Support NeoGAF

[GulAtiCa]

I suppose I will at least try applying to the Nintendo devkit loaner program to see what happens. If anyone has any particular advice about what to expect or what I need to have ready, if anything, please let me know. Finding a time to talk to them if they call me will be difficult in itself since I work during the day.

I can answer your questions perfectly.

1: You don't need to have anything ready.
2: When they get back to you, they will first email you to ask for when to best call. I work during day too. So I told them to call me anytime past 7PM. I'm on the east coast, so that probably helped.
3: The call is just a quick 5 minute chat to ask you your name, address, etc and to tell you some info about the program.
4: After a week or so, you will be approved (most likely). Then you can order your dev kit and look at docs.

 

[rohlfinator]

You could use the perspective camera to do 2D without any meshes that look like they use 3 axes.

As long as you keep all sprites on a particular depth, there shouldn't be any issues...the issue becomes depth sorting.

Yeah, I think you'd just need to be very careful to keep everything on the same depth. I suppose it would be possible but it still seems like more trouble than it's worth. At least if you want to do a pixel-perfect game -- other styles would be less sensitive to minor scaling discrepancies.

Wouldn't you still run into horizontal scaling issues too? One unit in the center of the screen is going to look larger than one unit toward the edge. Or am I misunderstanding the way the optics would work?

 

[TrickRoom]

Screenshot Saturday!

aka, "In which I discover why the slime is the first, most commonly appearing, most commonly recolored enemy in nearly every RPG."

They're easy to draw.

 

[Feep]

Wouldn't you still run into horizontal scaling issues too? One unit in the center of the screen is going to look larger than one unit toward the edge. Or am I misunderstanding the way the optics would work?

Yeah, it would be subtle, but you're right. If you want pixel perfect (and why wouldn't you?) just roll Ortho. It's fun and easy!

 

[charsace]

Well you don't use perspec if you want pixel perfect or do tile maps. It would be good for a non tile map game.

 

[Blizzard]

I can answer your questions perfectly.

1: You don't need to have anything ready.
2: When they get back to you, they will first email you to ask for when to best call. I work during day too. So I told them to call me anytime past 7PM. I'm on the east coast, so that probably helped.
3: The call is just a quick 5 minute chat to ask you your name, address, etc and to tell you some info about the program.
4: After a week or so, you will be approved (most likely). Then you can order your dev kit and look at docs.

Much obliged. I tried a Wii U in a store for the first time today.

 

[Sycle]

Wouldn't you still run into horizontal scaling issues too? One unit in the center of the screen is going to look larger than one unit toward the edge. Or am I misunderstanding the way the optics would work?

Only if it was true 3D, which introduces a fisheye effect as the FOV gets larger. Computer 3D is flat perspective, so if you point your perspective camera straight at a box, it'll be the same height all the way across. Even if you make your FOV really wide.

It's not optically correct, but in the case of 2D games in 3D, you can take advantage of it since your quads will be pixel correct no matter where they are on the screen as long as they don't rotate.

 

[Noogy]

I'll buy it at a high price.

Sorry, couldn't help myself. I'll buy Feep's game as well. I'm already in his ecosystem.

 

[Feep]

Sorry, couldn't help myself. I'll buy Feep's game as well. I'm already in his ecosystem.

*waves to Kimlinh, Lucien, and Ed*

<3

 

[Hydrargyrus]

Hi everyone!!

First of all, thanks again for the support comments!

The second, I would want to clarify that Kromaia is not my game, I'm not involved with the development, marketing or anything with the game.
The game is entirely developed by two devs (one of those is my brother-in-law) and non of them have account in Neogaf, so I thought that it would be great to share it here.

Yup, I'm in some way related with the project (I would say "politically") so... yeah, it could be considered autopromotion.
I asked Duckroll for that so, if I couldn't make a thread for this, if someone is interested in making a thread of Kromaia, I could help him with videos/gifs, asking the two developers or even putting him in contact with the devs.



Two more gifs:

Enemy IA patterns (group):

Melee weapon (sword) for close combat

Thanks and I hope you "rike" it!

 

[Galdelico]

Melee weapon (sword) for close combat

Woah, this looks stunning.

Also reminds me of...

which is a nice plus.

 

[Wyndstryker]

Seeing all this stuff makes me wish I can work more on my project during the week.

Still need to get my main char's rough animation down still >_>

Hell I still didn't even finish drawing the basic concept art lol.

 

[bumpkin]

Seeing all this stuff makes me wish I can work more on my project during the week.

Still need to get my main char's rough animation down still >_>

Hell I still didn't even finish drawing the basic concept art lol.

Same here. It's really tough to find time during the week for me to work on my project. And of course on the weekends, I have to do all the stuff I also don't have time to do during the week. It's a vicious cycle.

 

[rohlfinator]

Only if it was true 3D, which introduces a fisheye effect as the FOV gets larger. Computer 3D is flat perspective, so if you point your perspective camera straight at a box, it'll be the same height all the way across. Even if you make your FOV really wide.

It's not optically correct, but in the case of 2D games in 3D, you can take advantage of it since your quads will be pixel correct no matter where they are on the screen as long as they don't rotate.

Ah, that makes sense, thanks for the explanation!

 

[charsace]

Need some Unity help. I am trying to the the world coordinates for the mouse position in the scene view. What I've tried so far involving GUIPointToWorldRay and ScreenPointToRay doesn't work. All it every number in the point that i get from doing this is wrong. I'm using the scene view camera.

 

[Feep]

Need some Unity help. I am trying to the the world coordinates for the mouse position in the scene view. What I've tried so far involving GUIPointToWorldRay and ScreenPointToRay doesn't work. All it every number in the point that i get from doing this is wrong. I'm using the scene view camera.

Try this:

public Vector3 screenToWorld(Vector2 screenPos)
{
    Ray ray = Camera.main.ScreenPointToRay(screenPos);

    float t = -ray.origin.y / ray.direction.y;
    return ray.GetPoint(t);
}

 

[charsace]

Try this:

public Vector3 screenToWorld(Vector2 screenPos)
{
    Ray ray = Camera.main.ScreenPointToRay(screenPos);

    float t = -ray.origin.y / ray.direction.y;
    return ray.GetPoint(t);
}

still not working. With main camera it gives infinity. With current camera (the scene camera it gives 0's.

 

[Five]

Seeing all this stuff makes me wish I can work more on my project during the week.

Same here. By the time I'm done working on a week day, I get to a place where I need to relax or hang out with people, not hole myself up in my home office to work on the game. So weekends are when I get stuff done.

The bills are paid, quite handily, but every Screenshot Saturday that passes is a reminder of how little I accomplished that week.

 

[Feep]

still not working. With main camera it gives infinity. With current camera (the scene camera it gives 0's.

It works for me, but my game is set up such that the plane I want to hit is the plane where y = 0, i.e., the flat ground in 3-D space. If you're doing a 2-D title and your "world" is a vertical plane, you should change the .y to .x or .z (and make sure your flat plane is at x = 0 or z = 0).

The code obviously only works with the main camera, but that can be easily changed.

 

[charsace]

It works for me, but my game is set up such that the plane I want to hit is the plane where y = 0, i.e., the flat ground in 3-D space. If you're doing a 2-D title and your "world" is a vertical plane, you should change the .y to .x or .z (and make sure your flat plane is at x = 0 or z = 0).

The code obviously only works with the main camera, but that can be easily changed.

The z will always be zero for me though since mouse position is stored in a vector2. The code you gave me translates the x axis, z axis is always zero. The y axis number is still screwy. When I zoom or move the camera the y screws up, but the x is fine.

 

[Feep]

The z will always be zero for me though since mouse position is stored in a vector2. The code you gave me translates the x axis, z axis is always zero. The y axis number is still screwy. When I zoom or move the camera the y screws up, but the x is fine.

You're misunderstanding. Obviously THAT z doesn't exist, but the code posted only uses the mouse x and y coordinates in ScreenToRay. It then basically fires a ray from that point, and the further calculations are used to determine where on that ray the "world point" is. In the code above, the intersection of the xz plane and the ray is the "world point", but that's how my scene geometry is laid out. I don't know how yours is. It SOUNDS like your world is on the xy plane (you really need to give me more information, or a screenshot of your editor, or something), in which case you would change the ray.origin and ray.direction line from .y to .z.

 

[charsace]

You're misunderstanding. Obviously THAT z doesn't exist, but the code posted only uses the mouse x and y coordinates in ScreenToRay. It then basically fires a ray from that point, and the further calculations are used to determine where on that ray the "world point" is. In the code above, the intersection of the xz plane and the ray is the "world point", but that's how my scene geometry is laid out. I don't know how yours is. It SOUNDS like your world is on the xy plane (you really need to give me more information, or a screenshot of your editor, or something), in which case you would change the ray.origin and ray.direction line from .y to .z.

I understood that and changed it to y based off of what you said in the first post. That's the reason why its close to working. Whenever I zoom or move the scene camera the y axis falls apart in regards to what number it gives.

 

[keit4]

Hey guys, what tools do you use for prototyping? I have experience programming in Java, C, C++, C# and HTML5+javascript, so i'm ok with tools using these languages.

 

[Blizzard]

Hey guys, what tools do you use for prototyping? I have experience programming in Java, C, C++, C# and HTML5+javascript, so i'm ok with tools using these languages.

It may depend on what sort of game or mechanic you want to prototype. For simple 2D stuff, tools like Game Maker, Construct 2, GameSalad, or Stencyl might be pretty quick to use.

 

[keit4]

It may depend on what sort of game or mechanic you want to prototype. For simple 2D stuff, tools like Game Maker, Construct 2, GameSalad, or Stencyl might be pretty quick to use.

Thanks for the response. I'm trying to make a prototype of an action/adventure game with isometric perspective, but i don't know what is better, a 2D approach or a 3D one(i guess i should have asked this first). Do someone here have experience with both?

 

[Turfster]

Thanks for the response. I'm trying to make a prototype of an action/adventure game with isometric perspective, but i don't know what is better, a 2D approach or a 3D one(i guess i should have asked this first). Do someone here have experience with both?

Prototyping isometric stuff in 3D (with say, Unity) is pretty easy.
It's a matter of tilting your base plane and setting your camera.
Note that 'easy' is relative, you're still going to have to do your coding

 

[Blizzard]

Thanks for the response. I'm trying to make a prototype of an action/adventure game with isometric perspective, but i don't know what is better, a 2D approach or a 3D one(i guess i should have asked this first). Do someone here have experience with both?

Prototyping isometric stuff in 3D (with say, Unity) is pretty easy.
It's a matter of tilting your base plane and setting your camera.
Note that 'easy' is relative, you're still going to have to do your coding

I'd suggest checking out Unity then, keit4. You can do pure 2D isometric stuff in theory, but it might be easier to experiment in 3D if you can find some placeholder models.

Unity Pro isn't free, but the free version should be able to do some reasonable stuff, and I am guessing there are tutorials or example code available for setting up an isometric setup quite easily. Also, Unity can use C# which you said you have experience with.

UDK on the other hand is also free, and isn't really limited aside from no source code access, BUT it is probably a good bit harder to get into and is generally much more suited for FPS games. Plus it has its own UnrealScript language rather than C# or something.

 

[Cameron122]

Two more gifs:

Enemy IA patterns (group):

Melee weapon (sword) for close combat

Thanks and I hope you "rike" it!

I rike it. I rike it arot.

 

[rohlfinator]

I've also heard good things about prototyping using Processing:
http://processing.org/

Might be worth looking into since you're familiar with JavaScript.

 

[Feep]

Thanks for the response. I'm trying to make a prototype of an action/adventure game with isometric perspective, but i don't know what is better, a 2D approach or a 3D one(i guess i should have asked this first). Do someone here have experience with both?

Helpful tip: getting a true isometric perspective requires setting the camera to a downward tilt of 35.264 degrees. Something something math. ; )

 

[charsace]

Helpful tip: getting a true isometric perspective requires setting the camera to a downward tilt of 35.264 degrees. Something something math. ; )

you need an ortho camera too.

 

[Ashodin]

IT'S FINISHED

 

[RelentlessRolento]

nice... looking great man!

 

[keit4]

Prototyping isometric stuff in 3D (with say, Unity) is pretty easy.
It's a matter of tilting your base plane and setting your camera.
Note that 'easy' is relative, you're still going to have to do your coding

I'd suggest checking out Unity then, keit4. You can do pure 2D isometric stuff in theory, but it might be easier to experiment in 3D if you can find some placeholder models.

Unity Pro isn't free, but the free version should be able to do some reasonable stuff, and I am guessing there are tutorials or example code available for setting up an isometric setup quite easily. Also, Unity can use C# which you said you have experience with.

Thanks for the replies. I always wanted to try Unity but never had a chance, this could be the perfect excuse.

Helpful tip: getting a true isometric perspective requires setting the camera to a downward tilt of 35.264 degrees. Something something math. ; )

What is the explanation behind this? Why not 36 degrees? Is that some kind of magic number or something?

EDIT: just found this:

The reason for this angle is so that the width of the tile ends up being twice its height. This way you can get an even 2:1 ratio when drawing the diagonals so the tiles line up neatly without any gaps.

 

[bumpkin]

Ever since I got into the Wii U Developer program, I've been thinking about switching the lead platform to Wii U (from Mac), but I can't understate the convenience and speed of being able to build and test the engine on a dime. I feel like having to deploy it to an external machine would increase the time ten-fold.

Maybe I'll stick with building it on Mac and then when it's close to done, start porting it to Wii U. All I should have to rewrite is stuff like rendering, audio and input. The rest should all work since it's already being written in C++.

 

[GulAtiCa]

Man, I'm so close to finish coding my Wii U game. I can easily see myself being fully done with the code (for most part) within 2 to 3 weeks. Once that's done, I'll quickly port it back over to the normal web so I can get some feedback so people here and elsewhere can help test it out.

While that's going on, I plan to begin work on the graphics. I plan to do them myself, I have an idea for how it should look. That should really only take me less then a week, as the game is mostly small, and reuses assets/etc. If I don't like the look, I'll likely hire someone.

At same time, with game online for testing, I'll start to look around for someone to do music/sound effects for the game. Hopefully that won't cost me too much, esp as I really only need menu music and 1 or 2 main game music.

Then it will be all done! Really excited to be able to see the finish goal in sight.

 

[Jobbs]

Man, I'm so close to finish coding my Wii U game. I can easily see myself being fully done with the code (for most part) within 2 to 3 weeks. Once that's done, I'll quickly port it back over to the normal web so I can get some feedback so people here and elsewhere can help test it out.

While that's going on, I plan to begin work on the graphics. I plan to do them myself, I have an idea for how it should look. That should really only take me less then a week, as the game is mostly small, and reuses assets/etc. If I don't like the look, I'll likely hire someone.

At same time, with game online for testing, I'll start to look around for someone to do music/sound effects for the game. Hopefully that won't cost me too much, esp as I really only need menu music and 1 or 2 main game music.

Then it will be all done! Really excited to be able to see the finish goal in sight.

Details about your game? What is it?

 

[keit4]

So, i downloaded the free version of Unity and played a little with the editor and the example project. Looks very easy to use, but a little overwhelming for newcomers. Can someone recommend me some good books or tutorials to learn the basics?

 

[Feep]

Thanks for the replies. I always wanted to try Unity but never had a chance, this could be the perfect excuse.



What is the explanation behind this? Why not 36 degrees? Is that some kind of magic number or something?

EDIT: just found this:

Actually, if you want to use 2:1 pixel art, that isn't true isometric. For that, you *set* the camera to 30 degrees, which makes the actual angle of the axes about 26.565 degrees apart.

To see the math involved (trigonometry warning!), see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isometric_graphics_in_video_games_and_pixel_art

 

[Lautaro]

So, i downloaded the free version of Unity and played a little with the editor and the example project. Looks very easy to use, but a little overwhelming for newcomers. Can someone recommend me some good books or tutorials to learn the basics?

A book that really helped me: Unity Game Development Essentials

And try the tutorials in the official site, there's a FPS tutorial and 3d platformer that are really good to learn the basics.

 

[razu]

Hey!

Amazon featured Chopper Mike as the free app of the day last week, and 92,000 people downloaded it.

Since then I've seen a real increase in sales on Android and iOS. So it's worth pursuing every line of promotion you can get!

I'm going to update Captain Jatobe now... as it's still my favourite prototype I've made so far

Prototype here for anyone new to the thread:

​

 

[GulAtiCa]

Details about your game? What is it?

A simple, yet challenging, Tower Defense genre game for Wii U. I'm calling it ZaciSa's Last Stand. Here is a little more detail about the game that I wrote up last week.

I really look forward to getting around to the graphics stage of the project and applying the grpahics, and shaping the game to look like what I have in my mind.

 

[JulianImp]

So, i downloaded the free version of Unity and played a little with the editor and the example project. Looks very easy to use, but a little overwhelming for newcomers. Can someone recommend me some good books or tutorials to learn the basics?

Here're a few links I've been gathering. Hopefully, you'll find at least some of them useful. I might edit an explanation of each link later, but for now all I can do is copy-paste them from my browser's bookmarks list:
http://unitypatterns.com/
http://www.unifycommunity.com/
http://cgcookie.com/unity/
http://drupal.technicat.com/games/unity.html
http://www.unity3dstudent.com/
http://catlikecoding.com/unity/tutorials/star/
http://gamasutra.com/blogs/JohnWarn...5_things_Ive_learned_as_a_Unity_developer.php
http://www.sizefivegames.com/2012/11/07/using-unity3d-for-the-swindles-2d/
http://blog.heyworks.com/tutorial-writing-your-first-shader-in-unity3d/

 

[Limanima]

Hey!

Amazon featured Chopper Mike as the free app of the day last week, and 92,000 people downloaded it.

Since then I've seen a real increase in sales on Android and iOS. So it's worth pursuing every line of promotion you can get!

I'm going to update Captain Jatobe now... as it's still my favourite prototype I've made so far

Prototype here for anyone new to the thread:

​

I was about to proudly announce that today Snails surpassed 100K downloads on Windows Phone, and then I saw your post.
92K downloads in a day?
Wow...

 

[beril]

Ever since I got into the Wii U Developer program, I've been thinking about switching the lead platform to Wii U (from Mac), but I can't understate the convenience and speed of being able to build and test the engine on a dime. I feel like having to deploy it to an external machine would increase the time ten-fold.

Maybe I'll stick with building it on Mac and then when it's close to done, start porting it to Wii U. All I should have to rewrite is stuff like rendering, audio and input. The rest should all work since it's already being written in C++.

It's always much quicker to develop, test and iterate on PC (or I guess mac if that's the way you roll). The way I've done for both smartphones and 3DS is to have two SVN branches of the engine code and a single branch of the game code for the two (or more) versions of the project. I mainly work on the PC version and sync the "real" version maybe once a week. For purely graphical stuff that differs between platforms and doesn't really effect anything else, I often don't bother doing it on PC. You still want to be able to test in regularly on on your primary platform during development, but yea, working solely on the hardware would be rather cumbersome. And I also have some basic editors incorporated in the PC version that I obviously can't use on the hardware.

 

[FormallyMegadrive]

I was about to proudly announce that today Snails surpassed 100K downloads on Windows Phone, and then I saw your post.
92K downloads in a day?
Wow...

100k on Windows Phone is a pretty substantial feat! Well done!

 

[Blizzard]

Whoops, I just realized from earlier poster(s) that it's apparently a couple of months before you get an email from Nintendo after submitting the online form. I guess there's time to do other stuff first!

 

[GulAtiCa]

Yep, took them like 3 or 4 months for me.

But perhaps now it should go much faster, hopefully.

 

[Jobbs]

75% done with the new main character sprites. Comical how long this takes me, but it's also the biggest single job on the art side. Not just because of the greater number of animations, and the need for a left and right hand version of each, but due to my own obsessing (I place extreme importance on the main character sprites in any game like this).

I've got running and jumping and 8 way aiming (in the prototype I had only gotten to 4 way aiming) and idling and shooting --- and, as a new addition, I've got stuns and flinches and knockdowns. In my prototype, taking damage was handled nearly identically to how it is done in 2D metroid games. Now, if you are hit while on the ground, you'll be flinched but not bounced around much, unless you take too much damage in a short time (either by repeated hits or a heavy hit) in which case you will be knocked off your feet and fall down. Part of the reason for this is just a style/flow choice -- using the general metroid formula while trying to modernize it. It also changes the basic feel and pace of the game in a way that I find desirable.

Taking damage in the air is still something I'm working on, but I think it will be much easier to be knocked down if you are hit while airborne compared to if you are hit on the ground.

 

[Feep]

75% done with the new main character sprites. Comical how long this takes me, but it's also the biggest single job on the art side. Not just because of the greater number of animations, and the need for a left and right hand version of each, but due to my own obsessing (I place extreme importance on the main character sprites in any game like this).

I've got running and jumping and 8 way aiming (in the prototype I had only gotten to 4 way aiming) and idling and shooting --- and, as a new addition, I've got stuns and flinches and knockdowns. In my prototype, taking damage was handled nearly identically to how it is done in 2D metroid games. Now, if you are hit while on the ground, you'll be flinched but not bounced around much, unless you take too much damage in a short time (either by repeated hits or a heavy hit) in which case you will be knocked off your feet and fall down. Part of the reason for this is just a style/flow choice -- using the general metroid formula while trying to modernize it. It also changes the basic feel and pace of the game in a way that I find desirable.

Taking damage in the air is still something I'm working on, but I think it will be much easier to be knocked down if you are hit while airborne compared to if you are hit on the ground.

It's great, but that eye flashing is way too rapid for me. I guess if it's only meant to be an indicator of low health it's okay?