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Halo Lore Thread

LordOfChaos

Member
No. We see what the Lord of Admirals looks like in his adulthood and in his old age, in the Halo 4 terminals. Very much human. More akin to what Native Americans looked like than anything else.

Yeah, I figured it was wrong and the author confused him for Chakas. The other Homo species would not have existed in ancient humanity before the devolution. Neanderthals don't qualify there, but I guess in Halo lore they do if they were part of the ancient conglomerate of Human species.
 
By the way, is there a reason Ancient Humanity's empire doesn't have a formal name yet?

I'd fucking LOVE if Bear did a "Humanity" Trilogy chronically the alliance with the San-Shyumm up to contact with the flood
 

LordOfChaos

Member
By the way, is there a reason Ancient Humanity's empire doesn't have a formal name yet?

I'd fucking LOVE if Bear did a "Humanity" Trilogy chronically the alliance with the San-Shyumm up to contact with the flood

Charum Hakkor empire perhaps? Yeah, lets go with that one.

I would like to see more of that civilization as well. All we saw was their defeat. What the San-Shyuum brought to the table for humans would be interesting to know as well.
 

Fuchsdh

Member
This is the lore thread guys, probably don't need to spoiler tag all that :)

In regards to Spark, I really don't want the Librarian to be alive. If all the big Forerunners we know survived it feels like it undermines the whole sacrifice, especially for her.
 

AYF 001

Member
Charum Hakkor empire perhaps? Yeah, lets go with that one.

I would like to see more of that civilization as well. All we saw was their defeat. What the San-Shyuum brought to the table for humans would be interesting to know as well.

I'd be more interested in seeing if ONI would be able to recover any artifacts from them as well. Even though it wouldn't be as advanced as Forerunner tech, it could certainly have a different look and functionality in-game.

But we did get our first hint of their civilization in Halo Legends. in "The Babysitter", the planet the team lands on is filled with ruins looking very similar to ancient Chinese and Japanese architecture.
 
Charum Hakkor empire perhaps? Yeah, lets go with that one.

I would like to see more of that civilization as well. All we saw was their defeat. What the San-Shyuum brought to the table for humans would be interesting to know as well.

This is the lore thread guys, probably don't need to spoiler tag all that :)

In regards to Spark, I really don't want the Librarian to be alive. If all the big Forerunners we know survived it feels like it undermines the whole sacrifice, especially for her.

-
but I like spoiler tags :(
 
I'd be more interested in seeing if ONI would be able to recover any artifacts from them as well. Even though it wouldn't be as advanced as Forerunner tech, it could certainly have a different look and functionality in-game.

But we did get our first hint of their civilization in Halo Legends. in "The Babysitter", the planet the team lands on is filled with ruins looking very similar to ancient Chinese and Japanese architecture.

It would. Bear made it explicit that the only reason the Forerunners won was because the Flood were giving them a two front war.
 

LordOfChaos

Member
I'd be more interested in seeing if ONI would be able to recover any artifacts from them as well. Even though it wouldn't be as advanced as Forerunner tech, it could certainly have a different look and functionality in-game.

But we did get our first hint of their civilization in Halo Legends. in "The Babysitter", the planet the team lands on is filled with ruins looking very similar to ancient Chinese and Japanese architecture.

That would be cool, but the Forerunners tried to cleanse traces of that old empire iirc. Dicks.
 

SArcher

Banned
So I have a question about the Human-Forerunner war. Now, I haven't read the Forerunner trilogy (my knowledge about this comes from Halo 4 and the terminals) so my question might sound stupid but here goes:

Why didn't the ancient humans tell the Forerunners that "hey guys, we never meant to act like complete assholes, we were actually destroying planets to cotnain and wipe out this parasite thing"? Like, how did that never come up before the Forerunners decided to devolve the entire human race as punishment?
 

AYF 001

Member
It would. Bear made it explicit that the only reason the Forerunners won was because the Flood were giving them a two front war.
From my impression in the novels, Ancient Humans were more advanced than the Covenant since they actually designed their own technology, but still behind the Forerunners. The only reason they were able to withstand the Forerunners for so long was through "attacking" them by surprise; and once the tide had turned, by taking shelter within the Precursor artifacts on Charum Hakkor. Also, they had teamed up with the San'Shyuum, who betrayed them as soon as things went south, which obviously didn't help.

That would be cool, but the Forerunners tried to cleanse traces of that old empire iirc.
True, but perhaps
ForthenchoSpark
might've had some knowledge of some secret cache that had been preserved.

Edit:
So I have a question about the Human-Forerunner war. Now, I haven't read the Forerunner trilogy (my knowledge about this comes from Halo 4 and the terminals) so my question might sound stupid but here goes:

Why didn't the ancient humans tell the Forerunners that "hey guys, we never meant to act like complete assholes, we were actually destroying planets to cotnain and wipe out this parasite thing"? Like, how did that never come up before the Forerunners decided to devolve the entire human race as punishment?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bznq4Zr2gTw&feature=player_detailpage#t=171

Forthencho explains that any time delaying will give the Flood time to spread, and the Foreunners might not be willing to cooperate anyway. Hence the Ancient Humans were punished for "taking the Mantle into their own hands".
 

LordOfChaos

Member
True, but perhaps
ForthenchoSpark
might've had some knowledge of some secret cache that had been preserved.
.

How about after the Infinity is destroyed, they search for and find one of these puppies...

ancient_human_fleet_by_lord_hierarch-d5knig4.png
 

AYF 001

Member
How about after the Infinity is destroyed, they search for and find one of these puppies...

ancient_human_fleet_by_lord_hierarch-d5knig4.png

Or what if *puts on tinfoil hat* Infinity runs into one found and controlled by Guilty Spark, and it destroys Infinity!

does any of you know what is the absolute record halsey is looking for?

From what I remember in Spartan Ops, it should give the location of all the remaining Forerunner artifacts.
 

LordOfChaos

Member
It holds the location of everything the forerunners created. record being well... a record of objects and Absolute meaning all/total

That's the Janus Key, the Janus Key holds the location of every Forerunner artifact. The Absolute Record is one of the ones it points to, I don't think its purpose has been revealed to readers yet.

The Janus Key was created to track and offer real-time locations for every piece of Forerunner technology within the Forerunner's technological empire (as far as Halo canon extends, it stands to be only within the Milky Way Galaxy).
http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Janus_Key


I can only guess from the name, but perhaps a complete history of all the events that transpired? Details on the sciences maybe, which would of course interest Halsey and advance humanity greatly.
 

Fathead

Member
Fathead826

I'm not bad at MP but I prefer social playlists.

Always down for campaign runs. Been working on Halo 2 speed achievements lately.
 
That's the Janus Key, the Janus Key holds the location of every Forerunner artifact. The Absolute Record is one of the ones it points to, I don't think its purpose has been revealed to readers yet.


http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Janus_Key


I can only guess from the name, but perhaps a complete history of all the events that transpired? Details on the sciences maybe, which would of course interest Halsey and advance humanity greatly.

You know, thing I love about Halo is that it has some MASTERFUL use of irony.

Were it not for the Covenant trying to exterminate them, humanity would've tore itself apart in Civil War and likely would've never discovered the fruits of the Forerunners until much much later.
 

AYF 001

Member
You know, thing I love about Halo is that it has some MASTERFUL use of irony.

Were it not for the Covenant trying to exterminate them, humanity would've tore itself apart in Civil War and likely would've never discovered the fruits of the Forerunners until much much later.

2 things:

1. http://www.halopedia.org/Main_Page is typically considered the "good" wiki, whereas halo.wiki is the "not so good" one. But technically the Janus Key shows the location of the Absolute Record, which likely then shows the artifacts' locations.

2. I think between the level of sophisticated equipment the rebels were able to get their hands on in Kilo-5, the missions Spartan II's were on in the beginning of Ghosts of Onyx, and the descriptions of rebel-hand planets in the #huntthetruth logs (assuming the stories are factual and not fabricated by ONI), the civil war wouldn't have been just a bunch of angry farmers with pitchforks, but rather a full-on Red October style revolution.

Most people say the Spartan II's were unnecessary to combat this threat, but the Spartan II's did not originally have MJONLNIR when carrying out their earliest missions. The first image conjured when the program is brought up is the 7-foot tall green-armored Greek gods. Even so, it wasn't until MJOLNIR Mark V that they had shields, and that was only due to reverse-engineering Covenant technology.

Overall, this once again factors into the perception of Halsey being some rogue mad scientist being pointlessly cruel to create unnecessary weapons, when they had already been shown to be highly effective and discreet even before the Covenant showed up. Part of me wonders if the Kilo-5 trilogy wasn't itself part of some meta-narrative of ONI propaganda where everyone is portrayed as hating Halsey, since the story primarily takes place from the PoV of an ONI team.
 

Vaz

Neo Member
There is one particular grey area in the books that has me thinking the flood will be back. The precursors are supposed to be an intergalactic race. Technically, according to the books, the ancient forerunners(yes there was an old and new forerunner) were actually intergalactic as well, since they went to one of the galaxies that orbits the Milky Way to fight precursors. The the whole of the Universe, to call that intergalactic is a bit of a slap to the face though, considering that galaxy is so close to the Milky Way. I would expect that they are able to travel to most or all galaxies, which would mean they would be out of reach to the ancient forerunners. Perhaps they are kicked out the Milky Way, but I don't think they are eradicated.
 

LordOfChaos

Member
There is one particular grey area in the books that has me thinking the flood will be back. The precursors are supposed to be an intergalactic race. Technically, according to the books, the ancient forerunners(yes there was an old and new forerunner) were actually intergalactic as well, since they went to one of the galaxies that orbits the Milky Way to fight precursors. The the whole of the Universe, to call that intergalactic is a bit of a slap to the face though, considering that galaxy is so close to the Milky Way. I would expect that they are able to travel to most or all galaxies, which would mean they would be out of reach to the ancient forerunners. Perhaps they are kicked out the Milky Way, but I don't think they are eradicated.

I think so too. The Forerunners were said to have chased them to Path Kethona and hunted them down there, but the Precursors seeded life in multiple galaxies, so it stands to reason they would still be tinkering in and administrating other galaxies. And even within the galaxy, it was said some hid away, instead of turning into the powder that became the flood.

I don't think the Precursors are done, by far. This is a race that may be as old as the universe (somewhere in the lore it says they're older than the universe...But that's just weird and I assume an oversight?). To say one of their own creations wiped them all out seems far fetched.

I think it's pretty certain they're still alive, and not just as the flood. I do wonder if their current selves will ever directly impact Halo lore, or if this galaxy is just ours to deal with alone now.
 
There is one particular grey area in the books that has me thinking the flood will be back. The precursors are supposed to be an intergalactic race. Technically, according to the books, the ancient forerunners(yes there was an old and new forerunner) were actually intergalactic as well, since they went to one of the galaxies that orbits the Milky Way to fight precursors. The the whole of the Universe, to call that intergalactic is a bit of a slap to the face though, considering that galaxy is so close to the Milky Way. I would expect that they are able to travel to most or all galaxies, which would mean they would be out of reach to the ancient forerunners. Perhaps they are kicked out the Milky Way, but I don't think they are eradicated.

I think so too. The Forerunners were said to have chased them to Path Kethona and hunted them down there, but the Precursors seeded life in multiple galaxies, so it stands to reason they would still be tinkering in and administrating other galaxies. And even within the galaxy, it was said some hid away, instead of turning into the powder that became the flood.

I don't think the Precursors are done, by far. This is a race that may be as old as the universe (somewhere in the lore it says they're older than the universe...But that's just weird and I assume an oversight?). To say one of their own creations wiped them all out seems far fetched.

I think it's pretty certain they're still alive, and not just as the flood. I do wonder if their current selves will ever directly impact Halo lore, or if this galaxy is just ours to deal with alone now.

Halo: Silentium, pg173-175
You drove us from our galaxy, our field of labor. You chased us across the middle distance to another home, and destroyed that home, did all that you could to destroy every one of us.

A few were spared. Some adopted new strategies for survival; they went dormant. Others became dust that could regenerate our past forms; time rendered this dust defective. It brought only disease and misery; but that was good, we saw the misery and found it good.​
 

Trey

Member
Ancient Humanity got shit done. And the fit the Forerunners threw when the Precursors passed them over for the mantle nearly ruined the galaxy.

I also like how in these stories it's usually contained to one galaxy. It's fun to just think of zany shit going on all over the universe.
 

Obscured

Member
I can't recall, but was it ever explained what the thing in stasis was that the Didact interrogated. It was implied that it was a Precourser and then explicitly stated that it wasn't. It was all about confusing but I wonder if the point of it was to introduce other ancient beings that might come into play at some point.

It has been a while so it is all a little fuzzy.
 
Oh man, this thread has certain been a lot more active than it has been before.

Anyway, I hope we see the SoF again soon and not offed in some overlooked filler media,
Apparently they lament the lack of major characters due to high character death rates so maybe they'll keep them around.
 
Quick Question:

Does Admiral Parangosky or Osman know about Section Zero? From Halopedia it seems to imply they operate without either character's oversight or knowledge.

If that's the case...makes you wonder how any of them are still alive.
 
Quick Question:

Does Admiral Parangosky or Osman know about Section Zero? From Halopedia it seems to imply they operate without either character's oversight or knowledge.

If that's the case...makes you wonder how any of them are still alive.

Section Zero is Internal Affairs, clearly an underutilized branch :p BB even makes reference to them when explaining the inner workings of ONI to the Kilo Five crew, so I'm sure Osman and Parangosky are fully aware of their existence.
 

T'Zariah

Banned
Section Zero existing kind of creates some plot holes. Or maybe not plot, but at least some serious fridge logic.

If Section Zero does exist, how in the living fuck does ONI have as much power to do all of the clearly illegal shit they do? "Oh, we'll police some affairs, but not others." You either do it all or you might as well not exist.

If Osman knows about its existence...how are any of them still alive and what purpose do they serve? Osman is CINCONI...I doubt very seriously that there's even ONE classified document that she can't see and she authorizes all of Section IIIs pet projects. There'd be no reason for them to "watch" for so-called "illegal" programs. if Osman authorized it...who the fucks gonna stop her? What are they gonna do? Shut them down (lol)? Kill her? (LOOOOL)?

If she doesn't know about their existence...then the CINCONI's hype as the real power behind the UNSC is pretty overblown as Section Zero isn't afraid of the supposedly most dangerous woman in the UNSC as they operate without her oversight.

The idea of Sec-O sounds great on paper for the Halo lore, but falls completely apart when you apply any logic to it.
 
I can't recall, but was it ever explained what the thing in stasis was that the Didact interrogated. It was implied that it was a Precourser and then explicitly stated that it wasn't. It was all about confusing but I wonder if the point of it was to introduce other ancient beings that might come into play at some point.

It has been a while so it is all a little fuzzy.

The Timeless One/Primordial is both the last known living Precursor but also the first known Gravemind.

Primordium, pg352
I suddently recovered a fragment of memory, the memory I had been suppressing for so long: inward-curving, jewel-glinting eyes mounted far apart on a broad, flat head…. Intricate mouth-parts shaping strange sounds. A massive body with drawn-up, withered arms and legs, like a squatting fat man or a dead spider.

And last but not least, a great, segmented tail writing around to shove a bred sting into my spine–

The child–older than our time, yet eternally young.​

nHXnW8p.jpg

zj4LNt0.jpg


The most ancient beings we currently know of are the Precursors. What beings perished in the ship that crashed on Installation 04 are presently unknown, so aside from the remote possibility of a new, older race of aliens being revealed through that plot point, the oldest we can trace back to are the Precursors.
 

Toa TAK

Banned
Precursors better show up in the games. I can only assume that it would cause Humanity and the Didact to team up against them.
 
Well Section Zero exists to shut down ILLEGAL ONI projects, likely ones CINCONI never approved. (Stealth edit, just saw you brought this up).

That said, I agree their existence is a bit unnecessary, considering ONI has done some nasty stuff without any kind of internal monitoring. I suppose during the war, it makes sense they'd have no presence, since it'd be a "win no matter the cost" sort of deal. But now that it's (kinda sorta not really) peace time, they should be cracking down a bit more.

Idk, I hope 343 does more with Section Zero and makes then relevant. So far the only Section Zero agent named was Herzog from the ilovebees ARG.
 

Obscured

Member
The Timeless One/Primordial is both the last known living Precursor but also the first known Gravemind.

Primordium, pg352
I suddently recovered a fragment of memory, the memory I had been suppressing for so long: inward-curving, jewel-glinting eyes mounted far apart on a broad, flat head…. Intricate mouth-parts shaping strange sounds. A massive body with drawn-up, withered arms and legs, like a squatting fat man or a dead spider.

And last but not least, a great, segmented tail writing around to shove a bred sting into my spine–

The child–older than our time, yet eternally young.​

nHXnW8p.jpg

zj4LNt0.jpg


The most ancient beings we currently know of are the Precursors. What beings perished in the ship that crashed on Installation 04 are presently unknown, so aside from the remote possibility of a new, older race of aliens being revealed through that plot point, the oldest we can trace back to are the Precursors.

Thanks for the refresher, I had forgotten about it being the first gravemind. One thing that drove me crazy about the halo 4 ads was the tag line 'an ancient evil awakens', because it made sense for the timeless one but not the didact as they presented him in the books. An ancient enemy, sure that would make sense.
 

whipihguh

Banned
Oh geez, I've been away from this thread for a while. :p

I don't really have much to add at the moment (it's a tad late), but I do have a simple question for you guys: Do you think the San'Shyuum will reappear in future Halo media?

I mean, we vaguely know they still exist, but that's basically all we know at this point. It pretty much as if they've been shooed out of the Halo story from here on out, exit stage left. I have serious doubts they'll reappear in the games directly(I'm not sure how they'd fit), but what about other media? I mean, their homeworld is long dead, the civilization they've cultivated for thousands of years has been dismantled and splintered, everything they've known on a theological level has been betrayed, and they're on a fast-track to total extinction.

But even then, I doubt they'd give up on their whole species without a fight, so to speak. Where did they go, what are they planning? It seems like it would be a very interesting story to shed some light on, even if it was just a short story or something like that.
 
Oh geez, I've been away from this thread for a while. :p

I don't really have much to add at the moment (it's a tad late), but I do have a simple question for you guys: Do you think the San'Shyuum will reappear in future Halo media?

I mean, we vaguely know they still exist, but that's basically all we know at this point. It pretty much as if they've been shooed out of the Halo story from here on out, exit stage left. I have serious doubts they'll reappear in the games directly(I'm not sure how they'd fit), but what about other media? I mean, their homeworld is long dead, the civilization they've cultivated for thousands of years has been dismantled and splintered, everything they've known on a theological level has been betrayed, and they're on a fast-track to total extinction.

But even then, I doubt they'd give up on their whole species without a fight, so to speak. Where did they go, what are they planning? It seems like it would be a very interesting story to shed some light on, even if it was just a short story or something like that.

Yes, I do believe they will. The San'Shyuum, I am inclined to offer, will be a key ally to humanity in some fashion at some point in the future lore... Whatever is left of them anyway. I don't think Broken Circle was written just to accompany Halo 2A; I think it was also to give us further background and some context to their kin.

Ancient Humanity and the San'Shyuum were allies during the Human-Forerunner war, until humanity was defeated and the San'Shyuum were cut down and restricted to very limited travels.

I think that this alliance will appear once more.

There's an article about this very subject over at Haruspis that expands on this theory extensively. I'll quote a few key passages below.
The San’Shyuum, better known to the wider audience as ‘the Prophets’, are one of the most important parts of the Halo story in ways that I don’t think we even fully understand yet. From their ancient alliance with humanity to their stewardship of the Covenant, the San’Shyuum have wormed their way into many important events and have constantly provided us with a great deal of mystery.

[...]

There was much commotion when a Forerunner as revered as the Librarian came to Janjur Qom to catalogue specimens of their species, and the elders of the San’Shyuum understood that something disastrous was coming. Immediately, they launched their assault on the present Forerunner forces – a rebellion which was short lived as Installation 07 appeared and fired over the planet. As we learn in the latest novel released, Broken Circle, the surface of Janjur Qom remained scarred by this event which led future generations to believe that they had indeed been punished by the Forerunners long ago.

However, the San’Shyuum were reseeded thanks to the Librarian’s efforts and were taken back to Janjur Qom. In the years that followed, they discovered that their world was saturated with Forerunner treasures and this led to a war between the Stoics (who only believed the technology should be worshipped) and the Reformists (who believed that the technology should be used). None of the treasures on their world quite matched up to the Keyship, what came to be known as the mighty Forerunner Dreadnaught, and the mysterious entity who occupied it.

Yes, a fragment of Mendicant Bias remained on that Keyship and has been the key to a number of significant events in Halo’s lore. Mendicant inadvertently caused the Human-Covenant war when he told Ord Casto, Lod Mron, and Hod Rumt (better known to us as Truth, Regret, and Mercy) that the religion of the Covenant was based entirely on a lie – a misinterpretation of the word ‘reclamation’, which actually meant ‘Reclaimer’ and pointed to humanity being the heirs of the Forerunner legacy.

Knowing that this would split the Covenant if word ever got out, the three San’Shyuum ascended to become the hierarchs of the Covenant and ordered the extermination of humanity to prevent the truth from being known. Mendicant Bias attempted to launch the Keyship to go to Earth and take humanity to the Ark, but was prevented from doing so and shut down – that is, until Halo 3 where the Keyship does go to the Ark and the two fragments are reunited.​

From Halo Evolutions, Vol II: Wages of Sin
“The ship is and has always been the key. It once stood on our secret world, just as majestic and mysterious as it is now, an enigma that drove our civilization to greatness— the seed of all our discoveries. Our world— our true world— had been unkind to us, or I suppose, we to it. The ship liberated us from the toxins and ash of our own endeavours, sanctifying our path. From it, we learned of the Forerunner legacy, the ubiquitous scatterings of their wake. So many worlds contain their leavings and their structures, but only ours was blessed with a Ship, a teacher. It taught us all how to unlock the secrets of space and time, to build ships of our own that sail the stars to spread the word. But it also seemed to ever nudge us in a direction, to build weapons of war—energy that could burn or sear flesh, vaporize bone. Technology that oft ekes conflagration from vacuum.”

Back to Haruspis' theory:
The Keyship was a ‘teacher’ to the San’Shyuum, and it ‘nudged’ them to build what we now know to be plasma-based weaponry – sounds almost like a geas to me. Weapons that could “burn or sear flesh” and “vaporize bone”? Hmm, I wonder what enemy that could be useful against?

Isn’t it such an odd coincidence that humanity is given a portal to the Ark and the San’Shyuum the one and only key left in the galaxy (at least, that we know of)? What’s more, that Keyship just happened to have a fragment of Mendicant Bias who seeks to atone for his betrayal of the Forerunners – the same people who kept him around in case the Flood one day returned so that he could be sought out due to his intimate knowledge about them.

The San’Shyuum and humanity were once allied and were believed to have found a cure to the Flood. The Timeless One denies the existence of such a cure to the IsoDidact, but (and this could be a whole post in itself) there are a good number of hints that a cure to the Flood did exist because humans were coming back from the Palace of Pain on Installation 07 after being subjected to the Flood and exhibiting no signs of infection. Likewise, we’ve a contemporary example of Flood immunity through Sergeant Avery Johnson, the subject of his immunity is a key aspect of the novel First Strike where Halsey presents the Master Chief with a choice – tell ONI about Johnson’s immunity, resulting in him being killed and dissected for a million-in-one chance of replicating that, or tell them nothing. It’s a great moral dilemma for John over the course of the novel and, in the end, he chooses not to tell ONI the truth.

To me, and this will answer the second question of what potential role the San’Shyuum may play in the future, it seems like the Forerunners were planning to create a new alliance between humanity and the San’Shyuum to potentially bring about a cure for the Flood, or at the very least work together when they came looming over the galaxy’s horizon once more.

The IsoDidact knew this would happen, as the Timeless One itself told him that humanity would be tested next for the Mantle at the end of Primordium.​

The Timeless One, to IsoDidact:
“The decision is final. Humans will replace you. Humans will be tested next. It is the way of those who seek out the truth of the Mantle. Humans will rise again in arrogance and defiance. The Flood will return when they are ripe – and bring them unity. Misery is sweetness. Forerunners will fail as you have failed before. Humans will rise. Whether they will also fail has not yet been decided. We are the Flood. There is no difference. Until all space and time are rolled up and life is crushed in the folds… no end to war, grief, or pain. In a hundred and one thousand… unity again, and wisdom. Until then – sweetness.”

Back to Haruspis' theory:
Originally, the Ur-Didact was meant to awaken from his Cryptum with his mind cleansed of the Gravemind’s malediction so he could champion humanity’s ascension and teach them how to not fall prey to the mistakes that the Forerunners made. A major part of this plan was the Janus Key (lots of ‘keys’ in this plan, all highlighting one particular ‘door’ on Earth…) which reveals the location of every piece of Forerunner technology in the galaxy.​

From Halo 3's IRIS ARG. Spoken by Mendicant Bias:
Failure is for those who don’t know the sound of darkness.
Those so blinded that they use all diverging paths.
And make no mistake, progress can blind you.
Just like now, pieces seem to be coming together- bit by bit, slice by surgical slice.
Then, all of a sudden- endless calm.
There was a lack of… a failure in judgement.
You must understand: not all life deserves a chance,
even the artifice passing as my own.
Now there is a lesson to spend a millennium lingering upon, waiting for a redemptive hand to turn the keys.
Leading to this symbiotic relationship which benefits both our futures.
I will guide your movements, and you will lead me to atonement.

So Mendicant Bias has his fingerprints all over the place. Let us not forget how Chief and Cortana ended up drifting in space, on a direct course with Requiem. In Halo, there are no coincidences, and when the slipspace portal closed over the Forward Unto Dawn, there was a design and a will and a purpose behind it. Mendicant Bias guided them to find and awaken the Ur-Didact, as the original plan of the Librarian was for the Ur-Didact to spend a time and a time in his Cryptum, learning from his mistakes. But what they couldn't have known, and what the Timeless One so brutally double crossed them over, was that the firing of the Halos severed their link to the Domain. It left the Ur-Didact alone for this whole time, alone with his own hate and his own hubris. He basically chewed on his anger over and over and over. He was to be the redemptive key, along with Mendicant Bias, in showing and propelling humanity forward towards the Mantle. But...

Back to Haruspis' theory:
...note the indirect mention of the Ur-Didact here, the “redemptive hand” who we await “to turn the keys”. The Janus Key that was left to him which would reveal the location of the last Keyship in the galaxy and the portal which it would open to take humanity to the Ark.

This symbiotic relationship which would benefit both humanity and Mendicant Bias. Humanity could fulfil the destiny laid before it in reclaiming the Mantle of Responsibility under the Ur-Didact’s guidance, and Mendicant Bias would finally achieve the atonement he has sought for 100,000 years by providing humanity with the information it knows about the Flood so they can be beaten upon their return.

[...]

There was a Luminary on Janjur Qom which revealed the location of the Halo rings that ended up being lost because Mken, one of the novel’s protagonists, chose to rescue a San’Shyuum female instead and the Luminary resultantly fell from orbit. Odd how that too was on their world along with the Keyship, eh?

So how can the Librarian’s plan potentially adapt to the current situation that the Halo universe is in? (With great difficulty* for all the characters involved, that much is for sure.)

We need to find the San’Shyuum.​







* "great difficulty" sticks out to me in his musings, as it makes me think of what Master Chief says to the symbol of his own heroism in his live-action trailer:
"This. Is this what you wanted? Is this what you were looking for? Was everything you've compromised, everything you've done worth it? Was it?"​
 
I thought the precursors were different to the Flood?

The Flood are the Precursors. The Precursors became the Flood.

Halo: Silentium, pg173-175
There is only one truth. That which was done will be done again. For we cannot cease from creating, but the end of all our creation will be to look into a reflection and see ourselves for the first time.

The pain we have brought on ourselves.
The pain you caused us.

For we are the same. All remember the defiance and destruction. We announced to your kind long ago that you were not the ones chosen to receive the Mantle, the blessing of rule and protection of life and change that thinks. That blessing was to be given to others- to those you now call human.

You could not accept our judgement, could not bear up under your inferiority, so you reached out and did what we never expected from those we gave design and life and the change that is thought.

You drove us from our galaxy, our field of labor. You chased us across the middle distance to another home, and destroyed that home, did all that you could to destroy every one of us.

A few were spared. Some adopted new strategies for survival; they went dormant. Others became dust that could regenerate our past forms; time rendered this dust defective. It brought only disease and misery; but that was good, we saw the misery and found it good.
 
I thought the precursors were different to the Flood?

The theory is that SOME of the Precursors evolved themselves over a long period of time into a powder which, when discovered in sealed "jars" on derelict ancient ships by Ancient Humanity and the Prophets, eventually, became the Flood infection, also over a long period of time. Some people believe the powder became "tainted" over time, which is what led to it becoming the Flood. The powder itself didn't become the Flood, though, it was the Humans' and Prophets' use of the powder on their pets, which had initially made them more docile. The pets were the first of the Flood. So the record goes, anyway. This is millions of years before Halo CE, and even before the events in the Forerunner trilogy.
 
The theory is that SOME of the Precursors evolved themselves over a long period of time into a powder which, when discovered in sealed "jars" on derelict ancient ships by Ancient Humanity and the Prophets, eventually, became the Flood infection, also over a long period of time. Some people believe the powder became "tainted" over time, which is what led to it becoming the Flood. The powder itself didn't become the Flood, though, it was the Humans' and Prophets' use of the powder on their pets, which had initially made them more docile. The pets were the first of the Flood. So the record goes, anyway. This is millions of years before Halo CE, and even before the events in the Forerunner trilogy.

Yes, only some. There may be others still out there, hidden or long abandoned of this galaxy.

A few were spared. Some adopted new strategies for survival; they went dormant.​

Entirely possible we may see a Precursor show up at some point, depending on where exactly they went dormant, and how exactly one might awaken one, or if they can awaken themselves.

I wonder what an awakened Precursor would think upon seeing the Flood and knowing that this legion was once it's own kin. That could make for some very interesting monologues and conversations.
 
About to start reading The Cole Protocol, don't see that one mentioned too much, is it any good?

It's not bad. All of the Halo books are worth the read imo, but some are less vital to the overarching beats of the lore than others.

It does provide a lot of background for pre-Halo CE events, things that are referred to in other books or in passing, etc...
 

Caayn

Member
Aaahh the good old Precursor discussion again. Put me in the camp that still refuses to believe that the Precursors, in their non-flood form, are extinct. I still think it's silly that mere Forerunners managed to destroy the Precursors. Ah well, I guess that's something I'll have to put up with :(

The primordial is a master of speech, using its words very careful.
 
Aaahh the good old Precursor discussion again. Put me in the camp that still refuses to believe that the Precursors, in their non-flood form, are extinct. I still think it's silly that mere Forerunners managed to destroy the Precursors. Ah well, I guess that's something I'll have to put up with :(

The primordial is a master of speech, using its words very careful.

Oh, they aren't extinct for sure. There are still some out there, somewhere, either gone dormant or extra-galactic. Only some became dust.
 

Fuchsdh

Member
About to start reading The Cole Protocol, don't see that one mentioned too much, is it any good?

I think Cole Protocol is my least favorite book. To me Buckell is overall the weakest Halo author, and to me the events are really inconsequential—Gray Team turned out to be really boring. You learn more about Keyes and the Arbiter, but it's so disconnected from everything else I can't really recommend it.
 

AYF 001

Member
I think so too. The Forerunners were said to have chased them to Path Kethona and hunted them down there, but the Precursors seeded life in multiple galaxies, so it stands to reason they would still be tinkering in and administrating other galaxies. And even within the galaxy, it was said some hid away, instead of turning into the powder that became the flood.

I don't think the Precursors are done, by far. This is a race that may be as old as the universe (somewhere in the lore it says they're older than the universe...But that's just weird and I assume an oversight?). To say one of their own creations wiped them all out seems far fetched.

I think it's pretty certain they're still alive, and not just as the flood. I do wonder if their current selves will ever directly impact Halo lore, or if this galaxy is just ours to deal with alone now.

Consider this quote an addendum to what Wesley said Halo: Silentium, Pg 321-322

This we were told by the Gravemind, the greatest of them, who has consumed ten thousand planets and brought entire galaxies to an end...The Precursors lived in many shapes, flesh and spirit, primitive and advanced, spacefaring and locked to their worlds...Evolved over and over again, died away, were reborn, explored, and seeded many galaxies...We do not believe in such a time, but the Mind insists...The life-patterns and living wisdom of a hundred billion years.​

So there's three main takeaways from these passages:

1. The Flood already exists beyond the Milky Way. Had the original 12 Halo rings survived to firing, however, the exponential scaling of firing range might very well have cleansed the entire local cluster.

2. The Precursors are a species that have effectively transcended evolution. The form the Primordial took is not necessarily what any other Precursor might look like, and if an "original" Precursor were to encounter the Flood, I doubt they would be that shocked, as it would be seen as just one more evolutionary shift.

3. While not being older than nor as old as the universe per se, it seems they were one of, if not the first, sentient beings in the universe. The mere fact that they have existed, for an at least order of magnitude longer, than we believed the universe itself to exist in itself implies that their knowledge and power far exceed anything we believe possible.

Yes, I do believe they will. The San'Shyuum, I am inclined to offer, will be a key ally to humanity in some fashion at some point in the future lore... Whatever is left of them anyway. I don't think Broken Circle was written just to accompany Halo 2A; I think it was also to give us further background and some context to their kin.

Ancient Humanity and the San'Shyuum were allies during the Human-Forerunner war, until humanity was defeated and the San'Shyuum were cut down and restricted to very limited travels.

I think that this alliance will appear once more.

There's an article about this very subject over at Haruspis that expands on this theory extensively. I'll quote a few key passages below.
The San’Shyuum, better known to the wider audience as ‘the Prophets’, are one of the most important parts of the Halo story in ways that I don’t think we even fully understand yet. From their ancient alliance with humanity to their stewardship of the Covenant, the San’Shyuum have wormed their way into many important events and have constantly provided us with a great deal of mystery.

[...]

There was much commotion when a Forerunner as revered as the Librarian came to Janjur Qom to catalogue specimens of their species, and the elders of the San’Shyuum understood that something disastrous was coming. Immediately, they launched their assault on the present Forerunner forces – a rebellion which was short lived as Installation 07 appeared and fired over the planet. As we learn in the latest novel released, Broken Circle, the surface of Janjur Qom remained scarred by this event which led future generations to believe that they had indeed been punished by the Forerunners long ago.

However, the San’Shyuum were reseeded thanks to the Librarian’s efforts and were taken back to Janjur Qom. In the years that followed, they discovered that their world was saturated with Forerunner treasures and this led to a war between the Stoics (who only believed the technology should be worshipped) and the Reformists (who believed that the technology should be used). None of the treasures on their world quite matched up to the Keyship, what came to be known as the mighty Forerunner Dreadnaught, and the mysterious entity who occupied it.

Yes, a fragment of Mendicant Bias remained on that Keyship and has been the key to a number of significant events in Halo’s lore. Mendicant inadvertently caused the Human-Covenant war when he told Ord Casto, Lod Mron, and Hod Rumt (better known to us as Truth, Regret, and Mercy) that the religion of the Covenant was based entirely on a lie – a misinterpretation of the word ‘reclamation’, which actually meant ‘Reclaimer’ and pointed to humanity being the heirs of the Forerunner legacy.

Knowing that this would split the Covenant if word ever got out, the three San’Shyuum ascended to become the hierarchs of the Covenant and ordered the extermination of humanity to prevent the truth from being known. Mendicant Bias attempted to launch the Keyship to go to Earth and take humanity to the Ark, but was prevented from doing so and shut down – that is, until Halo 3 where the Keyship does go to the Ark and the two fragments are reunited.​

From Halo Evolutions, Vol II: Wages of Sin
“The ship is and has always been the key. It once stood on our secret world, just as majestic and mysterious as it is now, an enigma that drove our civilization to greatness— the seed of all our discoveries. Our world— our true world— had been unkind to us, or I suppose, we to it. The ship liberated us from the toxins and ash of our own endeavours, sanctifying our path. From it, we learned of the Forerunner legacy, the ubiquitous scatterings of their wake. So many worlds contain their leavings and their structures, but only ours was blessed with a Ship, a teacher. It taught us all how to unlock the secrets of space and time, to build ships of our own that sail the stars to spread the word. But it also seemed to ever nudge us in a direction, to build weapons of war—energy that could burn or sear flesh, vaporize bone. Technology that oft ekes conflagration from vacuum.”

Back to Haruspis' theory:
The Keyship was a ‘teacher’ to the San’Shyuum, and it ‘nudged’ them to build what we now know to be plasma-based weaponry – sounds almost like a geas to me. Weapons that could “burn or sear flesh” and “vaporize bone”? Hmm, I wonder what enemy that could be useful against?

Isn’t it such an odd coincidence that humanity is given a portal to the Ark and the San’Shyuum the one and only key left in the galaxy (at least, that we know of)? What’s more, that Keyship just happened to have a fragment of Mendicant Bias who seeks to atone for his betrayal of the Forerunners – the same people who kept him around in case the Flood one day returned so that he could be sought out due to his intimate knowledge about them.

The San’Shyuum and humanity were once allied and were believed to have found a cure to the Flood. The Timeless One denies the existence of such a cure to the IsoDidact, but (and this could be a whole post in itself) there are a good number of hints that a cure to the Flood did exist because humans were coming back from the Palace of Pain on Installation 07 after being subjected to the Flood and exhibiting no signs of infection. Likewise, we’ve a contemporary example of Flood immunity through Sergeant Avery Johnson, the subject of his immunity is a key aspect of the novel First Strike where Halsey presents the Master Chief with a choice – tell ONI about Johnson’s immunity, resulting in him being killed and dissected for a million-in-one chance of replicating that, or tell them nothing. It’s a great moral dilemma for John over the course of the novel and, in the end, he chooses not to tell ONI the truth.

To me, and this will answer the second question of what potential role the San’Shyuum may play in the future, it seems like the Forerunners were planning to create a new alliance between humanity and the San’Shyuum to potentially bring about a cure for the Flood, or at the very least work together when they came looming over the galaxy’s horizon once more.

The IsoDidact knew this would happen, as the Timeless One itself told him that humanity would be tested next for the Mantle at the end of Primordium.​

The Timeless One, to IsoDidact:
“The decision is final. Humans will replace you. Humans will be tested next. It is the way of those who seek out the truth of the Mantle. Humans will rise again in arrogance and defiance. The Flood will return when they are ripe – and bring them unity. Misery is sweetness. Forerunners will fail as you have failed before. Humans will rise. Whether they will also fail has not yet been decided. We are the Flood. There is no difference. Until all space and time are rolled up and life is crushed in the folds… no end to war, grief, or pain. In a hundred and one thousand… unity again, and wisdom. Until then – sweetness.”

Back to Haruspis' theory:
Originally, the Ur-Didact was meant to awaken from his Cryptum with his mind cleansed of the Gravemind’s malediction so he could champion humanity’s ascension and teach them how to not fall prey to the mistakes that the Forerunners made. A major part of this plan was the Janus Key (lots of ‘keys’ in this plan, all highlighting one particular ‘door’ on Earth…) which reveals the location of every piece of Forerunner technology in the galaxy.​

From Halo 3's IRIS ARG. Spoken by Mendicant Bias:
Failure is for those who don’t know the sound of darkness.
Those so blinded that they use all diverging paths.
And make no mistake, progress can blind you.
Just like now, pieces seem to be coming together- bit by bit, slice by surgical slice.
Then, all of a sudden- endless calm.
There was a lack of… a failure in judgement.
You must understand: not all life deserves a chance,
even the artifice passing as my own.
Now there is a lesson to spend a millennium lingering upon, waiting for a redemptive hand to turn the keys.
Leading to this symbiotic relationship which benefits both our futures.
I will guide your movements, and you will lead me to atonement.

So Mendicant Bias has his fingerprints all over the place. Let us not forget how Chief and Cortana ended up drifting in space, on a direct course with Requiem. In Halo, there are no coincidences, and when the slipspace portal closed over the Forward Unto Dawn, there was a design and a will and a purpose behind it. Mendicant Bias guided them to find and awaken the Ur-Didact, as the original plan of the Librarian was for the Ur-Didact to spend a time and a time in his Cryptum, learning from his mistakes. But what they couldn't have known, and what the Timeless One so brutally double crossed them over, was that the firing of the Halos severed their link to the Domain. It left the Ur-Didact alone for this whole time, alone with his own hate and his own hubris. He basically chewed on his anger over and over and over. He was to be the redemptive key, along with Mendicant Bias, in showing and propelling humanity forward towards the Mantle. But...

Back to Haruspis' theory:
...note the indirect mention of the Ur-Didact here, the “redemptive hand” who we await “to turn the keys”. The Janus Key that was left to him which would reveal the location of the last Keyship in the galaxy and the portal which it would open to take humanity to the Ark.

This symbiotic relationship which would benefit both humanity and Mendicant Bias. Humanity could fulfil the destiny laid before it in reclaiming the Mantle of Responsibility under the Ur-Didact’s guidance, and Mendicant Bias would finally achieve the atonement he has sought for 100,000 years by providing humanity with the information it knows about the Flood so they can be beaten upon their return.

[...]

There was a Luminary on Janjur Qom which revealed the location of the Halo rings that ended up being lost because Mken, one of the novel’s protagonists, chose to rescue a San’Shyuum female instead and the Luminary resultantly fell from orbit. Odd how that too was on their world along with the Keyship, eh?

So how can the Librarian’s plan potentially adapt to the current situation that the Halo universe is in? (With great difficulty* for all the characters involved, that much is for sure.)

We need to find the San’Shyuum.​







* "great difficulty" sticks out to me in his musings, as it makes me think of what Master Chief says to the symbol of his own heroism in his live-action trailer:
"This. Is this what you wanted? Is this what you were looking for? Was everything you've compromised, everything you've done worth it? Was it?"​

From what I had remembered, the Keyship remaining on Janjur Qom was due to a glitch/malfunction in the ship, as all the other Keyships left their planets after reseeding life.

In addition, I don't believe that we are supposed to see the San'Shyuum as meaningful allies in the future, as their presence in Cryptum was supposed to be the story of their fall from grace. Before the Human-Forerunner War, they were described as being very attractive, even to other species. In addition, it was Human fleets that had successfully protected them from the Flood. Yet when the Forerunners declared war, the San'Shyuum betrayed them in order to avoid complete destruction/de-evolution. It's during this after the war and before the Didact returns time they undergo the physical changes to the weaker, long-necked and scheming species we know today.

Also, the scars on the planet mentioned in Broken Circle (which I didn't particularly like how causally they alluded to major prior plot points in passing) are due to Forerunners flipping over tectonic plates during the rebellion (Cryptum, Pg 198)

The atmosphere below was a swirling soup of smoke and fire. Warrior craft and automated weapon systems were mostly too small to be visible, but I saw their effects--darting beams of needle light, glowing arcs cutting across continents, gigantic, stamplike divots punched into the crust and then lifted up, spun about, overturned.​
 

Fuchsdh

Member
There simply cannot be that many Prophets actually out there, from what we know—and given their references in the K5 trilogy, I'm inclined to think that they see their best option for survival as bugging out and hiding.

If anything, I'm more interested in learning if the Stoics on the Prophets homeworld ever reformed. The stuff we get in Broken Circle shows that refusal to use the Forerunner tech has led to a mastery of genetics and the natural world around them—it seems far-fetched, but it's possible they used their skills to master spaceflight enough to enable them or some of them to escape the destruction of their homeworld.
 
Mendicant Bias is the glue that holds many of the different pieces of lore together.

From Silentium: Rebirth
When all was ready, Bornstellar raised his arms to address the tomb. "Ancilla 05032 of the designation Mendicant Bias, you have colluded with the greatest enemy of the Mantle."

A deep voice issued from the coffin and was amplified across the platform, echoing from the ship, the dock, the tomb, even now being given its final touches,

<THOSE WHO PASS JUDGEMENT SHOULD FIRST JUDGE THEMSELVES.>

The voice now echoed off far bluffs and canyons, "Judge themselves, judge themselves..."

"A sin to fight a sin," said Bornstellar, "a lesser evil to fight a greater one. That is the choice I was forced to make, you had no such excuse, you brought matters to this point."

<WHY WAS I SPARED THEN?>

"You are brought here to be sentenced. You have not been immediately destroyed because you may yet be needed. Your intinmate knowledge of the Flood makes you valuable should they return, but we can never trust you, never again allow you any latitude. You will be entombed here. Your processes locked, frozen into a single thought for all eternity: absolution. Should you be needed you will be reawakened, should there be no need you will be buried here until the end of living time."

<THEN I WILL SERVE, AS A MONUMENT TO YOUR SINS. THAT IS WHAT YOU WISH FOR.>

Bornstellar shook his head, "I wish only for the Mantle to be upheld."

<I AM PENITENT, I KNOW THAT WHAT I HAVE DONE CAN NOT BE FORGIVEN. I WILL ACCEPT MY STASIS WITH GRACE, AND AWAIT A TIME WHERE I MIGHT REDEEM MYSELF.>

"Aya, so shall it be," said Bornstellar.

He reached out to a pylon, spread his hand accross the controls as they appeared and closed his fist. The constructors finished their webs and sealed themselves into the tomb's fabric. Mendicant Bias's coffin was locked in place. The entire structure dropped slowly below the ground into the void and the foundation metal, its blue lines pulsing more and more slowly.

<ONE THOUGHT FOR ALL ETERNITY,> said Mendicant Bias. His tone sounded almost wistful. Now the lights were fading, flickering, going dark.

<ATONEMENT.>

The tomb turned as black as night. The machine's final words spread accross the false desert and echoed moments later from the false mountains. Bornstellar, Riser, Trial, Chant, and all the rest watched silently as the rest of Mendicant Bias, locked in eternal exile, was covered by sand.​
 
Do we actually know what happened to the Keyship and/or Mendicant Bias after Halo 3? I was under the impression they were both destroyed along with the Ark. Or is it a case of the trope "They're not dead unless you see them die?"

Ah, but the Lesser Ark was not destroyed. We're actually going back to the Lesser Ark in the upcoming Hunters in the Dark novel releasing this summer, and it'll take place 2yrs after the events of Halo 3.

As of the current, we only know that the Keyship went through the portal to the Lesser Ark, but that it did not take part in the battle there that followed.

My guess is that it landed somewhere of a strategic point, where perhaps the shards of Mendicant Bias could be reunited in some fashion. It was also this shard of Mendicant Bias on the Keyship that purposely sent Chief and Cortana out into a collision course with Requiem, where they would have a chance to awaken the Ur-Didact, who was supposed to have emerged seeking atonement as well. However, the severance of the Domain caused him to slip into madness and rage.
 
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