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G4TechTV Phil Harrison interview: Killzone

M3Freak

M3Freak

Banned
Yes, crappy title.

Anyway, in the interview, the lady-with-no-hips asked Phil if Killzone was real time, and the dude said that the graphics and gameplay showcased in the trailer will be like that, if not better, in the final game.

I can't remember if he also said it was real time, but I think he did. Anyone got more on that?
 
He put his ass on the line. Man-jaw Morgan Webb asked something like, "so, when I get Killzone at home, will it look like this?" And Phil said a firm, "Yes." He also said this stuff "just scratches the surface" which is pretty obvious IMO since it should be representative of first-/early-gen stuff, much like the PS2 demos. That's my hope at least. Heavenly Sword is indeed spooge-worthy, and that's legit. But hey, if Phil Harrison is wrong, we've got various forumites around the interweb that have archived his public shame, and will be more than happy to roast his ass in the fires of fanboy hell if/when he's wrong. There's gonna be some ownage when this game drops...someone's gonna be eating a big turd sandwich. :lol PEACE.

EDIT: Jayfro on the fucking job. Save this to your HDD, Phil Harrison may have owned himself hardcore tonight. :lol

EDIT2: Whoops, not the video I was looking for. Thought you had a cap of Phil's interview with Webb on G4.
 
Pimpwerx said:
He put his ass on the line. Man-jaw Morgan Webb asked something like, "so, when I get Killzone at home, will it look like this?" And Phil said a firm, "Yes." He also said this stuff "just scratches the surface" which is pretty obvious IMO since it should be representative of first-/early-gen stuff, much like the PS2 demos. That's my hope at least. Heavenly Sword is indeed spooge-worthy, and that's legit. But hey, if Phil Harrison is wrong, we've got various forumites around the interweb that have archived his public shame, and will be more than happy to roast his ass in the fires of fanboy hell if/when he's wrong. There's gonna be some ownage when this game drops...someone's gonna be eating a big turd sandwich. :lol PEACE.

EDIT: Jayfro on the fucking job. Save this to your HDD, Phil Harrison may have owned himself hardcore tonight. :lol

EDIT2: Whoops, not the video I was looking for. Thought you had a cap of Phil's interview with Webb on G4.
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Sorry about that, thought I would throw a vid out there of what MS should have shown to rival that killzone footage.
 
I love how none of the reps actually say it is real time. Instead they say it is "representative" of what you will be playing. Damn fibbers.
 
binary said:
I love how none of the reps actually say it is real time. Instead they say it is "representative" of what you will be playing. Damn fibbers.
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So you want them to say it's real-time? That'd be even more of a lie.

Or do you want them to say, the PS3 can never achieve that. That's never going to happen, they'd fire Phil right that instant (or at least demote him Kutaragi-style).
 
binary said:
I love how none of the reps actually say it is real time. Instead they say it is "representative" of what you will be playing. Damn fibbers.
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You're pretty fucking demanding and pretentious y'know that.

What the hell are you angry over? You want the actual games to do less then what was shown? You want a solid guarantee that's what they'll be using?

Even if it is prerendered, so what? They render the stuff based on what the PS3 will be able to do; they don't use ray tracing or radiosity lighting. The shaders that you see making the demo come alive, is what the PS3 will be able to do.

Honestly, from some of the reactions we've had about this consoles, you'd think some of the people had their family killed by Sony. Or an agenda.
 
Wow...you all took my comments the wrong way. All I'm saying is that they should be honest from the get-go. Why tip-toe around the issue and continue having to answer questions like this from the media when you could just give an up front answer and dispell the rumors once and for all. :lol Chill out.
 
binary said:
Wow...you all took my comments the wrong way. All I'm saying is that they should be honest from the get-go. Why tip-toe around the issue and continue having to answer questions like this from the media when you could just give an up front answer and dispell the rumors once and for all. :lol Chill out.
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What more upfront answer do you want then "it'll be representative"? Are you brain dead that you can't figure out that the demo isn't currently been rendered on the PS3? Jesus Christ man, these people have jobs that they need to keep, and it involves giving out real information with a positive spin on it.

It'll be representative tells us, this is what we can look forward to expecting; if he says outright, no this is prerendered what the fuck is that supposed to tell us? The PS3 WON'T ACTUALLY DO THIS STUFF? Because fucking hell, that's the conclusion everyone will jump to.

As for 'upfront answer', you mean in the press conference? Because that's not what you're talking about before, if you even have reading comprehension.
 
hahahaha its funny how they made it from a "gameplay angle" so they could fool people. At least the PGR3 isn't trying to make people believe it's realtime(if in fact it wasn't). Hopefully both games end up looking that freaking good when complete.
 
briefcasemanx said:
hahahaha its funny how they made it from a "gameplay angle" so they could fool people. At least the PGR3 isn't trying to make people believe it's realtime(if in fact it wasn't). Hopefully both games end up looking that freaking good when complete.
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You can't please everybody it'd seem; This board often comments on how 'replay' or out of actual play angle shots aren't demonstrative of the actual visual in game. At least they didn't stick a HUD in there ya know.
 
Zaptruder said:
Was that CG or realtime? If it's the latter, then dayum, it's better than most CG done in this gen, and I'd be extremely happy to play games with graphics like that.
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That is basically the equivalent of the Killzone vid for PS3, that was Ghost Recon 3 for 360 and it's done the same way as Killzone. It's represenative of what the game could look like. Now we've seen real time gameplay of Ghost Recon for 360 and already know it won't look quite like that in game so the same can pretty much be said for Killzone on PS3.
 
binary said:
I love how none of the reps actually say it is real time. Instead they say it is "representative" of what you will be playing. Damn fibbers.
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Real-time? There is no final hardware... pre-rendered output from the game engine with real art assets is what you're going to get at this stage. It's the most representative way to demonstrate a game, see this is how it works:

The platform holders send out devkits that (hopefully) have hardware that supports the same basic featureset or can emulate it. They then give the developer a target level of preformance and let them go at it. In the case of Sony, their devkits have ISSCC-Cell's and nVidia graphics that support SM3 -- the only difference is in preformance.

So, of fucking course it better not be realtime if you expect them to be doing a good job. Hell, Microsoft's devkits have absolutly nothing in common with their final hardware... if they're being rendered in real-time then their developers have problems (eg. they suck) and you get Rare-level crap.
 
JayFro said:
That is basically the equivalent of the Killzone vid for PS3, that was Ghost Recon 3 for 360 and it's done the same way as Killzone. It's represenative of what the game could look like. Now we've seen real time gameplay of Ghost Recon for 360 and already know it won't look quite like that in game so the same can pretty much be said for Killzone on PS3.
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What? We've seen in game...but it won't look like that in game..... :lol
 
GhaleonEB said:
What? We've seen in game...but it won't look like that in game..... :lol
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It won't look quite like the link I've posted, unless you didn't check out those vids. Damnit you know what I meant! :D
 
GhaleonEB said:
What? We've seen in game...but it won't look like that in game..... :lol
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At this time with everyone saying 30%! Alpha kit! Final Dev Kits not yet shipped for any of the next gen consoles, we really have no idea what games on completed hardware will look like. It's a possibility they might just surpass our expectations of much of what we've seen to date.
 
JayFro said:
That is basically the equivalent of the Killzone vid for PS3, that was Ghost Recon 3 for 360 and it's done the same way as Killzone. It's represenative of what the game could look like. Now we've seen real time gameplay of Ghost Recon for 360 and already know it won't look quite like that in game so the same can pretty much be said for Killzone on PS3.
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I meant to say is that what they're expecting for realtime or is that just a CG trailer?

But yes... looks like despite some of the botched unveilings on the X360, it'll have enough power to propel us into 'next gen' rather than be 1.5 rushed solution. Well, that's the hope.
 
PS2 KID said:
At this time with everyone saying 30%! Alpha kit! Final Dev Kits not yet shipped for any of the next gen consoles, we really have no idea what games on completed hardware will look like. It's a possibility they might just surpass our expectations of much of what we've seen to date.
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So, you're saying that developers create art assets and enviroments that can run at 60fps on the devkits and then recreate it all when the beta devkits are out to run at 60fps and then recreate it all again when the final hardware is available? *roll*

What you see from the devkits are targeted at the final specifications and what you're going to see more or less in the final product.
 
I thought the Dev kits currently available had no where near the power of the consoles they seek to replicate. If this is so, there is bound to be improvement from alpha and beta kits to finals.
 
Zaptruder said:
I meant to say is that what they're expecting for realtime or is that just a CG trailer?

But yes... looks like despite some of the botched unveilings on the X360, it'll have enough power to propel us into 'next gen' rather than be 1.5 rushed solution. Well, that's the hope.
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I'm not sure if it was done with the game engine or if it's CG. Same boat as killzone though, represenative of what the final game will be.
 
I started playing further into Killzone since all this hype and I am finding myself quite impressed with several aspects. LOTS of great graphical effects and style. Even the AI is not as terrible as I thought, its pretty cool how they will fall out and take cover but yes they do have some moments of being dim. Biggest complaint is the unrefined control but the more I play the easier it is to believe that these guys could actually come very close to making that demo a reality.
 
I still remember the "i-i-in-game demo of Halo 2" from E3 2003 part. It was prerended. The final game looked nowhere like this. So, what's the problem with Killzone 2?
 
seismologist said:
at least with the Killzone footage all of the models and animation are done to PS3 spec. That Ghost recon video you posted doesn't even look close to being real-time.
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Seen any Killzone 2 game real time video you can point us to?
 
seismologist said:
at least with the Killzone footage all of the models and animation are done to PS3 spec. That Ghost recon video you posted doesn't even look close to being real-time.
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It doesn't matter, both are done to represent what the gameplay could be. :)
 
JayFro said:
That is basically the equivalent of the Killzone vid for PS3, that was Ghost Recon 3 for 360 and it's done the same way as Killzone. It's represenative of what the game could look like. Now we've seen real time gameplay of Ghost Recon for 360 and already know it won't look quite like that in game so the same can pretty much be said for Killzone on PS3.
Click to expand...
I see your point, but it is amazingly obvious that the GR video is CG. I don't think the same is true at all of the Killzone video. The Killzone video, whether pre-rendered or not, looks like an actual game, as technically incredible an accomplishment that that may be, using actual game assets. That GR video looks obviously CG, just like so many games this gen have stupid, amateur CG videos that mimick what the real game looks like as intros or promotional videos, and like nearly all of those, I frankly think GR's in-game footage looks a lot better.

I am still not taking a stance on the Killzone video one way or the other, but I do very much think it will wind up looking just like, or very close to the trailer, and if Guerilla weren't actually planning on it doing so before, I'm willing to bet that after what has happened during E3, Sony is going to be pumping them shit full of money and resources, and kidnapping their wives and children until it does.
 
Andy787 said:
I see your point, but it is amazingly obvious that the GR video is CG. I don't think the same is true at all of the Killzone video. The Killzone video, whether pre-rendered or not, looks like an actual game, as technically incredible an accomplishment that that may be, using actual game assets. That GR video looks obviously CG, just like so many games this gen have stupid, amateur CG videos that mimick what the real game looks like as intros or promotional videos, and like nearly all of those, I frankly think GR's in-game footage looks a lot better.

I am still not taking a stance on the Killzone video one way or the other, but I do very much think it will wind up looking just like, or very close to the trailer, and if Guerilla weren't actually planning on it doing so before, I'm willing to bet that after what has happened during E3, Sony is going to be pumping them shit full of money and resources, and kidnapping their wives and children until it does.
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So sony did a better job of making the CG look like actual gameplay???
 
mashoutposse said:
Is it that hard to conceive that realtime KZ could do a better job of matching the quality of the vid?
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Pretty much, but I'm not the one who was foolish enough to think the day that was shown to believe it was in game footage. Even Sony is dancing around the issue.......
 
Nervous Hamster said:
I still remember the "i-i-in-game demo of Halo 2" from E3 2003 part. It was prerended. The final game looked nowhere like this. So, what's the problem with Killzone 2?
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Well, the Killzone 2 trailer was so f'n OMGWTFBBQ.. drool.. SO AWESOME, that immediately enemy combatants start screaming RENDERED CG! to defend their fragile psyches from falling to pieces.

So everyone and their mother making software for the XBOX 360 started saying the next day that they ware working on Alpha kits or 30% of what is possible on 360. Things will look better when final hardware comes around.

So Phil Harrison, the SCEE's executive VP of development, says,
And what about the game footage clips?

Not all of that - in fact, none of it was real-time because it was all running off video. If you make a presentation to two and a half thousand people, you're going to put some of it on video just to be on the safe side.

I've been asked this question a lot. The way we put those videos together, everything was done to specification. Everything was done to PS3 spec. Virtually everything used in-game assets; some things were rendered.
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So in the end we're where we started, which is that looks great rendered or not! lol Because, we realize (hopefully) if we believe the 30% alpha kits line, then knowing that PS3 devs don't have final dev kits either, it might just be possible with 'game assets' to have this be very representative of what we'll be playing on final console hardware.
 
Zaptruder said:
Was that CG or realtime? If it's the latter, then dayum, it's better than most CG done in this gen, and I'd be extremely happy to play games with graphics like that.
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that Ghost Recon 3 video was CG. totally CG. more so than Killzone.

Killzone was compiled together using realtime assets, and done to PS3 spec.

the GR3 video doesnt seem to be using realtime assets at all.
 
I still remember the "i-i-in-game demo of Halo 2" from E3 2003 part. It was prerended. The final game looked nowhere like this. So, what's the problem with Killzone 2?

Um, it WAS in game. They just cut it. The final game looked just like it......
 
GhaleonEB said:
I still remember the "i-i-in-game demo of Halo 2" from E3 2003 part. It was prerended. The final game looked nowhere like this. So, what's the problem with Killzone 2?

Um, it WAS in game. They just cut it. The final game looked just like it......
Click to expand...

Bzzt, wrong answer. Halo2 didn't look as impressive as the footage shown at E3 2003.
 
M3Freak said:
Yes, crappy title.

Anyway, in the interview, the lady-with-no-hips asked Phil if Killzone was real time, and the dude said that the graphics and gameplay showcased in the trailer will be like that, if not better, in the final game.

I can't remember if he also said it was real time, but I think he did. Anyone got more on that?
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is there a video for this that we can see ?
 
There's a pretty marked difference between 'rendered to specifications' and 'rendered as a CG video'. The former means that they render it in such a way that they limit it to what they're expecting the final PS3 unit will be able to do; ignoring the fact that a final unit doesn't exist yet, and the fact that the developers themselves won't be able to code such a fully working engine in such a short time.

If there is concern, it shouldn't be whether or not the PS3 can handle that kind of graphics, but whether or not the developers can exploit the PS3 to that extent. But then, you have UE3 done in 2 months; already showing an extremely impressive engine running very quickly on less than final hardware machines.

On the otherhand, rendered as CG video, means that they took of the gloves and threw resources within a specified monetary budget (rather than an arbitarily technical limited one (as with limiting to specs)) that would get the video to look as good as possible. That of course means they weren't keeping in line with what the xbox specs are capable of and thus we can't expect games to look like that upon final release, or if the games will ever be capable of that kind of graphics on the Xbox.

You guys love to mince words and specifics, but that's the real and practical implication of what's been shown from both camps.
 
Zaptruder said:
There's a pretty marked difference between 'rendered to specifications' and 'rendered as a CG video'. The former means that they render it in such a way that they limit it to what they're expecting the final PS3 unit will be able to do; ignoring the fact that a final unit doesn't exist yet, and the fact that the developers themselves won't be able to code such a fully working engine in such a short time.

If there is concern, it shouldn't be whether or not the PS3 can handle that kind of graphics, but whether or not the developers can exploit the PS3 to that extent. But then, you have UE3 done in 2 months; already showing an extremely impressive engine running very quickly on less than final hardware machines.

On the otherhand, rendered as CG video, means that they took of the gloves and threw resources within a specified monetary budget (rather than an arbitarily technical limited one (as with limiting to specs)) that would get the video to look as good as possible. That of course means they weren't keeping in line with what the xbox specs are capable of and thus we can't expect games to look like that upon final release, or if the games will ever be capable of that kind of graphics on the Xbox.

You guys love to mince words and specifics, but that's the real and practical implication of what's been shown from both camps.
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How do we know they didn't limit the Ghost Recon 3 trailer to what the final Xbox 360 specs would be capable of? Running at 30% Ghost Recon 3 in game looks pretty damn impressive, how do we know they couldn't reach what the trailer showed at some point?
 
JayFro said:
How do we know they didn't limit the Ghost Recon 3 trailer to what the final Xbox 360 specs would be capable of? Running at 30% Ghost Recon 3 in game looks pretty damn impressive, how do we know they couldn't reach what the trailer showed at some point?
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Well we don't know. But no one's come out and said on the record that, that trailer is what we can expect from the real X360.

Personally, I HOPE that's what the X360 will be capable of achieving, as I plan on buying both consoles; the X360 to stem my wait for the PS3, but I'd rather it didn't become redundant after the PS3 arrived!
 
Gek54 said:
I started playing further into Killzone since all this hype and I am finding myself quite impressed with several aspects. LOTS of great graphical effects and style. Even the AI is not as terrible as I thought, its pretty cool how they will fall out and take cover but yes they do have some moments of being dim. Biggest complaint is the unrefined control but the more I play the easier it is to believe that these guys could actually come very close to making that demo a reality.
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Killzone is alot better than people give it credit for. You can tell that Guerilla has alot of talent and what was really holding them back was the hardware and not their actual abilities. People were also complaining about how scripted the stuff in the Killzone 2 video looked, but if you played Killzone you'd know that the original was very scripted too. It made certain things in the game alot more interesting.
 
I think MS's problem is...and this may be surprising given it's MS. Is that they have their ear to the gaming ground so to speak and are probably concious of people being pissed off with unrealistic expectations. What sucks about the Sony presentation is this should be the era where everything is realtime, FMV should be a thing of the distant pass - most XBOX games use real models now to progress the story such as Riddick - I don't want to see CGI bullshit this generation, wether it's leading up to the machines or after they are released.
 
COCKLES said:
I think MS's problem is...and this may be surprising given it's MS. Is that they have their ear to the gaming ground so to speak and are probably concious of people being pissed off with unrealistic expectations. What sucks about the Sony presentation is this should be the era where everything is realtime, FMV should be a thing of the distant pass - most XBOX games use real models now to progress the story such as Riddick - I don't want to see CGI bullshit this generation, wether it's leading up to the machines or after they are released.
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I agree, bravo :D
 
I thought this has already been put to rest. The guy himself said it was a representation but of course he's going to say it will look like that. Whether it will or not remains to be seen, but currently what we were shown was NOT real time. Peace.
 
jimbo said:
I thought this has already been put to rest. The guy himself said it was a representation but of course he's going to say it will look like that. Whether it will or not remains to be seen, but currently what we were shown was NOT real time. Peace.
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Oh no you dinna. Duane, get him!
 
FMV is never gonna die. I mean DoA is a fighting game, and alot of the DoA4 trailer is FMV even though the ingame models look perfectly fine. According to Square this is real time

zoom_01.jpg


And you can be almost certain that the next FF on the PS3 will still have FMV.
 
My wife and I were watching G4 tonight when this interview came on. They showed Heavenly Sword and the Killzone trailers. Both being pretty big Sony haters, we agreed that if those were actually real-time and the games look like that when it's released - we'll buy a PS3 for each of us.

In other words, we think Phil is full of shit.
 
So do we have video of Phil saying this shit on G4 yet?

Anyway, coincedentilly, I traded someone Mario 64 DS for Killzone a while back, and just got Killzone today. Couldn't have come at a better time. :) I really liked the style/atmosphere Killzone seemed to be going for, and now that the PS3 video has me so psyched, I'm very interested to see how the original is first hand.
 
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