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Hillary's promise about troops in Syria & Iraq. Is it a promise she can keep?

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She said that we wouldn't commit to ground troops last night. Which is wholly separate from an invasion, suggesting that we wouldn't even do the bare minimum in lending ground support to Syria (in an effort to keep soldiers from being killed).

Which 1) ignores the situation today and 2) is apparently not recommended

Today, she said that she "meant" that we wouldn't invade Syria (or however you want to characterize "invasion"), which suggests that keeping troops off the ground is totally off the table (something I was for). Added to the fact that she said that her plan is to "intensify" what we are currently doing.

So she's not going to invade Syria because of Iraq? Great! Neither would anyone else in the world. But last night she suggested that we wouldn't even do much less than that....but today she's saying that the "far less" option is something we would actually do.

Comparing her statements last night to that of today, they are two completely different things.

Bro. Reading is fundamental. They are not two different things. Like, I don't even know where you're getting this from. Like...I'm legitimately confused here on how you could possibly come up with that based on what she said.

Last night, she said:

We have to defeat ISIS. That is my highest counterterrorism goal. And we’ve got to do it with air power. We’ve got to do it with much more support for the Arabs and the Kurds who will fight on the ground against ISIS. We have to squeeze them by continuing to support the Iraqi military. They’ve taken back Ramadi, Fallujah. They’ve got to hold them. They’ve got to now get into Mosul.

We’re going to work to make sure that they have the support — they have special forces, as you know, they have enablers, they have surveillance, intelligence, reconnaissance help.

They are not going to get ground troops. We are not putting ground troops into Iraq ever again. And we’re not putting ground troops into Syria. We’re going to defeat ISIS without committing American ground troops. So those are the kinds of decisions we have to make on a case-by-case basis.

Which is, again, exactly what she said today! There is no divergence here. She is saying she will not send ground troops into Syria, but what we're doing now with on the ground support is absolutely fine. We will continue the air strikes and helping our allies in the region. Again, this is exactly what she said last night, and what she's been saying the entire campaign season.

Honestly, I don't know how to engage with you on this because I have no idea what you're trying to say...other than Hillary said something so SOMETHING must be bad here! It's there! Somewhere! Believe me! She's lying bigly!
 
Last night:

They are not going to get ground troops. We are not putting ground troops into Iraq ever again. And we’re not putting ground troops into Syria. We’re going to defeat ISIS without committing American ground troops

Today:

I think putting a big contingent of American ground troops on the ground in Iraq and Syria would not be in the best interest of the fight against ISIS and other terrorist groups.

Last night:

We’re going to work to make sure that they have the support — they have special forces, as you know, they have enablers, they have surveillance, intelligence, reconnaissance help.

Today:

However, I’ve been very clear, and I said this again last night, I support the air campaign. I support special forces. I support enablers. I support surveillance, intelligence and reconnaissance.

Last night:

We've got to do it with much more support for the Arabs and the Kurds who will fight on the ground against ISIS. We have to squeeze them by continuing to support the Iraqi military. They’ve taken back Ramadi, Fallujah. They’ve got to hold them. They’ve got to now get into Mosul.

Today:

I will absolutely be prepared to do whatever is necessary to support the Arab and Kurdish fighters on the ground to take out as much of the infrastructure of ISIS from the air

Last night:

And as part of it, we’re going after Baghdadi, the leader, because it will help us focus our attention, just like going after bin Laden helped us focus our attention in the fight against Al Qaida in the Afghanistan- Pakistan theater.

Today:

... to go after Baghdadi, as I said today, with a very focused commitment to taking him off the battlefield.

Show me how there is any difference between last night and tonight!
 

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
So here's the press conference (the relevant part):



So basically she was lying (or at least trying to make her plan more appealing): saying one thing to a much bigger audience of viewers and then completely backing off of the statement when pressed to explain herself. Not a single media outlet took her words last night to mean an invasion -- what she's saying here.

One of the worst mistakes you can make is to think that somebody is playing 4-dimensional chess when they are being rhetorically inconsistent or unclear. Lauer spent a third of her time on emails last night and spent the last 20 minutes asking her to be brief and to speed it up. She clarified within 24 hours. That's what you need to know.
 

Alucrid

Banned
why is every mimic hillary thread a backfire followed by his slow attempt to claw his way to some semblance of a rational point. it's like the trump campaign. you keep on expecting some improvement and yet they continue to be unable to deliver
 

Quixzlizx

Member
I think some of the Busters/Steiners would burst a blood vessel if they knew how many countries the US has special forces operating in.

It's either naivety or outright lying/trolling to claim that special forces being active in Syria = HILLARY LIED PEOPLE DIED.

I guess they're so focused on the drone strikes in Pakistan to realize we've already "committed ground troops" to take out Osama?
 

MIMIC

Banned
adam387: Well if I'm misunderstanding Hillary's position (which I might be), then maybe I'm wrong here. The way she described her position yesterday (which is why I agreed with her) and the way she's describing it today is still confusing to me.
 
adam387: Well if I'm misunderstanding Hillary's position (which I might be), then maybe I'm wrong here. The way she described her position yesterday (which is why I agreed with her) and the way she's describing it today is still confusing to me.

He just broke down a list of yesterday and today's clarification. What is confusing to you? Specifically, what is confusing to you?
 

pigeon

Banned
adam387: Well if I'm misunderstanding Hillary's position (which I might be), then maybe I'm wrong here. The way she described her position yesterday (which is why I agreed with her) and the way she's describing it today is still confusing to me.

Have you considered reading the NPR source you quoted? It makes the distinction pretty clear and notes that it's identical to the distinction Obama, and the Pentagon, make.

She said that we wouldn't commit to ground troops last night. Which is wholly separate from an invasion, suggesting that we wouldn't even do the bare minimum in lending ground support to Syria (in an effort to keep soldiers from being killed).

You seem to not know what the phrase "ground troops" means. I am guessing that is part of your confusion here.
 
adam387: Well if I'm misunderstanding Hillary's position (which I might be), then maybe I'm wrong here. The way she described her position yesterday (which is why I agreed with her) and the way she's describing it today is still confusing to me.
You can call me Adam. :)

And, it's the same position. Ground troops has traditionally meant things such as infantry, Marines, tanks, whatever. That's "boots on the ground." What we have now is not considered ground forces. Her position is 100% consistent with not only last night, but what she said throughout the primary and before.
 

MIMIC

Banned
Have you considered reading the NPR source you quoted? It makes the distinction pretty clear and notes that it's identical to the distinction Obama, and the Pentagon, make.



You seem to not know what the phrase "ground troops" means. I am guessing that is part of your confusion here.

No, that's not what was confusing me. What was confusing me was whether or not she was saying that she would put U.S. forces on the ground in head-to-head combat with ISIS (instead of simply arming/aiding the locals). She said she wouldn't do that, which is what I originally agreed with.

Today, I got the impression that she was backing off of that claim, sending an even more aggressive message (she even said that she wanted to "intensify" our approach....or maybe someone can clarify what she meant by that)....but at the same time, still no ground troops. Seem a little hard for me to believe. Last night was a less aggressive policy, but today's is the opposite to me.

I just don't get the same unequivocal message as last night.
 
No, that's not what was confusing me. What was confusing me was whether or not she was saying that she would put U.S. forces on the ground in head-to-head combat with ISIS (instead of simply arming/aiding the locals). She said she wouldn't do that, which is what I originally agreed with.

Today, I got the impression that she was backing off of that claim, sending an even more aggressive message (she even said that she wanted to "intensify" our approach....or maybe someone can clarify what she meant by that)....but at the same time, still no ground troops. Seem a little hard for me to believe. Last night was a less aggressive policy, but today's is the opposite to me.

I just don't get the same unequivocal message as last night.

I mean, I don't know what to tell you. It's the exact same message. There is, literally, nothing different. The questions were slightly different, but the answer was the same.

But, again, no t no shade, but this is kind of indicitive of what a lot of people mean when they're a little (overly) critical of your posts. Instead of getting a grasp on what she's saying, there's an automatic assumption that she's doing something nefarious or bad, or she's straight up lying. There's room for discussion, but not when you approach every, single issue as "Hillary is somehow wrong/lying on this!" and then work backwards to make the facts fit that story.

Again, not being shady.
 

MIMIC

Banned
I mean, I don't know what to tell you. It's the exact same message. There is, literally, nothing different. The questions were slightly different, but the answer was the same.

But, again, no t no shade, but this is kind of indicitive of what a lot of people mean when they're a little (overly) critical of your posts. Instead of getting a grasp on what she's saying, there's an automatic assumption that she's doing something nefarious or bad, or she's straight up lying. There's room for discussion, but not when you approach every, single issue as "Hillary is somehow wrong/lying on this!" and then work backwards to make the facts fit that story.

Again, not being shady.

OK, just to be clear, what exactly is she promising? No ground head-to-head combat against ISIS at ALL; or no large, 2003-style ground invasion.
 
OK, just to be clear, what exactly is she promising? No ground head-to-head combat against ISIS at ALL; or no large, 2003-style ground invasion.
The two things are identical. There is no difference, really, between them.

There will be no ground troops in Syria. Special ops, intelligence, training/support for the fighters (Kurds, specifically) are fair game. These are not considered an invasion force or ground troops or boots on the ground.

Her entire position is that sending in American troops a la Iraq would be exactly what ISIS wants. It would legitimize them and it would help their overall message. (Besides being ineffective).

So, again, her position is exactly what she said

No ground troops in Syria.
 

Xe4

Banned
No, that's not what was confusing me. What was confusing me was whether or not she was saying that she would put U.S. forces on the ground in head-to-head combat with ISIS (instead of simply arming/aiding the locals). She said she wouldn't do that, which is what I originally agreed with.

Today, I got the impression that she was backing off of that claim, sending an even more aggressive message (she even said that she wanted to "intensify" our approach....or maybe someone can clarify what she meant by that)....but at the same time, still no ground troops. Seem a little hard for me to believe. Last night was a less aggressive policy, but today's is the opposite to me.

I just don't get the same unequivocal message as last night.

So right now, Obama has been taking a more hands on approach to Syria and Iraq. This is after moths and months of him not doing much and the region spiraling out of control. Without a doubt the way Obama handled Syria is his biggest foreign policy disaster, because whilst bloodshed and destruction of the country was inevitable, it is possible with a more hands on approach a change of government could have happened. It wouldn't have been perfect, think Libya, but it would've been a hell of a lot better than it is now. Or maybe not, it's hard to tell. Certainly, Russia took more offense to the idea of NATO in Syria than in Libya. It's possible the blowback would've made something equally messed up, but in a different way. All I know is Obama made the wrong choice, but what exactly the right choice was we will probably never know.

The last year or so Obama has been working more with the Syrian Democratic Forces (AKA the Kurds) in order to fight ISIS, whilst not doing much to extend the fight. The SDF don't really care about an overthrow of the Assad regime, nor about fighting them outside of their borders. Why would they spend the effort when it would likely backfire and bite them in the ass? The US is also somewhat backing the Free Syrian Army and affiliated groups, which are Sunni with the primary objective trying to overthrow the Assad regime, but also fighting ISIS as a secondary objective. We're not helping them as much as the SDF, because it's hard to direct funds to them without having it end up in the hands of terrorists, given how fucked the situation is. It's tricky to say the least.

Clinton is more aggressive than Obama on foreign policy, although people often exaggerate that to an extreme degree. Her plan for Syria is to weaken the Assad regime by implementing a no fly zone (with the added benefit that they are less likely to drop poison gas on certain cities, and glass others), and fund groups fighting ISIS even more than Obama so that their territory continues to shrink. This includes sending people to train the SDF and FSA, as well as supplying arms, and rarely having special operatives lead offensives.

What she is absolutely NOT going to do is send a large influx (say 1,000+) of troops to either Iraq and Syria. Even if she wanted to (which she doesn't), it would be supremely unpopular, and for good reason. We just got out of Iraq, are currently in Afghanistan, and certainly don't want to make the clusterfuck of Syria wholly our problem. Russia tried that and it backfired in their face hard. It is incredibly obtuse to say there are ground forces already in Syria, because under that definition, there would be ground troops in dozens of countries. When referring to ground troops, it is meant an invasion, ala Iraq, and Afghanistan.

Keep in mind, the entirety of the post I just wrote is a very simplified version of what is going on right now. The whole thing, including America's policy is a mess, and no matter what direction taken, Syria will not be resolved in the near future. Honestly, I can unfortunately see the country being stuck in a state of perpetual warfare for years and years to come. There are too many forces that all want different things, and so nobody gets what they want, and all the while innocents die. It's terribly fucked, but there is no easy out.
 

MIMIC

Banned
The two things are identical. There is no difference, really, between them.

There will be no ground troops in Syria. Special ops, intelligence, training/support for the fighters (Kurds, specifically) are fair game. These are not considered an invasion force or ground troops or boots on the ground.

Her entire position is that sending in American troops a la Iraq would be exactly what ISIS wants. It would legitimize them and it would help their overall message. (Besides being ineffective).

So I'm reading more about what these special ops guys are doing and apparently their job is a lot more involved than it's being made out to be:

The U.S. special operation forces headed to Iraq won't be sitting on the sidelines in the fight against ISIS — they'll be in combat, a top military official said Wednesday.

"A raid is a combat operation, there's no way around that,"
said Colonel Steve Warren, the Baghdad-based spokesman for the Combined Joint Task Force-Operation Inherent Resolve. "So yeah, more Americans will be coming here to Iraq and some of them will be conducting raids inside of both Iraq and Syria."

[...]

Earlier, NBC News reported that the force would be permanently based in Iraq and consist of 100 to 150 special operations forces that would conduct ground combat raids against ISIS targets in both Iraq and Syria.
NBC News

So correct me if I'm wrong, but is this in line with what Hillary is saying/advocating? Because I specifically asked about ANY ground troops in Syria/Iraq (meaning a small number of forces) vs. a large-scale operation . And you said that they're the same thing (that neither is going to happen), yet this NBC report says otherwise (if I'm understanding it correctly).

I mean, I specifically asked whether there would be ANY head-to-head combat against ISIS on the ground, and not to say that you were skirting the issue, but you equated that to an "invasion." But that's not what I was asking.
 
Today on GAF, MIMIC learns that special operation troops (Delta/Seal Teams/Rangers + a whole lot of other divisions) are used in combat operations.
 

atr0cious

Member
Bill O'Reilly used almost this exact talking point today in his show while discussing how wrong HIllary was in her ISIS policy.
 

AlphaDump

Gold Member
adam387: Well if I'm misunderstanding Hillary's position (which I might be), then maybe I'm wrong here. The way she described her position yesterday (which is why I agreed with her) and the way she's describing it today is still confusing to me.

Can you point out from a Hilary quote what is specifically confusing you?
 

pigeon

Banned
I don't understand your desire to keep rephrasing the topic, frankly.

There is a category of American soldier that the Pentagon defines as "ground troops."

Clinton committed to not sending members of that category to Syria.

What part of that isn't clear?
 

Lime

Member
She can still keep on bombing with drones and doing air strikes and send in tons of weapons into a region and destabilize political systems without having "ground forces" and keeping her promise.

So basically what the US has always and still does
 

MIMIC

Banned
So you just learned what special ops are and that's causing the confusion?

Okay.

Well I asked you specifically you whether she was promising "No ground head-to-head combat against ISIS at ALL."

Anyway, I overlooked a post here that probably clarified things the most for me:

Yeah her statement is accurate if you use the military definition of "boots on the ground" which generally does not inclusive special forces or trainers even if they are expected to be in combat.
 

pigeon

Banned
Well I asked you specifically you whether she was promising "No ground head-to-head combat against ISIS at ALL."

Anyway, I overlooked a post here that probably clarified things the most for me:

Not to mention my first post in this thread which explained the same topic, or, you know, the SOURCES YOU CITED IN YOUR ORIGINAL POST which also explain this distinction.

Why link an article you didn't read?
 
Well I asked you specifically you whether she was promising "No ground head-to-head combat against ISIS at ALL."
Because no one knows what you mean by "head-to-head" combat! If you want that very specific question answered you're going to have to ask her directly, and you're going to get the same answer she's already given because the answer is no. No. Ground. Troops. In. Syria.

There are special ops and intelligence people on the ground in Syria. These. Are. Not. Ground. Troops. These special ops people are not considered "ground troops" or "boots on the ground." They work with the local militias and troops to help them take back territory and to provide intelligence services.

Edit: This was posted before your edit.
 

Laughing Banana

Weeping Pickle
Man... It seems so exhausting posting anything that may be viewed as against Hillary these days in GAF. There were so many quick 'hahaha the op is crazy' replies in the first page before people even try to seriously reply to his points.

I mean, even if MIMIC is known for his intense dislike towards Clinton, then so what? Are people like him immediately unable to ask questions and deserved to be mocked at without a chance to be heard in here? Should threads made by folks like him is suddenly immediately eligible to be bombarded with 'lol op' posts that spared no effort whatsoever in trying to discuss his concerns? If he's wrong, he's wrong, but don't just mock him relentlessly without bothering to at least respond constructively to his points.

Damn.
 

pigeon

Banned
Man... It seems so exhausting posting anything that may be viewed as against Hillary these days in GAF. There were so many quick 'hahaha the op is crazy' replies before people even try to seriously reply to his points.

I mean, even if MIMIC is known for his intense dislike towards Clinton, then so what? Are people like him immediately unable and deserved to be mocked at without a chance to be heard in here? Should threads made by folks like him is suddenly immediately eligible to be bombarded with 'lol op' posts that spared no effort whatsoever in trying to discuss his concerns. If he's wrong, he's wrong, but don't just mock him relentlessly without bothering to at least respond constructively to his points.

Damn.

In the spirit of this thread, I will ask you: why post in a thread if you're not willing to actually read it and understand what took place in it?
 
Man... It seems so exhausting posting anything that may be viewed as against Hillary these days in GAF. There were so many quick 'hahaha the op is crazy' replies in the first page before people even try to seriously reply to his points.

I mean, even if MIMIC is known for his intense dislike towards Clinton, then so what? Are people like him immediately unable to ask questions and deserved to be mocked at without a chance to be heard in here? Should threads made by folks like him is suddenly immediately eligible to be bombarded with 'lol op' posts that spared no effort whatsoever in trying to discuss his concerns? If he's wrong, he's wrong, but don't just mock him relentlessly without bothering to at least respond constructively to his points.

Damn.

because he's being willfully obtuse and ignorant on a thread he made.
 

Blader

Member
Man... It seems so exhausting posting anything that may be viewed as against Hillary these days in GAF. There were so many quick 'hahaha the op is crazy' replies in the first page before people even try to seriously reply to his points.

I mean, even if MIMIC is known for his intense dislike towards Clinton, then so what? Are people like him immediately unable to ask questions and deserved to be mocked at without a chance to be heard in here? Should threads made by folks like him is suddenly immediately eligible to be bombarded with 'lol op' posts that spared no effort whatsoever in trying to discuss his concerns? If he's wrong, he's wrong, but don't just mock him relentlessly without bothering to at least respond constructively to his points.

Damn.

He was constructively responded to and corrected on literally the first reply:

She mentioned during the press conference this morning that she supports special operation forces and handler/trainers. Her comments are purely pertaining to a large scale ground troop deployment ala Iraq 2003 and that is absolutely a promise she can keep.

Is it really everyone's fault that the next 80 posts had to be spent circling MIMIC back to this point?
 

MIMIC

Banned
Not to mention my first post in this thread which explained the same topic, or, you know, the SOURCES YOU CITED IN YOUR ORIGINAL POST which also explain this distinction.

Why link an article you didn't read?

My source doesn't say anything about special ops engaging in combat operations (which Pai Pai Master explained). It just says that special ops aren't considered ground troops.

And knowing what I know now, I'm very reluctant to even support this type of policy.

Help the locals. Give them intelligence. Arm them. That's all fine. But doing anything that puts them directly in harm's way, I not totally behind. Whether it's the ground troops, special ops, WHOEVER they may be. I am not really supportive of this policy.

No ground troops in combat missions but special ops in combat missions? That's not OK either.

(but to reiterate, she does appear to have been saying what she had said all along...but now that I completely understand what she meant, I disagree with it)
 

Alucrid

Banned
Man... It seems so exhausting posting anything that may be viewed as against Hillary these days in GAF. There were so many quick 'hahaha the op is crazy' replies in the first page before people even try to seriously reply to his points.

I mean, even if MIMIC is known for his intense dislike towards Clinton, then so what? Are people like him immediately unable to ask questions and deserved to be mocked at without a chance to be heard in here? Should threads made by folks like him is suddenly immediately eligible to be bombarded with 'lol op' posts that spared no effort whatsoever in trying to discuss his concerns? If he's wrong, he's wrong, but don't just mock him relentlessly without bothering to at least respond constructively to his points.

Damn.

i'm glad you found your own hillary
 
MIMIC is like one of these chest that look perfectly normal on the outside, but if one were to open it it'd only reveal the hideous beast inside ; something with a giant mouth and stupid teeth that will try to mindlessly fight everything in front of it.


Guys, please don't open the chest.

(but to reiterate, she does appear to have been saying what she had said all along...but now that I completely understand what she meant, I disagree with it)
XszJzQt.jpg
 
MIMIC is like one of these chest that look perfectly normal on the outside, but if one were to open it it'd only reveal the hideous beast inside ; something with a giant mouth and stupid teeth that will try to mindlessly fight everything in front of it.


Guys, please don't open the chest.

This isn't needed.

I obviously disagree with MIMIC on quite a few issues. But if there's not going to be a legitimate effort to engage, then just maybe roll your eyes and keep scrolling. But, that's just me so you do you!
 
This isn't needed.

I obviously disagree with MIMIC on quite a few issues. But if there's not going to be a legitimate effort to engage, then just maybe roll your eyes and keep scrolling. But, that's just me so you do you!

Well actually I think it is, this particular election has been flooded with post/threads like those everywhere on the internet where one guy comes in and say "look !!! hillary has done the thing again !!! she is an x and a y" when this person hasn't a clue of what he's saying and is talking about a matter he didn't even bother doing proper research on.

So yeah, I get the lack of patience from others and myself as facing another saddening attempt to take a blow at Clinton.
 
Well actually I think it is, this particular election has been flooding with post/threads like those everywhere on the internet where one guy comes in and say "look !!! hillary has done the thing again !!! she is an x and a y" when this person hasn't a clue of what he's saying and is talking about a matter he didn't even bother doing proper research on.

So yeah, I get the lack of patience from others and myself as facing another saddening attempt to take a blow at Clinton.

Like, believe me? I get that. I've been a Hillary supporter since 2008. I've dealt with this shit for years now. And, I agree, it's annoying as hell that everything she says is warped and twisted and whatever. I dealt with it in 2008. I dealt with it in the primaries in 2016. I'll deal with it during the GE like we are now. I've been knocking on doors for Hillary since before a lot of people on Gaf could probably vote. This shit riles me up too something fierce.

I still think engaging in good faith is better than just reading. The latter is a lot more rewarding, but I guess my goal is not to just get people to stop their quote unquote bad or underinformed behavior, but to actually try and change someone's mind.

It's probably naive on my part, but it's what I think we should try to do!
 
Well actually I think it is, this particular election has been flooding with post/threads like those everywhere on the internet where one guy comes in and say "look !!! hillary has done the thing again !!! she is an x and a y" when this person hasn't a clue of what he's saying and is talking about a matter he didn't even bother doing proper research on.

So yeah, I get the lack of patience from others and myself as facing another saddening attempt to take a blow at Clinton.

I can sort of see both sides. On one hand, it's certainly obnoxious seeing thread_345 of "Hillary is LYING about <x>" ... "Oh, I guess she's not lying, but I disagree with her!"

On the other hand, while Mimic might be the first person to immediately scurry down a never-ending rabbit hole the moment a Clinton smell is in the air, he's certainly not the only one. If even one person in the audience learns something about a technical definition that provides an important distinction or a lesson about actual government, then at least something was accomplished via engaging in good faith and taking things at face value.
 

MIMIC

Banned
Well actually I think it is, this particular election has been flooded with post/threads like those everywhere on the internet where one guy comes in and say "look !!! hillary has done the thing again !!! she is an x and a y" when this person hasn't a clue of what he's saying and is talking about a matter he didn't even bother doing proper research on.

So yeah, I get the lack of patience from others and myself as facing another saddening attempt to take a blow at Clinton.

So if I don't understand the situation from top to bottom (and ask for clarification), it's damning of an inability to do proper research? I'll remember that the next time I have something to say about Hillary.
 
So if I don't understand the situation from top to bottom (and ask for clarification), it's damning of an inability to do proper research? I'll remember that the next time I have something to say about Hillary.
You don't need to understand the situation from top to bottom, just read the article you posted next time?

Dude you can say whatever you want on this website, just be factual.
 
So if I don't understand the situation from top to bottom (and ask for clarification), it's damning of an inability to do proper research? I'll remember that the next time I have something to say about Hillary.

Please, you only need to read your last posts to know what you did wrong.
You went in with assuming you knew better, you went in disregarding what you knew you should have watched or read, you went in to disdain not to debate.

If "clarification" is really what you're after, then you're going to need some serious work about how you have to present the ideas you want to argue about -- don't come biting, and no one will bite you back.
 

Blader

Member
So if I don't understand the situation from top to bottom (and ask for clarification), it's damning of an inability to do proper research? I'll remember that the next time I have something to say about Hillary.

You didn't start the thread asking for clarification, you started the thread saying that Hillary was lying about her troop strategy for Syria to win votes.
 
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