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[User 73706]

I don't think this was the design intent, even in the original.

If so, they did a pretty bad job. Hulking super soldier is not what I think when I see Spartan armor designs.

In h4, at least the design appears to be capable of what they can do in the books; and hulking super soldiers rarely sneak around in stealth mode.

Now Space Marines... that's what I think of when I think "hulking super soldier"

Chief gets most of his "hulking" appearance due to his size alone, a lot like Samus. I was actually going to use Space Marines as the antithesis of their intent but then I saw you mentioned them, lol.

Look at the Didact for another example - if he were human-sized, he'd look more athletic than "hulking," but the fact that he's about thirteen feet tall inspires that same level of "oh shit" while still giving him human levels of dexterity and expression.

An in-universe example of the "bulky hulkies" that you're talking about would probably be Promethean Knights, or maybe the Halo Wars-era Cyclops.

 

[IHaveIce]

Well it's not like it's a super weapon with a 3 shot kill from miles away...

I won't get into this discussion, that is Funknown's job.

But if you think the CE Pistol was an guaranteed 3 shot kill over a cross map distance I'm not that sure you did play it really or are just thinking about Halo Reach Anniversary

Edit: The surveys were a great idea, and super easy to fill out. Though I think I would quite mad reading some of them ( People who gave Complex more than 1 Star as a map).

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

How come you prefer the CE chief?

For me CE armour is iconic and nostalgia wrapped in one package (no pun intended). It also fits the iridescent green colour from the books, which I miss and was only present in CE/2 armour. The CGI scenes of SIVs/Chief having their armour taken off was a total nerdgasm though, perfect with the books and descriptions etc.

Also we're up to 70 surveys completed, keep those submissions rolling in people.

 

[Fuchsdh]

How come you prefer the CE chief?

To me it makes Chief feel sufficiently imposing and solid. The material they gave it, like a lot of the CE textures, was excellent--it didn't really feel like regular metal to me. The helmet just feels a bit more designed and otherworldly with the bisected visor and extreme curvature to the visor. I also liked the way the black under armor merged with the green as well.

It's definitely chunky in places where it's less a design decision and more a lack of polys but I think some of the angular elements helped distinguish it from the Covenant as well.

For me CE armour is iconic and nostalgia wrapped in one package (no pun intended). It also fits the iridescent green colour from the books, which I miss and was only present in CE/2 armour. The CGI scenes of SIVs/Chief having their armour taken off was a total nerdgasm though, perfect with the books and descriptions etc.

Also we're up to 70 surveys completed, keep those submissions rolling in people.

Post a link in HBO and Waypoint see how many other hits you can get.

Also if you want to do any motion graphics/animation with the results, let me know.

 

[jem0208]

I won't get into this discussion, that is Funknown's job.

But if you think the CE Pistol was an guaranteed 3 shot kill over a cross map distance I'm not that sure you did play it really or are just thinking about Halo Reach Anniversary

Edit: The surveys were a great idea, and super easy to fill out. Though I think I would quite mad reading some of them ( People who gave Complex more than 1 Star as a map).

It wasn't guaranteed but the fact that it was a 3 shot kill alone meant that it was a lot more powerful than all the basic weapons. It certainly wouldn't work in the current sandbox.

 

[aHebrewMenagerie]

Post a link in HBO and Waypoint see how many other hits you can get.

Also if you want to do any motion graphics/animation with the results, let me know.

Just put it on the TeamBeyond forums now.

 

[Fotos]

Also we're up to 70 surveys completed, keep those submissions rolling in people.

I was answering the questions last night but then I realized how many there were and stopped. I'll do it now.

 

[IHaveIce]

It wasn't guaranteed but the fact that it was a 3 shot kill alone meant that it was a lot more powerful than all the basic weapons. It certainly wouldn't work in the current sandbox.

Well the current sandbox is shit and overloaded with weapons nobody needs and weapons lost their invidual charm (plasma rifle)

The thing is not to nerf the pistol to make it fit in, make an awesome sandbox where every weapon feels super strong in their own field.

 

[Prinz Eugn]

I'm looking at the survey and realizing with finality that I am not a Campaign Guy.

Except for Silent Cartographer. Maps 4 Lyfe

 

[Syphon Filter]

Well the current sandbox is shit and overloaded with weapons nobody needs and weapons lost their invidual charm (plasma rifle)

The thing is not to nerf the pistol to make it fit in, make an awesome sandbox where every weapon feels super strong in their own field.

plasma rifle was not in halo 4.

 

[User 73706]

plasma rifle was not in halo 4.

I think he meant the Storm Rifle as a replacement.

 

[jem0208]

Well the current sandbox is shit and overloaded with weapons nobody needs and weapons lost their invidual charm (plasma rifle)

The thing is not to nerf the pistol to make it fit in, make an awesome sandbox where every weapon feels super strong in their own field.

I agree that the current sandbox definitely needs some tuning. However I think the pistol is just too good in too many situations. I mean it's a sidearm, why is it the most powerful basic weapon?

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

I was answering the questions last night but then I realized how many there were and stopped. I'll do it now.

You can fly through in a few minutes or you can ponder your answers and take hours. It's quicker than it appears and thanks for taking the time to fill it out.

Well the current sandbox is shit and overloaded with weapons nobody needs and weapons lost their invidual charm (plasma rifle)

The thing is not to nerf the pistol to make it fit in, make an awesome sandbox where every weapon feels super strong in their own field.

I should add a weapon rating questions, although that would be a long ass list.

Just put it on the TeamBeyond forums now.

Thank you, I'm setting it up for Waypoint at the moment. Anyone a regular over at HBO and feel like posting it there? I've always lurked a little over there but that forum format is too cumbersome for me.

I'll try to watch the various community forums for issues/updates to the survey. Today or tomorrow I'll post it other communities, which I have about 10 accounts with from the streaming thread being posted.

Post a link in HBO and Waypoint see how many other hits you can get. Also if you want to do any motion graphics/animation with the results, let me know.

Nice and thanks, I'll hit you up as we move into infographic stage. Graphic design isn't my strongest talent, I can use various design software enough to just be dangerous.

 

[NobleGundam]

Did the survey. Put a lot of 3 stars on everything almost. Its kinda depressing how I feel about Halo now than before.

 

[FUNKNOWN iXi]

There were a lot of things which I thought were weird about Halo 4's campaign. How did the Chief and Cortana know the Didact's name again? No one seemed all that surprised to find the Chief after he's been gone for a few years on some random forerunner shield world. Just odd little things which weren't explained much.

Despite this I still thoroughly enjoy it.

That's one thing I really appreciated about past lore; the little convos about Spartans and/or MC that took place in the background dialogue.

"OH shit! A Spartan!"
That whole scene where MC is walking in the hangar with The Arbiter and Sgt. Johnson was special :'] - The relationship between Spartans and the rest of the UNSC (ie: ODST) made it so interesting.

I doubt we'll see the CE pistol make a return, it's just a bit too OP.

I won't get into this discussion, that is FUNKNOWN's job.

But if you think the CE Pistol was an guaranteed 3 shot kill over a cross map distance I'm not that sure you did play it really or are just thinking about Halo Reach Anniversary

Well the current sandbox is shit and overloaded with weapons nobody needs and weapons lost their invidual charm (plasma rifle)

The thing is not to nerf the pistol to make it fit in, make an awesome sandbox where every weapon feels super strong in their own field.

However I think the pistol is just too good in too many situations. I mean it's a sidearm, why is it the most powerful basic weapon?

The BR came back in Halo 4 as a 5sk, I don't see why the Pistol can't come back as a starting weapon with the AR as a 4sk in a sandbox that's balanced around it.

No worries jem, 343 will bring it back and prove to the world how much better Halo is/was with CE AR/Pistol starts. That way, I can stop explaining to people that the Pistol was never broken, Bungie just planted that in people's minds to make room for the intentionally random/inconsitent BR.

Think about it:
Good strafe. Faster movement speed. Little aim assist, especially compared to the rest of the weapons after CE (babby level aim assist on everything). Had to lead your shots. Not even pros can land consistent 3sk's.

CE nerds have been dying for this weapon to return. I can guarantee you that if they made a true-to-form version of the CE Pistol, Halo would explode in the social media scene. Halo needs to tap into that nostalgia more than ever, and this could be one significant way to do it.

Spoiler

Combat Evolved 2

EDITS: Also, I don't believe in "sidearms" for Halo. Each weapon should be powerful to use and not throwaway. 343 labeling the H4 Magnum, PP and Boltshot as "sidearms" or "secondaries" identifies too much with common military shooters which have a lot of throwaway weapons. Halo should have no baggage in its weaponry.

v -- nope.jpg

 

[Syphon Filter]

That's one thing I really appreciated about past lore; the little convos about Spartans and/or MC that took place in the background dialogue.

"OH shit! A Spartan!"
That whole scene where MC is walking in the hangar with The Arbiter and Sgt. Johnson was special :'] - The relationship between Spartans and the rest of the UNSC (ie: ODST) made it so interesting.

The BR came back in Halo 4 as a 5sk, I don't see why the Pistol can't come back as a starting weapon with the AR as a 4sk in a sandbox that's balanced around it.

No worries jem, 343 will bring it back and prove to the world how much better Halo is/was with CE AR/Pistol starts. That way, I can stop explaining to people that the Pistol was never broken, Bungie just planted that in people's minds to make room for the intentionally random/inconsitent BR.

Think about it:
Good strafe. Faster movement speed. Little aim assist, especially compared to the rest of the weapons after CE (babby level aim assist on everything). Had to lead your shots. Not even pros can land consistent 3sk's.

CE nerds have been dying for this weapon to return. I can guarantee you that if they made a true-to-form version of the CE Pistol, Halo would explode in the social media scene. Halo needs to tap into that nostalgia more than ever, and this could be one significant way to do it.

Spoiler

Combat Evolved 2

CE 2 is Halo 2 ; )

Also didn't ODST have the halo 1 pistol?

 

[Madness]

I meant retconned because if we are supposed to buy that a rampant AI in a broken ship, magically changed his armor around using nanomachines, why is Halsey 'imagining' or why did they show Chief in the past, fighting a Brute with this new armor? So it's clearly meant to be 343's visual change to the MK VI armor.

And the sad part is, I bet not one of them even thought that fans would pick up on it. Hell, they could've kept his normal armor, but when they crashland on Requiem it gets damaged and when he meets the Infinity, they upgraded his armor with all the new technology Spartans supposedly have.

I don't mind the new armor, I still love the old more, but I just didn't like that it wasn't explained, that it was just a random change.

 

[User 73706]

I meant retconned because if we are supposed to buy that a rampant AI in a broken ship, magically changed his armor around using nanomachines, why is Halsey 'imagining' or why did they show Chief in the past, fighting a Brute with this new armor? So it's clearly meant to be 343's visual change to the MK VI armor.

And the sad part is, I bet not one of them even thought that fans would pick up on it. Hell, they could've kept his normal armor, but when they crashland on Requiem it gets damaged and when he meets the Infinity, they upgraded his armor with all the new technology Spartans supposedly have.

I don't mind the new armor, I still love the old more, but I just didn't like that it wasn't explained, that it was just a random change.

I think the only possible excuse is that Halsey's shifting history's events in her favor (saying the Spartans helped defeat the Covenant, even though they were originally intended to counter the Insurrection) and as a result her little flashback ditty is suitably skewed.

 

[Zeouterlimits]

And the sad part is, I bet not one of them even thought that fans would pick up on it.

I would bet you are wrong. Nevermind how much we think about it, they have lots of people there [including Cocop & Voc] whose livelihood is to think about this stuff. So the thought has definitely occurred to them.

In the end the decision makers prefer their new Chief design.
Just like a whole bunch of their aesthetic changes to the Universe - I don't.

It's a real bummer for me. Because even if the gameplay improves significantly, and I hope it does, I know it's real unlikely they'll fix the atrocious Didact design or dinoCovies or xyz.

 

[aHebrewMenagerie]

I would bet you are wrong. Nevermind how much we think about it, they have lots of people there [including Cocop & Voc] whose livelihood is to think about this stuff. So the thought has definitely occurred to them.

In the end the decision makers prefer their new Chief design.
Just like a whole bunch of their aesthetic changes to the Universe - I don't.

It's a real bummer for me. Because even if the gameplay improves significantly, and I hope it does, I know it's real unlikely they'll fix the atrocious Didact design or dinoCovies or xyz.

My personal opinion, is that if they get the gameplay and the "general" look of things, I'm fine with whatever they put out in terms of design.

Also, my body is ready for Christmas, as you can see by my avatar. Thanks to Rambles over at the TeamBeyond forums for hooking me up.

ftfy

Holy shit that takes me back. I shall don the fez..... ONCE AGAIN.

 

[User 73706]

Also, my body is ready for Christmas, as you can see by my avatar. Thanks to Rambles over at the TeamBeyond forums for hooking me up.

ftfy

 

[FUNKNOWN iXi]

Welcome back buddio.

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

150+ survey replies already. 10 or so more communities yet to be posted to. Hopefully we can top 1,000+ entries.

 

[daedalius]

I'm certain they knew fans would notice the new design.

I'm sure they thought everyone would like it. And most people probably do, well enough.

Long survey is long

Because they didn't spend one damn second thinking about what they were doing while making those. They just said, "Fuck it. Let's make shit up."

Nah, they probably did. And they probably didn't think they were retconning anything, they just decided to make a cool new scene fighting brutes.

But sure, some of you should continue with the 'slighted fan persecution complex'; they made all their decisions just to make you mad.

 

[GrizzNKev]

How do we know they retconned those scenes? Are they teasers for new Halos to come? Have they elaborated what each scene meant? Why put the new Mk Armor on other Spartans? What's Halsey doing handing Cortana to chief while he was depressed wearing his new armor?

Something doesn't make sense to those scenes and why I haven't seen any developer talk about them just makes it odd.

Because they didn't spend one damn second thinking about what they were doing while making those. They just said, "Fuck it. Let's make shit up."

 

[Steelyuhas]

Halo 5 Beta access with every new copy of Titan Fall better be announced the VGX. That would only help both franchises in sales and attention.

One game is published my MS, the other EA. Extremely unlikely.

 

[NobleGundam]

Because they didn't spend one damn second thinking about what they were doing while making those. They just said, "Fuck it. Let's make shit up."

If I'm not mistakened, 343 didn't do those cutscenes. Someone else did.

 

[User 73706]

...maybe they should have pulled a Halo 3 and had those out-of-house CGI cutscenes used for actual commercials.

 

[daedalius]

How can I choose 'favorite halo multiplayer' when each selection has its own caveats?

bah

 

[aHebrewMenagerie]

How can I choose 'favorite halo multiplayer' when each selection has its own caveats?

bah

Halo 2 or CE is the correct answer.

 

[daedalius]

Halo 2 or CE is the correct answer.

I actually picked 3.

But if there was a notes section, I'd be pointing out the slow run speeds, anchor like aiming, poor hit registration; y'know I think I'll change it to 4, because I really like Halo 4 Legendary BRs.

Is that survey really being sent to 343 as a representation of HaloGAF's opinion on Halo?

Seems like a good idea, more communities would be better.

 

[Tashi]

Is that survey really being sent to 343 as a representation of HaloGAF's opinion on Halo?

 

[Fuchsdh]

150+ survey replies already. 10 or so more communities yet to be posted to. Hopefully we can top 1,000+ entries.

I actually picked 3.

But if there was a notes section, I'd be pointing out the slow run speeds, anchor like aiming, poor hit registration; y'know I think I'll change it to 4, because I really like Halo 4 Legendary BRs.

Yeah I think I ended up picking Halo 4 too just because I prefer the feel of it over all the other games, even if I like individual components of the other games (art direction, map choice, weapon sandbox) far more.

Likewise, I picked Halo CE as best campaign for its consistent level of quality and effective storytelling, even if we've gotten better character interplay in 4, more elaborate storylines in 2, greater scale in Reach, and greater encounters and mission structure in 3.

I think the overall "best" answers aren't going to be that illuminating, but I expect other parts of the survey will have some more interesting (and useful) results.

Is that survey really being sent to 343 as a representation of HaloGAF's opinion on Halo?

I don't believe so considering he's sent it to other communities.

CE 2 is Halo 2 ; )

Also didn't ODST have the halo 1 pistol?

ODST's pistol is really nothing like the H1 pistol. It fires really quickly and very accurately making it incredibly easy for a good marksman to obliterate unshielded infantry, but its overall power and staggering ability is pretty low, forcing you to strip shields with another weapon.

ODST's sandbox is pretty great IMO. If anything the Carbine is closer to the H1 pistol in that game because it wrecks everything, but its not as plentiful ammo-wise as is other games and in Firefight you have to manage it as a resource.

I dunno about having a billion weapons in campaign or multiplayer sandbox but it would be cool if during the stealth-based missions they swapped out your starting missions with the suppressed versions. It would make a great choice of forcing players to trade versatility for stealth--if you drop your suppressed SMG you won't find another, but if you keep it with you, you'll find more ammo. Like a return to the Halo CE approach (sniper rounds in T&R).

 

[User 73706]

Is that survey really being sent to 343 as a representation of HaloGAF's opinion on Halo?

"signed,

The Competitive Halo Community"

 

[Syphon Filter]

Is that survey really being sent to 343 as a representation of HaloGAF's opinion on Halo?

We already know what halogaf wants. Maybe other sites should do similar polls.

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

Is that survey really being sent to 343 as a representation of HaloGAF's opinion on Halo?

No one really replied with doing HaloGAF alone first then the wider community. So no, it has already been opened up to the community at large. So far it's on TeamBeyond, Waypoint and HaloGAF.

The questions are designed to remove the need for text input, after all how would you present 1,000 entries with subjective text? It has to be a funnelling type process. Here's some simple replies I gave on TeamBeyond.

1. I wanted to keep the survey something that can collate easily and present in an infographic for us and 343i. That means no text inputs, sorry guys'n'gals with more specific answers.

2. Apologises on the poor grammar/English, limited time when I created this and I was trying to keep it quick to fill out.

3. Custom edition PC was a tough choice to omit, too complex for this survey with custom maps or mods etc. Great game though and I get the love for it/PC.

4. Sprint doesn't really need an additional question due to the existing question about "best movement". Again it's about simplifying choices/results so if you pick Halo 3 for example you've already provided your answer that you don't like sprint or AA's giving extra movement abilities etc. If enough members want a sprint exclusive question I'll happily add one.

5. Feel free to make suggestions to help me/us refine the survey, this forum [TeamBeyond] is probably the best fit to expand sections about movement, strafe, bullet magnetism etc. Any help there appreciated.

6. We're going to post this survey in as many communities as we can find that will participate.

7. The final infographic will be posted to all communities involved and sent to 343i specifically with of course a Waypoint thread too.


If you have some ideas to add please feel free.

 

[FUNKNOWN iXi]

These results are going to break my heart. Ozzy, you should ask how much time people put into each campaign/multiplayer and to what extent.

 

[Fracas]

Design a competitively viable game with a high skill gap, good matchmaking logic, and a ranking system. Competitive players will love it while average players will see themselves get better and strive to improve as they learn the metagame. Everybody wins.

You don't need a survey - this is basic knowledge that's been regurgitated since Halo 4 came out.

 

[aHebrewMenagerie]

You know, I know we give Ozzy a lot of shit. Probably more than he deserves. Though some of his opinions on Halo 4 might be bad, he's really pulled through with the OT and poll.

Props, Ozzy. I take off my hats for you.

 

[nillapuddin]

1-50 as it was will never be viable again.

Completely revamped ranking system will be needed.

 

[Syphon Filter]

1-50 as it was will never be viable again.

Completely revamped ranking system will be needed.

why wouldn't it be viable?

 

[DeadByDawn]

I took the two surveys. I sure do hope I helped save Halo today.

 

[Blueblur1]

I would bet you are wrong. Nevermind how much we think about it, they have lots of people there [including Cocop & Voc] whose livelihood is to think about this stuff. So the thought has definitely occurred to them.

In the end the decision makers prefer their new Chief design.
Just like a whole bunch of their aesthetic changes to the Universe - I don't.

It's a real bummer for me. Because even if the gameplay improves significantly, and I hope it does, I know it's real unlikely they'll fix the atrocious Didact design or dinoCovies or xyz.

Not only are the new visual designs awful but so is the audio. It was a huge downgrade in sound. Everything sounded like cheap sci-fi original movies caliber junk and we lost unique item pick-up sounds. Also, the distant weapon sounds were replaced by inferior sound effects. It was huge step backwards from Marty's work on Halo 3 and Reach. It makes me wish they would get a new sound director if they're going to stick to their "vision" of Halo (which is still a preposterous concept).

 

[User 73706]

Having given it little to no thought but with some mildly changed, less-OCD tastes than last time, I think I'm going to try and get down what I'd want out of a competitive (but still fun) multiplayer sandbox. Weapons, anyways. Dunno about vehicles.

Loadouts: Magnum / AR / Either 2x or 1x Frag starts across the board. Four "classes" available, with the sole difference being an armor ability.

AAs: Sprint, a buffed Thruster (pretty much a single-use per charge Evade), Jump Jet (double jump), and Halo 4's Hologram.

Grenades: Frag / Plasma / Firebomb / Promethean Pineapple

The Firebomb would have a slightly larger radius and less damage output, but with damage that increases closer to the epicenter you get. It's meant to be a denial-of-entry / suppression grenade now, with it only making kills on direct hits / walking through the entire diameter of the fire.

The Promethean Pineapple would just be some sort of Pulse Grenade-ish thing with added stasis functionality.

Weapons:

Magnum (Halo 4 version, but with Combat Evolved levels of feedback)
AR (Halo 4 version)
Plasma Rifle (Combat Evolved variant)
Plasma Pistol (Reach Beta variant)

Bread-and-butter weapons located throughout the map.

Battle Rifle
Carbine
Light Rifle

The three precision weapons would have roles very similar to their functions in Halo 4 Turbo, with the key difference that they don't show up in loadouts - instead, one of each type spawns in the general perimeter of opening spawn or the team's base. In a traditional 4v4 environment, this leaves one player with an immediate drive to locate additional support, such as a power weapon, powerup, or vehicle, even in Slayer modes.

Needler (mix between Combat Evolved / 4 versions)
Shotgun (CE version; favors range over Halo 4 version's evident "bulk")
Sentinel Beam

Low-level power weapons. The Sentinel Beam in particular would replace the DMR not only as an anti-sniper weapon, but as a vehicle stripper. The Sentinel Beam would gain a unique property in that its beam actually gains power over distance (capping at about 200%, maybe) despite lacking a scope with a power level between the Halo 2 and 3 editions, meaning that using it to suppress a sniper would be doubly effective.

Energy Sword
Grenade Launcher (added Sticky Det. functionality)
Railgun

Mid-level power weapons.

Rocket Launcher
Plasma Launcher
Sniper Rifle
Beam Rifle

High-level power weapons. UNSC versions are more deliberately anti-infantry, while Covenant are anti-vehicle.

Powerups: Camo / OS / Damage Boost / Speed Boost, bare minimum. Some extra powerups could replace oldie-but-goodie Armor Abilities / perks / etc.

I think that leaves the total at 17 weapons, not including grenades. I feel like I'm forgetting some, though. There are also a few wild card ideas I had like the ONI Hard Sound Rifle, a "cluster buster" Promethean Revolver / Scattershot combination thing, and of course the Gravity Gauntlet, but those would be superfluous.

 

[DeadNames]

How about we just scrap loadouts?

 

[Syphon Filter]

How about we just scrap loadouts?

yup they need to remove it completely. it doesn't make sense for Halo.

 

[DeadNames]

yup they need to remove it completely. it doesn't make sense for Halo.

But dem war games bro. Gotta train those Spartans to fight in UNSC science installations somehow.

 

[Poker Face]

How about we just scrap loadouts?

But...but..but...in order to fit in with generic FPS 2013 you need loadouts and perks!

 

[Cow]

How about we just scrap loadouts?

While we're at it, scrap sprint too.

 

[gAg CruSh3r]

But...but..but...in order to fit in with generic FPS 2013 you need loadouts and perks!

It puts sadness into my heart that people would even want perks in Halo ...