bgassassin
Member
So nextbox wins again? More power and easier to write game for? bummer
Wins again? I'm not really impressed by what "they did" this gen. Just because they may have done things to appease developers guarantees nothing.
So nextbox wins again? More power and easier to write game for? bummer
I'm not OK with this.../cut
Shoddy engineering resulted in RROD. With better cooling or a more well thought out distribution of the internal components it wouldn't have happened.Oh, you're talking about tech risk.
I would say pushing the tech envelope with 360 is the biggest risk, and it resulted in RROD.
This interview with Jack Tretton (5.30) really gives me hope on what direction Sony is going with PS4.
Can you resume what he says??im at work![]()
Jack made clear in that Interview that Sony is doubling down on core gaming. MS can chase media deals, Nintendo can give it a go with their confusing controller strategy, but Sony just wants to zero in on gaming as their core ethos. That's very heartening, indeed.
Jack made clear in that Interview that Sony is doubling down on core gaming. MS can chase media deals, Nintendo can give it a go with their confusing controller strategy, but Sony just wants to zero in on gaming as their core ethos. That's very heartening, indeed.
Geoff asked Jack if they are keen to beat Microsoft to the market in the next console cycle. Jack answered that Sony's number one goal is to have the best machine and if that means it will come after their competitors then so be it. They want a machine that has longitivity and doesn't run out of gas on the long run.
isn't that what they did this time? Didn't work out so well. Can they give MS a years head start and still succeed if they launch at a reasonable price? Hmm. Maybe. Not sure I'd want to risk it unless they genuinely feel they can get a big step forward in tech that is noticable.
Jack made clear in that Interview that Sony is doubling down on core gaming. MS can chase media deals, Nintendo can give it a go with their confusing controller strategy, but Sony just wants to zero in on gaming as their core ethos. That's very heartening, indeed.
Jack made clear in that Interview that Sony is doubling down on core gaming. MS can chase media deals, Nintendo can give it a go with their confusing controller strategy, but Sony just wants to zero in on gaming as their core ethos. That's very heartening, indeed.
Jack made clear in that Interview that Sony is doubling down on core gaming. MS can chase media deals, Nintendo can give it a go with their confusing controller strategy, but Sony just wants to zero in on gaming as their core ethos. That's very heartening, indeed.
did any one catch the jack tretton interview on game trailers?
SO awesome to hear that sony are still focused on delivering the best possible machine, as apposed to the cheapest or first.
i was worried they would be tempted to water things down ...i still want the Ferrari of console gaming.
Core gaming is on the top of both agendas (MS and Nintendo), I can assure you that. What is this fud?
so the CPU-APU should be around what, Wii U power give or take a few gflops, then factor in the discrete GPU and you're talking about a nice system.
The HD7670 is the exact same thing as the HD6670 IGN said was in the next Xbox. It's also way weaker than what many people are expecting for the next gen of consoles.
That said, if there's any truth to this at all, these are the specs of the PCs the devs have started development on, not actual console parts.
Core gaming is on the top of both agendas (MS and Nintendo), I can assure you that. What is this fud?
Core gaming is on the top of both agendas (MS and Nintendo), I can assure you that. What is this fud?
so the CPU-APU should be around what, Wii U power give or take a few gflops, then factor in the discrete GPU and you're talking about a nice system.
????
is there more to this post? why did you just post this?
Look at how they are happy and all. That surely means that we'll be happy when we hear about the specs.
Here's to hoping, at least...
MS is on autopilot...
Nintendo is just a mess...
Sony braced their conference with two core-focused, new AAA IP. It's not hard to see who is actually focused on their effort to appeal to the core.
Trolling the hardcore that don't want casual interfaces; umgawa me want power.????
is there more to this post? why did you just post this?
CPU power is coming as BOTH have rumored specs of about 16 CPUs performance whether it's the Durango 16 CPUs or the early PS4 with 16 SPUs or the AMD Fusion CPU-GPU with 400 elements that coincidentally equal about 16 SPUs. These specs are too close to be anything but by design. Both are going to have voice and Kinect 2.0 functionality.
Wonderbook says hi
Well, I've been waiting on these new consoles to hit for over a year now. If these specs are anywhere close to true... then I'm just going to keep gaming on my pad and phone while using my PC for more graphic heavy games. Developers are bringing more and more games to the PC and with consoles having DirectX11 maybe console ports on the PC won't be so terrible. I'm not very knowledgeable on the technical aspects of everything, but I know enough to understand that the specs that are floating around as rumors right now put the PS4 and the new Xbox as a weaker platform than my laptop.
Wonderbook says hi
They actually didn't do that. They were set to release their console in 2005, but a flurry of bullshit came into the equation. For example, blu laser diode shortages (MS strategic move to include the HD-DVD), low yields, and many other issues. This time, as long as they stick to more conventional hardware with the Sony twist (something that dev's worker harder for that gives them a wealthy girth of power)- it will be awesome.
The PS4 SOC should have 100 megs or so of VERY VERY fast "common" memory in the SOC. It's possible to have more, to have the entire system memory in the SOC. This is not likely though if the second GPU is external and also Full HSA using a GDDR memory buss rather than PCIe.http://semiaccurate.com/forums/showpost.php?p=158494&postcount=139 said:AI technique such as Neural Network(image, handwriting recognition) and Genetic Algorithm(optimization used in planning) basically performs searches in parallel. AI techniques are best implemented in a system with many cores. A 1K nodes Neural Network or a Genetic Algorithm with 1K population size will perform 1K searches in parallel. These algorithms do not need a lot of memory. 100MBytes of memory is should be more than enough. What AI algorithm needs is more processing cores.
Currently, the GPU and CPU does not have a common address space. The algorithm needs to move the memory between the GPU and CPU many times during the execution. The memory swaps make implementation of AI on GPU not very efficient. Once the GPU and CPU share the same memory space, it will be very efficient to implement AI on GPU.
If GPU and CPU share the same memory space in Kaveri, Kaveri will have great impact how software is implemented. AI, Computer Vision and linear programming implemented on GPU will be many times faster than implemented on CPU. There will be alot more AI and Computer Vision application on the laptop.
TLDR SPECS
CPU
4 core (2 core pairs) 3.2 GHz AMD x86 (Steamroller) (rumored changed to 2 Jaguar CPUs with 2 gigs cache each)
aggregate, 10x PS3 PPU performance
512 KByte L2 per core pair
64 bit pointers
GPU
AMD R10x series GPU @ 800 MHz (Tahiti)
aggregate 10x RSX performance, 1.84 TFlops
DX”11.5″
cheap branching
18 compute units, focus on fine grained compute & tessellation
MEMORY:
2 GByte UMA, pushing for 4 GByte
192 GByte/ sec non-coherent access for e.g. GPU
12 GByte/ sec coherent access for CPU
>50% longer memory latency for CPU/ GPU compared to PC!!!
DXT is lowest bpp texture compression format
MEDIA:
50 GByte BD drive
PCAV, between 3.3 and 8x BD, most likely clamped to 6x
automatic background caching to HDD
HDD SKU with at least 380 GByte
downloadable games
EXTRA HARDWARE:
video encoder/ decoder
audio processing unit, ~200 concurrent MP3 streams
HW zlib decompressor
Our source claims that the final specs should be 10x powerful than PS3, due to this info has got 10 months.
"Orbis will support 4 layer BR discs from day 1" most likely means that Orbis will be a 4K blu-ray player also (4 layer + h.265= 4K Blu-ray) All PS3s can support 4K video but only Slim blu-ray drives may be able to read 4 layers. (To not fragment the PS3, Sony may not enable 4K blu-ray on the PS3.) Dev kits are not final design and final design may include 2 (1PPU4SPU) modules with software to support Backward compatibility as well as support Floating Point number crunching (rumor has 2 Jaguar cores without FPU in final SOC design).http://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=9241544#post9241544 said:Spec numbers that IGN posted are from first/early dev kits that have been replaced in mid January. Now I repeat what I know is based on second dev kits that DO NOT represent the final product. Kits will most definitely change. Before I reveal SOME of the specs let me tell you that based on what we have heard in our studio from our publisher is that Sony was undecided if they should go for a high end machine and take on MS or go for 1.5 leap.
According to rumors a couple of Sonys first party studios are asking for high end machine to make games that are going to have noticeable generation leap. While Hirai and other heads over in Japan think it's time to think about profitability. For now "fight" is some where in between, edging more towards higher end. RAM has been raised from 2GB to 4GB when most of bigger publishers and first party studios that have saying went mental. CPU yes it is true Sony is moving away from the CELL. Will there be BC? Our publisher doesn't care and we haven't heard a word about it. Again since these are dev kits we can't know more than that 99% Cell is done and dusted. Second dev kit uses APU design AMD A8-3870k redesigned to have HD 6850 on board. And yes SI rumors are true. APU is paired with the HD Radeon HD 7900. No HDD rumors are untrue since it has already been confirmed that just like PS3, every "Orbis" SKU will have large HDD since Sony is very eager to make Orbis the media hub. O and one more thing Orbis will support 4 layer BR discs from day 1."
tunafish said:4P refers to 4 cores, so this would have two units of 4 cores, both of them connected to their own 2MB pool of cache, for a total of 8 cores and 4MB cache.
... which would be pretty pathetic. One bobcat core at 1.6GHz is roughly 3-4 times faster than one Xenon thread at 3.2GHz in integer, so unless Jaguar is a real upset, that's realistically less than 5 times the power of Xenon, on 8 threads. It would be pretty low power and low cost.
Stacked Memory plus GPU plus substrate. Two of the 4 CUSTOM memory chips are in the red dotted circle (could be total 256 or 512 bit wide). This is the same 2.5D substrate + Interposer technology we will probably see supporting the PS4 SOC just with PS4 SOC much LARGER. It also looks like the following picture includes Southbridge. Just missing the CPUs and MMU for CPU and it would be a APU including memory.http://semiaccurate.com/forums/showpost.php?p=164227&postcount=225 said:That's why I keep posting 2.5D stacking news released by the company that Charlie's "Far Future AMD GPU Prototype" picture originated from. Moreover, Charlie made it rather clear that SONY is going for a "multi-chip-on-interposer" HSA design that is supposed to be gradually integrated into a cheaper, monolithic SoC later in the life cycle. We also heard about "two GPUs", so its probably going to be APU + dedicated GPU - with the APU-GPU basically reserved for GPGPU computation.
"Interposer inclusion defines the 2.5D approach. It will route thousands of interconnections between the devices. Coupled with true 3D stacked die (enabled by TSVs), the high routing density and short chip-to-chip interconnect ensures the highest possible performance while packing as much functionality as possible into the smallest footprint.
Functional blocks may include a microprocessor or special purpose logic IC (GPU, applications processor, ASIC, FPGA, etc.) connected through high-speed circuitry to other logic devices or memory (DRAM, SRAM, Flash) ..."
In response to this:http://www.stonearch.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1138&page=4 said:Next-gen consoles should have APUs to perform some tasks like physics calculations in the CPU.
Additionally, because next-gen consoles will need to achieve quality and performance of current high-end, I don't think an APU can be done on a reasonably small die in 22 nm (which should be approaching bulk in 2013). After a year or two, they will be able to integrate half of the graphics die at twice the clocks into an APU to allow all of the performance.
In fact, I would dare to think that with consoles being a very specific market, assuming that next-gen architecture in consoles (PS4, Xbox 720 category) will be exclusively made by AMD will include the following:
APU: multiple (4-8) integer cores;
APU: few (1-2) floating-point cores;
APU: some (200-400) shaders;
GPU: a lot (2000-4000) of shaders in a separate die clocked at about half the clock of the APU.
In time, with integration going up, at about 1 node later, GPU could be clocked higher with less shaders (1000-2000), bringing the GPU cost down. At the same time, APU will not go down in price, but will gain faster-clocked shaders and increase their number to some 400-800. One more node away, the manufacturer could get rid of the GPU completely, after increasing the number of shaders in the APU to ca. 1000-2000, clocked at twice the initial speed of GPU.
At that time, the APU still costs the same as it did initially, but the GPU is gone, so price goes down. In time, the APU will shrink, integrate more components, bringing the total price to a bargain.
FWIW, that's my take on the market.
alvter said:I don't see how this is bad news: Newer and better technology will replace the Cell that was rumored to be in the PS4. Maybe it will be another version of the Cell. Or (let's start rumors) I just heard that it will use the Bulldozer core!!!
Wel according to http://www.fudzilla.com/content/view/16530/1/ it shows that all fused cores are doomed to fail leaving only the one true GPU manufacturer to rule them all:
Quote:
The Cell inspired both Intel and AMD to create the Larrabee and AMD Fusion respectively. In other words, one or more general purpose cores fused with a number of stream processing units.
Thanks, I added this after you posted:You're V'ger. <slow clap>
Tag'im up, boys.
one casual game means they're not focusing on the core?
So, we have 3 possible configurations according to all rumors:
1. only APU [2 steamroller or jaguar modules with 78xx GPU (~1840gflops)]
2. APU [2 modules + 68xx on chip gpu] + external 79xx class GPU
3. APU +possible GPU +possible 1 or 2 mini CELLs