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Evidence Mounts That The Vote Was Hacked

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MacGuffin

Member
MIMIC said:
That alone is impetus for an investigation.

EDIT:

Hmmm...I see that the ball is rolling in some respects.

God bless Keith Olbermann. :)

Yes Keith is doing some good work, this is promising.


....Since Kerry conceeded, and if this could turn around the election (hypothetically) could he still "win" or does that forfeit his chance?
 

goodcow

Member
JScott said:
Yes Keith is doing some good work, this is promising.


....Since Kerry conceeded, and if this could turn around the election (hypothetically) could he still "win" or does that forfeit his chance?

Kerry conceeding isn't legally binding. It's merely to save the Democratic party a bunch of hate.

If the evidence countinues to mount you can bet Kerry and the DNC will unconceed and fight.
 
impirius said:
(it's on now! WATCH IT)

I am!

it was heavily hinted that I need to email this video (the one linked there) to all of the local television stations. maybe that's an idea? email and ask why they aren't covering it?

As an aside, why is Keith the only person covering this? I mean, damn.
 

Trakball

Banned
bune duggy said:
As an aside, why is Keith the only person covering this? I mean, damn.


because if you challenge anything that the U.S of A. puts in front of you, you're a terrorist! didn't you know?!
 

MC Safety

Member
George W. would have gotten away with it, too, if not for you meddling kids!

Seriously, though. Evidence mounts that your candidate lost. You can scratch and claw all you want, but America spoke the other day, and it didn't elect John Kerry.
 

Kettch

Member

Dan

No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
Disco Stu said:
George W. would have gotten away with it, too, if not for you meddling kids!

Seriously, though. Evidence mounts that your candidate lost. You can scratch and claw all you want, but America spoke the other day, and it didn't elect John Kerry.
And how many times can it be stated that these are issues that need to be addressed regardless of the election's outcome? Goddamn.
 

Trakball

Banned
Disco Stu said:
George W. would have gotten away with it, too, if not for you meddling kids!

Seriously, though. Evidence mounts that your candidate lost. You can scratch and claw all you want, but America spoke the other day, and it didn't elect John Kerry.


I love smug folk on msg. boards as much as the next guy, but really - if this "America" you speak of happened to speak in favor of John Kerry, are you telling me in complete honesty that you would accept that outcome, just like that? Especially in the case of all the shady voting mishaps that have went down in the last couple elections?
 

MC Safety

Member
Trakball said:
I love smug folk on msg. boards as much as the next guy, but really - if this "America" you speak of happened to speak in favor of John Kerry, are you telling me in complete honesty that you would accept that outcome, just like that? Especially in the case of all the shady voting mishaps that have went down in the last couple elections?

Well, you see, I'm not fond of whining or puling. Nor is it my style to grab hold of any conspiracy that might serve to distract me from the truth. If John Kerry won -- and who's to say I didn't vote for the guy? -- I would continue to live my life as I have for the past 877 years, give or take a few.

You can make your vague claims of shadiness all you want. For me, the only thing that matters is the vote (imperfect as it is, and as rigged as you claim it to be) which the democrats were gracious enough to admit they lost. Life goes on.
 

Dan

No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
Disco Stu said:
You can make your vague claims of shadiness all you want. For me, the only thing that matters is the vote (imperfect as it is, and as rigged as you claim it to be) which the democrats were gracious enough to admit they lost. Life goes on.
Not all of us are claiming it was rigged. But you think we should all ignore that fact that some counties received more presidential votes than there were registered voters? This stuff needs to be solved no matter what. Other larger countries have handled electronic voting without any major issues, why the hell can't we do it? Jesus, I really don't understand this kind of justifying of a flawed system just because it produces a result. What's so terrible about investigating the discrepancies? If there's nothing to be found, then there's nothing to be found. If there are problems, they can be fixed and we can have better, more confident elections in the future.
 

Trakball

Banned
Disco Stu said:
You can make your vague claims of shadiness all you want. For me, the only thing that matters is the vote (imperfect as it is, and as rigged as you claim it to be) which the democrats were gracious enough to admit they lost. Life goes on.


See, this is what gets me about you, and other posters with the whole "oh boo-hoo, get over it" attitude.

#1) where did I ever claim anything was rigged? Yes, I said "shady" but that means "things didn't look right". it doesn't mean "someone definitely stole this election!!!!oneoneeleven" - and it doesn't help matters when you spin what I'm saying right in front of me

#2) being that I don't work for Diebold, I can't exactly make specific claims of shadiness, can I? all I can say is that things don't look right - oh, wait, I forgot, if I question things, I'm a terrorist!

#3) life goes on, sure. are you old enough to get drafted?
 

MC Safety

Member
demon said:
Which must be why you don't give a shit if "the vote" isn't accurately counted.

I care very much that the vote was accurately counted well enough to give this country a president.

Now. There's probably a margin of error involved with all elections. If this is the shadiness and grand conspiracy some people are hinting at, let it be known here and now that I am all for correcting/minimizing it.
 
After seeing the MSNBC report, I have to say there should be an investigation.

The Florida discrepancies are puzzling you have to admit.

If everything went smoothly then it should check out, but if there were problems, then at the very least those should be made public, and then addressed so they don't happen again.
 

Alcibiades

Member
ravingloon said:
I'll tell you another thing that bothered me the entire election nite (Florida): Bush vs. Kerry and the Senate race: Martinez vs Castor. Castor, the democrat, pulled in 10,000 MORE votes than Kerry. Martinez, the Republican, pulled in 300,000 LESS votes than Bush. I'm sorry, but those numbers are flat out fucked up. I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but Castor ran an absolutely horrible campaign and could never and pulled in more votes than Kerry. And neither was an incumbent, so there was no inflated base.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5650738/
the word on cable news was that Castor was a formidable opponent, and IMO she performed great at the debates...

also, in many states around the country a Senator from one party wins while the state goes for the President from another party, just look at Colorado, North Dakota, etc...

it's not unusual at all...
 

RiZ III

Member
Ohio— The recount of 2004 (David Shuster)

This afternoon, I spoke with Blair Bobier, the attorney/spokesman for David Cobb, the Green Party's 2004 candidate for President. Bobier confirms that the press release floating on the net is legitimate. The Green Party is combining forces with the Libertarian Party to seek a statewide election recount in Ohio.

Unlike Florida in 2000, Ohio's recount rules are straightforward and specific. Once the Ohio vote is certified, which I'm told could happen as early as next week, the Green/Libertarian group will have five days to file a formal application for statewide recount. In addition, the group must then deposit $10 for every precinct to be recounted.

Based on the number of precincts in Ohio, a statewide recount will cost the Green/Libertarian group about $110,000. However, the group expects to raise that money "rather easily" within the next few days.

Once the recount application has been filed, the recount itself must begin within 10 days. So, expect to see the formal recount kick-off in early December.

Again, the procedures in Ohio are quite clear: The recount must be conducted by teams having equal numbers of Democrats and Republicans; records must be available for visual inspection by witnesses; ballots must be handled only by members of the board; witnesses may observe the inspection the ballots; punch card ballots must be inspected for hanging chads ("if a chad is attached by three or four corners, a vote shall not be counted for that particular candidate.") and etc. The lengthy list of rules and procedures are available on the Ohio Secretary of State's Web site.

Whether you agree with a recount or not... the rules are the rules. And even a candidate like David Cobb, who received a total of 24 votes in Ohio, is entitled to a recount. So, let us all hope the process in the Buckeye state will be orderly, calm, and litigation free.

Pre-recount, here is where the Ohio vote total stands:

President Bush (Republican Party) 2,796,147
John Kerry (Democratic Party) 2,659,664
Badnarik (Libertarian) 14,331
Peroutka (Constitutional) 11,614

My friend and colleague Keith Olbermann has been all over this story.

On Friday night, "Hardball with Chris Matthews" (7 p.m. and 11 p.m. ET) will be jumping into the fray. You won't want to miss that. Plus, this weekend here on Hardblogger, I'll be posting some amazing national election numbers and demographic trends that may shock you. I've run some of the numbers past a few MSNBC political analysts, and everybody is calling it "a big deal."
 

adam20

Member
u know most the media wont cover a lot of this as it is "controlled". it really makes me sick what america is turning into.

kerry did win. i hope it can be proven even further.
 
kerry did win. i hope it can be proven even further.

your ignorance is astounding. There is virtually NO EVIDENCE that Kerry would have won FL or OH. You know why the mostly democratic counties in FL went for Bush? Because they are mostly old southern Dixiecrats in northern Florida. These counties went for Bush in 00,. Dole in 96 and ever Bush Sr in 88. Something that Olbermann failed to mention in his piece. These areas tend to be fiscally liberal(that is why a minimum wage ballot initiative in one of these counties passed) but conservative on everything else(values, War on Terror).

As far as OH is concerned, right now there about 150K uncounted votes. Kerry would have to take nearly all of them in order to win. That is not going to happen. The odds of kerry doing that are statiscally insignificant. And while there was some iregularities in Cuyahoga county Kerry took that area by a 2-1 margin. Really good job of cheating by the Bush team :lol

There are thousands of people(democrats, republicans, and even third party people) involved in all levels of government with this election. To rig the election, you would have to get nearly all of them on board. Do you really think none of these people would speak up if there was shenanigans going on?? That is absurd. Do you really think the Kerry would have conceded if he thought that this crap was going on?
 
Holy Sh---
Crazy new developments on voter fraud cover up:
Volusia County election records just got put on lockdown



Dueling lawyers, election officials gnashing teeth, Votergate.tv film crew catching it all.

Here's what happened so far:

Friday Black Box Voting investigators Andy Stephenson and Kathleen Wynne popped in to ask for some records. They were rebuffed by an elections official named Denise. Bev Harris called on the cell phone from investigations in downstate Florida, and told Volusia County Elections Supervisor Deanie Lowe that Black Box Voting would be in to pick up our Nov. 2 Freedom of Information request, or would file for a hand recount. "No, Bev, please don't do that!" she exclaimed. But this is the way it has to be, folks. We didn't back down.

Monday Bev, Andy and Kathleen came in with a film crew and asked for the FOIA request. Deanie Lowe gave it to us with a smile, but I noticed that one item, the polling place tapes, were not copies of the real ones, but instead were new printouts, done on Nov. 15, and not signed by anyone.

I asked to see the real ones, and they told us for "privacy" reasons we can't have copies of the signed ones. I insisted on at least viewing them (although refusing to give us copies of the signatures is not legally defensible, according to our attorney). They said the real ones were in the County Elections warehouse. It was quittin' time and we arranged to come back this morning to review them.

Lana Hires, an employee who gained some notoriety in a Diebold memo, where she asked for an explanation of minus 16,022 votes for Gore, so she wouldn't have to stand there "looking dumb" when the auditor came in, was particularly unhappy about seeing us in the office. She vigorously shook her head when Deanie Lowe suggested we go to the warehouse.

Kathleen Wynne and I showed up at the warehouse at 8:15 this morning. There was Lana Hires looking especially gruff, yet surprised. She ordered us out. Well, we couldn't see why because there she was, with a couple other people, handling the original poll tapes. You know, the ones with the signatures on them. We stepped out and they promptly shut the door behind us.

There was a trash bag on the porch outside the door. I looked into it and what do you know, but there were poll tapes in there. They came out and glared at us. We drove away a small bit, and then videotaped the license plates of the two vehicles marked 'City Council' member. Others came out to glare and soon all doors were slammed.

So, we went and parked behind a bus to see what they would do next. They pulled out some large pylons, which blocked the door. I decided to go look at the garbage some more. Kathleen videotaped this. A man came out and I immediately wrote a public records request for the contents of the garbage bag, which also contained ballots -- real ones, but not filled out.

A brief tug of war occurred, tearing the garbage bag open. We then looked through it, as Pete looked on. He was quite friendly.

We collected various poll tapes and other information and asked if they could copy it for us, for our public records request. "You won't be going anywhere," said Pete. "The deputy is on his way."

Yes, not one but two police cars came up and then two county elections officials, and we all stood around discussing the merits of my public records request.

They finally let us go, about the time our film crew arrived, and we all trooped off to the elections office. There, the plot thickened.

We began to compare the special printouts given to us with the signed polling tapes from election night. Lo and behold, some were missing. We also found some that didn't match. In fact, in one location, precinct 215, an African-American precinct, the votes were off by hundreds, in favor of George W. Bush and other Republicans.

Hmm. Which was right? Our polling tape, specially printed on Nov. 15, without signatures, or theirs, printed on Nov. 2, with up to 8 signatures per tape?

Well, then it became even more interesting. Lana Hires took it upon herself to box up some items from an office, which appeared to contain -- you guessed it -- polling place tapes. She took them to the back of the building and disappeared.

Then, voting integrity advocates from Volusia and Broward, decided now would be a good time to go through the trash at the elections office. Lo and behold, they found all kinds of memos and some polling place tapes, fresh from Volusia elections office.

So, we compared these with the Nov. 2 signed ones and the "special' ones from Nov. 15 given to us, unsigned, and we found several of the MISSING poll tapes. There they were: In the garbage.

So, Kathleen went to the car and got the polling place tapes we had pulled from the warehouse garbage. My my my. There were not only discrepancies, but a polling place tape that was signed by six officials.

This was a bit disturbing, since the employees there told us that bag was destined for the shredder.

By now, a county lawyer had appeared on the scene, suddenly threatening to charge us extra for the time we took looking at the real stuff they had withheld from us in our FOIA. Other lawyers appeared, phoned, people had meetings, Lana glowered at everyone, and someone shut the door in the office holding the GEMS server.

Andy then went to get the GEMS server locked down. He also got the memory cards locked down and secured, much to the dismay of Lana. They were scattered around unsecured in any way before that.

We then all agreed to convene tomorrow morning, to further audit, discuss the hand count that Black Box Voting will require of Volusia County, and of course, it is time to talk about contesting the election in Volusia.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2704906
 
demon said:
Dude this is so last week.
Did you read that story, dude?

What the account contains is actual faces, names and hints of procedure on vote tampering. It's news.

Oh, wait, I'm sorry to be so last week. I'll get with the program--

buyDVDsheadinsandlolomgsurvivoramazingracepowelloutcondoleezainlolwtfomgpresidentbush fairandsquaremandateredstatesbluestates
[/america2004]
 

DCharlie

And even i am moderately surprised
not that anyone cares, but Diebold are covered by Solomon Oxley legislation and it's very very clear that they are not in compliance.

That alone should that in an investigation.
 
DCharlie said:
not that anyone cares, but Diebold are covered by Solomon Oxley legislation and it's very very clear that they are not in compliance.

That alone should that in an investigation.

while you are correct in assuming that I don't care, it is only because I have no idea what you are talking about. What is the Solomon Oxley legislation, and how do you comply with it?
 
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