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Easy Allies |EZOT2| Love & Respect

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Axass

Member
its provocative. it gets the people going.

No matter what, being insulting isn't a good way to get a conversation going. It seems to me right now you're just rationalizing what you did.

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Please, do not misquote me. I don't think it's over the top, in fact I said I like present opening. I just offered a possible solution to the problem some people have with it, i.e. making it a permanent "segment" but limited to a set, consistent, amount of time each week.
 
About the game selection: In 3 weeks they'll make the switch. It will be fine.

About gifts: 20 or 30 minute time limit. And please gift-givers, don't write 3 pages of text to be read on stream.

About on-stream donation: No. Use Patreon.

About subscriber song: When anything of importance (bets, dioramas, trials) happen, stop the acknowledgement

About tets: two 400k runs in one night. Thank you Sweeney
 
All I'd request is that there is a minimum bar for group stream games. Dumb games are fine for Dumb Game Monday, but I remember a few weeks back all group stream options being below-60 on Metacritic. They were all turds. There's enough good games out there that we don't need to see Power Rangers ever again. Ever. Again.

Ever.

Second request, just test that controllers are working in advance. I think the Nintendo Olympics game would've been fun multiplayer, but no-one would've picked it if we knew in advance that it would be a single-player-only stream. Curation and quality control, that's all we need. I'd also be up for something a little different - the Gundam stream was fantastic, as are board games - don't be afraid to go outside the box!

Again, some users in this thread going way overboard. All the usual suspect.

Love and respect.
 
Few thoughts:

Errbody calm down

That said I missed Tetris and that makes me sad. The price of having it at a reasonable hour on Friday, ha.

Regarding subs: necessary evil. Group streams are fun chaos anyways. It's not like when EZA started and it was the only interaction you'd get between allies, more content/podcasts/streams with multiple people

Re: gifts, I get it. At the same time it's all for fun. I only really have a problem when it plays into the neediness some of the sub type stuff brings out, like when you have someone having a meltdown because they didn't freak out over the gift or if you have someone badgering about "hey guys I sent this a while ago so who's been using it?" You wouldn't do that to people you know (I'd hope) so you really shouldn't do it to people you don't who receive a ton of stuff and may not necessarily want it. Lol
 
Let's be constructive and suggest some good group stream games?

• Pacman
• Castle Crashers
• Bomberman
• Rayman Origins / Legends
• 'Splosion Man
• Rock Band (would love to see this)
• Aegis Wing
• Little Big Planet 1 or 2
• Lovers in a Dangerous Spacetime
• Blur (top pick)
• Super Mario 3D World
• Geometry Wars 2
• Doritos Crash Course
• Sonic and All Stars Racing
• Blast Corps
 

_Ryo_

Member
I have very little to contribute to this thread other than to geek out about how much I enjoy Tabletop Escapades. Legit one of my favorite YT shows ever and I'd gladly watch or listen to it rather than a lot of network/cable TV shows. Waiting does such though.
 

Anaithsol

Neo Member
Please, do not misquote me. I don't think it's over the top, in fact I said I like present opening. I just offered a possible solution to the problem some people have with it, i.e. making it a permanent "segment" but limited to a set, consistent, amount of time each week.

It seems to be a popular conclusion that if you have criticisms regarding the subscriber song or the gift opening, you're completely against the idea when instead I'm seeing a lot of folks suggesting alternative options to keep them going without becoming overbearing.

About the game selection: In 3 weeks they'll make the switch. It will be fine.

About gifts: 20 or 30 minute time limit. And please gift-givers, don't write 3 pages of text to be read on stream.

About on-stream donation: No. Use Patreon.

About subscriber song: When anything of importance (bets, dioramas, trials) happen, stop the acknowledgement

About tets: two 400k runs in one night. Thank you Sweeney

Game selection needs to be better curated without a doubt, but I can also see the appeal in choosing recent releases as a form of doing something new all the while being informative. It would be interesting to see more patron involvement in the selection process besides a poll vote as it seems the other allies aren't too invested in recommending choices that differ from Kyle's.

A hard time limit for gift opening seems to be a bit much, but also a goal to work toward at the same time. For the extreme cases where they're overburdened or receive those long pages of text, it would probably be better suited to have them featured in a separate video in order to properly give them the attention they deserve.

Straight-up asking for monetary donations starts leading down a very slippery slope that generally comes off as begging or being greedy. The advertising of Patreon with a banner at the top and at the end of every video can be seen as the same thing by certain people; however, Patreon is more of a trade of services rather than just straight donation.

The subscriber song is a fickle beast; it's awesome in low doses, but incredibly disruptive when done in quick succession or in a forced matter. I still strongly think that subscribers should be briefly acknowledged at the time of their notice or read off a list at the end of a stream with the subscriber song serving as the catch-all conclusion in either instance.
 

Tankard

Member
Let's be constructive and suggest some good group stream games?

• Pacman
• Castle Crashers
• Bomberman
• Rayman Origins / Legends
• 'Splosion Man
• Rock Band (would love to see this)
• Aegis Wing
• Little Big Planet 1 or 2
• Lovers in a Dangerous Spacetime
• Blur (top pick)
• Super Mario 3D World
• Geometry Wars 2
• Doritos Crash Course
• Sonic and All Stars Racing

They already played games that everyone thought it was not good stream games and everyone had a great time and other times they picked stream games that were just bad to watch.

Just vary the types of games, retro or new, stop with this "only stream games" mantra, it doesn't work like that.
 
They already played games that everyone thought it was not good stream games and everyone had a great time and other times they picked stream games that were just bad to watch.

Just vary the types of games, retro or new, stop with this "only stream games" mantra, it doesn't work like that.

It's not a hard and fast rule, but it improves the chances. Just because it's not a 100%, that's not a good enough reason (in my eyes) not to have any curation whatsoever.
 

Axass

Member
@Blood (because I know he wanders around here)

I'm watching Cup of Jones at the moment and I heard Brandon's not sure about streaming the anniversary meetup, because it would feel less special for those going there.

No, please do stream it. I'm sure you know that your fans aren't limited to the USA and many (like me) can't possibly spend lots of money and time to get there on the 21st. The first anniversary event is a huge milestone for you and for all of us, and I would really feel bummed and left out as a fan (for the first time ever), if I couldn't partecipate in some measure.

I have very little to contribute to this thread other than to geek out about how much I enjoy Tabletop Escapades. Legit one of my favorite YT shows ever and I'd gladly watch or listen to it rather than a lot of network/cable TV shows. Waiting does such though.

That's a very good reason to be here! TTE is something special.

Anyway, you may try the fancast about TTE, it may make the wait more bearable: https://twitter.com/TTExplacades?s=09
 

Pie and Beans

Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
@Blood (because I know he wanders around here)

I'm watching Cup of Jones at the moment and I heard Brandon's not sure about streaming the anniversary meetup, because it would feel less special for those going there.

No, please do stream it. I'm sure you know that your fans aren't limited to the USA and many (like me) can't possibly spend lots of money and time to get there on the 21st. The first anniversary event is a huge milestone for you and for all of us, and I would really feel bummed and left out as a fan (for the first time ever), if I couldn't partecipate in some measure.

Maybe not stream it (how would you even), but at least record vast segments for a week or month release after. Preferably not on mobile phones because come on now.
 

Mista Koo

Member
About the game selection: In 3 weeks they'll make the switch. It will be fine.
The only launch games that would work for groups stream are 1-2 Switch and Bomberman. Not sure if they can carry a full stream.
I'm mainly looking forward to the eventual Arms tournament. Mario Kart and Splatoon 2 would make for a jolly 8 player stream. Although that's a summer stream.
 

Auctopus

Member
@Blood (because I know he wanders around here)

I'm watching Cup of Jones at the moment and I heard Brandon's not sure about streaming the anniversary meetup, because it would feel less special for those going there.

No, please do stream it. I'm sure you know that your fans aren't limited to the USA and many (like me) can't possibly spend lots of money and time to get there on the 21st. The first anniversary event is a huge milestone for you and for all of us, and I would really feel bummed and left out as a fan (for the first time ever), if I couldn't partecipate in some measure.

As someone from the UK who won't be able to attend, I kinda hope they don't stream the meet-up. As Brandon said, it means it's less special for the people who do go.

Plus, if it's outside, is that just gonna be a bad quality stream on someone's phone? I just feel like if there's a personal meet-up, everyone should be in the room and not worried about being broadcasted.

I'd be happy with a marathon anniversary game stream then some sort of EZA Meetup video on Youtube, maybe. At the last meetup, there was plenty of great stuff on twitter anyway.
 

_Ryo_

Member
@Blood (because I know he wanders around here)

I'm watching Cup of Jones at the moment and I heard Brandon's not sure about streaming the anniversary meetup, because it would feel less special for those going there.

No, please do stream it. I'm sure you know that your fans aren't limited to the USA and many (like me) can't possibly spend lots of money and time to get there on the 21st. The first anniversary event is a huge milestone for you and for all of us, and I would really feel bummed and left out as a fan (for the first time ever), if I couldn't partecipate in some measure.



That's a very good reason to be here! TTE is something special.

Anyway, you may try the fancast about TTE, it may make the wait more bearable: https://twitter.com/TTExplacades?s=09


For some reason I never really thought about it ever having fan podcasts... Despite how much I enjoy it. So I'll gladly give it a try, thanks. :)
 
@Blood (because I know he wanders around here)

I'm watching Cup of Jones at the moment and I heard Brandon's not sure about streaming the anniversary meetup, because it would feel less special for those going there.

No, please do stream it. I'm sure you know that your fans aren't limited to the USA and many (like me) can't possibly spend lots of money and time to get there on the 21st. The first anniversary event is a huge milestone for you and for all of us, and I would really feel bummed and left out as a fan (for the first time ever), if I couldn't partecipate in some measure.
Keep in mind, the people going are spending the money to be there

I get what you mean but people are flying out for this event. Streaming is of course not comparable to being in the room but yea. They'll film anything important I'm sure

I remember Brandon saying they were going to make announcements at the meet and greet but that didn't happen. They had a cam set up but really it's just a room of people hanging out. Whatever "show" aspect they're filming should be filmed but you don't really need to watch a loud room of people's conversations lol
 

Mikey Jr.

Member
Group Stream game picks have gone majorly downhill and have been pretty crap for a while other than the tourneys and VR nights. Game selection needs to be blown wide the fuck open to have a much bigger list of retro and non-multiplayer games, and have switch outs. Patrons pick doesnt need to be the entire stream. That Power Rangers game was goddam awful the other week too.

The last group stream was one of the better ones because of a little bit of Towerfall and Gundam Breaker 3, a game that was actually good. Wild Guns was shit, and the EZA patrons seem to routinely vote for the shittest game to win often out of old brand nostalgia or whatever. Given the chance to play awesome old stuff like Crazy Taxi, fun is had. I wonder if Kyle is stuck in the old corporate GT Time days of having to do new releases because those guests were on or thats "current" and everyone else is being lazy suggesting games.

Brandons recent Cup Of Jones seemed to be dancing around the gift giving getting a bit out of control. The problem being that each week is entering one-upmanship territory, and perhaps people are spending just a bit too much. The sweets stuff especially is just kinda lame? Someone just hurled a $100 Target card at Bosman the other week. It's just odd but then I don't get a lot of what makes the Twitch world tick.

I'd rather just have more quality shows personally. Specific goals in mind where an ally gets an Adobe Cloud account or whatever to learn and cut more video content (or make time? Does Ian cut anything thats not Easy Update?). It is honestly not that hard once youre set up with audio and music and get to grips with opening and closing clipping brackets.

Don just shows up randomly with these perfectly cut shows, and I feel it should be lighting a fire under some of the other allies. We definitely didn't get enough Tales From Japan, because Ben was new at that and learning, but I would have settled for more photo slideshows with audio rather than just 2 and forgotten. Anime podcast and Frame Trap are great content though, as is Tabletop and all the massive reviews he does. There has however only been 2 Game Sleuth episodes in 7 months. Reading a Zelda manual for an hour seems like an incredibly bad use of time and is not "a show". "Story Time With The Allies" is a pretty dreadful stretch goal (evidence by 40k not being an impetus to the fanbase) because thats what every week of content is anyway, especially things like Talking Syndrome and Cup of Jones.

I said earlier that EZA need to be doing Best Of compilations, because thats the way to net new viewers with essentially demo reels and trailers of what fun can be had by buying in on this outfit. New users need to see whats the fuss about these 3-6 hour streams and podcasts in clipped out form. A random twitter user puts together a Hottake reel, and its like... yes. This shit isn't hard and is just a better use of time for expansion.

We're almost a year in, its been fun times. I know they're doing a lot already (Community Comments while good at getting peoples pledge money in seems like a huge timesink I don't ever watch or care about) But if they ever want to hit that 50k, they need to get their time balancing a bit better and put more into content thats going to draw new viewership.

Damn, this is a good breakdown.
 
Don just shows up randomly with these perfectly cut shows, and I feel it should be lighting a fire under some of the other allies. We definitely didn't get enough Tales From Japan, because Ben was new at that and learning, but I would have settled for more photo slideshows with audio rather than just 2 and forgotten. Anime podcast and Frame Trap are great content though, as is Tabletop and all the massive reviews he does. There has however only been 2 Game Sleuth episodes in 7 months. Reading a Zelda manual for an hour seems like an incredibly bad use of time and is not "a show". "Story Time With The Allies" is a pretty dreadful stretch goal (evidence by 40k not being an impetus to the fanbase) because thats what every week of content is anyway, especially things like Talking Syndrome and Cup of Jones.

I said earlier that EZA need to be doing Best Of compilations, because thats the way to net new viewers with essentially demo reels and trailers of what fun can be had by buying in on this outfit. New users need to see whats the fuss about these 3-6 hour streams and podcasts in clipped out form. A random twitter user puts together a Hottake reel, and its like... yes. This shit isn't hard and is just a better use of time for expansion.

We're almost a year in, its been fun times. I know they're doing a lot already (Community Comments while good at getting peoples pledge money in seems like a huge timesink I don't ever watch or care about) But if they ever want to hit that 50k, they need to get their time balancing a bit better and put more into content thats going to draw new viewership.

I just wanted to hop in admidst the chaos and clarify that Tales From Japan hasn't been forgotten. Of course, I understand that maybe it feels forgotten. More is on the way, but all of the other projects I have going on take priority for a number of reasons. I am trying my absolute best to produce things that I think you'll all enjoy. Sometimes that takes an annoyingly long time. I understand the impatience (I would feel it too), but it's not laziness. We just care a lot about what we put out. I had people getting really, really upset that we didn't have a Nioh review out immediately. It's because I wanted to do it right. I'm glad I didn't spit something out, even if it means being pretty late.

That's not to say the criticism doesn't often have a point. There have been harsh things said about streams, EZAnime, and Tales From Japan that I think were more or less on point. So I'm not asking for people to stop criticizing us. We need it. I do ask however for perhaps a bit of patience, a belief that we're listening, and that things will get better. Better doesn't happen overnight, though. It's a slow process and a bunch of little steps.

EDIT: Removed a fairly petty sounding sentence at the beginning. I just want to help, not pick fights.
 

Pie and Beans

Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
I just wanted to hop in admidst the chaos and clarify that Tales From Japan hasn't been forgotten. Of course, I understand that maybe it feels forgotten. More is on the way, but all of the other projects I have going on take priority for a number of reasons. I am trying my absolute best to produce things that I think you'll all enjoy. Sometimes that takes an annoyingly long time. I understand the impatience (I would feel it too), but it's not laziness. We just care a lot about what we put out. I had people getting really, really upset that we didn't have a Nioh review out immediately. It's because I wanted to do it right. I'm glad I didn't spit something out, even if it means being pretty late.

That's not to say the criticism doesn't often have a point. There have been harsh things said about streams, EZAnime, and Tales From Japan that I think were more or less on point. So I'm not asking for people to stop criticizing us. We need it. I do ask however for perhaps a bit of patience, a belief that we're listening, and that things will get better. Better doesn't happen overnight, though. It's a slow process and a bunch of little steps.

EDIT: Removed a fairly petty sounding sentence at the beginning. I just want to help, not pick fights.

P&B can give sass like none other so you'd have to have a knife made of pure vinegar petty sass to even phase him. I'd hoped I'd sauced up the following sentence enough after to say I know you're one of the absolute busiest allies (Jones The Unsleeping takes crown) because reviews are a beast when also factoring in streaming, capping footage yourself, and so on. You're probably the Ally thats the most needlessly harsh on and second guessy of themselves too.

I guess I have no idea why I though Tales From Japan was over? I think its when you said the 3rd episode would likely be the final one at the end of the 2nd one, it sort of felt like we'd already ended there, like the runway had already come up short.

The 'East' quibbling here probably didn't help at all so if that stayed your hand on just speaking about a cool holiday, that sucks. To coin Bosman's new favourite term from Mr Stevens, Analysis Paralysis feels like it can prevent some Allies from accepting that they can't do GT level stuff until the studio happens. For Tales From Japan, just being several straight up podcast bits early on with very little video editing when it was still fresh would have been absolutely fantastic. You have a podcast that's now routinely like 3 hours long and you stopped yourself talking about the Japan trip on it for its own show but ultimately may only get 30 mins total of Tales From Japan. Hindsight but a lesson learned maybe.

I'm just very eager for EZA to get to that studio point. I think you lot are easily capable of making something akin to the 1up Show of old once that happens and so seeing the Patreon a bit deadlocked is aggravating. None moreso I'm sure than being used to a fully functioning media company and then having to guerilla warfare it because big media money ran out/decided people screaming sexual violence into a mic is where the big money is.
 
P&B can give sass like none other so you'd have to have a knife made of pure vinegar petty sass to even phase him. I'd hoped I'd sauced up the following sentence enough after to say I know you're one of the absolute busiest allies (Jones The Unsleeping takes crown) because reviews are a beast when also factoring in streaming, capping footage yourself, and so on. You're probably the Ally thats the most needlessly harsh on and second guessy of themselves too.

I guess I have no idea why I though Tales From Japan was over? I think its when you said the 3rd episode would likely be the final one, it sort of felt like we'd already ended there, like the runway had already come up short.

The 'East' quibbling here probably didn't help at all so if that stayed your hand on just speaking about a cool holiday, that sucks. To coin Bosman's new favourite term from Mr Stevens, Analysis Paralysis feels like it can prevent some Allies from accepting that they can't do GT level stuff until the studio happens. For Tales From Japan, just being several straight up podcast bits early on with very little video editing when it was still fresh would have been absolutely fantastic. You have a podcast that's now routinely like 3 hours long and you stopped yourself talking about the Japan trip on it for its own show but ultimately may only get 30 mins total of Tales From Japan. Hindsight but a lesson learned maybe.

I'm just very eager for EZA to get to that studio point. I think you lot are easily capable of making something akin to the 1up Show of old once that happens and so seeing the Patreon a bit deadlocked is aggravating. None moreso I'm sure than being used to a fully functioning media company and then having to guerilla warfare it because big media money ran out/decided people screaming sexual violence into a mic is where the big money is.

I feel like there's no one in this world I respect more than Jones. His determination is honestly inspiring. "The Unsleeping" couldn't be more accurate. Dude just does work all of the time and he's so good at it. Blood is also an unsung hero. A lot of what he does isn't seen by the viewers and sometimes I wish that weren't the case. He's unfailingly committed.

I agree with ToJ being a "lesson learned" scenario. There are a zillion different ways the series could have gone better and I'm not even saying that from a place of regret, bitterness, or sadness. I really did learn a lot from the experience. I'm so grateful that the series gave me the confidence to try my hand at video editing, even if I had to embarrassingly show my inexperience in front of a lot of people. It did make me better and helped develop another skill. I'm editing my first review this month because of that show and I'm very happy about that. But yeah, even with all of that said, I'm not happy with how the show was handled overall. I totally accept that. People expect a level of quality and production value from us, as they should. They are oftentimes paying for what we provide. It should be good. I just wish the process of finding that good could always be smooth.

I also agree that a studio could do wonders. I think the reason I responded at all is because a lot of what you were saying has been going through my mind as well.

I know some people think love and respect is bullshit, and I get it, but I'm not one of those people. I want to have a back-and-forth with our audience that is honest while still being respectful. That's the kind of community I want to build and represent. I don't always get it right. There are definitely times when I sound whiny or aggressive, but I don't think it's an invalid or insincere thing to strive for L&R.

EDIT: There were a lot of edits to this.
 

Axass

Member
As someone from the UK who won't be able to attend, I kinda hope they don't stream the meet-up. As Brandon said, it means it's less special for the people who do go.

Plus, if it's outside, is that just gonna be a bad quality stream on someone's phone? I just feel like if there's a personal meet-up, everyone should be in the room and not worried about being broadcasted.

I'd be happy with a marathon anniversary game stream then some sort of EZA Meetup video on Youtube, maybe. At the last meetup, there was plenty of great stuff on twitter anyway.

Keep in mind, the people going are spending the money to be there

I get what you mean but people are flying out for this event. Streaming is of course not comparable to being in the room but yea. They'll film anything important I'm sure

I remember Brandon saying they were going to make announcements at the meet and greet but that didn't happen. They had a cam set up but really it's just a room of people hanging out. Whatever "show" aspect they're filming should be filmed but you don't really need to watch a loud room of people's conversations lol

About the bolded: I don't agree, that's just gaming's "exclusive content" for EZA fans. I mean, would you really feel more special by excluding the majority of the community (thousands of people from all over the world) from an anniversary event? If I were able to go there I couldn't care less about streaming making it less "exclusive", I'd just be happy to meet the Allies and that's it.

That said... I understand what you guys are saying as well, I definitely don't care about the whole meetup being streamed, but Brandon has been hyping it up as more than a simple meetup for months, and he even said the Allies would put up a "performance": if there's something special programmed I wouldn't want to miss it. So my plea would be to stream at least part of it, in case they plan to do something cool, besides meeting fans in general.

I feel like there's no one in this world I respect more than Jones. His determination is honestly inspiring. "The Unsleeping" couldn't be more accurate. Dude just does work all of the time and he's so good at it. Blood is also an unsung hero. A lot of what he does isn't seen by the viewers and sometimes I wish that weren't the case. He's unfailingly committed.

I agree with ToJ being a "lesson learned" scenario. There are a zillion different ways the series could have gone better and I'm not even saying that from a place of regret, bitterness, or sadness. I really did learn a lot from the experience. I'm so grateful that the series gave me the confidence to try my hand at video editing, even if I had to embarrassingly show my inexperience in front of a lot of people. It did make me better and helped develop another skill. I'm editing my first review this month because of that show and I'm very happy about that. But yeah, even with all of that said, I'm not happy with how the show was handled overall. I totally accept that.

I also agree that a studio could do wonders. I think the reason I responded at all is because a lot of what you were saying has been going through my mind as well.

I know some people think love and respect is bullshit, and I get it, but I'm not one of those people. I want to have a back-and-forth with our audience that is honest while still being respectful. That's the kind of community I want to build and represent. I don't always get it right. There are definitely times when I sound whiny or aggressive, but I don't think it's a invalid or insincere thing to strive for L&R.

The fact you're so receptive towards criticism and that you always try your best no matter what, is part of why I respect you a lot. Especially considering how hard it is (by your own admission) to take part of that criticism. Just wanted to say it, keep up the good work

L&R
 

Auctopus

Member
I know some people think love and respect is bullshit, and I get it, but I'm not one of those people. I want to have a back-and-forth with our audience that is honest while still being respectful. That's the kind of community I want to build and represent. I don't always get it right. There are definitely times when I sound whiny or aggressive, but I don't think it's a invalid or insincere thing to strive for L&R.

Big Love & Respect to you, Ben.

I agree, I think dissenting and different opinions are healthy, the most important thing is the way that we present ideas etc. ; that it's in a constructive and welcoming manner, even when we are at our most frustrated.

If Luchadork's reading this then I hope that came across in what I was replying to you. I wasn't meaning to shout out your opinion, purely converse constructively about the issues you had instead of insulting/isolating other members of the community.
 

Pie and Beans

Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
If Luchadork is Australian, his use of the C word is actually filed under that nations useage of L&R.

Just a personal thought I'm throwing out there: it would be interesting if at some point they experimented with half of the group streams (or just 1 per month) be with smaller amount of allies present with rotating cast. Some of the best streams from GT and EZA are with 2-3 allies present. For example the Resident Evil Remake stream has totally different vibes from the group stream and solo streams when it's just Huber and Jones having a conversation rather than everyone talking at the same time (tho that can be fun too, especially on some games). Could spice things up a bit and feel more intimate.

Hubers RE7 playthrough was this slice of nostalgic heaven with Bosman and Brad, like the Full Playthroughs of old. It being Jones' house means they can only do it very occasionally but its so good when they do. Much preferred to Rambunctious Boys Gettings Presents Night.
 
Just a personal thought I'm throwing out there: it would be interesting if at some point they experimented with half of the group streams (or just 1 per month) be with smaller amount of allies present with rotating cast. Some of the best streams from GT and EZA are with 2-3 allies present. For example the Resident Evil Remake stream has totally different vibes from the group stream and solo streams when it's just Huber and Jones having a conversation rather than everyone talking at the same time (tho that can be fun too, especially on some games). Could spice things up a bit and feel more intimate.
 

Holundrian

Unconfirmed Member
Damn I really like the current discussion I think P&B criticism was well formulated in a way that may be harsh but also kind of reads somewhat fair to me in the sense where it comes from. I can understand the perspective and think about it without going "really duuuuuuude!?" first.
Maybe that's a good tone for other people to look towards to when have major misgivings about something :-x.

Kudos to Blood and Ben for engaging so much. Especially Blood I'm always amazed at how he manages to respond to stuff that just seems to be formulated to aggrieve(srsly do not understand how people think that's an effective way to communicate) and he defuses situations with his answers(like if people read some of the youtube comment answers it's impressive). I've been a mostly silent reader in other communities where people are way less receptive to criticism :/.

I like the current discussion, some of the criticism I agreed with I was reluctant to voice myself given that I felt like the past few weeks seemed very intense work load wise(I mean the anniversary event just around the corner that is probably a toooon of planning work as well). Given how swamped I myself was I empathized a lot. I tried to ask back in December if we could at least get updates on retros and game sleuth given that it's been a while without necessarily wanting to pressure them but then January came around and Damiani was on Gravity Rush 2 and Berseria so it just felt like a bad time to push it.

Edit: That said I'm part of the group that enjoys presents. Especially because some of the stuff that allies send actually went into giving some of the shows and things happening a little nice extra, like the recent prove it ticket upgrade. I also enjoy the presents that showcase some of the stuff the talented community does.
But I guess I can also see that in some ways it can get out of control with them getting buried in candy for example. As for equating presents to the subscriber song shoutout I just disagree with that. Presents are a segment that generally does not disrupt anything(I enjoyed the 45 min present opening but I can also get behind that that's maybe too long and ways to handle it for such occasions differently might be worth exploring). The subscriber song has several time put conversations to a halt for a moment(that said it's just a moment it's well within what I can tolerate I write it of as twitch culture not a biggie for me).
 

VanWinkle

Member
I love these guys. I just wish EZA could get to a point where production and original content get a huge bump sooner rather than later. A studio would obviously be a big step in that. I just feel like one of the highest paid Patreons should have a higher level of production than they do. And I totally understand that there's a lot of people compared to some other Patreon campaigns. It's just unfortunate, I guess.

Hopefully we will get there soon. I'm just ready to get to a point where podcasts have crystal clear sharp video and audio quality in a nicely lit environment.
 
its provocative. it gets the people going.

and at least now we know theres a couple of people who think the present giving is over the top...

Are you patting yourself on the back for throwing a temper tantrum? Because that's exactly what that post was. A temper tantrum. Not to say I'm not guilty of throwing them myself but I tend to regret them later on and apologise if need be, not dig my hole even deeper.

Deliberately misquoting a bunch of people to make it seem like they agree with you is some really lame stuff too.

The last few weeks.

I'm out of this thread, these purity tests are ridiculous. Unsubbed.

Uh, what? What purity tests?

Just a personal thought I'm throwing out there: it would be interesting if at some point they experimented with half of the group streams (or just 1 per month) be with smaller amount of allies present with rotating cast. Some of the best streams from GT and EZA are with 2-3 allies present. For example the Resident Evil Remake stream has totally different vibes from the group stream and solo streams when it's just Huber and Jones having a conversation rather than everyone talking at the same time (tho that can be fun too, especially on some games). Could spice things up a bit and feel more intimate.

There were a few suggestions like this after the RE7 stream, including doing it weekly and making it a stretch goal. I think it's a good idea but it probably depends on whether they can get enough of them together on a weekly basis.

Anyways, props to Ben and Blood for wading into this thread even when it gets rough.
 

Maiar_m

Member
I love these guys. I just wish EZA could get to a point where production and original content get a huge bump sooner rather than later. A studio would obviously be a big step in that. I just feel like one of the highest paid Patreons should have a higher level of production than they do. And I totally understand that there's a lot of people compared to some other Patreon campaigns. It's just unfortunate, I guess.

Hopefully we will get there soon. I'm just ready to get to a point where podcasts have crystal clear sharp video and audio quality in a nicely lit environment.

It's one of the first criticism one can find in the youtube comments, but then again, it's 9 people, quite lot of shows and close to non-stop streams going on in one of the biggest, priciest cities there are. There are reasons for all this, as you've said.

And to be honest, I've found a way to be ok with all this as I'm going to miss Jones' garage when they get the studio. Sure, some shows could massively benefit from the studio (mostly because of the fact all shows would be shot there and they'd benefit from one another), but things like the RE7 full playthrough with the near heart attack when the pizza guy knocked on the door was priceless, or Papa Jones coming through inquiring if anybody's hungry (I imagined him with a "Kiss the chef" apron) are a nice homely touch.

Also love the discussion going on. Ben and Blood are always so great dealing with us here.

Regarding the Damiani / Bosman FE Heroes discussion (for those asking, check this week's group stream), I had troubles with Kyle's not really wanting to discuss his opinion or hear arguments when Damiani seemed to be really wanting to get something through. I can't always tell when he's trolling or just being mean without wanting to. I always fear it's going to get somebody pissed off.
 

Kasper

Member
Other than the game choice sometimes being off, the only real complaint I have regarding group streams is the subscriber song which I find absolutely obnoxious. At least the GT one was a song of sorts and not just yelling at the top of your lungs all the fucking time. That's not to say that I'm against acknowledging subs, I just wish it was a lot more low key like regular streams.
 

Anaithsol

Neo Member
Damn I really like the current discussion I think P&B criticism was well formulated in a way that may be harsh but also kind of reads somewhat fair to me in the sense where it comes from. I can understand the perspective and think about it without going "really duuuuuuude!?" first.
Maybe that's a good tone for other people to look towards to when have major misgivings about something :-x.

Kudos to Blood and Ben for engaging so much. Especially Blood I'm always amazed at how he manages to respond to stuff that just seems to be formulated to aggrieve(srsly do not understand how people think that's an effective way to communicate) and he defuses situations with his answers(like if people read some of the youtube comment answers it's impressive). I've been a mostly silent reader in other communities where people are way less receptive to criticism :/.

I like the current discussion, some of the criticism I agreed with I was reluctant to voice myself given that I felt like the past few weeks seemed very intense work load wise(I mean the anniversary event just around the corner that is probably a toooon of planning work as well). Given how swamped I myself was I empathized a lot. I tried to ask back in December if we could at least get updates on retros and game sleuth given that it's been a while without necessarily wanting to pressure them but then January came around and Damiani was on Gravity Rush 2 and Berseria so it just felt like a bad time to push it.

Edit: That said I'm part of the group that enjoys presents. Especially because some of the stuff that allies send actually went into giving some of the shows and things happening a little nice extra, like the recent prove it ticket upgrade. I also enjoy the presents that showcase some of the stuff the talented community does.
But I guess I can also see that in some ways it can get out of control with them getting buried in candy for example. As for equating presents to the subscriber song shoutout I just disagree with that. Presents are a segment that generally does not disrupt anything(I enjoyed the 45 min present opening but I can also get behind that that's maybe too long and ways to handle it for such occasions differently might be worth exploring). The subscriber song has several time put conversations to a halt for a moment(that said it's just a moment it's well within what I can tolerate I write it of as twitch culture not a biggie for me).

Not to call out luchadork for antagonist reasons as there's been plenty of that already, but it's definitely not well received when you're just throwing out insults and exaggerations to demonstrate your argument. I get what he/she was going for, but it could have been said a whole lot better and far less aggressive and matter-of-fact. Pie and Beans teetered around strong language to drive a point home rather than just swearing up and down to rile up the crowd for no real good reason.

I personally would like to see more episodes of Game Sleuth and Retrospectives, but I also understand that those particular shows require far more research, planning, material, and overall attention than most of the other projects. That's not even taking into account the current workload all the allies look to be battling as of late due to all the good releases just these past two months and their upcoming anniversary.

I agree with Pie and Beans that "Story Time with the Allies" is a pretty weak target to shoot for as a Patreon goal as we more or less get a good chunk of it already via Frame Trap and questions from the community. I like the idea of Damiani continuing to develop Inside Zelda though as it has a ton of room to grow despite the first showing lacking oomph value.

As for gift opening being as disruptive as the subscriber song: That's not what I was going for nor do I think others were either. It's the same issue in the sense that both need to be evaluated and reworked to a level where it removes the burdens they introduce to the stream environment. I love both concepts, but I can definitely see where the extreme cases have really turned off folks or drove them to annoyance. Personally, I've turned down or even muted my volume after hearing a deluge of high-pitched "You're a subscriber now!" instances.

It's one of the first criticism one can find in the youtube comments, but then again, it's 9 people, quite lot of shows and close to non-stop streams going on in one of the biggest, priciest cities there are. There are reasons for all this, as you've said.

And to be honest, I've found a way to be ok with all this as I'm going to miss Jones' garage when they get the studio. Sure, some shows could massively benefit from the studio (mostly because of the fact all shows would be shot there and they'd benefit from one another), but things like the RE7 full playthrough with the near heart attack when the pizza guy knocked on the door was priceless, or Papa Jones coming through inquiring if anybody's hungry (I imagined him with a "Kiss the chef" apron) are a nice homely touch.

Also love the discussion going on. Ben and Blood are always so great dealing with us here.

Regarding the Damiani / Bosman FE Heroes discussion (for those asking, check this week's group stream), I had troubles with Kyle's not really wanting to discuss his opinion or hear arguments when Damiani seemed to be really wanting to get something through. I can't always tell when he's trolling or just being mean without wanting to. I always fear it's going to get somebody pissed off.

I'm torn between the studio and their current situation as both have their pros and cons. A studio would definitely allow for more organization and collaboration, but it also removes a sense of that homely personality we've grown to love over the past ten to eleven months. It'll be an adjustment period to be sure once the switch happens, and it'll be tough to recreate certain instances such as the REVII playthrough and the pizza delivery employee showing up and, in turn, scaring the group like you mentioned.

As for the Fire Emblem Heroes discussion, it was a bit off-putting to see how closed off Kyle was to any potentially positive feedback someone can have for it. Damiani has a certain demeanor and tone which oftentimes can be misconstrued as trolling, but I genuinely believe he was trying to inform Kyle that the game wasn't as badly designed as he thought. There were many instances where Kyle presented information that was just plainly false and can be proven as such by anyone who has even put a minimal amount of time into the application.
 

luchadork

Member
Straight-up asking for monetary donations starts leading down a very slippery slope that generally comes off as begging or being greedy. The advertising of Patreon with a banner at the top and at the end of every video can be seen as the same thing by certain people, however, Patreon is more of a trade of services rather than just straight donation.

what slope though? we all know the money is going to be used to get a studio. a goal we all agree on. the quiet bird doesnt get fed. its an obvious area that eza could improve on. something that brandon has touched upon in regards to getting a business manager.

honestly, if youre worried about what asking for studio money comes across as, have you not considered what a couple of hours of present opening a month comes across as? one has some sort of utility. the other is an exercise in consumerism IMO.



If Luchadork is Australian, his use of the C word is actually filed under that nations useage of L&R.

can confirm. i'm a cunt.



There were many instances where Kyle presented information that was just plainly false and can be proven as such by anyone who has even put a minimal amount of time into [thinking about it].

god i hate it when people do that.
 

AAMARMO

Banned
I see many people are complaining about the group stream in this thread so people may hate what I'm about to say, but I think they should follow structure of what Giant Bomb does with the UPF. Play 3 or 5 games on stream for like 30 mins tops and don't dedicate one game for each stream (Tournament will not be effective) remove Gift section and make it into a video every 2/3 weeks gives you more time for to prepare gifts and thank people who sent them.
 
Hey, more opinions:

I said earlier that EZA need to be doing Best Of compilations, because thats the way to net new viewers with essentially demo reels and trailers of what fun can be had by buying in on this outfit. New users need to see whats the fuss about these 3-6 hour streams and podcasts in clipped out form. A random twitter user puts together a Hottake reel, and its like... yes. This shit isn't hard and is just a better use of time for expansion.

Yes. And the community in general is always asking for the allies to offer their help and that's something the fans can do. Be it just selecting, timestamping and voting for the best moments of the week/month/quarter/year... or maybe doing the edit itself.

We're almost a year in, its been fun times. I know they're doing a lot already (Community Comments while good at getting peoples pledge money in seems like a huge timesink I don't ever watch or care about) But if they ever want to hit that 50k, they need to get their time balancing a bit better and put more into content thats going to draw new viewership.

I can't help but feel bad when Jones talks about being busy with the Community Comments editing. And I always try to watch the first 10 minutes. But it does makes 698 people pay double the usual ammount...
I honestly thought it was a 15 dollars pledge until I checked now, $10 is too cheap for a reward that gets so time intensive, and excluding the direct monetary earning, does not make for great content to watch.
But I don't know, I feel like they painted themselves into a corner, I don't have a clear solution to this.

. I really think they are losing out in revenue by not doing the donation thing. Hell this past week Max's stream went nuts with a guy giving 10k donations and then others dumping in with 2-3k donations. But they chose not to and that's fine. It's their call.

We already have that. It's the donations of Michael Kozachenko and Mango. Done in a healthy and sustainable way.
Maybe they could separate the spots for individual sponsors and corporate sponsors? It's faster to say Mishakoz and Mango than the whole ads for ikeyless and scorn, so I wouldn't mind more spots for individual sponsors.
Anyway, I'm reaaally against donations on stream with unlimited ammounts. I think anyone that have the means to do this should donate on patreon.

No, please do stream it. I'm sure you know that your fans aren't limited to the USA and many (like me) can't possibly spend lots of money and time to get there on the 21st. The first anniversary event is a huge milestone for you and for all of us, and I would really feel bummed and left out as a fan (for the first time ever), if I couldn't partecipate in some measure.

I don't want a stream, but I expect a video... Similar to what Ian did for the meet and greet.
A livestream for an event like this is not an easy task, at all. They have people that were dedicated enough to leave their houses to go see them, they should have the preference. I'd prefer that they film the important bits.
 

Anaithsol

Neo Member
what slope though? we all know the money is going to be used to get a studio. a goal we all agree on. the quiet bird doesnt get fed. its an obvious area that eza could improve on. something that brandon has touched upon in regards to getting a business manager.

honestly, if youre worried about what asking for studio money comes across as, have you not considered what a couple of hours of present opening a month comes across as? one has some sort of utility. the other is an exercise in consumerism IMO

Outright asking your audience to donate money comes across to many as begging or plain greedy even if that's not the case. It's better to let your work speak for itself and have monetary contributions be provided naturally rather than through the constant advertising of the fact that donations are accepted.

Naturally, everyone's going to have a different take on the matter, but it's safe to say it won't come across well if Easy Allies advertised their Patreon all the while asking for monetary donations on a frequent basis let alone over other gifts. I've said it before but Patreon is more like a trade of services rather than a simple donation so it doesn't come across the same way when that's advertised on a constant basis.

I've also already said my piece on the gift opening sequences and subsequent impressions while providing my suggestion that they could be delegated to the ending of a stream or repurposed as a separate showcase video to combat that.

luchadork said:
god i hate it when people do that.

Can't tell if you're being sarcastic here and implying something else or are genuinely expressing similar dislike of the situation due to your tone so far and the small edit of my statement.

Hey, more opinions:

I can't help but feel bad when Jones talks about being busy with the Community Comments editing. And I always try to watch the first 10 minutes. But it does makes 698 people pay double the usual ammount...

I honestly thought it was a 15 dollars pledge until I checked now, $10 is too cheap for a reward that gets so time intensive, and excluding the direct monetary earning, does not make for great content to watch.

But I don't know, I feel like they painted themselves into a corner, I don't have a clear solution to this.
________

We already have that. It's the donations of Michael Kozachenko and Mango. Done in a healthy and sustainable way.

Maybe they could separate the spots for individual sponsors and corporate sponsors? It's faster to say Mishakoz and Mango than the whole ads for ikeyless and scorn, so I wouldn't mind more spots for individual sponsors.

Anyway, I'm reaaally against donations on stream with unlimited ammounts. I think anyone that have the means to do this should donate on patreon.
________

I don't want a stream, but I expect a video... Similar to what Ian did for the meet and greet.
A livestream for an event like this is not an easy task, at all. They have people that were dedicated enough to leave their houses to go see them, they should have the preference. I'd prefer that they film the important bits.

Community Comments is a great feature as it really fosters that community aspect all the while rewarding supporters who not only give financially but also dedicate time to leaving comments, questions, and/or suggestions. It could probably stand to be at a higher tier, but changing it now might produce more negative results than positive at this point.

Adding more sponsor spots is a good idea as well as differentiating between individuals and corporations. There has to be a healthy limit and balance though as you don't want the segment carrying on too long either. As for donations, I believe it's best to leave it in its current form as a small section in their Twitch information panel/biography and nothing beyond that.

A video or live stream of certain areas or events at the meet-up where discussed in the latest Cup of Jones episode. I don't think the event itself needs to be exclusive to those attending, however, it's a bit awkward and a hard task to get every single thing live streamed. Personally, I'd settle for the more substantial events being covered be it via stream or a video after the fact.
 

Gurrry

Member
Just wanna say I enjoy watching the gift opening and want to say thanks to all the people who are gracious enough to donate. Not everyone can show their love for EZA and its nice to see that the people that can are doing so.

L&R to all and to all a good night.
 

Anaithsol

Neo Member
Now is your chance

Well then, a good majority of the information was already provided by Damiani in the discussion you both had and then followed up on Twitter, but I'll give it my fair shake.

For starters, five star characters are not necessary at all to succeed in the game nor are they heavily encouraged to the point where monetary investment is necessary in order to proceed. The feather cost is initially a problem to upgrade four star characters to five star, but it seems this current implementation is accounting for long-term investment rather than immediate reward. Nevertheless, Nintendo has been handing out feathers in a more frequent matter now with recent promotions rewarding 10,000, 1,000, and another 1,000 respectively without the requirement of ranking high in the arena.

Secondly, Damiani didn't find a secret well of experience in order to conquer chapter nine in one playthrough. The game was initially advertised to feature a training tower that allows you to level up your old and newly obtained characters without facing the same stamina requirements as the main missions. In addition to that, there's currently an incentive to utilize the training tower as the stamina costs are cut down even further to the point where you can greatly level up with just your initial allotment of 50 stamina.

If that wasn't enough, Nintendo has also been providing a healthy amount of free stamina potions during this initial opening period. It's possible we'll see lowered frequency as the game goes on, but stamina, so far, hasn't been a large problem unless you're looking to complete everything possible within a couple of days.

One last tidbit is that My Nintendo is also offering Stamina Potions, Duel Crests, and other various upgrade items at a relatively fair point cost for those folks who would like to gain an extra advantage without investing money into the game.
 
If I had faith in the EZA community's ability to pick, I'd agree, but week in week out we'd miss the best games in the vote for some total tosh. I think a stream of them playing something insane like Zombie Revenge would be great, but I doubt many people would vote on that if it had Mario Party or something asinine and overdone.

I'll agree that I've never been able to understand the voters on these polls. The same thing would happen with Dumb Game Monday where the worst thing would inevitably win.

Personally I'd agree that a separate video for opening mail would be optimal combined with a changeup to the group stream format, but I also understand that having the gifts opened on the stream saves them a lot of time from having to shoot, edit and upload another show. Since we're talking about a group that is already short of the editing resources it could use, and already shooting for 12+ hours some Tuesdays I can understand that not changing anytime soon.

I do think maybe doing two games each group stream would be a good idea. Have a vote for one and have the allies rotate picking another. Maybe focus on distinct groups on the couch for each segment so the discussion can be more audible and focused. I personally miss the days at GT where 3 or 4 people would stream together at the end of the day so I'd love if they could recapture some of that. It can be frustrating when they have 3 different conversations happening around the room, none of which can be clearly followed.
 

arkon

Member
I'll chime in and say I've not had a problem with the subscriber song or gift giving segments. The subscriber song complaints in particular I feel are overblown. I haven't watched all the group streams but the ones I have never felt like they were overwhelmed with the song or disrupting the flow or whatever.

The gift giving segments have often led to additional bits like the head-to-heads between Brandon and Huber, or the Gundam building stream. So they get a pass for those alone. Also it's surreal seeing them eating Space Raiders onstream.

As for the Anniversary streaming idea I think they could do what the KF guys do. Put the uploads up after a few weeks/months so they still have people compelled to go and those of us (like myself) who live miles away can eventually get to see those things as they happened.
 

Bosman

GUILTY videogame man
Well then, a good majority of the information was already provided by Damiani in the discussion you both had and then followed up on Twitter, but I'll give it my fair shake.

For starters, five star characters are not necessary at all to succeed in the game nor are they heavily encouraged to the point where monetary investment is necessary in order to proceed. The feather cost is initially a problem to upgrade four star characters to five star, but it seems this current implementation is accounting for long-term investment rather than immediate reward. Nevertheless, Nintendo has been handing out feathers in a more frequent matter now with recent promotions rewarding 10,000, 1,000, and another 1,000 respectively without the requirement of ranking high in the arena.

Secondly, Damiani didn't find a secret well of experience in order to conquer chapter nine in one playthrough. The game was initially advertised to feature a training tower that allows you to level up your old and newly obtained characters without facing the same stamina requirements as the main missions. In addition to that, there's currently an incentive to utilize the training tower as the stamina costs are cut down even further to the point where you can greatly level up with just your initial allotment of 50 stamina.

If that wasn't enough, Nintendo has also been providing a healthy amount of free stamina potions during this initial opening period. It's possible we'll see lowered frequency as the game goes on, but stamina, so far, hasn't been a large problem unless you're looking to complete everything possible within a couple of days.

One last tidbit is that My Nintendo is also offering Stamina Potions, Duel Crests, and other various upgrade items at a relatively fair point cost for those folks who would like to gain an extra advantage without investing money into the game.

Each of your points don't seem to acknowledge any of the multiple instances where I presented plainly false information, but I'll be super clear now: I don't believe you can beat this game without grinding in the tower/repeating areas on higher difficulties, and I think that is bad. It kind of stinks when a game forces you to grind, but it is simply Bad when grinding is a limited resource (stamina).
- Even with 12,000 feathers, I still don't believe you could upgrade a 4 star to a 5 yet. 20k is an outrageous number, but so is 10 or 8.
- The training tower is designed to incentivize players to spend more stamina. It's not created to be fun or interesting. Your defense that the costs are currently reduced already seems like an admission that this thing might be stupid.
- Free potions do not make the game design better.
- Logging into MyNintendo and redeeming awards does not make the game design better.
I don't call a lot of games bad but I truly believe this one just is. I didn't just glance at this game; I played up to the final mission. I went to the training tower and replayed missions on Hard and Lunatic and even played a bunch of PVP matches. Despite some neat things, this is a free to play game designed to monetize your time. It's all normal stuff if you're used to FTP games but I really didn't think Nintendo would ever be making a game like this and it bums me out.
All this said, if I had lucked into one 5 star in any of my 25 pulls I probably would have had a better impression of the game. I'm very salty about that.
 

sora87

Member
Brilliant NIoh review Ben, probably the best EZA have put out so far.

I personally would like to see more episodes of Game Sleuth and Retrospectives, but I also understand that those particular shows require far more research, planning, material, and overall attention than most of the other projects. That's not even taking into account the current workload all the allies look to be battling as of late due to all the good releases just these past two months and their upcoming anniversary.

I think more game sleuths and retros are what will help EZA grow in 2017, if that means Damiani or someone not doing as many streams as they are now, so be it imo. Those are the things that grab people's attention and gives them a reputation for solid, well produced original content, more so than now. Getting that stuff out in a timely manner keeps those 1000s who aren't interested in the podcasts and stuff coming back.
 
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