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[RebornYeti]

Just read the news. Sad that Mechs wont' be playable, but I'm excited to see the vehicle that apparently dwarfs it.

And I'm not too familiar with all the hitscan mumbo-jumbo, but hitscan is a good thing right? Why are people complaining?

 

[Homeboyd]

As they've mentioned several times; classic Halo will be available. I'm guessing while Halo 4's entire Matchmaking suite may be linked, there will be different "modes" within it to suit certain playstyles (kind of like how they've done with Anni vs TU vs Vanilla Reach).

A new section of multiplayer (perhaps a list of playlists dedicated to this mode only) that is made up of this progression system that includes armor/weapon progressions and is tied to a separate "rank/level" than other more classical approaches. Think of it as vanilla Reach vs Arena (or social vs ranked). Except this time one of those options is dedicated to the new progression system while the other (or others) are not.

So if I want to start at level "0" with no kinds of armor/weapon attachments/"abilities" other than the basics and work my way through the new progression system, I enter a certain area of Matchmaking and play those playlists. How they provide these upgrades could be something similar to how Tashi described it or it could be something that resembles other shooters. I would still have the option to enter other areas of Matchmaking which would have their own dedicated playlists for the classicalists™ to play socially or move through the new "1-50" style ranks as we used to.

I don't think there will be 50 playlists to accommodate all of these modes, but rather a few core ones dedicated to the new progression system and then all the others being featured in the social/ranked.

Just a thought.

 

[ManBearPanda]

Just read the news. Sad that Mechs wont' be playable, but I'm excited to see the vehicle that apparently dwarfs it.

And I'm not too familiar with all the hitscan mumbo-jumbo, but hitscan is a good thing right? Why are people complaining?

I don't think people are (at least I hope they aren't).

e:

Game just turns into who can spam who the fastest. I prefer my firefights to be minute long ballads of leading, pacing, reloading, shield recharging, and then pacing & leading, ultimately leading us both into simultaneous melee deaths.

 

[Rickenslacker]

And I'm not too familiar with all the hitscan mumbo-jumbo, but hitscan is a good thing right? Why are people complaining?

We're just shitting. Hitscan is godlike.

 

[Ramirez]

And I'm not too familiar with all the hitscan mumbo-jumbo, but hitscan is a good thing right? Why are people complaining?

Game just turns into who can spam who the fastest. I prefer my firefights to be minute long ballads of leading, pacing, reloading, shield recharging, and then pacing & leading, ultimately leading us both into simultaneous melee deaths.

 

[RebornYeti]

We're just shitting. Hitscan is godlike.

So, can someone fill me in on the difference between hitscan and... not hitscan?

Game just turns into who can spam who the fastest. I prefer my firefights to be minute long ballads of leading, pacing, reloading, shield recharging, and then pacing & leading, ultimately leading us both into simultaneous melee deaths.

Yeah, ok.

 

[Devolution]

Game just turns into who can spam who the fastest. I prefer my firefights to be minute long ballads of leading, pacing, reloading, shield recharging, and then pacing & leading, ultimately leading us both into simultaneous melee deaths.

I <3 you.

 

[Fracas]

While I enjoy the BR quite a bit, I'd have to say I prefer the DMR. I like the BR's look more, but I like single shot a LOT, and burst fire just isn't my thing. I am glad to see the BR's return, though, and it being hitscan is awesome, although pretty much anyone could've guessed that.

About the armor abilities debacle, I was skeptical at first, but I just don't see how Halo 4 could have the same balancing issues with them that Reach did. I mean, Frankie's seen us hate on them for quite some time, and he knows the issues that Reach's AA's have.

As for the "progression that may or may not be gameplay related"...I just don't know, I suppose I'll just have to wait and see. I have to admit, this is probably the most hyped I've been for a game in quite some time.

 

[Rickenslacker]

So, can someone fill me in on the difference between hitscan and... not hitscan?

Basically with hitscan bullets are made to instantly travel the distance and hit their target. Non-hitscan effectively turns the bullet into a projectile.

So, what that means is:
Hitscan - Aim at the person, shoot the person, they get shot.
Non-hitscan - Aim at the person, shoot at the person, shots miss because they moved out of the way by the time the bullet traveled. It means you have to lead your shots, but because of the P2P nature of the games it makes for a lot of inconsistent aiming and bullet registration.

 

[Ramirez]

So, can someone fill me in on the difference between hitscan and... not hitscan?

Hitscan means where you aim, the bullets go, like the Halo 2 BR or the DMR in ZB. Non hitscan would be Halo 3 BR where the bullets had a random spread.

 

[nomis]

So, can someone fill me in on the difference between hitscan and... not hitscan?



Yeah, ok.

Hitscan is the DMR in Reach. Pull trigger, bullet lands at the same time. You see the shields on your opponent flare right as you see muzzle flash.

Non-hitscan means travel time, so like the sniper in Halo 1 I think, where it took a sec to snipe someone across Blood Gulch, or like the BR in Halo 3 where only if you led your reticule ahead of a moving target would all three bullets of the burst make contact. Otherwise by the time the third bullet ejected, your target would have moved.

 

[Havok]

Hitscan means where you aim, the bullets go, like the Halo 2 BR or the DMR in ZB. Non hitscan would be Halo 3 BR where the bullets had a random spread.

Well, not really. It's about travel time, not accuracy.

 

[kittens]

While I enjoy the BR quite a bit, I'd have to say I prefer the DMR. I like the BR's look more, but I like single shot a LOT, and burst fire just isn't my thing. I am glad to see the BR's return, though, and it being hitscan is awesome, although pretty much anyone could've guessed that.

Frankie has emphasized that the BR isn't "replacing" anything in the weapon sandbox, and that single shot precision weapons will still have a role. Whether that means the DMR is returning, or a needle rifle, carbine, pistol, or whatever... remains to be seen.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Hitscan means where you aim, the bullets go, like the Halo 2 BR or the DMR in ZB. Non hitscan would be Halo 3 BR where the bullets had a random spread.

I don't think hitscan would affect the spread, but rather the bullet travel time. No need to lead shot with hitscan.

Edit: damn you Havok.

 

[Ramirez]

Well, not really. It's about travel time, not acuracy.

On most maps though, the travel time doesn't matter, so it's about the same definition!

Well, let me say this, if you make it hit scan, but then add a random spread on it, then what's the point of it being hit scan? This is like Reach being hitscan, but bloom making it pointless.

 

[Havok]

On most maps though, the travel time doesn't matter, so it's about the same definition!

It sure mattered with Halo 3's netcode

 

[Fracas]

Frankie has emphasized that the BR isn't "replacing" anything in the weapon sandbox, and that single shot precision weapons will still have a role. Whether that means the DMR is returning, or a needle rifle, carbine, pistol, or whatever... remains to be seen.

Forgot about that. If they're both in the game, and customizable weapon loadouts are in the game, then BR/DMR starts could be possible...My god...

Then again, that is a lot of "ifs".
edit: Haha if he was just meaning the pistol, I'm going to be mad

 

[RebornYeti]

Cool, thanks guys.

 

[Ramirez]

It sure mattered with Halo 3's netcode

Halo 3 wasn't hit scan though...? I've always equated hit scan to my bullets going exactly where I aim instantly, which 3 didn't do, but 2 did. From there you add on the range cap to keep the BR from dominating all areas of a map since it doesn't have a spread.

 

[Redford]

I guess you suck at leading and pacing.

No, I sucked at getting host, if anything.

And pacing? Wat.

Spoiler

I know there's a certain amount of pacing in H3 that helps, but that's true of any shooter

 

[HigherLevel]

I just wanna know how these armor enhancing things are gonna work or whatever they are. That's my only worry so far. I know Frankie said not to worry but it's hard in a world where COD is the most played Xbox game.

 

[nomis]

It means you have to lead your shots, but because of the P2P nature of the games it makes for a lot of inconsistent aiming and bullet registration.

I'm grossly under informed on the specifics of netcode, but it makes sense to me that hitscan weapons are more consistent because the only two nuggets of information being shared between boxes for a single DMR bullet are literally a single vector (X,Y,Z) and a timestamp (00:00:00). Whereas for a H3 BR burst, there are three vectors, only the first of which is directly point to point between the shooter and whatever is in the exact center of the reticule. There is also then TWO timestamps for each bullet. Time of departure and time of arrival. Because P2P connections can vary so greatly with latency, there is probably a greater opportunity for different peer boxes to have disagreements over the length of time between the two stamps.

Also Reach had better netcode because it was a further iteration, and was BETTER. Hitscan just made it even more reliable.

 

[Ramirez]

No, I sucked at getting host, if anything.

And pacing? Wat.

Spoiler

I know there's a certain amount of pacing in H3 that helps, but that's true of any shooter

Dude, I was trolling.

 

[Fracas]

I just wanna know how these armor enhancing things are gonna work or whatever they are. That's my only worry so far. I know Frankie said not to worry but it's hard in a world where COD is the most played Xbox game.

Exact same way I'm feeling. Everything looks great so far, but that one nagging doubt in my mind is still there

 

[Havok]

Halo 3 wasn't hit scan though...? I've always equated hit scan to my bullets going exactly where I aim instantly, which 3 didn't do, but 2 did. From there you add on the range cap to keep the BR from dominating all areas of a map since it doesn't have a spread.

Right, it wasn't, which just added a layer of inconsistence to the entire experience. The travel time, combined with some jackass having 300 ms ping (or the game just having shitty hit detection), with the spread layered on top of that resulted in the bad experience with the Halo 3 BR, and hitscan removes one of those layers.

(For the record, I like the Halo 2 BR and I like that it's what you're describing)

 

[Demoncarnotaur]

Great update, I'm surprised my question got used, although reading it now I wish I had phrased it differently. One way or another there was plenty of Juicy bits of info, and while I still feel like we know nothing, we certainly know more than we did before. That said, Im kinda bummed we didn't get any new pictures or footage, I was hoping for some direct feed shots of the MP.

BR renders:

Wait.. Where did those come from? I don't see them in the Bulletin. One way or another, the BR is looking damn sexy, but its strange, in this render it looks almost like concept art. Its weird that it looks kinda cartoony when the lighting from the engine isn't interacting with the 3D model.

I've said this earlier: have Invasion and Firefight make a baby. Fight against AI through a few objectives.

I agree, I would love to see what could of the mode if they went that direction. Still, I would like a more classic, ODST approach to FF as well, with a more clear, defensible location where you get pushed back into as all hell breaks loose. Also, no infinite ammo crates please. Reach FF is just not very fun for me, and Im not sure why.

"Short version, yes. Assassinations are altered, but they’re back. The weapon question isn’t something we’re going to answer today."

Please be campaign only.

Eh, I like assassinations. A lot actually. Just make them toggle-able for players who don't want to perform them in MM.

 

[FyreWulff]

I just wanna know how these armor enhancing things are gonna work or whatever they are. That's my only worry so far. I know Frankie said not to worry but it's hard in a world where COD is the most played Xbox game.

I wonder of any of them are beneficial for firefight. Like a skull you can equip (say, lower the ability for enemies to sense you)

 

[Ramirez]

Right, it wasn't, which just added a layer of inconsistence to the entire experience. The travel time, combined with some jackass having 300 ms ping (or the game just having shitty hit detection), with the spread layered on top of that resulted in the bad experience with the Halo 3 BR, and hitscan removes one of those layers.

(For the record, I like the Halo 2 BR and I like that it's what you're describing)

I see what you're saying, but to me, if it's hitscan, but still has a crappy random spread, then it's one step forward and two steps back. Guess we'll have to wait and see.

I also told Therms earlier that they've been pretty adamant in saying the BR isn't replacing DMR type weapons, so I think it's a safe assumption a single shot rifle is returning. What I don't understand is what differentiates it from the BR? If you add a 3x scope on it, then it ruins BTB, and if it does have the insane range like Reach's does, who would use the BR over it? Glad I'm not making the decisions over there.

 

[HigherLevel]

I could see a DMR with 2x scope and a locked rate of fire that equals the fastest amount of time you can get off four bursts with the BR being included to satisfy the people who want a single-shot gun. I don't see why there can't be a little redundancy in the weapons to satisfy fans of each, as long as it's balanced I've got not problem with it.

 

[Havok]

I see what you're saying, but to me, if it's hitscan, but still has a crappy random spread, then it's one step forward and two steps back. Guess we'll have to wait and see.

I also told Therms earlier that they've been pretty adamant in saying the BR isn't replacing DMR type weapons, so I think it's a safe assumption a single shot rifle is returning. What I don't understand is what differentiates it from the BR? If you add a 3x scope on it, then it ruins BTB, and if it does have the insane range like Reach's does, who would use the BR over it? Glad I'm not making the decisions over there.

Sure, I get that. Neither travel time or a random spread is something I want to see anyway. We're on the same page here.

I assumed them not shutting out single shot weapons completely just means that a Carbine-like weapon is returning, maybe along with a Reach-y pistol. You can almost see a balance being struck with the inherent risk-reward of single shot weapons. Unlike with burst, there's no possible partial damage, but maybe that lets them be slightly more powerful.

 

[Kibbles]

Wait.. Where did those come from? I don't see them in the Bulletin. One way or another, the BR is looking damn sexy, but its strange, in this render it looks almost like concept art. Its weird that it looks kinda cartoony when the lighting from the engine isn't interacting with the 3D model.

They were put out today on press site.

 

[Fracas]

Sure, I get that. Neither travel time or a random spread is something I want to see anyway.

I assumed them not shutting out single shot weapons completely just means that a Carbine-like weapon is returning, maybe along with a Reach-y pistol.

I really hope the Reach pistol comes back. The most underrated weapon in the series IMO.

 

[ManBearPanda]

I also told Therms earlier that they've been pretty adamant in saying the BR isn't replacing DMR type weapons, so I think it's a safe assumption a single shot rifle is returning. What I don't understand is what differentiates it from the BR? If you add a 3x scope on it, then it ruins BTB, and if it does have the insane range like Reach's does, who would use the BR over it? Glad I'm not making the decisions over there.

Well DMR-type weapon could just mean "single shot weapon" which is just a fancy term for pistol, heh.

I do agree with you, however, with regards to the DMR's affect on long-range combat. Perhaps a single-shot rifle with a really low ROF, and 2x scope, which in that case it becomes a poor man's sniper. I don't envy the people responsible for building the sandbox at all.

 

[xxjuicesxx]

Well cause theres time in between each burst. So I assume each bullet on the BR fires and hits instantly but regarding the whole burst theres time in between to slip or adjust the shot. Where in Halo 3 there was time between the shot and the destination AND the 3bullets.

Spread is different, spreads sort of the total distance the last two bullets land from the first bullet.

 

[Ken]

ME3 MP is pretty fun, but grinding credits for a loot-box for a chance at a specific sniper rifle is not.

 

[Redford]

Dude, I was trolling.

I've been lurking here a while, and you were always an enigma tbh.

 

[Domino Theory]

The way they specifically pointed out that bloom as it exists in vanilla Reach won't be in Halo 4 makes me think that maybe 85% will make it in on some weapons.

Please no.

I want bloom to be a mere memory when 4 comes out.

 

[Ramirez]

I've been lurking here a while, and you were always an enigma tbh.

I do my best.

 

[daedalius]

I really hope the Reach pistol comes back. The most underrated weapon in the series IMO.

Wat?

You like 5sk, 8 shot clip?

No thanks. Would rather have Halo 1 pistol back, but not 3sk. Maybe 4 or 5.

 

[kittens]

I miss Squad Slayer.

 

[heckfu]

Ghaleon and Fyre in an epic twitter battle. Just a heads up if you want to read what we've already read before.

 

[Garrett 2U]

Why are people okay with game types starting with AR and BR, but then if you can choose a class and start with either, people freak out?

 

[Fracas]

Wat?

You like 5sk, 8 shot clip?

No thanks. Would rather have Halo 1 pistol back, but not 3sk. Maybe 4 or 5.

I'm dead serious. That thing is damn good, decent at range and a beast up close. Add a couple rounds in the clip and you have a weapon as versatile as the DMR and nearly as deadly.

I can't be the only one who likes this thing...right?

Spoiler

Right?

Ghaleon and Fyre in an epic twitter battle. Just a heads up if you want to read what we've already read before.

Link? I love a good debate.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Ghaleon and Fyre in an epic twitter battle. Just a heads up if you want to read what we've already read before.

Let's just say the battle is over and call it good.

 

[Nutter]

Ghaleon and Fyre in an epic twitter battle. Just a heads up if you want to read what we've already read before.

Ghaleon might want to watch out, he might put him on ignore and then post about it.

 

[daedalius]

I'm dead serious. That thing is damn good, decent at range and a beast up close. Add a couple rounds in the clip and you have a weapon as versatile as the Reach DMR and nearly as deadly.

I can't be the only one who likes this thing...right?

Spoiler

Right?

Link? I love a good debate.

Lol not a debate.

Pistol would be fine if it had a better clip; far too shallow at 8 shots.

 

[Redford]

I'm dead serious. That thing is damn good, decent at range and a beast up close. Add a couple rounds in the clip and you have a weapon as versatile as the DMR and nearly as deadly.

I can't be the only one who likes this thing...right?

Spoiler

Right?

Link? I love a good debate.

I certainly can't stand its small clip.

---

Also hope they can bring the fireworks over here, if it's a showdown they're having.

 

[Fracas]

Lol not a debate.

Pistol would be fine if it had a better clip; far too shallow at 8 shots.

That's my only real problem with it, if you miss just a few shots, you're dead.
However, seeing a guy fill you with AR rounds as you calmly place 5 shots straight in his head, only getting your shields popped...feelsgoodman

And oh God, what did you guys do to Fyre.

 

[Domino Theory]

Ghaleon might want to watch out, he might put him on ignore and then post about it.

LOL

 

[xxjuicesxx]

Will Halo 4 use Kinect, or 3D in any form?