BruiserBear
Banned
Miserable? Speak for yourself. I'm totally hyped for the new consoles!
EDGE: "Power struggle: the real differences between PS4 and Xbox One performance"
- Thread starter Musiol
- Start date
Miserable? Speak for yourself. I'm totally hyped for the new consoles!
GPGPU I'd guess. If I had to guess specifics, perhaps Physics.
NoMoreTrolls
Banned
Timlot or ekim will succeed him as the new MrPresident.
Timlot = Vice president, ekim = speaker of the house.
And yes, these threads get so miserable because they're full of frustrated gamers who just want to play these damn things.
Me too. Next gen is going to be a good one. The amount of excitement from developers this time around compared to the panic of HD development that was hitting them at the beginning of this gen makes me think that we'll be in for a real treat.
DragonSworne
Banned
Time travel and faster than light travel. Also light sabers.
So that's what the light on the DS4 is for.
Already there my friend, Photon binding http://www.theguardian.com/film/2013/sep/30/star-wars-lightsabers-invented
Back on topic:
I'm super Hyped for November 29.
Ultimatepancake
Banned
No idea where to put this, but since the thread is Sony related,
https://twitter.com/yosp/status/382556122088869888
https://twitter.com/yosp/status/382556122088869888
Maybe he'll stop trolling NeoGAF and get his ass down to the Capitol building. The government isn't going to turn itself back on ya know!
Not sure but PS4 is pretty much giving us something that we have never seen before, an 1.94 TFLOP APU with 8GB of GDDR5 in a closed box so you never know what they might come up with.
picture a game using about 940 GFLOPS of the PS4 for normal GPU stuff but using 1 TFLOPS of computing power for crazy stuff like Procedural Weather & 3D Sound & things like that making it feel like you are really in a storm.
I think you're getting the wrong impression from some forum debates. Everyone is excited for the upcoming console generation and is awaiting its arrival. But until that time actually, it leaves folks with time to discuss the merits of each machine. And of course you've got some that get a little too invested in their favorite corporation that they feel compelled to spread misinformation of perceived opponents... Hence this thread.
Just a way to pass time until we get our new toys, in between playing vidya of course.
Iacobellis
Junior Member
That reminds me. Has anybody measured these boxes in terms of Gamecubes?
How many Gamecubes taped together are we talking here?
Thanks. We're going to need a lot of duct tape!
Amazing.
Iacobellis
Junior Member
This makes the Xbox One look even weaker.
velociraptor
Junior Member
Digital Foundry: "PlayStation 4's 32 ROPs are generally acknowledged as overkill for a 1080p resolution (the underlying architecture from AMD was never designed exclusively just for full HD but for other resolutions such as 2560x1400/2560x1600 too), while Xbox One's 16 ROPs could theoretically be overwhelmed by developers."
What does this mean? The PS4 should hit 1080p with ease?
What does this mean? The PS4 should hit 1080p with ease?
Muppet of a Man
Member
It means that the ROPs on the PS4 won't ever become a bottleneck to the overall system (which is great news). Pixel fill rate was a sticking point on PS3 with its subpar RSX GPU.
It means Leadbetter is spinning. There is no "could theoretically" the 16 ROP's are already a bottleneck in some xb1 games as stated in the same article.
PS4 will be able to achieve higher resolutions than XB1, He's trying to paint a picture of 32 ROP's being not as important as 16 are "good enough".
GrizzleBoy
Banned
Holy fffffffffffffffffwow.
If neogaf was literally just these gifs, I wouldn't even care.
DirgeExtinction
Member
Sword Of Doom
Member
So they're saying the xbone has the perfect amount of power (balance) and the ps4 has a lot of useless power. Because Sony is stupid and they don't realize they don't need the extra power.
It's one way to spin things I guess
Yep, someone should phone AMD, because the 7850 and 7870 have higher pixel fill rates (same rops higher clocks) and less bandwidth (156gb/s) guess AMD don't know how to make GPU's.
Sword Of Doom
Member
I finally understand what that article is saying and why some people are skepticle of Leadbetter. As a tech writer he has to call them out on their bullshit. I know he's interviewing them but that nonsense is being published on their site. There's no excuse
knighthonor
Banned
no matter how more powerful the PS4 is over the BONE, the developers will still make most games BONE accessible stat-wise. and never really do some things that use the PS4 true power, beyond first and 2nd party games on the PS4.
Andvary
Member
I don't agree with you. This gen they can target high end graphics cards and then port to the consoles.
Sword Of Doom
Member
I'm hoping you're right. The generation hasn't even started yet so it's still early. I think if PS4 gains a strong foothold then developers will definitely use all the power it has to offer.
Sort of.
The biggest problems this generation came not from fancy shader effects and shit but from core game systems not being possible on PS360 levels of memory. See: Skyrim, Fallout 3 and Fallout New Vegas all being complete shitshows on the consoles.
That memory limitation is also what held back PC games, more so than the CPU/GPU limitations of the consoles.
With the PS4 and Xbone both consoles have 8GB of RAM with ~5-6GB accessible to games, contrasted against the 512MB the 360 and PS3 had. That is fucking huge and will allow for massive changes in games, from BF4 finally having 64 players on consoles to future RPGs like Witcher 3 having massive open worlds with little to no compromise.
Next-gen games will, in time, open up. The boring linear corridor shooter bullshit of CoD should give way to proper open level design like we saw in Crysis before Crytek neutered the franchise to work on the PS360 consoles. Witcher 3 is the harbinger of RPGs to come; expect the next-gen Fallout, Elder Scrolls and even terrible Bioware RPGs to open up to a scope and scale unprecedented on consoles.
All due to the memory.
Xbone is substantially weaker than the PS4 and it's going to show from day one and only become more egregious as time passes, but that's just graphics. In terms of core gameplay systems and scope they both have roughly the same amount of available memory and are going to allow for better, grander games.
NingenJanai
Member
I think you are wrong, just look at some of the launch titles and dev comments, Battlefield being 720p on Xbox and probably having higher res on PS4, Watch dogs PS4 being the definitive version, etc..
it's clear (if we believe the 100% better comments from EDGE's sources) that the ESRAM is something that they are struggling with, so I'd expect first multiplats to therefore be very much different..
(I've no idea why they didn't struggle with eDRAM on the 360 and yet are apparently flummoxed by the ESRAM on the XB1, but I don't do console software, so I'll just wait and see)
SwiftDeath
Member
The eDRAM on the 360 was handled at the SDK level to my knowledge (by the software enviroment itself) whereas the ESRAM has to be handled by the programmer
So it could very well become like the 360 but I think it may be a bit more complex a solution
NingenJanai
Member
I think they are forced to struggle with the ESRAM on Xbox One, otherwise the difference between PS4 and Xbox One would be even bigger.
But both machines have great specs and games on both machines will look great, but there's no denying the PS4 is more powerful, how that translates into actual games we'll have to wait until development into the machines is more mature to know.
hooijdonk17
Member
The EDRAM on the 360 was a nice extra that you could make use of some way, but even if you did not use it at all (or effectively at all) a regular directx title was still bount to do better on the PPC CPU than Cell. Effectively, playing with the EDRAM was a bonus.
With the ESRAM, you HAVE TO make GOOD USE of it, otherwise your game will probably suck compared to the PS4 version.. and it's a pain in the ass to do that.
It's like the PS3 all over again, people having to make good use of SPEs when the PPC CPU could easily and efficiently distribute its workload..
This has been debunked countless times, so no split for PS4 and no split for XB1.
bigboss370
Member
from the other thead, prob relevant here too:
pretty big margins imo, but I still believe multiplats will not be significantly different from each other. You're not gonna get one version be 30fps and another be 60fps or anything big like that, just minor stuff perhaps. its first party (and second) that will really shine on PS4, but I think X1 will be fine when I see stuff like ryse and quantum break visuals.
pretty big margins imo, but I still believe multiplats will not be significantly different from each other. You're not gonna get one version be 30fps and another be 60fps or anything big like that, just minor stuff perhaps. its first party (and second) that will really shine on PS4, but I think X1 will be fine when I see stuff like ryse and quantum break visuals.
That's not the purpose of my question. I know that ps4 can use all it's CU's for graphics. I'm trying to understand why xboxfans tried to use this approach to criticize Sony's console, while x1 faced the same dilemna
Oh sorry, my bad.
Well they'd try any approach that would give better specs to their consoles, or close the gap, or whatever helps them sleep at night.
For example, some of them are spinning the 10% gpu reservation on xb1 into good news somehow...
I think it is the same situation as early RSX and Xbox GPU.
RSX had devided shaders as every GPU back then where Xbox GPU had unified shaders which was totally new thing back then.
Suddenly people who worked earlier on hardware said that RSX is hard to work with.
It didn't mean it was hard to work with or they struggle with it. It means new Xbox GPU was that much easier to work with.
Similar situation is here. Instead of juggling with memory, deciding what should go to ESRAM and how on PS4 they just dump everything in their one unified pool of ram and that is it. After initial load they don't need to move it anywhere. It is even better than PC where you need stuff main system memory and then later juggle with data between DDR3 and GDDR5.
Because they don't know what they're talking about and they're desparate to use any kind of bullshit wizard math or straight up misinformation to downplay facts.
CadetMahoney
Member
With one version of the same $60 game having lower-res textures here and there, far more framedrops, tearing and inferior lighting, the casual player may not notice/care but it would still be an unmitigated disaster. And if that's the case for every AAA multiplat than it would be a permanent bullet point not to get a bone, with friends and forums constantly reminding everyone about it which offers the best value for money for the same game.
It's the ultimate falling of that line of thinking. They'll spout 14+4 to try and indirectly turn the argument to 12 vs 14 CUs, but indeed if developers of a multiplat title are using 4 of the PS4's for GPGPU, they'll need just as many when doing the same workload on the Xbone. Unless said devs cut back on whatever they're using for GPGPU on the Xbone port, but then that leaves a port with inferior physics/audio/whatever on the 'bone, not something I'm sure said devs would really want to delve into.
Admiral Woofington
Member
The multiplat might not be affected in terms of drastic looks, but if the ps4 is easier to code for and has more hardware freedom, games will probably be built on that and then moved to the xbone. I think the day we see a Bethesda game made with PS4 in mind is not too far away.
TastyOreoFriend
Member
I would agree with you if the PS4 had some kind of exotic architecture like PS3, but that really doesn't seem to be the case this time around. There's doesn't seem to be all that much holding devs back on PS4 from all the dev interviews and insider leaks we've had. I think it'd be hard to spin parity to PS4 owners once the big guns start coming out like Santa Monic, NaughtGods, and Guerrilla Games 2nd game.
Crimson_Fate
Member
I look at it like this. Most 3rd party titles are going to be designed for PC first.
The PS4 is the easiest console to port to so it will be ported first mainly because of their architecture . You can even see it today where the PS4 Ports of 3rd party titles were seen running on a PS4 LONG before the xb1 versions were.
Do you really think that a developer is going to take the extra time to go back to the PS4 after the XB1 Port is finally complete and put in extra effort to make it worse ?
I think developers are going to end up porting the PS4 first each time just because they know they can push it out the door faster. Likely they will need extra time and resources to finish the XB1 ports.