GT4 review at 1up
- Thread starter PanopticBlue
- Start date
It's a well written review although it comes to the game with a slightly different perspective. I think anyone who's interested in cars will love GT4 just for the Nurburgring experience, but I'm not sure a non-car-fan would still enjoy the game. It's not as universal of an appeal as other games, and it doesn't have the wow factor that GT3 had at the time. I definitely wished at least a passing comment was made about the FF wheels supported.
The other thing is that professional reviewers like John have a busy queue of games they need to review each month and so they don't get as much time to spend with the game to review it. Case in point, John mentions not having the Cadillac Cien but it's the very first prize car for the very easiest Rally d'Umbria. I write maybe 4 game reviews a year. That said, I still think it's a well written review from the gamer perspective.
From a driving enthusiast perspective though, I think my article was better.
I really don't think the AI has improved notably though. The problem now is that even when the computer AI bumps into you, you're penalized for the hit. This is particularly annoying in one track in which the computer AI cuts you off in the first 2 seconds meaning that you cannot hold down the accelerator even though it's a straight line. Likewise, RUF's aren't Porsches. When you have a lot of money in the game, the only thing you really want to buy are the cars you can't get (Ferrari, Porsche, etc.)
It's a good game, but if Enthusia lives up to the hype, the scores given to GT4 will have been so grade-inflated that it'll be difficult to really quantify the success of the game.
http://www.firingsquad.com/games/gran_turismo_4/
The other thing is that professional reviewers like John have a busy queue of games they need to review each month and so they don't get as much time to spend with the game to review it. Case in point, John mentions not having the Cadillac Cien but it's the very first prize car for the very easiest Rally d'Umbria. I write maybe 4 game reviews a year. That said, I still think it's a well written review from the gamer perspective.
From a driving enthusiast perspective though, I think my article was better.
I really don't think the AI has improved notably though. The problem now is that even when the computer AI bumps into you, you're penalized for the hit. This is particularly annoying in one track in which the computer AI cuts you off in the first 2 seconds meaning that you cannot hold down the accelerator even though it's a straight line. Likewise, RUF's aren't Porsches. When you have a lot of money in the game, the only thing you really want to buy are the cars you can't get (Ferrari, Porsche, etc.)It's a good game, but if Enthusia lives up to the hype, the scores given to GT4 will have been so grade-inflated that it'll be difficult to really quantify the success of the game.
http://www.firingsquad.com/games/gran_turismo_4/
SolidSnakex
Member
"I think anyone who's interested in cars will love GT4 just for the Nurburgring experience, but I'm not sure a non-car-fan would still enjoy the game."
That's how the series has always been. You've gotta have an appreciation of cars to understand just how much work went into the game.
That's how the series has always been. You've gotta have an appreciation of cars to understand just how much work went into the game.
D'ultimate
Member
Originally Posted by Ryudo:
Originally Posted by Borys:
I would just like to bring light to the amount of ownage that has taken place here.
In too many thread Borys jumps in with the same bullshit about Xbox fanboys, when there is legit back and forth conversation going on. That's all he does! He doesn't realize that In return he comes off looking like an even bigger fanboy than those he's criticising.
If it isn't obvious by now Borys. Ryudo is being critical of a game he has already played. Wow, what a notion, huh?!? It's so foreign you just couldn't grasp it. Unlike your PS2 defending, "Xbox fanboy" bashing, don't even play the games on the system you're defending/bashing ass.
Originally Posted by Borys:
I would just like to bring light to the amount of ownage that has taken place here.
In too many thread Borys jumps in with the same bullshit about Xbox fanboys, when there is legit back and forth conversation going on. That's all he does! He doesn't realize that In return he comes off looking like an even bigger fanboy than those he's criticising.
If it isn't obvious by now Borys. Ryudo is being critical of a game he has already played. Wow, what a notion, huh?!? It's so foreign you just couldn't grasp it. Unlike your PS2 defending, "Xbox fanboy" bashing, don't even play the games on the system you're defending/bashing ass.
GXAlan said:
Hehe, awww... no M0M0 4 U!
But seriously, we all played this game a shitload -- that said, I'm not sure why John never got the Cadillac Cien. I probably did get it in my save game, but as less of a Western car freak than John, I probably didn't notice it or simply don't remember getting it.
And yeah, GT3 had the graphical wow factor at the time, which helped to pull in a lot of casuals into the driving sim series. Now, the graphics are still impressive, but to really get your mileage out of GT4, you've got to be into driving sims. I think that pretty much goes without saying.
maximum360 said:
Quotes like this puzzle me. Does it really matter how they got the result in this case? Our eyes see it as 1080i so that is what it is.
There was already a 12 page thread devoted to people flaunting their technical knowledge on this topic, which is really just a "My dick is bigger than yours" contest. Give it a rest.
dskillzhtown
keep your strippers out of my American football
Surprising that people who absolutely hate a series would invade a thread about said game and have an extended stay...
I am getting GT4 at launch, I was on the fence, but reading about the feature that let's you transfer pics from picture mode to a portable memory device, to transfer the pictures to my PC made me trade in some crap I am not playing for it. I have always gotten to about 60-65% in GT games and that is waaaaayyyy worth it to me. Online doesn't make too much of a difference. As Halo 2 was supposed to be the next frontier of online gaming and, well.....that didn't happen. Online is a plus, but a non-sports game not having it is not a negative in my book. The only thing I don't like about the GT series is the damned licensed tests.
I am getting GT4 at launch, I was on the fence, but reading about the feature that let's you transfer pics from picture mode to a portable memory device, to transfer the pictures to my PC made me trade in some crap I am not playing for it. I have always gotten to about 60-65% in GT games and that is waaaaayyyy worth it to me. Online doesn't make too much of a difference. As Halo 2 was supposed to be the next frontier of online gaming and, well.....that didn't happen. Online is a plus, but a non-sports game not having it is not a negative in my book. The only thing I don't like about the GT series is the damned licensed tests.
chespace said:
chespace -10 =P (that'll probably be my tag: In MOMO we trust).
chespace said:But seriously, we all played this game a shitload -- that said, I'm not sure why John never got the Cadillac Cien. I probably did get it in my save game, but as less of a Western car freak than John, I probably didn't notice it or simply don't remember getting it.
Yup, that's the magic of GT4's super expansive races and cars. The Cien is probably the best approach for novices though. With a minimally upgraded AE86, you can do the first Special Hall track and win the Cien. It's nice to have a supercar early on in the game.
I can tell you guys definitely played the game a lot before reviewing it, but GT4 is such a huge game to begin with. The article is well crafted for the 1up.com audience though. People who get bored with the description of Nurburgring and don't finish reading the article are people who wouldn't like GT4 anyway. I always write from a more hardcore gaming niche, reflective of the site. Remember, when Gamers.com was up, we were the guys in the corner with the lights dimmed during the day
Ryudo said:
Point of order Mr. Chairman.... Lamborghini is my father, not Ferrari, thank you very much.
And we can lament the lack of Ferrari's and Porsche til the cows come home but that doesn't change the point that GT isn't just about driving the exotics. I will always thank GT for making the US public aware of the Evo and the WRX even if the Evo's sales in the US aren't that hot...Guy LeDouche
Banned
they aren't exclusive licenses, but they are 8 figures a piece. Kaz has stated specifically that it wasn't worth the return and they'd rather invest that money into other things.bishoptl said:
Seriously, there are 500+ cars ranging from the first motorcoaches produced to the most exotic of the exotic. I certainly won't miss a handful of 'real' porches and ferraris.
SolidSnakex
Member
Guy LeDouche said:
:lol No wonder so few games have those cars in their games. They've gotta be out their damn minds trying to rip developers off like that.
DarienA said:
I would bet it would be more due to the fact that most would be Evo consumers are turned off by Mitsubishi's dreadfull financial situation.
As far as this Ferrari arguement goes, all I have to say is that thought of ferrari not being in the game quickly deminishes once you get behind a driving force pro. Even with out it there are soo many other great exoctic cars to check out that you wont be able to in Forza. I am getting both but to knock GT for not having ferrari is a weak cop out comming from someone who obviously hasnt played GT4.
Gek54 said:
I just want to second this comment by saying that the DFP wheel is indeed, the shit. It's like having an arcade wheel in your own home. It turns GT4 into a completely different experience. I was a MOMO devotee before I got my hands on one of these.
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
Ryudo said:
But you said there are no Porsches. Just because the name isn't being used, doesn't mean they're not there. As far as damage, it's still pointless in this generation.
Uhh? I went online faar more on my Xbox than my PS2. Because, frankly, Sony's online structure sucks dick.
You're still wrong. Have you ever even taken your car to a track?
Hahaha. Well, nice jab at me scoring the import a little high -- but I am retracting that score and lowering it considerably. There are a lot of things wrong with GT4, some blatanly obvious and some only a select few would notice. And as far as Forza goes, I'm not the only who jumps on that game -- in fact, a majority of MS fanatics here have trashed it pretty hard, harder than I have ever. (Go take a look at my last comment about the game too...k?)
Your list wasn't objective, it was blindsided since it's obvious you have no idea about what you're talking about.
My problem with John Davison is, specifically, that his opinions tend to clash with mine. It wasn't meant as a generalized statement, though in retrospect I understand how it came off as one.
Quite simply, anyone who gushes over Need For Speed Underground: Rivals so extensively is NOT a reliable source, in my opinion. For driving games, or any others.
Quite simply, anyone who gushes over Need For Speed Underground: Rivals so extensively is NOT a reliable source, in my opinion. For driving games, or any others.
Soul4ger said:
I think the acronym IMO should be dropped altogether -- OF COURSE it's your opinion. Whose opinion would it be anyway, if not yours?
Still, your reason for writing John off completely strikes me as a little silly. But I guess I'm not interested enough to ask you why. So I'll just leave it at that.
Ninja Scooter
Member
alpha: WTF do you mean by "AI is as good as you want it to be"? Im not being an ass, im honestly curious cause i don't get what you're saying.
Mike Works
Member
He didn't write a GT4 review.Axsider said:
Cold-Steel
Member
AlphaSnake said:
That's why it's free.
Uh, okay. So it's clear something's my opinion when I say it, but you call bullshit when I make a general statement about Davison's reviewing. Then when I explain a little bit, you don't care enough to ask.chespace said:I think the acronym IMO should be dropped altogether -- OF COURSE it's your opinion. Whose opinion would it be anyway, if not yours?
Still, your reason for writing John off completely strikes me as a little silly. But I guess I'm not interested enough to ask you why. So I'll just leave it at that.
Maybe I clarified it was my opinion because you seemed to ignore I was speaking for myself in my original post?
Anyway, I'm sorry for any confusion and/or statements of the obvious. Especially for this one that follows: A BARD'S TALE was NOT THAT GOOD.
Cold-Steel
Member
Wario64 said:
Oh man...that would be AWESOME.
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
Ninja Scooter said:
Basically, don't cheat. Don't replay easy, but expensive, races over and over again just to make some quick cash so you could acquire a 700HP car in an hour. Play the game fairly and the AI will give you a great challenge. Compete in races with a car in the same class as your opponents and you'll see how much you'll be struggling against the AI. If you want the AI to be good, play fair. If you cheat and hook your car up instantly, then you're only screwing yourself out of a challenge.
I think Gran Turismo is a bit overrated. I don't know exactly what score i would give it and honestly, i don't give a shit about scores.
What i see in Gran Turismo 4 though is a lack of improvements in the gameplay department. The game suffers also from some bad design choices imo.
If i claim to make "the real driving simulator" i'm gonna try the most overall realistic approach as possible. Gran Turismo only focus on 2 things: cars and all well done they are graphically and also the driving controls.
Don't get me wrong, GT4 is realistic and fun. The cars handle right like you'd think it should. But after you pass over the graphics, get bored of your never ending car collecting process you feel left over. The only thing that still makes me play GT is 2 player modes or Lan modes.
GT4 is having better graphics than GT3 but mostly regarding backgrounds. That's ok for me, the cars looked nice enough already for me. The sound quality is pretty near GT3, it's not the big fat improvement and anyway, it was good already. Now having 700 cars instead of 300 or something may be interesting. But will i get all those cars? no. There's will always be around 50 cars that will stay the favorites and hundreds of cars you will never give a shit and maybe NEVER own. So what's the use of more cars???
AI: it's a little better but it's still dumb as fuck. It's been almost one month i play the game and i still have that "cars on a track" feel that bored me of GT3.
The game could have been online already or pushed back again for an online mode that would have improve the replay value a freaking lot.
About other stuff missing: Many cars are modeled up to inside the cockpit... where is my cokcpit view? Nothing is more immersive or realistic than a cockpit view, why isn't the focus there? Just put à god damned camera on the dashboard as in TOCA2 per example. TOCA2 cars aren't even modeled inside!!!!
About the damage engine and collisions: Why do we still have soap boxes to drive with? Since GT1 it wouldn't be impossible to improve anything regarding this? I'm bumping the other car and it does nothing? Is it supposed to be realistic?
Same goes for the damage engine. I understand many car manifacturers don't want to see their cars ready for scrap but damn, give us at least an acceptable damage engine. I play racing games with decent enough damage engines since the beginning of the PS1.
GT4 is a very nice game but it suffer from a little lack of focus and bad design choices. Personally i think they should have tried to simplify their graphics a little and give the extra power on something else like making the car collide completely in 3D. You can't even roll the car by accident in "the real driving simulator" this makes no sense.
They could also have modeled less cars and flashy extra stuff like the photo mode and try to improve the physics and gameplay of the core game. Taking that time to devellop a more dynamic AI or something.
GT4 is made for "the everybody car lover" not the "gamer that really likes racing". The game look great and handles it's couple of features in a godly way. But for racing fan, i like games like (again yeah, it's always my example i know,) TOCA 2.
In TOCA2 i don't have as much cars to drive but there's enough. It's not the best graphics but it's enough. The AI of the other car is WAYYYYYY beyond GT4. My car can flip. I drive cockpit view and the physics and controls just as GT4 realistic. I have a damage engine and an online mode without lag with 8 players in full time voice chat.
It's clear to me that GT4 isn't good as it could have been. I can understand people being deceived. GT4 is a great game but certainly not the best racer out there. It's also sad that GT4 is also way beyond many other racers in the market, don't get me wrong, the racing game market is weak...
What i see in Gran Turismo 4 though is a lack of improvements in the gameplay department. The game suffers also from some bad design choices imo.
If i claim to make "the real driving simulator" i'm gonna try the most overall realistic approach as possible. Gran Turismo only focus on 2 things: cars and all well done they are graphically and also the driving controls.
Don't get me wrong, GT4 is realistic and fun. The cars handle right like you'd think it should. But after you pass over the graphics, get bored of your never ending car collecting process you feel left over. The only thing that still makes me play GT is 2 player modes or Lan modes.
GT4 is having better graphics than GT3 but mostly regarding backgrounds. That's ok for me, the cars looked nice enough already for me. The sound quality is pretty near GT3, it's not the big fat improvement and anyway, it was good already. Now having 700 cars instead of 300 or something may be interesting. But will i get all those cars? no. There's will always be around 50 cars that will stay the favorites and hundreds of cars you will never give a shit and maybe NEVER own. So what's the use of more cars???
AI: it's a little better but it's still dumb as fuck. It's been almost one month i play the game and i still have that "cars on a track" feel that bored me of GT3.
The game could have been online already or pushed back again for an online mode that would have improve the replay value a freaking lot.
About other stuff missing: Many cars are modeled up to inside the cockpit... where is my cokcpit view? Nothing is more immersive or realistic than a cockpit view, why isn't the focus there? Just put à god damned camera on the dashboard as in TOCA2 per example. TOCA2 cars aren't even modeled inside!!!!
About the damage engine and collisions: Why do we still have soap boxes to drive with? Since GT1 it wouldn't be impossible to improve anything regarding this? I'm bumping the other car and it does nothing? Is it supposed to be realistic?
Same goes for the damage engine. I understand many car manifacturers don't want to see their cars ready for scrap but damn, give us at least an acceptable damage engine. I play racing games with decent enough damage engines since the beginning of the PS1.
GT4 is a very nice game but it suffer from a little lack of focus and bad design choices. Personally i think they should have tried to simplify their graphics a little and give the extra power on something else like making the car collide completely in 3D. You can't even roll the car by accident in "the real driving simulator" this makes no sense.
They could also have modeled less cars and flashy extra stuff like the photo mode and try to improve the physics and gameplay of the core game. Taking that time to devellop a more dynamic AI or something.
GT4 is made for "the everybody car lover" not the "gamer that really likes racing". The game look great and handles it's couple of features in a godly way. But for racing fan, i like games like (again yeah, it's always my example i know,) TOCA 2.
In TOCA2 i don't have as much cars to drive but there's enough. It's not the best graphics but it's enough. The AI of the other car is WAYYYYYY beyond GT4. My car can flip. I drive cockpit view and the physics and controls just as GT4 realistic. I have a damage engine and an online mode without lag with 8 players in full time voice chat.
It's clear to me that GT4 isn't good as it could have been. I can understand people being deceived. GT4 is a great game but certainly not the best racer out there. It's also sad that GT4 is also way beyond many other racers in the market, don't get me wrong, the racing game market is weak...
Agent Icebeezy
Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
About GT4 and the 'no damage' model Exactly what car manufacturer doesn't allow this? In Nascar, the Big 3 lets their cars get beat up. In Pro Race Driver, there were a few more. Who is this mystery company that doesn't allow it, or is this a cover up on Sony's part?
ak said:
There WILL BE NO GT4 online! Next Online GT will be GT5 for PS3.
Slurp said:
What does your sig have to do with it? I am not referring to Xlink as an alternative. I am referring to OFFICIAL online support whether via add-on disc or as a new GT4 game version 2 or whatever. PD has scrapped all plans to include online features in GT4. The next GT game that will officially support online play out of the box will be GT5. That is not speculation, that is a FACT
So yes, thank God for alternatives such as Xlink.
Ryudo said:
:lol
Oh and that's a badass avatar dude! That scene in WotD is may fav!
Agent Icebeezy said:
Certain manufactures range from wanting no damage at all to only scrathes and dents. Codemasters seems to be working with the manufactures who have teh balls to show full peices of car flying off. IIRC forza only shows minort dents/scrathes and broken glass. Who knows if this is dev limitation or a manufacture limitation. I wouldnt be surprised if was the later.
Guy LeDouche
Banned
Link to source? Everything I have heard is that there will be an expansion online mode.isamu said:
SolidSnakex
Member
Agent Icebeezy said:
Here's a snip from an GamePro interview from one of the guys working on Juiced
"Up until now, manufacturers have been resistant to let their products get wrecked in games, but Whiteford says they are starting to understand that damage in an integral feature of any game. 'We still have to be careful of how we portray damage; we cannot destory the passenger compartment, roll the car totally, or make it a write-off.' explains Whiteford. 'We can bruise it up badly, however, to the point where you'll be sorry you didn't drive more skillfully.' Though you cannot completely destory a car, the games damage system does enable you to bang up the major body panels, while parts like fenders, spoilers, and skirts can fall off and form debris that can damage other cars that run into them."
Borys said:
What about from people who demand more from a so-called sim than invulnerable cars and a hotlap machine?
The missing brands are bad, the cut online is hilarious given Sony's multi-year blitz touting the feature in industry show after industry show, but lack of damage in today's racing game world is just ridiculous.
I expect it's actually because PD is so detail-oriented that, were they to put a damage engine in, it would have to be so intricately modeled (point of impact, velocity, paint damage, performance factors, alignment shifting, etc.) that it couldn't be done on modern hardware and is being saved for the PS3. This, however, does not excuse the pingponging in GT4.
I don't see how the few enhanced modes and improved graphics warrant the 9+ scores it's garnering. Could it be that it would be seen as heretical to give a Gran Turismo game a score in the 80 percentile range in the same way it would be heretical to do the same to a Halo or Zelda game? Definitely maybe, IMO.
CrimsonSkies
Member
Let's bash Forza some more. And please dont consider yourselves hypocrites or trolls about it. I wouldn't want reality to hit you on the forehead ahah. :lol