Anyone thinking they'll have more than 4 is nuts...
Remember when people were nuts for thinking Sony would abandon the Cell?
Anyone thinking they'll have more than 4 is nuts...
Anyone thinking they'll have more than 4 is nuts...
Now (as aforementioned, I'm a certifiable n00b) the can't they carry over a similar design philosophy on board larger than this, given that they won't produce the same amount of heat a processing chip would?
The density size for GDDR3 hasn't increased either. It's the same as GDDR5.
This is why I put the qualifier "if I fuxored up" in there. I was initially thinking 1 gig GDDR5 and 5 gigs GDDR3. If they really are going for a split pool I'd expect more RAM chips to be used purely for higher total overall. Otherwise you'd just be better suited for a smaller unified pool. Most of the game world though (and here's the catch) would be designed to fit into that smaller faster pool. You could have things streaming in and out of the slower pool as a giant cache, but at some point it just becomes redundant.
If they want to go just for size, they could get a unified pool of 8 gigs GDDR3 under the same chip budget of the first 360.
Or they could go for something with insane speed like a unified pool of GDDR5. At 256MB a chip you're top end would be 2-3 gigs at the maximum. And that's with 8-12 RAM chips on the board.
The density size for GDDR3 hasn't increased either. It's the same as GDDR5.
The density size for GDDR3 hasn't increased either. It's the same as GDDR5.
Thankfully, as you already know DDR3 chip densities are higher than both![]()
GDDR5 has 512MB chip density?
Thankfully, as you already know DDR3 chip densities are higher than both![]()
Remember when people were nuts for thinking Sony would abandon the Cell?![]()
Let's just make something clear here - RAM speed has no bearing on load times (unless you're talking 1970s RAM speed).Thunder Monkey said:That slow of RAM coupled with slow disc read speeds equals some truly epic load times.
Consider me purely and utterly owned.Let's just make something clear here - RAM speed has no bearing on load times (unless you're talking 1970s RAM speed).
But as a general rule - hw-maker TRC restrictions have far more effect on average loading-times then any underlying hw. PS2 generation was a good example of having no real differentiators on hw level, but people still perceive some console to be drastically better then another (and ironically, usually the one with slowest hardware).
You guys are crazy MS having 4 GB of DDR3 and 2GB of DDR5 would make the board so complex is not even funny.
If you going to add some many ram chips you could well as go for 3 to 4 GB of DDR5 and call it a day .
so whats GAF's perfect PS4 final spec sheet look like?
Lol... you're not nice. And of course they'd use less ram with faster speeds. That's why I was perplexed in your last post. 4 is a lot, honestly I think they are better off with 2gig with storage for cache... Sure, stick a hybrid HDD in a performance PC, and it becomes a bottleneck because the HDD ends up downspinning often to save energy. That's not a problem (and can be bypassed) in a console. Sure, it's not as fast as adding 2 extra gigs of ram, but overall it'll probably be very cost efficient.I was throwing out a hypothetical of course to see what us tech-minded folks would think about that if it were to come to fruition (see tag - trollface.jpg). bg is just baiting jeff (lol)
Seriously, though, if a console manufacturer decided to use a larger pool of slower memory vs a smaller pool of faster memory - it would certainly satisfy forums like us here, wouldn't it?
Look at every next gen related thread in the past 2 years and you'll find quite a large percentage of posts reflecting that.
I was throwing out a hypothetical of course to see what us tech-minded folks would think about that if it were to come to fruition (see tag - trollface.jpg). bg is just baiting jeff (lol)
Seriously, though, if a console manufacturer decided to use a larger pool of slower memory vs a smaller pool of faster memory - it would certainly satisfy forums like us here, wouldn't it?
Look at every next gen related thread in the past 2 years and you'll find quite a large percentage of posts reflecting that.
so whats GAF's perfect PS4 final spec sheet look like?
Check the photograph a couple pages ago (lol)
![]()
Do you guys think Sony will go 3D wafers or not?I honestly forgot jeff keeps talking about stacked memory. I'm on a roll tonight for unintended puns and baiting.![]()
so whats GAF's perfect PS4 final spec sheet look like?
I hope MS is planning on at least 2GB of GDDR5 alongside 4-8GB DDR3. 1GB isn't enough for 1080P gaming.
12GB Ram 4GB VRam
SOC made up of a AMD APU with 8 Steamroller cores ,Radeon HD 8790 , FPGA & a 2PPU 8SPU Cell for full BC
Radeon HD 8990 GPU
1TB Blu-ray drive & 1TB SSD
ohh & a 4K 480FPS 3D PlayStation Eye
all for $299
Do you guys think Sony will go 3D wafers or not?
I'll give you some more bait.I honestly forgot jeff keeps talking about stacked memory. I'm on a roll tonight for unintended puns and baiting.![]()
So insisting on using current Memory standard packaging is likely to be misleading. Memory packaging is taking advantage of TSVs to increase the memory density. Custom packages are now easily possible.http://seekingalpha.com/article/291012-micron-technology-inc-shareholder-analyst-call said:Graphics and consumer. Fair to say, a little bit of a slowdown here, specifically in the DTV segment. I'll speak more about what's happening in game consoles as well. A pretty good push for more memory coming up in the Game Console segment as a level of redesigns. We'll start to hit it over the next couple of years.
And talking about consumer again here. I thought it'd be beneficial to show you across a couple of key applications how this looks in terms of megabyte per system. On the left, what we have are game consoles. This is a space that's been pretty flat for a number of years in terms of the average shipped density per system. That's going to be changing here pretty quickly. I think everyone realizes that these systems are somewhat clumpy in their development. The next generation of system is under development now and that because of 3D and some of the bandwidth requirements, drives the megabyte per console up fairly quickly. So we're anticipating some good growth here.
We've worked with a number of these vendors specifically on both custom and semi-custom solutions in that space.
High bandwidth memory is 3D stacked wide and ultra wide created with TSVs and can be stacked vertically outside a SOC on a graphics card or even a PS4 motherboard or 2.5D stacked side by side on a transposer SOC substrate.http://sites.amd.com/us/Documents/TFE2011_006HYN.pdf said:• GDDR5 Single-ended I/O
- Max. 8Gbps with same power
• GDDR5 Differential I/O
- Max. 14Gbps with much more power
• HBM*(Wide I/O with TSV) High Bandwidth Memory HBM migrating to mainstream 2-3 years after High-end segmentation
- Lower speed with many I/Os and low power => Handheld low power DRAM
 Upgradable DRAM Speed ==> using higher power faster DRAM at higher clock speed, not for handheld
 Increasable # of I/O
 Flexible # of stack
Graphics Card, HPC, Workstation
MS joined the Hybrid Memory Cube consortium. IBM has already started making prototypes at their fabs as of last year.
http://www-03.ibm.com/press/us/en/pressrelease/36125.wss
There is a chance we'll see 4-8 GB HMC in Durango / PS4.
Game changer.
Hybrid Memory Cube Consortium (sounds like the name of a comic book universe alliance)Is Sony already a part of this consortium?
Quite surprise that all of these rumours tell us that MS will go for more exotic hardware whereas Sony will go different way.
Look like MS willing take more loss per system, It would be funny if they will lose all 360 profit just like PS3.
Hybrid Memory Cube Consortium (sounds like the name of a comic book universe alliance)
Not listed on the website, though Sony could benefit by the end product without being one, anyway.
Not really Microsoft has allot more money to take risks on that business model, if they were smart they'd produce an powerful system and go in for the kill(at least in Americas) with Sony.
Sure, MSFT is a company known for taking risks.
Rumours state that Sony are trying to bring out PS3 late next year and that XB3 may be out sometime Q1 2014. Given that MS is a partner, aren't they, as one of the partners, in position to acquire the fruits of this venture first? If so then Sony can't really benefit from it if the memory is the reason XB3 has been delayed to launch after PS4.
Being part of the consortium probably has nothing to do with gaming, you guys do realize what their bread and butter is right?
If something is going to impact computers, Microsoft will always be involved.
Graphics and consumer. Fair to say, a little bit of a slowdown here, specifically in the DTV segment. I'll speak more about what's happening in game consoles as well. A pretty good push for more memory coming up in the Game Console segment as a level of redesigns. We'll start to hit it over the next couple of years.
And talking about consumer again here. I thought it'd be beneficial to show you across a couple of key applications how this looks in terms of megabyte per system. On the left, what we have are game consoles. This is a space that's been pretty flat for a number of years in terms of the average shipped density per system. That's going to be changing here pretty quickly. I think everyone realizes that these systems are somewhat clumpy in their development. The next generation of system is under development now and that because of 3D and some of the bandwidth requirements, drives the megabyte per console up fairly quickly. So we're anticipating some good growth here.
We've worked with a number of these vendors specifically on both custom and semi-custom solutions in that space.
why so late?
This is totally reasonable, but the quote from Micron Stockholder's meeting suggest that something more is involved.
Xbox.
PC in a box. They really took a risk with that one. It would serve better for your argument if you mention Xbox 360 and Kinect.
At the end of the day, I really wonder if 2GB would be sufficient (esp. if MS comes out with double that. The next gen like this will be mostly about third parties and it will be damaging to PS4 if the multiplats, much like this gen, are visually [and performance wise] superior).
Generally there is a space that is allotted between E3 (if PS3's and 360's examples are to be followed) and launch of the console to allow the confluence of marketing, hype, proper production numbers to ensure a successful launch. So if the PS4 is announced at E3 2013, the launch window will be somewhere in late Q4 2013 (if not early Q1 2014).
Oh, you're talking about tech risk.
I would say pushing the tech envelope with 360 is the biggest risk, and it resulted in RROD.
I guess you still didn't notice your mistake lol
I guess you still didn't notice your mistake lol
Terms may be misleading. Stacking Memory on logic would be ultra wide I/O made with TSVs of maybe 100 megs that could be 2.5D attached to the SOC substrate not stacked on top of the CPU. That was mentioned in the Global Memory Summit in Tokyo, memory stacked on Logic for game console SOCs in 2013-2014. SemiAccurate Quote; "expect stacked memory and lots of it." That could be stacked memory outside the SOC.I wonder where this puts PS4 because I remember reading a report (link cited by Rigby) where there was talk of stacking memory for PS4.
At the end of the day, I really wonder if 2GB would be sufficient (esp. if MS comes out with double that. The next gen like this will be mostly about third parties and it will be damaging to PS4 if the multiplats, much like this gen, are visually [and performance wise] superior).
Not really Microsoft has allot more money to take risks on that business model, if they were smart they'd produce an powerful system and go in for the kill(at least in Americas) with Sony.
Apple producing a game console next Year?The next generation of consoles starts in 2013, if all goes according to developers’ plans. In an anonymous questionnaire, multiple industry professionals told IGN that they plan to release games for the next Microsoft and Sony consoles before January 1, 2014.
Multiple developers also intend to launch software for an unannounced platform next year
Nintendo Wii U probably hard to use because of the Split screen (LCD handheld controller).To further signal the winding down of the current console generation, approximately 60% of respondents have no plans to release games for the Xbox 360, PlayStation 3, or Nintendo Wii after 2013. Of course, this means some 40% intend to keep at current-gen releases after next year. To that point, an anonymous developer told IGN, “I would not be surprised if something atypical cannibalizes the market, maybe even the Xbox 360 itself.”
From a hardware perspective, nearly 80% of respondents said Microsoft’s next console is the easiest to work with, and the overwhelming majority suspect it will be the sales leader over the next five years.
So Next generation Browser based games using WebCL (OpenCL incorporated into the javascript engine)"Gesture and voice control will become more commonplace, which in the future could help the industry overcome some of the challenges of interfacing with games apps using unresponsive and clumsy existing TV controllers." Pronounced Pachter: "This is the most impactful area for 2012, although it's not focused on gamers, per se. Rather, the focus is on converting other members of a gamer household to users of the home console, and Microsoft has a lot of things planned this year.
"Ultimately, the Xbox 360 and PS3 could be used as TV tuners (we'll see that this year), and will continue to beef up their content offering for over-the-top internet TV."
"Browser-based gaming will continue to grow," decided Divnich, "especially as developers unlock the potential of HTML5. But I don't believe HTML5 gaming really begins to capture mainstream attention until 2013/2014. There are still plenty of bugs to work out in the HTML5 technology."
Harped Harding-Rolls: "The mobile social network games opportunity in the West has yet to burst into life - 2012 looks a safe bet for this to happen. "
"AMD is betting the farm on HSA" in both the PC and Games console market and NEEDS Sony to educate Developers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!So nextbox wins again? More power and easier to write game for? bummer
So nextbox wins again? More power and easier to write game for? bummer