How's Ms. Marvel's Popularity in the comics community?

Athreous

Athreous

Member
Hello, GAF!

I vaguely know Ms. Marvel... I remember a friend talking about her (when she was Carol Denvers) and he really liked her, but now she has a new backstory origin, and he hates it... So I'm wondering if her inclusion in the comics was something natural or forced by some kind of global agenda...
 
Athreous said:
Hello, GAF!

I vaguely know Ms. Marvel... I remember a friend talking about her (when she was Carol Denvers) and he really liked her, but now she has a new backstory origin, and he hates it... So I'm wondering if her inclusion in the comics was something natural or forced by some kind of global agenda...
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Yes. A different character whose identity (female and Muslim) is totally not possible in the US... Therefore, it's forced and part of an agenda by globalists... Despite her being an all-american girl who loves all the typical American things and stans Captain Marvel Carol Danvers.


ETA: I really like her comics. Mostly all the stories written by G. Willow Wilson
 
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It's an entirely new character, right?

The Captain Marvel name is just a title really. So it's what everyone says they want versus altering an establish character to "add diversity". All I know about her was from playing the first 30 min of the Marvel game she is in. Seems young to be out fighting people to the death but thems comics!
 
Nobody cares about that tokenized failure of a Muslim superhero. Sales are abyssal (some issues don't even manage sell 1.5k books), the character cliché and the stories are badly written.
The comic has been cancelled multiple times, because nobody wants to read that crap. They tried rebooting it for almost a dozens times now and each time it just gets worse and worse...
 
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strange headache said:
Nobody cares about that tokenized failure of a Muslim superhero. Sales are abyssal (some issues don't even manage sell 1.5k books), the character cliché and the stories are badly written.
The comic has been cancelled multiple times, because nobody wants to read that crap. They tried rebooting it for almost a dozens times now and each time it just gets worse and worse...
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Proof? You just sound like an angry nerd who doesn't like anything not male centered
 
ManaByte said:
The first run of the comic was Marvel's best selling digital title ever and helped grow the move to ComiXology.
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He said abyssal as in they could fill an abyss, you are just reading abysmal because of your own prejudice and bias.
/s
 
DeafTourette said:
Proof? You just sound like an angry nerd who doesn't like anything not male centered
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The f*ck do you mean about proof? It's really not hard to look at sales numbers.

Comichron: January 2020 Comic Book Sales to Comics Shops

Estimated comic book and graphic novel sales to North American comic shops
www.comichron.com

3f0F6QW.png
 
I actually really like the Ms. Marvel comics (and Champions by extension.) Of the stuff I've read recently I prefer that team over the Avengers.
 
strange headache said:
The f*ck do you mean about proof? It's really not hard to look at sales numbers.

Comichron: January 2020 Comic Book Sales to Comics Shops

Estimated comic book and graphic novel sales to North American comic shops
www.comichron.com

3f0F6QW.png
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www.cbr.com

'Ms. Marvel' rockets to the #1 slot on Marvel's digital sales chart

www.cbr.com www.cbr.com

Ms Marvel #1 Has Sold More In Digital Than In Print Form

Ms Marvel recently went to its sixth printing, a rare accomplishment in comics today. But chatting with Marvel executives at San Diego Comic Con I
bleedingcool.com

Ms. Marvel Has Sold Half a Million Trade Paperbacks - Bleeding Cool

It's a handy stat for the solicitation of the tenth Ms. Marvel collection: in print collections alone, Ms. Marvel has sold half a million copies.
bleedingcool.com

The singles market has been dead for about a half decade. Digital and trade sales is where the money is now.
 
ManaByte said:
www.cbr.com

'Ms. Marvel' rockets to the #1 slot on Marvel's digital sales chart

www.cbr.com www.cbr.com

Ms Marvel #1 Has Sold More In Digital Than In Print Form

Ms Marvel recently went to its sixth printing, a rare accomplishment in comics today. But chatting with Marvel executives at San Diego Comic Con I
bleedingcool.com

Ms. Marvel Has Sold Half a Million Trade Paperbacks - Bleeding Cool

It's a handy stat for the solicitation of the tenth Ms. Marvel collection: in print collections alone, Ms. Marvel has sold half a million copies.
bleedingcool.com

The singles market has been dead for about a half decade. Digital and trade sales is where the money is now.
Click to expand...

With nine volumes published, that's around 60,000 copies of each on average.
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And that's their #1 digital comic?
What a joke... the desperation is real :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
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GLOBAL AGENDA

Seriously though, if anyone feels the character is somehow "unnatural" I would assume that they hold some really vulgar opinions on race and religion.
 
People will always try and point to sales to try and prove that Ms. Marvel is a failure. The problem with this is that Marvel keep doing new Ms Marvel books and put her in teams and other books with other characters. Why would Marvel be happy to burn money on Ms Marvel when they very clearly do cancel books that are actually failing?

Ms Marvel definitely is aimed at a younger audience who probably tend to lean towards digital purchases. We don't have digital sales numbers and we have no knowledge to how popular she is on Marvel Unlimited. Also, her collected edition books sell really really well.
 
sol_bad said:
People will always try and point to sales to try and prove that Ms. Marvel is a failure. The problem with this is that Marvel keep doing new Ms Marvel books and put her in teams and other books with other characters. Why would Marvel be happy to burn money on Ms Marvel when they very clearly do cancel books that are actually failing?

Ms Marvel definitely is aimed at a younger audience who probably tend to lean towards digital purchases. We don't have digital sales numbers and we have no knowledge to how popular she is on Marvel Unlimited. Also, her collected edition books sell really really well.
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She's very much the leader of the new set of books Marvel is running for the younger crowd.

She starts off as a fangirl, who accidentally gets her powers, after meeting a bunch of her heroes gets to join the Avengers, and realizes they do things different than she wants so she quits and makes a new team of younger heroes.

She has a great story and for the most part has done well so far.
 
Kagey K said:
She's very much the leader of the new set of books Marvel is running for the younger crowd.

She starts off as a fangirl, who accidentally gets her powers, after meeting a bunch of her heroes gets to join the Avengers, and realizes they do things different than she wants so she quits and makes a new team of younger heroes.

She has a great story and for the most part has done well so far.
Click to expand...

G Willow Wilson did an amazing volume 1, I legit teared up in those Last Days issues, so good. Wilson's volume 2 isn't as good but it's still high quality, I'm only about 15 issues into the volume though.
A few months ago I also started reading Champions and have really enjoyed her in that as well. Currently reading some bronze age stuff so will return to Champions at a later date.
 
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Why am I not surprised to see the usual Marvel consumer zombies rising up in this thread?

sol_bad said:
The problem with this is that Marvel keep doing new Ms Marvel books and put her in teams and other books with other characters.
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Yeah because her own books keep failing and need to be cancelled and rebooted time and time again.

sol_bad said:
Why would Marvel be happy to burn money on Ms Marvel when they very clearly do cancel books that are actually failing?
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Oh probably for the same reason why Amazon is screwing up LOTR, because ideology has become more important than good storytelling and making money.
 
Ideology is NOT more important than making money ... The FRAK?!? LMBO!

If the comic character is selling well digitally and is receiving lots of fan support, more digital than physical, in the age of COVID ... Which is when those sales posted were during... Then yeah... It's not ideology. They're in pursuit of dollars. And since her fans are younger, it stands to reason that digital would outpace physical.

But her trades are selling well. Which is true for a lot of characters nowadays. Trades over single issues.
 
Character was introduced long time ago. Before the MCU got popular. Was one of the most popular of many other "kid hero" spin-offs like Mastermind Excelo and Sentinel.

For us Muslims she is a mixed bag. stereotyping is still there and worse because it's promoted as an "authentic" depiction, and not the view of a liberal of South Asian background. worse when other white liberal writers handled her.
 
DeafTourette said:
Ideology is NOT more important than making money ... The FRAK?!? LMBO!
Click to expand...

Amazon's The Rings of Wokeness, Ghostbusters 2016, Dr. Who, Nu Trek, Batwhaman, Terminator Dark Fate, WW 1984, TLJ, Ocean's 8, Spielberg's massive flop West Side Story, MIB: International, Netflix' Cowboy Bebop, Captain Marvel...

Amiga said:
Stereotyping is still there and worse because it's promoted as an "authentic" depiction, and not the view of a liberal of South Asian background.
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That is probably the worst part, the depiction of her faith is very orthodox and does not fit modern liberal Muslims at all.
 
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I recall the character being introduced almost 10 years ago, maybe 2013? So before a lot of what people consider now is "woke" etc.

I also remember the initial series being well received, although I didnt read it myself.
 
DGrayson said:
I recall the character being introduced almost 10 years ago, maybe 2013? So before a lot of what people consider now is "woke" etc.

I also remember the initial series being well received, although I didnt read it myself.
Click to expand...

Wokness started out in comics before infecting gaming/movies and politics. Resulted in era of identity politics pandering and a hero replacement gimmick that had Thor, Cap, Iron Man, Hulk, Spider-Man (yes all of them) replaced one time or another by the designated oppressed groups. This heavy handed approach and disregard for actual focus on long running stories and history turned off long time readers. and then these critics got personally attacked as bigots/racists/xenophobes for their opinions. And then creators who objected to this woke trend got canceled and lost work at the big publishers. A consistent series of escalation.
This saga turned me off comics over a decade ago so I don't know what things look like today. But every time I peak in it looks worse.

Unlucky for Kamala khan, because she started out before all this with other expansion characters on side projects and was successful without replacing anybody in their own book. But unfortunately got dragged into identity politics later and it didn't help that her writer played it up.
 
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strange headache said:
Yeah man, such an upward trend that it got cancelled by issue 18 :messenger_tears_of_joy:
An upward trend from nothing is still nothing.
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This just proves you have no clue what you're talking about in regards to comics and are just in here to woke whine and troll. For at least the last six years or so Marvel only would allow a comic to go at most 18-20 issues, sometimes even 12, before being restarted with a fresh #1. It's chasing what's called "investment collectors" who only buy #1 issues and it's a way to artificially pad single issue sales, which have been dying in the age of digital and the popularity of trades. This DID receive a backlash and eventually, for longer running series, Marvel will add a secondary "Legacy" numbering on the cover. So it'll have the new #1 but then Legacy: with the number as it lines up with the comic's original run.
 
ManaByte said:
This just proves you have no clue what you're talking about in regards to comics and are just in here to woke whine and troll. For at least the last six years or so Marvel only would allow a comic to go at most 18-20 issues, sometimes even 12, before being restarted with a fresh #1. It's chasing what's called "investment collectors" who only buy #1 issues and it's a way to artificially pad single issue sales, which have been dying in the age of digital and the popularity of trades. This DID receive a backlash and eventually, for longer running series, Marvel will add a secondary "Legacy" numbering on the cover. So it'll have the new #1 but then Legacy: with the number as it lines up with the comic's original run.
Click to expand...

Animated GIF


On one hand it is just a kids comic, on the other it is serious investment collectors business.
The coping in this thread is real.
 
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strange headache said:
Animated GIF


On one hand it is just a kids comic, on the other it is serious investment collectors business.
The coping in this thread is real.
Click to expand...

It's not just Ms. Marvel. They do it with all of their titles. If you actually read comics or were at all familiar with what you're arguing against you'd know that. At this point you're just disingenuously trolling.
 
ManaByte said:
It's not just Ms. Marvel. They do it with all of their titles. If you actually read comics or were at all familiar with what you're arguing against you'd know that. At this point you're just disingenuously trolling.
Click to expand...
Marvel keeps cancelling their comic series in the middle of their frikkin' story lines to sell to a fringe market of collectors.
Are you for real? :messenger_tears_of_joy:
 
strange headache said:
Marvel keeps cancelling their comic series in the middle of their frikkin' story lines to sell to a fringe market of collectors.
Are you for real? :messenger_tears_of_joy:
Click to expand...

Again if you read comics you'd know this is how Marvel has been operating since around 2012 after DC's New 52's #1 relaunches overtook them on the charts. They had an obsession over having new #1s for each major character every year or so, which means shorter runs for series. Again, that's why they introduced the Legacy numbering on the comics.
 
ManaByte said:
Again if you read comics you'd know this is how Marvel has been operating since around 2012 after DC's New 52's #1 relaunches overtook them on the charts. They had an obsession over having new #1s for each major character every year or so, which means shorter runs for series. Again, that's why they introduced the Legacy numbering on the comics.
Click to expand...
Sure, that must be the reason why there hasn't been a new issue of Ms. Marvel since it got cancelled, they just want to sell more #1 issues... of which there are none.
I read comics, I'm just not a Marvel apostle like you.
 
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Amiga said:
Wokness started out in comics before infecting gaming/movies and politics. Resulted in era of identity politics pandering and a hero replacement gimmick that had Thor, Cap, Iron Man, Hulk, Spider-Man (yes all of them) replaced one time or another by the designated oppressed groups. This heavy handed approach and disregard for actual focus on long running stories and history turned off long time readers. and then these critics got personally attacked as bigots/racists/xenophobes for their opinions. And then creators who objected to this woke trend got canceled and lost work at the big publishers. A consistent series of escalation.
This saga turned me off comics over a decade ago so I don't know what things look like today. But every time I peak in it looks worse.

Unlucky for Kamala khan, because she started out before all this with other expansion characters on side projects and was successful without replacing anybody in their own book. But unfortunately got dragged into identity politics later and it didn't help that her writer played it up.
Click to expand...

Cap's mantle was handed down to Sam Wilson. People always say Bucky was Cap for a time but the mantle and shield weren't passed down to him... Cap was dead so he took it up himself. Steve GAVE the shield and mantle to Sam because Steve got old ... And Steve is still alive. And young again. He and Sam are BOTH co-Caps.

Mike Morales was a different universe Spider-Man. He became popular and is now in the main 616 universe WITH Peter Parker. The main 616 Parker never died and had his own series still ongoing alongside the Ultimate comics line with Miles.

Tony died and was later brought back. I'm spacing on her name but Iron Heart is her own character... Not a replacement for Tony. Just like War Machine wasn't a replacement for him... Even though he put on the IM armor when Tony was too drunk to be IM. And Iron Heart is also in universe along with Tony/Iron Man alive again.

The Mighty Thor wasn't a replacement FOR Thor Odinson. They both existed alongside each other. Thor lost his worthiness but regained it later on. Jane died and is now the new Valkyrie.

I didn't keep up with Hulk but there's multiple Hulks. Totally Awesome Hulk, I think, is still around while Bruce Banner's hulk is too... Along with Ross, Betsy and some others.

No one got replaced... At least not in the way you intimate in your post.
 
DeafTourette said:
Cap's mantle was handed down to Sam Wilson. People always say Bucky was Cap for a time but the mantle and shield weren't passed down to him... Cap was dead so he took it up himself. Steve GAVE the shield and mantle to Sam because Steve got old ... And Steve is still alive. And young again. He and Sam are BOTH co-Caps.

Mike Morales was a different universe Spider-Man. He became popular and is now in the main 616 universe WITH Peter Parker. The main 616 Parker never died and had his own series still ongoing alongside the Ultimate comics line with Miles.

Tony died and was later brought back. I'm spacing on her name but Iron Heart is her own character... Not a replacement for Tony. Just like War Machine wasn't a replacement for him... Even though he put on the IM armor when Tony was too drunk to be IM. And Iron Heart is also in universe along with Tony/Iron Man alive again.

The Mighty Thor wasn't a replacement FOR Thor Odinson. They both existed alongside each other. Thor lost his worthiness but regained it later on. Jane died and is now the new Valkyrie.

I didn't keep up with Hulk but there's multiple Hulks. Totally Awesome Hulk, I think, is still around while Bruce Banner's hulk is too... Along with Ross, Betsy and some others.

No one got replaced... At least not in the way you intimate in your post.
Click to expand...

Nothing organic. these were all editorial mandate storylines written for the propose of replacement done one after another. they kept talking about this in interviews, replacement was emphasized as a goal.
Sad part is there was no need for this. It gives the idea that a person of different ethnic background lives permanently under the shadow of others and only through them. Marvel had a few of the oldest independent original African heros in Luke Cage, who had the awesome title of Power Man, and Black Panther who had his own utopian country. They could have focused on building up with consistent A-list teams and important story arcs. But unfortunately Marvel chose the race baiting controversy game.
 
Amiga said:
Nothing organic. these were all editorial mandate storylines written for the propose of replacement done one after another. they kept talking about this in interviews, replacement was emphasized as a goal.
Sad part is there was no need for this. It gives the idea that a person of different ethnic background lives permanently under the shadow of others and only through them. Marvel had a few of the oldest independent original African heros in Luke Cage, who had the awesome title of Power Man, and Black Panther who had his own utopian country. They could have focused on building up with consistent A-list teams and important story arcs. But unfortunately Marvel chose the race baiting controversy game.
Click to expand...

BP had his own comic and so did Luke Cage.

Question, Robin taking up the mantle of Batman: good or bad?

Remember, Sam Wilson was Cap's partner and one of his best friends... Is THAT not organic?

Miles becoming the Ultimate universe's Spider-Man after their Parker was killed by Kingpin ... And now in the 616 universe SHARING the mantle with our Parker ... Is that not organic?

You keep saying replacement but for all intents and purposes, they ALL NOW exist alongside the originals. You'll have to link us to the interviews you mentioned.
 
I think the "passing of the torch" tactic would work better if there was a single narrative with no takesies backsies. Bilbo passes off Sting to Frodo and that's it. There are no more adventures of Bilbo alongside Frodo, instead of Frodo in an alt universe, or suddenly a Lady Bilbo (Bilba?) at times. Comic continuity is basically dogshit compared to almost any other medium which makes mantle passing always feel transient, a "throw ideas at the wall to see what sticks" ratings ploy, or susceptible to trendy blips that return to "normal" in time.
 
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jason10mm said:
I think the "passing of the torch" tactic would work better if there was a single narrative with no takesies backsies. Bilbo passes off Sting to Frodo and that's it. There are no more adventures of Bilbo alongside Frodo, instead of Frodo in an alt universe, or suddenly a Lady Bilbo (Bilba?) at times. Comic continuity is basically dogshit compared to almost any other medium which makes mantle passing always feel transient, a "throw ideas at the wall to see what sticks" ratings ploy, or susceptible to trendy blips that return to "normal" in time.
Click to expand...
That is why all of these multiverse shenanigans really suck from a narrative point of view. Nothing has real consequences anymore and no character is unique as they all have numerous others variants.
 
DeafTourette said:
Question, Robin taking up the mantle of Batman: good or bad?

Remember, Sam Wilson was Cap's partner and one of his best friends... Is THAT not organic?
Click to expand...
Batman will always be seen as Bruce Wayne. For the iconic characters no change would stick. white replacements didn't work, so that proves that replacements are not rejected because of race. Green Lantern and Flash also reverted after long stints with white replacements.
Reverting to the popular characters was always inevitable. only originals like Luke cage and System Shock are truly sustainable. Reminds me DC had Milestone comics, many original African characters that could be built up.
 
Amiga said:
Batman will always be seen as Bruce Wayne. For the iconic characters no change would stick. white replacements didn't work, so that proves that replacements are not rejected because of race. Green Lantern and Flash also reverted after long stints with white replacements.
Reverting to the popular characters was always inevitable. only originals like Luke cage and System Shock are truly sustainable. Reminds me DC had Milestone comics, many original African characters that could be built up.
Click to expand...

The milestone line is coming back but in the Dakota Universe... Not the main DC universe. So static, Icon, Blood Syndicate, etc are coming back. The only place where they exist WITH the DCU is on Young Justice.
 
Amiga said:
Green Lantern and Flash also reverted after long stints with white replacements.
Click to expand...

Excuse Me Reaction GIF by One Chicago


Dude, Jay Garrick being replaced by Barry Allen happened in the 50's and unless I missed something Jay has never returned to replace Barry and the other Flashes. And Green Lantern? There are tons of GLs and Earth itself has quite a few, and Alan Scott (the original) did not just come back and replace all of them.
 
Literally nobody I know in the comic world reads or cares about this character.

Marvel was (and still is to an extent) hiring people based on their identity politics and not their writing or editing skills for a bit there. Turns out, you can't sell books based on that alone. With the vast majority of these titles selling abysmally. Who'd have thought?

Many of these people had never read a single comic in their life and while the people they often write for are a vocal minority, they actually just like to complain about what sensibilities comics have traditionally appealed to. They don't give a fuck about the medium or any comics in particular.
 
strange headache said:
Sure, that must be the reason why there hasn't been a new issue of Ms. Marvel since it got cancelled, they just want to sell more #1 issues... of which there are none.
I read comics, I'm just not a Marvel apostle like you.
Click to expand...

I don't know how I missed this but... You DO realize you're wrong, right?

There's a new Ms. Marvel book out now... Started last September.

Ms. Marvel: Beyond the Limit
 
Amiga said:
Nothing organic. these were all editorial mandate storylines written for the propose of replacement done one after another. they kept talking about this in interviews, replacement was emphasized as a goal.
Sad part is there was no need for this. It gives the idea that a person of different ethnic background lives permanently under the shadow of others and only through them. Marvel had a few of the oldest independent original African heros in Luke Cage, who had the awesome title of Power Man, and Black Panther who had his own utopian country. They could have focused on building up with consistent A-list teams and important story arcs. But unfortunately Marvel chose the race baiting controversy game.
Click to expand...

People love to shit talk Ms Marvel and how she is apparently a failure. But ignore actual failures like Luke Cage and Blade.
There was a Power Man and Iron Fist comic that went for about 15 issues in 2016 and then a Luke Cage series that went for 10 issues in 2017 ........ and then nothing since.
Blade hasn't had a self titled book since 2006.

And just quickly on the topic of Iron Heart, people bitched, moaned and cried about her "replacing" Tony. But I didn't see anyone complaining about Dr Doom being Iron Man at the same time.

strange headache said:
Sure, that must be the reason why there hasn't been a new issue of Ms. Marvel since it got cancelled, they just want to sell more #1 issues... of which there are none.
I read comics, I'm just not a Marvel apostle like you.
Click to expand...

www.gamesradar.com

Kamala Khan returns to fight a "trench-coated loser" in Ms. Marvel - Beyond the Limit #1 preview

Kamala Khan goes to Bollywood in Ms. Marvel: Beyond the Limit
www.gamesradar.com www.gamesradar.com

As I've said a million times, you don't read comics, you read articles about hating comics.
 
strange headache said:
That is probably the worst part, the depiction of her faith is very orthodox and does not fit modern liberal Muslims at all.
Click to expand...
She says in all the comics that her family is very traditional and orthodox, she spends a lot of time fighting against it.

As a non muslim id like to hear more about specific things they got wrong.
Amiga said:
Batman will always be seen as Bruce Wayne. For the iconic characters no change would stick. white replacements didn't work, so that proves that replacements are not rejected because of race. Green Lantern and Flash also reverted after long stints with white replacements.
Reverting to the popular characters was always inevitable. only originals like Luke cage and System Shock are truly sustainable. Reminds me DC had Milestone comics, many original African characters that could be built up.
Click to expand...
After Nightfall batman had a long run where Bruce was out of action and Azreal and Dick both took the mantle. It worked fine.

In fact most people don't know that any Robin after the the late 80s wasn't Dick Grayson.




BossLackey said:
Literally nobody I know in the comic world reads or cares about this character.

Marvel was (and still is to an extent) hiring people based on their identity politics and not their writing or editing skills for a bit there. Turns out, you can't sell books based on that alone. With the vast majority of these titles selling abysmally. Who'd have thought?

Many of these people had never read a single comic in their life and while the people they often write for are a vocal minority, they actually just like to complain about what sensibilities comics have traditionally appealed to. They don't give a fuck about the medium or any comics in particular.
Click to expand...
I haven't kept up much on comics lately , I'm about 5 years behind in Marvel and 30 years behind on DC, but I don't think this is true.
 
strange headache said:
That's the exact same mini series that DeafTourette DeafTourette mentioned and I already replied to. Do you even read the comments here, or do you just jump on the fan bandwagon?
Click to expand...

I can only add, and this is spit balling, that Marvel might be testing the waters with Samira Ahmed. This is her first comic that she is writing so they gave her a limited series to see how she goes.
 
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