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[xxjuicesxx]

:lol :lol :lol

That's 360 games look the same as they did in 2005, right?

THATS EXACTLY WHAT IM FUCKING GETTING AT.

NEW GAMES = BETTER GRAPHICS

DONT RUN AS GOOD ON SAME HARDWARE.

REALLY THAT HARD TO UNDERSTAND BRO?

You think this game will run better than Halo 3 did even tho it looks way fucking better...ON THE SAME 360 system?!

Jesus can any understand and comprehend sentences on this fucking forum?

 

[EazyB]

THATS EXACTLY WHAT IM FUCKING GETTING AT.

NEW GAMES = BETTER GRAPHICS

DONT RUN AS GOOD ON SAME HARDWARE.

REALLY THAT HARD TO UNDERSTAND BRO?

You think this game will run better than Halo 3 did even tho it looks way fucking better...ON THE SAME 360 system?!

Jesus can any understand and comprehend sentences on this fucking forum?

Would you say Halo 2 ran better than CE?

I think Reach is going to have 6 player co-op. I think it is a very serious possibility.

One thing i am disappointed with is the "new guy" shit again.

I just hope they lock down the netcode so it runs significantly better than Halo 3/ODSTs co-op modes. Same goes for MP, as awesome as it'd be to play on even larger maps with 24 players, it could never happen without dedicated servers (which won't happen) and I just hope they put a lot of effort into making it run better with 16 and less.

 

[Princess Carl]

I think Reach is going to have 6 player co-op. I think it is a very serious possibility.

One thing i am disappointed with is the "new guy" shit again.

I think a really cool idea would have been to been able to pick any of the spartans in the squad and have personalized objectives throughout the campaign. Now granted if any of them die during the campaign i could see this idea sucking. But it would have been an interesting take that could have really diversified the story.

 

[xxjuicesxx]

Would you say Halo 2 ran better than CE?

Don't know never played Halo CE on an original Xbox, only on a 360. Even then I never really played it.

 

[broony]

Jesus can any understand and comprehend sentences on this fucking forum?

:lol

Seriously though, look at Halo and Halo 2 as how things look better on the same console given time to develop against the hardware and learn fom it.

Spoiler

Cutscenes excluded of course

 

[NemesisPrime]

On the same hardware. Newer versions NEVER do. FACT!

Its why PC gaming is expensive. Newer faster stuff needed all the time. To accommodate larger worlds more expansive gameplay and of course killer gfx.

Yeah.. software never gets optimized. Fact! Let's just throw bigger/faster hardware at it instead.

Dude... seriously.... If you were a game dev I would never hire you.

 

[adamsapple]

NEW GAMES = BETTER GRAPHICS

DONT RUN AS GOOD ON SAME HARDWARE.

dude .. what ?

 

[xxjuicesxx]

:lol

Seriously though, look at Halo and Halo 2 as how things look better on the same console given time to develop against the hardware and learn fom it.

Spoiler

Cutscenes excluded of course

I agree sometimes you can optimize your game to work better. But that was already ODST. And it wasn't quite impressive. Optimizing and straight up getting more graphics with less power is DIFFERENT.

 

[Kitschkraft]

I think Reach is going to have 6 player co-op. I think it is a very serious possibility.

One thing i am disappointed with is the "new guy" shit again.

I think a really cool idea would have been to been able to pick any of the spartans in the squad and have personalized objectives throughout the campaign. Now granted if any of them die during the campaign i could see this idea sucking. But it would have been an interesting take that could have really diversified the story.

I know it's probably been asked to death but I'm not pillaging the shit show of a topic to find the answer...are you definitely NOT going to play as Master Chief in this?

 

[JimiNutz]

THATS EXACTLY WHAT IM FUCKING GETTING AT.

NEW GAMES = BETTER GRAPHICS

DONT RUN AS GOOD ON SAME HARDWARE.

REALLY THAT HARD TO UNDERSTAND BRO?

You think this game will run better than Halo 3 did even tho it looks way fucking better...ON THE SAME 360 system?!

Jesus can any understand and comprehend sentences on this fucking forum?

Gears of War 2 looks and runs better than Gears of War 1, Mass Effect 2 looks better and seems to run better than Mass Effect (although it's not out yet so hard to be certain), Left4Dead 2 looks and runs better than the original (I'm talking 360 version), Fight Night Round 4 looks and runs better than Round 3...I could go on all day.

Most sequels look AND run better, on the same 360 hardware...

You're probably going to say that these games were simply 'optimized'? well I don't care what you call it, they LOOK BETTER.
Plus Reach is running on a completely different engine from Halo 3 and ODST.

 

[LCfiner]

THATS EXACTLY WHAT IM FUCKING GETTING AT.

NEW GAMES = BETTER GRAPHICS

DONT RUN AS GOOD ON SAME HARDWARE.

REALLY THAT HARD TO UNDERSTAND BRO?

You think this game will run better than Halo 3 did even tho it looks way fucking better...ON THE SAME 360 system?!

Jesus can any understand and comprehend sentences on this fucking forum?

Dude, chill out :lol

Tons and tons of console games across all platforms have looked better and ran just as good as earlier games on the same systems.

god of war and god of war 2
uncharted and uncharted 2 ( no tearing in better looking sequel)
gears and gears 2

what you're saying goes against the experiences of almost everyone in this forum playing console games for the past decade or longer.

 

[The Crawf]

I know it's probably been asked to death but I'm not pillaging the shit show of a topic to find the answer...are you definitely NOT going to play as Master Chief in this?

Correct. You won't be playing as the Master Chief

 

[Louis Wu]

I agree sometimes you can optimize your game to work better. But that was already ODST. And it wasn't quite impressive. Optimizing and straight up getting more graphics with less power is DIFFERENT.

Because nobody ever comes up with cool new tricks to do more with less, right?

 

[Princess Carl]

I just hope they lock down the netcode so it runs significantly better than Halo 3/ODSTs co-op modes. Same goes for MP, as awesome as it'd be to play on even larger maps with 24 players, it could never happen without dedicated servers (which won't happen) and I just hope they put a lot of effort into making it run better with 16 and less.

I cant say i had a bad experience with the co-op in either.

Granted, the people i was playing were very close to me, but i felt like they did a pretty awesome job with the co-op.

But back on topic, i think its silly. I don't wanna play as the default new guy. I want to be able to pick between them and feel like im playing each level 5 different ways. I WANT THIS SO BAD.

 

[Princess Carl]

Because nobody ever comes up with cool new tricks to do more with less, right?

nope, innovation is for pussies

 

[Magni]

Here's to hoping the netcode is improved, for Co-op MP as well as for adversarial MP. And add ping numbers please.

 

[snoopeasystreet]

THATS EXACTLY WHAT IM FUCKING GETTING AT.

NEW GAMES = BETTER GRAPHICS

DONT RUN AS GOOD ON SAME HARDWARE.

REALLY THAT HARD TO UNDERSTAND BRO?

You think this game will run better than Halo 3 did even tho it looks way fucking better...ON THE SAME 360 system?!

Jesus can any understand and comprehend sentences on this fucking forum?

It's all about program optimization bro. Over time, developers find better better ways to program for the console making tasks require less memory or CPU usage. Hence why games to tend to look/run better as the generation progresses.

 

[xxjuicesxx]

It's all about program optimization bro. Over time, developers find better better ways to program for the console making tasks require less memory or CPU usage. Hence why games to tend to look/run better as the generation progresses.

Yes but that was back when coders were piecing together things by themselves. A lot more today is just copy paste of already working stuff.

Don't reinvent the wheel and such.

Trends. Lol.

 

[rjcc]

Yes but that was back when coders were piecing together things by themselves. A lot more today is just copy paste of already working stuff.

Don't reinvent the wheel and such.

Trends. Lol.

have you ever played a videogame, ever?

 

[Diablohead]

After halo 2 and 3 footage before release what I see happening is:

720p at 2xAA, maybe 640p again like halo 3.
Cut scenes using a more refined player model then in-game action, since most foes will easily be a average distance away and all that compared to a more focused cut scene camera.
More blocky shadows and maybe a few removed light sources in the final version.

 

[broony]

I agree sometimes you can optimize your game to work better. But that was already ODST. And it wasn't quite impressive. Optimizing and straight up getting more graphics with less power is DIFFERENT.

I don't really want to get into this, plus I am the oposite of a graphics whore, but what you have said makes no sense. You are talking about optimising an existing engine. Which Bungie did really well with ODST. Just looks at the size of the city and the spaces the engine draws there for proof.

However Reach is using a new engine, different from Halo 3, as was different from Halo 2 and Halo: Coimbat evolved. This where you should be making your comparisons, and in my opinion there were dramtic graphical leaps in each iteration, not to mention big feature improvements like online play, movies, screenshots, forge, matchmaking, party system, and so on.

EDIT** Anyone got a Reach avatar for me? Ta.

 

[snoopeasystreet]

Yes but that was back when coders were piecing together things by themselves. A lot more today is just copy paste of already working stuff.

Don't reinvent the wheel and such.

Trends. Lol.

You don't have to reinvent the wheel but you can certainly improve it. Despite the wheel being around for around 8,000 years or so, our cars still don't roll on stone Flintstones style.

 

[kylej]

see, everyone complained when the AR vs BR argument would start but that was more fun than this.

 

[SecretBonusPoint]

xxjuicesxx stop making a fool of yourself. You clearly have no idea how console development operates. Take for instance (gonna get shit for even mentioning this name :lol) Uncharted 1 to Uncharted 2 on the PS3? Lost Planet 1 to Resident Evil 5? Massive improvements. I expect the same from Halo Reach (hopefully?).

Console development starts out using the basics, and then after devs are comfortable with the system they start to squeeze it for everything its worth. Depending on developer talent, you'll see almost a generational leap in quality or just better IQ.

 

[Truant]

After halo 2 and 3 footage before release what I see happening is:

720p at 2xAA, maybe 640p again like halo 3.
Cut scenes using a more refined player model then in-game action, since most foes will easily be a average distance away and all that compared to a more focused cut scene camera.
More blocky shadows and maybe a few removed light sources in the final version.

I'm certain it will be Halo 3 announcement trailer tendencies all over again when the game is finally out. I doubt people will really care though, if the game is good.

 

[Princess Carl]

xxjuicesxx stop making a fool of yourself. You clearly have no idea how console development operates. Take for instance (gonna get shit for even mentioning this name :lol) Uncharted 1 to Uncharted 2 on the PS3? Lost Planet 1 to Resident Evil 5? Massive improvements. I expect the same from Halo Reach (hopefully?).

Console development starts out using the basics, and then after devs are comfortable with the system they start to squeeze it for everything its worth. Depending on developer talent, you'll see almost a generational leap in quality or just better IQ.

not to mention this time around the extra RAM they are getting to use with the new DEV kits.

I'm certain it will be Halo 3 announcement trailer tendencies all over again when the game is finally out. I doubt people will really care though, if the game is good.

I am hoping that they received this backlash and did something about it. I would love to think that saw that and were determined to shut the nay sayers up this time around.

I can only hope

 

[adamsapple]

Yes but that was back when coders were piecing together things by themselves. A lot more today is just copy paste of already working stuff.

Don't reinvent the wheel and such.

Trends. Lol.

What was the last sequel you played on the same console hardware ? I would really like to know that.

 

[The Wise Old Man]

Not here to troll, but I'm a little let down that we're apparently not going to be playing with MC's squad of Spartans. "Fall of Reach" details some incredible stuff and it's a same that we'll only see it in a peripheral sense if we're lucky. How about MC's squad of Spartans flying through space trying to land on the Covenant carrier? Give the people what they want, Bungie!

That having been said, this still looks like an awesome game.

 

[TheOddOne]

Yes but that was back when coders were piecing together things by themselves. A lot more today is just copy paste of already working stuff.

Don't reinvent the wheel and such.

Trends. Lol.

And you know this how?

So Bungie aint doing anything to optimize their code? Well you must know that right, you work for Bungie... ehhhh

 

[Dabanton]

Damm. xxjuicesxx got rushed. :lol

 

[Kitschkraft]

Correct. You won't be playing as the Master Chief

Interesting, is it possible for him to make an appearance? I don't know Halo timeline that well.

 

[xxjuicesxx]

And you know this how?

So Bungie aint doing anything to optimize their code? Well you must know that right, you work for Bungie... ehhhh

No I know this because thats how programming is working these days. Before there was so many languages everyone was trying new things. Things have settled down you use a lot more work thats already there. I don't even program and I know this. I'm not saying anything about Bungie doing this, they probably are though as most programmers do.

And yes you can optimize but there is in fact a fucking wall, and you will need new hardware, its just simple you need more power to push more whatever the fucks(pixels, freepoints, I don't fucking know what they are called) in games. And its already needed. Go play Halo 3 and shoot a bunch of shit and throw some equipment down. It halts to a fucking standstill.

 

[The Librarian]

Interesting, is it possible for him to make an appearance? I don't know Halo timeline that well.

Depends on when the game takes place. If the game takes place when the Covenant first attack Reach (disabling the UNSC's extraterrestial defenses and weapons platforms and the simultaneous ground assualt) then no. If the game takes place when the UNSC is forced to retreat, leaving their ground forces on the planet (i.e., the book "First Strike), then, yes, it's a possibility.

It looks like the game takes place during the latter, so it's possible.

 

[The Wise Old Man]

No I know this because thats how programming is working these days. Before there was so many languages everyone was trying new things. Things have settled down you use a lot more work thats already there. I don't even program and I know this. I'm not saying anything about Bungie doing this, they probably are though as most programmers do.

In other news, I don't even drive a car but I consider myself highly qualified to lecture others on how to navigate the Autobahn.

 

[NemesisPrime]

Damm. xxjuicesxx got rushed. :lol

He should get banned... Nobody can be that ignorant on purpose.

 

[ChairmanMeow]

Stuff.

Is he. . . is this guy for real?

 

[infinityBCRT]

Wow this thread is a mess. And :lol at godhandiscen serious business indeed.

Move over MGS4 thread, theres a new champion...

 

[xxjuicesxx]

He should get banned... Nobody can be that ignorant on purpose.

Dude I'm not wrong lol.

Greater graphics require greater hardware. This is a fact. Maybe not one or two iterations in but you WILL need greater hardware.

I'm guessing you all play Crysis on High on your Voodoo 2's right?

 

[feel]

A friend remade the remix to be more awesome.

:lol :lol Brilliant!

I WANT ANIMATION IN MY AVATAR!

can someone who is way more gifted than I make an avatar from 1:10-1:12 in the trailer?

This one from my avatar gifs post is still available I think

also

or more similar to your current avatar

I have done a total revamp of the OP. Hope you guys like it. I will be keeping it updated as new info comes in. =)

Sweet!

 

[tahrikmili]

Move over MGS4 thread, theres a new champion...

Holy shit that JPG is AWESOME.

 

[Shake Appeal]

Console games generally tend to improve over the course of a generation as teams and studios get a better handle on the hardware and how to eke the best results out of it.

There are limits, of course, and this Reach trailer far surpasses the 360's limitations. As DigitalFoundry said, the trailer is likely rendered at a very high resolution with maxed-out AA/AF, then later scaled down to 720p. And there also may well be post-processing effects (film grain, additional blurring on edges) that will not be present in gameplay. Simply put, the clarity and crispness on the edges of things (there is no aliasing present, virtually none), and also the clarity and crispness of dynamic lighting/shadowing, is impossible on this or any other current-gen console, and on most PCs.

That's not to say Reach won't look better than Halo 3 (God, I'd be disgusted if it didn't), but it will not, indeed can not, look as good as it does in this "in-engine" cutscene.

 

[∀ Narayan]

Move over MGS4 thread, theres a new champion...

Disagree.

 

[Falagard]

No I know this because thats how programming is working these days. Before there was so many languages everyone was trying new things. Things have settled down you use a lot more work thats already there. I don't even program and I know this. I'm not saying anything about Bungie doing this, they probably are though as most programmers do.

And yes you can optimize but there is in fact a fucking wall, and you will need new hardware, its just simple you need more power to push more whatever the fucks(pixels, freepoints, I don't fucking know what they are called) in games. And its already needed. Go play Halo 3 and shoot a bunch of shit and throw some equipment down. It halts to a fucking standstill.

You need to open up your eyes, juices. Game programmers are constantly experimenting and using new techniques to games look better and run faster, use less memory, make better use of existing hardware. You're deluded if you think that programmers have "settled down" and "copy and paste" and aren't doing crazy things with the 360 hardware to squeeze more power of the system.

There is a wall - a point where not much else can be done with the hardware, but we haven't hit it yet. In the last year we've seen games release with screen space ambient occlusion and sparse virtual textures, both of which increase the graphical fidelity as well as use less memory than previous techniques. (SSAO can allow developers to use lower resolution lightmaps and still get nice looking lighting making better use of memory, and sparse virtual textures load only the textures that are required into memory, allowing developers to display higher resolution textures of only what is needed).

As others have pointed out, Gears 2, Mass Effect 2, Left 4 Dead 2, etc. all look better on the same hardware.

Pull your head out of your ass, you sound like an ignorant dick.

 

[Shake Appeal]

It's like you guys have already forgotten:

 

[Jinjo]

One thing i am disappointed with is the "new guy" shit again.

I think a really cool idea would have been to been able to pick any of the spartans in the squad and have personalized objectives throughout the campaign. Now granted if any of them die during the campaign i could see this idea sucking. But it would have been an interesting take that could have really diversified the story.

Me too. I don't want to play as a pansy-ass Spartan-III. Even though he is the (almost) sole survivor of some fucked up epic battle.:lol

Choosing your own spartan is a great idea. Give each their own traits. Think along the lines of giving Skullface a knife melee attack or something. (it would be a waste not to)

I am already getting a sort of ODST vibe with the different spartan's each having their own speciality. I am assuming this from one spartan loading his sniper, Skullface with the knife and Jorge having the biggest baddest armor, so he has to be the demolitions guy, right? Let's hope they expand upon it more than just different starting weapons as in ODST.

 

[scently]

Sweet! [/QUOTE]
Taken, thanks

 

[xxjuicesxx]

You need to open up your eyes, juices. Game programmers are constantly experimenting and using new techniques to games look better and run faster, use less memory, make better use of existing hardware. You're deluded if you think that programmers have "settled down" and "copy and paste" and aren't doing crazy things with the 360 hardware to squeeze more power of the system.

There is a wall - a point where not much else can be done with the hardware, but we haven't hit it yet. In the last year we've seen games release with screen space ambient occlusion and sparse virtual textures, both of which increase the graphical fidelity as well as use less memory than previous techniques. (SSAO can allow developers to use lower resolution lightmaps and still get nice looking lighting making better use of memory, and sparse virtual textures load only the textures that are required into memory, allowing developers to display higher resolution textures of only what is needed).

As others have pointed out, Gears 2, Mass Effect 2, Left 4 Dead 2, etc. all look better on the same hardware.

Pull your head out of your ass, you sound like an ignorant dick.

I'm not saying they dont expirement and do new techniques. I'm saying theres a lot more using other work these days. A new engine is a lot less NEW in this respect than the older new engines.

As for the 360, they seem to be closing in on the wall. I do not believe Reach would be able to look and play like that on a 360.

And no reason to call people ignorant dicks, especially when they are trying to explain things and are right in a way.

 

[StUnNeR H2K]

The difference in Halo CE vs Halo 2 was a big difference... Yes the Halo 2 that was shown at E3 early was different then the Halo 2 we actually got, but still the final Halo 2 product improved upon Halo CE.

It shouldn't be a suprise to expect the same improvement from Halo: Reach that we got with Halo 2 (graphically). If anyone remembers the PAX Panel on ODST, Bungie mentioned some of the changes they made in ODST to improve the lighting/effects. They were limited in ODST to the changes since it was the Halo 3 engine, but they mention that Reach will have improvements since it is a new engine (fyi new engine means they didn't copy paste the old one onto a new game disc).

For those that missed the Bungie PAX Panel: HERE

 

[Talon]

And no reason to call people ignorant dicks, especially when they are trying to explain things and are right in a way.

You get no bones for poorly reasoned and badly written arguments, especially when you say something as silly as this:

On the same hardware. Newer versions NEVER do. FACT!

 

[Thermite]

It's like you guys have already forgotten:

[/QUOTE]

While it's true that Bungie failed to deliver on what we all thought the final game was going to look like going off the Halo 3 E306 trailer, it was also Bungie's first experience developing a game on the 360 hardware. No doubt a good majority of it was foreign, which could explain why, at one time, they thought they could deliver on the visuals shown there but eventually didn't. Reach, however, is going to be their [I]third[/I] developed game on the 360. By this point, they should know what does and doesn't work, and just how far they can push the hardware.

With a new engine taking advantage of the 360's power, in ways they may have not known how to in Halo 3, I think it's possible the visuals of Reach will come very, very close to what we all saw (AA, aside).