should push that stupid thing back. I have high hopes for them to stop working with those weirdos entirelly.

 

[Drake]

With how unpopular this stuff is now and how much it can actually hurt the sales of games I'm surprised SE still decided to go in that direction. That being said when this was made there wasn't the giant push back against it that there is now.

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Square Enix's fatal error as well other companies is playing the game in the first place.

They caved (likely due to pressure from their Western branches or companies akin to Sweet Baby) and now the reversing the decision is more difficult than if they'd just stuck with male/female and let the 0.5% of lunatics cry on the Internet.

 

[Hypereides]

Honestly, its time someone starts developing decently budgeted games that ridicule/caricaturize this politically driven entertainment culture that has been fostered in the recent decade. Its a pitch that's ripe for the taking. Someone in this industry must have the gonads to do it. The activist gaming journos will definitely throw a fit about it.

 

[Fake]

I don't think he does the artwork, surely that's mostly on Akira Toriyama and probably since then an army of artists that simply imitate his designs while he maybe did main characters or something, and they will continue to imitate him long past his death probably.

You mean artstyle. Is more like a co-op between Akira Toriyama and Yuji Hori
. I know Akira Toriryama artstyle is what make DQ possible.

But he still have the right to complain about, I don't get your point.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

It is ok SE. You don’t base your sales on god damn Reddit.

Who are going to be the core audience? Realistically older gamers nostalgic for those 90s RPGs (yes, it was technically released in 1987). Would these people want these stupid changes? Not really.

So SE chose to piss off the core audience for …. very small chance of expanding the audience to people who would care about Male and Female as available genders or want censorship on tiny sprites?

A modicum of critical thinking would have told them that this audience either doesn’t exist or is tiny and it’s not worth f-by with their core customers.

But SE has been known to lack any sort of business acumen or critical thinking for years.

Companies do not base their multi-million dollar business decisions on hearsay and gut feelings.

Marketing is practically all data-driven these days. And what I'm telling you is that the data has been poisoned for the past half-decade. Yet you still want to blame SE for making data-driven marketing decisions, just because you think something is common sense today, when we now have the benefit of hindsight.

5 yrs ago when this Dragon Quest game in question was being made, neither SE nor you nor I would have had any clue that the mass market's actual views don't align with the views represented in social media analytics. Heck, back then people right here on Gaf were using Google analytics to justify arguments about the sentiments of the masses. It's only now that we know about the radical left capture and active censorship of any views that dissent from their own.

 

[TheAssist]

Honestly, its time someone starts developing decently budgeted games that ridicule/caricaturize this politically driven entertainment culture that has been fostered in the recent decade. Its a pitch that's ripe for the taking. Someone in this industry must have the gonads to do it. The activist gaming journos will definitely throw a fit about it.

Lets wait and see if GTA6 adresses it

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

Companies do not base their multi-million dollar business decisions on hearsay and gut feelings.

The only relevant data is sales. They have all the means to know what happens to games that go that route.

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Companies do not base their multi-million dollar business decisions on hearsay and gut feelings.

Marketing is practically all data-driven these days. And what I'm telling you is that the data has been poisoned for the past half-decade. Yet you still want to blame SE for making data-driven marketing decisions, just because you think something is common sense today, when we now have the benefit of hindsight.

5 yrs ago when this Dragon Quest game in question was being made, neither SE nor you nor I would have had any clue that the mass market's actual views don't align with the views represented in social media analytics. Heck, back then people right here on Gaf were using Google analytics to justify arguments about the sentiments of the masses. It's only now that we know about the radical left capture and active censorship of any views that dissent from their own.

I agree and marketing departments themselves are also a poisoned as they're run by college educated liberal minded woke activists and (as are most organisations) and so when a company such as Square, Capcom or Sony ask for market research data or enlist a 3rd party company for support they are naturally going to be presented with the modern liberal agenda (gender roles are harmful or a construct and to be kind we should change them). The views which are expressed on GAF or in the general public aren't being expressed to these companies (aka stick to male/female please).

This is evident from this clip where at the end he says:

The creators are confused because they're seemingly only hearing the activists screeching and the US/Europe EDI market research or staff is telling them look guys make these changes. They probably don't even know most gamers are sick of it or getting to that point and are on their side.

 

[tomato shrub]

The series is still a relative flop outside of Japan, so why even take any of that into consideration?

 

[ReyBrujo]

Let's look at the things bought up in the interview

• First they say its about age ratings so that they can sell more copies, but we all know that the game with the highest sales in the world is rated mature
• They mention for the male and female options they changed them to Type 1 and Type 2 and then proceed to say they don't even know who is complaining about that, so why did they make they change? Other games certainly still allow you to choose male or female.

So it seems like they're self-censoring in hopes of selling more units and blaming the decision process on the West.

They made the change because the publisher section told them to do so. You gotta split the development team and the publisher team, even if they are the same company they aren't the same groups within the company.

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

Let's look at the things bought up in the interview

• First they say its about age ratings so that they can sell more copies, but we all know that the game with the highest sales in the world is rated mature
• They mention for the male and female options they changed them to Type 1 and Type 2 and then proceed to say they don't even know who is complaining about that, so why did they make they change? Other games certainly still allow you to choose male or female.

So it seems like they're self-censoring in hopes of selling more units and blaming the decision process on the West.

They did the change because they were forced to from above. Don’t play dumb. The hand of developers is forced all the time, and you know perfectly well they don’t have a say in that.

The problem here is,
a) those designs were so tame that the rating would be a T in the worst case, and DQ isn’t really the ideal kid’s game, especially now that the younger audience is deep into completely different stuff. And whatever certain ideologists may tell you, teens are horny all the time, and one less piece of clothing actually helps selling them the game rather than the opposite. So the loss of sales would have been negligible (and who even looks at age rating anyway, unless there’s a big A on the box? Oh wait, what box?).
b) the people who would make a shitstorm in a teacup out of the original designs wouldn’t buy the game anyway, or they’d buy it and play it “secretly” after throwing their tantrum online. They’ve shown plenty enough that not a few of them invariably do that.
c) Dragon Quest is either a tradition, or an acquired taste. Its audience is firmly established at this point, even in the west. Those who love it aren’t going to not buy it because of a scantily-clad woman, and those who don’t know it aren’t going to not buy it just because of a scantily-clad woman. If this game sells less than the previous DQ, it will be because someone in its established audience decides not to - for reasons that, I can assure you, don’t involve a scantily-clad woman. So that design could never be held responsible for selling less than expected, except by the usual crowd of idiots.

The devs believe those forced changes are stupid, and inconsequential for sales. And they’re completely right about that.

Honestly, its time someone starts developing decently budgeted games that ridicule/caricaturize this politically driven entertainment culture that has been fostered in the recent decade. Its a pitch that's ripe for the taking. Someone in this industry must have the gonads to do it. The activist gaming journos will definitely throw a fit about it.

The problem there is, politically-driven entertainment culture has gone so extreme that telling what is legit and what is parody isn’t easy anymore. Just look at the Dustborn thread - some people there have a feeling that the game is a parody, and I certainly can’t blame them.

 

[near]

Pulling no punches here. Amazing.

Torishima's lack of indiscretion appears to make Horii uncomfortable, but he's been working with a war crime denier almost he's whole career. If it was Sugiyama making these statements so candidly I wouldn't be remotely surprised.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

They made the change because the publisher section told them to do so. You gotta split the development team and the publisher team, even if they are the same company they aren't the same groups within the company.

It's funny that you think the publishing team is run out of the US. They still report to Japan and any mandates and decisions are ultimately being made in Japan, especially if they are impacting development choices.

Again, this is Square Enix electing to self-censor, no one is censoring them.

 

[Outlier]

And they literally did NOT have to make those changes.

Do they think their games would be barred from sale if they didn't take the woke pill or something?

 

[vagabond-]

I feel you homie. Tired of this shit

 

[Stu_Hart]

Many western games still have genders, many asian games have released in the west by not censoring stuff, so he might have removed them assuming that's what he has to do to please people. That's his own problem.

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

It's funny that you think the publishing team is run out of the US. They still report to Japan and any mandates and decisions are ultimately being made in Japan, especially if they are impacting development choices.

Again, this is Square Enix electing to self-censor, no one is censoring them.

SE is self-infected by DEI virus but that virus comes from the US. Unfortunately, they have infiltrated Nintendo and Capcom too. That's why the western media is not that belligerent towards Japan and they found a new enemy in Korea and China, who unapologetically show them the finger.

 

[delishcaek]

So it seems like they're self-censoring in hopes of selling more units and blaming the decision process on the West.

Why do you pretend that all of this isn't coming from the west, especially the US?

First they have Sony with their new HQ in the US cracking down on their sorry asses, then they have their own publishers demanding DEI shit, because they have investors with specific guidelines they need to follow. Like two out of four of Square-Enix key shareholders are american Investor firms. BlackRock and Vanguard Group, they demand DEI/ESG shit in all products. If Square-Enix doesn't meet those demands than they lose these investors.

Here is what BlackRock's CEO has to say about this, this was 7 years ago:

Q: BlackRock has really been in the forefront of ESG movement within corporate governance and a real leader... and change is so slow, how do you force change when it's so incremental and so gradual? How do you do something more radical? Have you thought about that? Has the board of American Express thought about more radical things we could do to enhance diversity and inclusion?

A: Well, I could speak about BlackRock's board, but it doesn't come from the board, it really has to come from the leadership of the firm and if the leadership of the firms are not doing the changes, hopefully the board forces that change and if not it's gonna be the shareholders, okay?



You can safely assume that the Vanguard Group shares the sentiments. Now you have two of those as your key shareholders and you really want and need their money, so what do you do? You follow their DEI/ESG guidelines. So, no shit SE is telling their devs to self censor.

 

[Synless]

The man himself has come forward and said exactly what we discussed in the other thread.

It’s fucking further erosion of humanity, a cancerous mindset by weak minded individuals who are in a cult.

 

[kubricks]

There are men and there are women, there are people with different sexual preferences but they are still either man or woman. Then there are these fucking lunatics.

I can only think of diabetes when they mention type 1 and type 2.

 

[midnightAI]

'we fucked up but it's someone else's fault'

 

[LordCBH]

It’s not even that they are trying to appease anyone.

They are doing it in the hope to increase sales to the modern audience which doesn’t exist for this game. The people they are making changes for won’t buy this game.

The “modern audience” in general has proven they don’t buy games or movies no matter what. I can’t believe these companies don’t understand this.