I am assuming it was for Theo to make Jerome retreat and escape.
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Gotham S2 |OT| Dawn of Altruism - Mondays 8/7c
- Thread starter TheOddOne
- Start date
I am assuming it was for Theo to make Jerome retreat and escape.
Still not much love from me for Jerome, but the magic show and the hostage situation was pretty good. I liked that he was a legitimately good stage magician and the arrogance of him and Babs (her winking at Thompkins or in first place getting close to her) were spot-on. Gallavan was almost good, but him turning to the cameras when saying his name was too on the nose. There was really no need for that.
But glad Jerome's dead now.
But glad Jerome's dead now.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
He's way too easily manipulated. He should really learn some self-control, especially if he wants to be a big shot.
That was a really good episode and surprisingly it felt a lot like an episode of Batman The Animated Series minus Barbara and Tigress kissing of course and the violent deaths. The setup and structure though really felt like one. This episode also moved really fast to the point I was surprised it was over when it was. I guess I was enjoying it that much.
The ending for Jerome was interesting and I believe Heller said they would be building up an entire mythos surrounding the Joker's origin and this clearly is the first step. Looking forward to seeing where they go from here.
The ending for Jerome was interesting and I believe Heller said they would be building up an entire mythos surrounding the Joker's origin and this clearly is the first step. Looking forward to seeing where they go from here.
Enosh
Member
it's an act for gotham, he wants everyone to know exactly who he is
Exactly, it was totally meant to play out that way look exactly like it did.
I understand that, but my point is that this is far too on the nose. If I would watch that broadcast I would immediately catch this turn to the camera. He should've just locked on Jerome and trusted that he was heard. This was screaming act.
The reactions to yesterday's Gotham have been hilarious, to say the least.
Season 1 reactions: You can't give Joker an origin story! You can't have a kid Joker! That's so corny. The writers are disrespecting Batman's canon and mythology.
Season 2 reactions: Why did you kill the kid Joker! What do you mean he's not the REAL Joker!?! Who cares about sticking closely to Batman's canon! Bring Jerome back! Wahhhhhh.
I fucking love how unpredictable and crazy this show is.
Last night's episode was great stuff.
Season 1 reactions: You can't give Joker an origin story! You can't have a kid Joker! That's so corny. The writers are disrespecting Batman's canon and mythology.
Season 2 reactions: Why did you kill the kid Joker! What do you mean he's not the REAL Joker!?! Who cares about sticking closely to Batman's canon! Bring Jerome back! Wahhhhhh.
I fucking love how unpredictable and crazy this show is.
Last night's episode was great stuff.
Copy cat!
https://twitter.com/ER_NoTR/status/651407055778152448
But seriously, it's like folks aren't happy no matter what the show does
NotTheGuyYouKill
Member
Crazy Barb is literally one of the sexiest people on TV right now.
Who wouldn't wanna spend a night with her, man or woman
Who wouldn't wanna spend a night with her, man or woman
Knew it.
Not an accomplishment, they said early on that there would be red herrings.
Kid Kamikaze10
Member
Hopefully they'll give the Galavan's more to do in the upcoming episodes, despite Penguin being the target now.
Yeah based on some of the reaction, I think a lot of people assumed he HAD to be The Joker now
I'm happy they did it, but really thought could have milked it more... maybe the mid-season finale
I didn't expect him to be the real Joker. I had how many traits of the Joker they gave him to the point where was essentially Kid Joker., even if he weren't. There was nothing subtle, nothing witty about it. Just massive overkill of wink wink nudge nudge.
To be fair, that has been a huge criticism of the show with The Penguin and The Riddler and "Cat"
Do you know what I like about Gotham? It opens up a lot of interesting discussions and debate about Batman's mythology. I like how the show doesn't play it safe like most comic book shows do. It's a very ballsy show.
I guarantee that if a live-action Batman show were created (with an actual Batman)...comic book fans would tear it to shreds.
"The Flash" and "Arrow" don't have to worry about living up to the legacy of past live-action films like Batman does (Nolan, Burton). We never had great movies based on The Flash and Arrow.
Daredevil (TV series) doesn't have to worry about living up to the legacy of Ben Affleck's Daredevil movie. Because that film wasn't well-received, and Daredevil is a B list superhero.
Jessica Jones -- most mainstream audiences aren't that familiar with Jessica Jones.
Even Supergirl isn't under a lot of pressure. The last two Superman films (Superman Returns, Man of Steel) were met with mixed receptions by fans and critics.
But a live-action Batman show would have to live up to the legacy of Nolan's trilogy, Burton's films, and Batman: The Animated Series. That is a big legacy to live up to on a television budget.
Oh I agree
And I think last night's twist was needed.
It's the unofficial way of saying we know what fans want/expect, we can play with those expectations.
I think the thing fans keep forgetting/ignoring is Gotham doesn't lead to any one version of Batman.
I mean really there is no "one" Batman universe. He's too big of a pop culture icon for people not to be familiar with the West version or the Burton version or TAS or Nolan or the comics or the games...
see... this is EXACTLY what I thought last season. Corny.
and then in the first episode... super fucking corny.. hated it even more..
then sometime during the second episode I was like "eh, it's really fucking corny... but god damn he plays a good joker"
then last night I was one of "they fucking killed the joker!?!?!?!?"
so yeah, I get what you're saying and mostly agree. But he was a really fucking good joker. his origin was cheesy as fuck, but when you get an actor capable of playing that, it kind of sucks to toss him away.
fwiw, S2 of Gotham utterly destroys S1, and all other superhero shows currently on TV. What a great show.
Ghostmaster
Member
There's always a chance Jerome comes back in this very season as a Talon, if they are really doing the Court of Owls story.
a secret-boss
Banned
Part of me Wants Jerome to stay, and another part of me is glad that the show can explore more villain.
Miles Quaritch
Member
The hell, they just killed Jerome like it was nothing. At least lock him up so he's still a presence...I won't be able to take the next iteration of Joker not Joker seriously any more after this, Jerome nailed it so perfectly.
And Gawddamn at Barbara and Tabi...GOAWDDAMN!
I laughed my ass off at Alfred getting to his swag on and he nearly got in there too...Amazing.
LOL at Barbara's escape. LOL. What the hell, Jim...why didn't he look underneath the damn stage? Jesus Christ...
And Gawddamn at Barbara and Tabi...GOAWDDAMN!
I laughed my ass off at Alfred getting to his swag on and he nearly got in there too...Amazing.
LOL at Barbara's escape. LOL. What the hell, Jim...why didn't he look underneath the damn stage? Jesus Christ...
If I remember correct I said to my girlfriend "that's probably the future joker" when I saw the stand up comedian ^^"
QueenOfThorns
Member
I have a question about this show that's probably been asked a bunch of times before, but hey. What is this show's endgame? I've watched the first season and it's had some decent moments, but I can't help but feeling it's all going to be a waste if it's not going to turn into a proper Batman show like 2 or 3 seasons down the road.
Does this exist just to show a bunch of villain origins and maybe show a vague promise of Batman in the series finale? I'm not going to go through this smallville crap again!
Does this exist just to show a bunch of villain origins and maybe show a vague promise of Batman in the series finale? I'm not going to go through this smallville crap again!
how do you expect us to know 3 episodes into season 2? I get it, I hope to see batman zero year and year one arcs done on this show or earth one but only show runners know that.
Enosh
Member
after the episode in which he just went and gave himself over to a mass murdering psychopath in order to save his butler?
The actor don't sell it, sorry. His body language scream Beta
Shadax the wizard
Member
HAHAHA HAHAHA
QueenOfThorns
Member
Ah, sorry. I thought it was something the showrunners might have commented on by season 2 for like an overall plan. I do hope there is a timeskip into Batman stuff, it'd be a shame to see all this buildup go to waste.
psychotron
Member
Right? I have to actively fight biting my bottom lip when she's on screen, so my wife doesn't catch me drooling, lol.
Grizzlyjin
Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
It's never going to be a Batman show. Otherwise they would just make a Batman show.
Smallville started getting desperate in the later seasons and basically introduced every element from the Superman mythos they could because those are the episodes that got then ratings. Stuff like Doomsday has no business in a pre Superman show, but that's going to happen when you're on the air so long.
Gotham might go the same way, we've already seen the young versions of several Batman villians, season 1 lacked a lot of restraint in that regard. Honestly, it probably depends on what DC allows them to do. I imagine there are some things they'd rather only be kept in the films at certain times.
The best way to enjoy this show is to allow it to be its own thing. It isn't a prequel series to Batman Begins, it's just Gotham. Batman doesn't exist in Gotham. He might one day, but right now we just have to accept the story they are telling now. If this was connected to the movies in some way, there would be an expectation of getting to a certain point. But right now, its just Gotham.
QueenOfThorns
Member
My issue with this is...why have Bruce Wayne in the show at all then? Because to me it feels like a bunch of buildup that will go nowhere if it doesn't eventually turn into a Batman show. Same with all the villains and stuff. Seeing their origins is nice, but what's the point if we never get to see these versions of the characters vs Batman?
I'm not expecting movie tie ins or anything, I just want it to be its own Batman show with its own continuity which it's already doing with the villains and stuff. I'm finding it extremely difficult to get invested if it's only going to be half the story. Maybe this show isn't for me.
Miles Quaritch
Member
It's an origins show, it will never be more than that. We'll never see the cowl, we'll never see the final versions of the most iconic villains, it's all just a slow build to what we see in the movies with some twists and turns to keep things interesting.
QueenOfThorns
Member
That's the thing, is this a buildup to the villains we'll see to the movies? Because everything I've read says this is self contained. So it's an origin show to villains we'll never see?
PHOENIXZERO
Member
That bad acting was great I'll miss Jerome though I'm not sure how I feel about Joker being inspired by him. The meta commentary was great too.
He is around Selina but she's falling for him so it works for him.
Poodlestrike
Banned
Holy shiiiit, Crazy Barb in that magician's assistant outfit.
Those legs. Those L E G S.
Those legs. Those L E G S.
Miles Quaritch
Member
Sadly no.
The villains here will likely never show up elsewhere, the show is giving them a background they haven't received in the movies.
So we have proto Joker, Riddler, Penguin, Falcone, Zsaaz, Catwoman, Poison Ivy, etc all in the show but that's where they'll stay.
Poodlestrike
Banned
Okay, so I think I have an idea for how they could (way, way, down the line) introduce a "real" Joker without making him a copycat, as such.
So, at the moment, we have two threads that lead towards a Joker-character: the Red Hood, and Jerome. My thinking is that over the years, we'll see both more Red Hoods and various Jerome copycats, each of them bringing their own thing to the "crazed laughing showman" shtick. Until, eventually, we arrive at a point where we have one of each... until they both turn up dead, and a totally unknown third party shows up wearing the hood and laughing like a lunatic. An apex predator of Gotham proto-villains, entirely anonymous.
Then all they have to do is segue it into the Ace Chemical factory before we find out who this new uber-lunatic is.
So, at the moment, we have two threads that lead towards a Joker-character: the Red Hood, and Jerome. My thinking is that over the years, we'll see both more Red Hoods and various Jerome copycats, each of them bringing their own thing to the "crazed laughing showman" shtick. Until, eventually, we arrive at a point where we have one of each... until they both turn up dead, and a totally unknown third party shows up wearing the hood and laughing like a lunatic. An apex predator of Gotham proto-villains, entirely anonymous.
Then all they have to do is segue it into the Ace Chemical factory before we find out who this new uber-lunatic is.
NotTheGuyYouKill
Member
We need some Barb GIFs up in here
- Angry Jim is best Jim
- Jerome is fun. Joker-light, but who cares right?
- Babs really went over the edge ey? From casually using drugs and having a thing with the lady detective to fullblown batshit insane crazy person. Wonder if she'll end up dead by the end if this season. Hope not, she actually has a character now.
- I lolled way too hard when Alfred started to hit on Lee. Seriously, he still might be my favourite character on the show. Every scene he's in is great.
- Oh Bruce, poor love sick puppy. Try again in fifteen years.
- Hostage stuff was good. Galavan (Galaban?) was a bit too much on the overacting. Wouldn't really trust the guy. Him killing Jerome didn't really surprise me.
- Lol at Jims face when Alfred was flirting with Lee
- *Jim and Lee kiss* Alfred: "Bugger."
- Bullock <3
- Speech of Jerome's dad + his Joker-ish smile was a nice touch. It's true then: Joker's past is multiple choice.
- Jerome is fun. Joker-light, but who cares right?
- Babs really went over the edge ey? From casually using drugs and having a thing with the lady detective to fullblown batshit insane crazy person. Wonder if she'll end up dead by the end if this season. Hope not, she actually has a character now.
- I lolled way too hard when Alfred started to hit on Lee. Seriously, he still might be my favourite character on the show. Every scene he's in is great.
- Oh Bruce, poor love sick puppy. Try again in fifteen years.
- Hostage stuff was good. Galavan (Galaban?) was a bit too much on the overacting. Wouldn't really trust the guy. Him killing Jerome didn't really surprise me.
- Lol at Jims face when Alfred was flirting with Lee
- *Jim and Lee kiss* Alfred: "Bugger."
- Bullock <3
- Speech of Jerome's dad + his Joker-ish smile was a nice touch. It's true then: Joker's past is multiple choice.
Poodlestrike
Banned
So, 3 episodes in, who do we think Theo Galavan "really" is? That's supposed to be an assumed identity, yeah?
Have we seen anything named after the Kanes? That'd be a fun reversal.
Have we seen anything named after the Kanes? That'd be a fun reversal.