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htoL#NiQ: The Firefly Diary |OT| It's Pronounced "Hotaru no Nikki"

The second maze was much easier for me, but it is cruel that there was no checkpoint before the flower.

Also, I'm pretty sure it was easy because I beat the part after the flower in an unintended way.

Edit: Man, they make you work to figure out the 4-1 trophy.

I thought the first maze was easier. It only gets super difficult if you're going for that trophy. Otherwise, maze 2 requires a lot more precision and timing.

And yeah, it was funny to me that maze 1 had too many checkpoints, and maze 2 had too few...

edit, FYI, for the pipes trophy in 4-3, you can die/restart and it saves your pipe progress.
 
edit, FYI, for the pipes trophy in 4-3, you can die/restart and it saves your pipe progress.

Yeah, there's no way to go through all the pipes without dying and/or restarting. Fortunately, this means you can use the easiest route to actually finish the level.

Also, 3-1 has the worst trophy. I'm on the cusp of getting 2-3 done, whereas I've retried 3-1 maybe four times as much and still don't have a consistent run through it.
 
Also, 3-1 has the worst trophy. I'm on the cusp of getting 2-3 done, whereas I've retried 3-1 maybe four times as much and still don't have a consistent run through it.

I actually did get 3-1 after a little bit. It was frustrating, but much easier than 2-3 for me. Small tip, even if she's preparing to land, it doesn't discount you unless she fully puts the umbrella away.
 
I actually did get 3-1 after a little bit. It was frustrating, but much easier than 2-3 for me. Small tip, even if she's preparing to land, it doesn't discount you unless she fully puts the umbrella away.

I was counting on that but wasn't sure. Thanks!

Although what ends most of my attempts is still death...
 
Just got the platinum for this game. Had a lot of fun with this game, although the maze(s) and boss 4 trophies are frustrating as hell. Overall though, this game had a lot of charm and beautiful graphics.

My interpretation. Long as heck, but there's a reason this was my number 2 game of the year.

*Major spoilers*

I pretty much agreed with this analysis. There are a couple minor things I don't recall or didn't pick up on, but for the most part I think this was spot on. It's a great story for those who are able to pick up on the subtle things.
 

Yasumi

Banned
Finally got my physical version on Friday but haven't had much chance to play, only gotten through chapter 1 so far. The @tbk has some really gorgeous art. I love how much detail they put into the environmental designs.
 
Came back to this after a week, and got the 2-3 and 3-1 trophies with one try each. Taking a break usually works for me on challenges like these.

Now to get the trophy for the final boss, which is exactly what I suspected. Will definitively have to cheat for this one since I can get
shadow dad
every time but
shadow mom
quickly becomes impossible.

Honestly, cheating by
pausing
seems more effective than by
recording video
... but I still need to prove that in practice.
 

finch

Member
I hadn't missed a hit on the final boss for a while
because of the pause trick
, EXCEPT FOR ONE AND RIGHT AFTERWARDS THE ENDING SEQUENCE STARTED, SO IT WAS THE LAST ONE. I don't know if i want to try that again.
SHADOW DAAAAAAD!
 
I've just about given up on this game. I'm on chapter 4-2, on a moving platform, and have to dodge (?) shadows. Cannot for the life of me make it past this part. Only thing keeping me is the art style, otherwise I'm loosing intrest quick...
 

jonno394

Member
The
shadow maze
in 2-3 was annoying but not nearly as annoying as the
umbrella
section in 3-1. first time I've rage quit in years
 
I've just about given up on this game. I'm on chapter 4-2, on a moving platform, and have to dodge (?) shadows. Cannot for the life of me make it past this part. Only thing keeping me is the art style, otherwise I'm loosing intrest quick...

That part is basically impossible if you miss the item you need, but it's the most fun part of the game if you have it.

Before you go down to the moving platform, you need to get the plant onto the platform with you. Then it becomes a shooting gallery section. I never figured out how to get the plant down from the upper level, but that doesn't matter - if you die on the moving platform then you will be returned to the lower hallway with the plant already there.

Actually, the trophy description for 4-2 gave away what you have to do for me.
 
That part is basically impossible if you miss the item you need, but it's the most fun part of the game if you have it.

Before you go down to the moving platform, you need to get the plant onto the platform with you. Then it becomes a shooting gallery section. I never figured out how to get the plant down from the upper level, but that doesn't matter - if you die on the moving platform then you will be returned to the lower hallway with the plant already there.

Actually, the trophy description for 4-2 gave away what you have to do for me.

I hardly ever look at my trophies, and feel incredibly stupid now lol...

Edit: Thanks for the fast reply buddy :)
 
Well, this was my first platinum ever. I'm not in the habit of picking easy games.

That ending... I had to look up hints for the first time.
First, how to retrieve the "light" that you place in memory sprout #13 (you can actually choose where to put it!), and then, the existence of your super-attack in the final fight (I would never have figured that out).

My interpretation. Long as heck, but there's a reason this was my number 2 game of the year.

I'll write down my interpretations as well. Your theory makes a ton of sense in light of the read-along videos and the full ending, but there are more details to account for.

Read-along video #3 suggest to me that the war was already underway before the story started, which would explain why the TV was showing images of bombs to begin with. The house and the lab were already in some remote location, thought to be safe.

What killed the original Mion? I think that's deliberately left vague, but it was whatever broke the window in memory sprout #5. The window returns as recurring imagery in 4-1 in the background of some rooms; in one room, it's obscured by glitches. A traumatic, repressed memory?

After Mion's death, the war seems to intensify, shown by the frequency of bomb images on TV.

How is "Mion" observing the creation of the horned Mion? I think you're right that hornless Mion floating in the void is the "red" Mion at the end of the game, but I don't think it's supernatural. This is the uploaded copy of Mion's mind that was shut down in memory sprout #9, which is why hornless Mion visibly glitches out right at the end. The shimmering blue wall that blocks her from entering the room - which disappears at the end of #10 allowing you to enter the room - represents some kind of barrier between the computer world and the real world.

Why does original Mion see horned Mion as a blob? Hard to say. Maybe it's some kind of imperfection in the Mion copies, and this is what it looks like in its imperfect "digital" form.

What happens in memory sprout #11? My theory is that original Mion, somehow entering the real world, tries to interact with everyone just as before (through machinery?) but instead inadvertently kills them. This somehow causes copies of mom and dad's minds to be uploaded as well in the form of Lumen and Umbra. It's no mistake that when original Mion sees the real world again, there are bloodstains leading through the walls and into the void. Horned Mion gets disabled at this point as well.

What is going on in memory sprout #12? I think there was some kind of process for creating more copies of Mions, after the first success. Of course, all these were also imperfect copies. The system was full of them, and original Mion was stuck in an endless cycle of destroying untold imperfect Mion copies for a long time.

I think the starting room of the game is actually where newly assembled Mion copies are placed, and that new horned Mions have been popping up in this room for centuries before the game started. Somehow they get destroyed through a combination of the deteriorating facility, the shadows and hostile plant life, and original Mion's actions, which accounts for all the dead Mions you find later in the game. It is possible that Lumen and Umbra, somehow manifesting to each new horned Mion, have been doing this for the entire time.

I can't explain what the shadows are. Probably intended to be the ghosts of the dead - the artbook hints that boss #1 has some kind of connection to Mion. Boss #1 must be the corgi, which explains his appearance and his persistence in following Mion.

The machines, on the other hand, are probably controlled by original Mion. Boss #2 is clearly a bigger version of a prototype in mom's lab in memory sprout #3.

The plants are obviously dad's work as seen in memory sprout #2, rampantly growing over everything.

What does the divergence between the normal ending and the true ending mean? Memory sprout #13 shows that original Mion locked the big door (behind which her uploaded mind is stored) and hid the "key" in the house. She clearly has physical access to these places. This sequence of events also suggests that the path you take in 3-3 when you can't unlock the door leads directly to the house. When you take the route to the normal ending, that means that you failed to find the "key." However, original Mion clearly did not leave the key for horned Mion's benefit.

I suspect the "key" was a message for Lumen and Umbra, in order to restore their memories so that they know what needs to be done. This is why you are able to use the key in chapter 3 even though you only find it in chapter 4 - the "data" was carried over by Lumen and Umbra from a previous cycle. Original Mion's plan was to leave this to lead Lumen and Umbra to find her and bring her a new body.

What happens when you fail to find the key? You end up in chapter 4. My interpretation is that none of chapter 4 is real; you are now in original Mion's trap, and you are experiencing some kind of virtual world that cannot possibly exist in reality (how could 4-1 be real?). This is why there are now glitches in the world you are experiencing.

The start of chapter 4 suggests that you have actually reached the real house, but the end of chapter 4 - there's a machine there with a monitor, and some puppets - suggests that "mom," "dad," and the corgi as seen by horned Mion in the house were actually these stand-ins being controlled by original Mion. By the end of chapter 4, you have become just another copy that original Mion has succeeded in destroying. Lumen and Umbra are left behind to start the cycle over again. If they happened to find the "key" along the way, however, that will open the path to the true ending and finally break this cycle.

In other words - another Japanese game where you are trapped in an endless cycle of events until you break out of it. At least that's my theory, but it seems to fit this structure that's incredibly popular in Japan for some reason.

I'm going along with the rest of your interpretation after that, except:

The tree was growing around the computers that store original Mion's mind and the machines that create new Mion copies using the giant seed in the vat. (But somehow, although they originate here, the finished copies appear in the facilities far below.) In the end, the last Mion copy defeats original Mion by growing the tree to finally destroy the machines, and the seed from which Mion copies are created.

I have no idea how both Mions continue to exist without the machines, or bodies.
 

omlet

Member
Finished the Etrian MD main game so I'm finally getting back to this game. Finally got past the frustrating mushroom hat part I was on when EMD arrived so I'm pushing on through chapter 4 now (I think?). Just got the Hopeless Romantic trophy. That was a pretty great little "oh, you" moment lol.

This certainly isn't creepy at all. http://i.imgur.com/EU7MJOM.jpg (potential spoilers)

I think I may have missed a sprout in ch3 because there were a couple places I could see another path but couldn't figure out a way to safely traverse there. If I stage select and replay one can I resume from my farthest checkpoint afterwards or should I just play all the way through then go cherry-pick stages I need to redo?
 

Zonic

Gives all the fucks
Really should get back to this, but the damn completionist in me wants to get that one part where you can't take damage taken care of so I can move on. Haven't touched it since due to being so frustrated with that trophy.
 

AniHawk

Member
i'm getting my ass kicked at the third boss. i was having a legitimately good time (and found the game fairly easy?) until then.
 
I think I may have missed a sprout in ch3 because there were a couple places I could see another path but couldn't figure out a way to safely traverse there. If I stage select and replay one can I resume from my farthest checkpoint afterwards or should I just play all the way through then go cherry-pick stages I need to redo?

I'm pretty sure replaying old stages would save over your checkpoint. Best to wait.

Really should get back to this, but the damn completionist in me wants to get that one part where you can't take damage taken care of so I can move on. Haven't touched it since due to being so frustrated with that trophy.

I think that's the worst trophy for most people, but by the endgame you're going to have several potentially frustrating trophies to work on. Might want to come back later.

i'm getting my ass kicked at the third boss. i was having a legitimately good time (and found the game fairly easy?) until then.

Once you learn all the patterns, everything can be dodged. However, it's easier if you speed it up by
dropping two corpses at once (with the correct timing and positioning)
.

Edit: Thread just got moved to Community. Subscribe if you need to.
 

omlet

Member
Once you learn all the patterns, everything can be dodged. However, it's easier if you speed it up by
dropping two corpses at once (with the correct timing and positioning)
.

What about the third wave where they're coming in left to right very close together? I can't seem to find a safe spot. Tried standing between them twice and it didn't work either time. That was my 5th death, heh.

Hm, just thought maybe am I supposed to
hold on to one of the corpses until that wave then feed it at that time so I can stand on the chomper and not get killed?
Will try that. Edit: Nope that didn't work, spike coverage is too wide for that... How do you dodge this?
 

SerTapTap

Member
Man, fuck the second boss. That is all. I even did it RIGHT once before looking up the solution and somehow still died, must have been an animation that wasn't done or something was too early or too late or something. Haven't gotten back in yet.
 

omlet

Member
What do I do after the maze in chapter 4 where Mion is riding on the platform as you go through the maze? The damn maze is frustrating enough but then when I occasionally manage to get through that I can't tell what to do before she dies...

I tried
aiming the plant on the ceiling down to shoot the switch on the floor but it never fired anything so Mion kept getting roasted
. Am I not pressing something somewhere? Trying to activate the jet devices themselves didn't do anything.
 
I tried
aiming the plant on the ceiling down to shoot the switch on the floor but it never fired anything so Mion kept getting roasted
.

That should do it - not sure what's gone wrong. It is a little hard to see where you're aiming due to the distance, so you might not have hit it.
 

omlet

Member
That should do it - not sure what's gone wrong. It is a little hard to see where you're aiming due to the distance, so you might not have hit it.

Hm. It seemed like it wasn't shooting at all, not just that I missed. I will try again tonight or something when I feel ready to be frustrated again.

Edit: Phew, made it past that. I seriously want to punch whoever thought those mazes were a good idea. I'm fine with the rest of this game's trial-and-error and difficulty but those segments are pure annoying. It's like the controls completely change when you get into them... they feel so touchy and inconsistent. Tap one way once and you go where you want... tap it again and you zoom in a different direction at a different speed right into a wall.
 
It's like the controls completely change when you get into them... they feel so touchy and inconsistent. Tap one way once and you go where you want... tap it again and you zoom in a different direction at a different speed right into a wall.

I always switch to touch for the mazes. Can't do them with the stick at all but touch gets me through most of the time.

And it's a good thing that the last maze can be cheesed. I have yet to figure out how you're supposed to do it properly.
 

omlet

Member
omg is this shadow flashcard thing random? I can't do this it's too fast, this is ridiculous. It's too fast even for me to try to use Umbra swap to do any good...

oh god I did it 4th try

lol

insane

edit2: OH GOD memory sprout 7 D:! (well, it's numbered 7 for me, the bottom left one? maybe the numbers change as you get more so my #7 isn't necessarily your #7?)
 
I can tell you that they're definitely random, because I tried every way I could think of to cheat at that.

Guess what the trophy for that part is?

edit2: OH GOD memory sprout 7 D:! (well, it's numbered 7 for me, the bottom left one? maybe the numbers change as you get more so my #7 isn't necessarily your #7?)

Yes, they're renumbered so that they're always consecutively numbered. But... yeah, I know which one you were looking at.
 

omlet

Member
I'm guessing it's make no mistakes, going from what I've seen of the other trophies. I had 2 on the attempt I finally got through.

This game is so twisted.

<3
 

cj_iwakura

Member
Finished.

4-3 can rot in hell. Yes, that section.

Got the final boss on the third try. Partly because I'm unstoppable at
the old shell game.

The rest was blind luck and lucky freeze framing with Lumen.
 
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