iPhone - Official Thread
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Kung Fu Jedi
Member
RevenantKioku said:Pardon me for assuming the rest of the world caught up with quality.
Hahahaha Yeah! Thank goodness Japan discovered push e-mail!
VanMardigan said:
I had Rogers lock me out of being able to access the net outside of my Wi-Fi network. There are no dead spots in my house.
Oh, and I definitely see where I'd love having a data plan, but I just have to save money. I'll get a data plan in the future, likely after I finish University, but for now it would just be a luxury.
Also, one reason dissuading me from getting a data plan is that my University engineering building shields wireless signals, so it would be useless to me there (not to mention I have VPN access). The main thing I'm losing here is GPS.
OK this is really shitting me and I'm wondering if it's just me.
The damn earphones that come with the iPhone. They are so damn annoying. They for some reason are all springy and bounce around everywhere, and never straighten. They are also made of some funny sticky rubber that grabs hold of every bloody thing it gets close to. With these two attributes I find the earphones aggravating beyond belief.
The cord is bouncing around spring like and grabbing parts of my clothing, pulling on my ears. Please tell me I'm not the only one.
The damn earphones that come with the iPhone. They are so damn annoying. They for some reason are all springy and bounce around everywhere, and never straighten. They are also made of some funny sticky rubber that grabs hold of every bloody thing it gets close to. With these two attributes I find the earphones aggravating beyond belief.
The cord is bouncing around spring like and grabbing parts of my clothing, pulling on my ears. Please tell me I'm not the only one.
http://gizmodo.com/5050849/iphones-...-genius-capability-and-playlist-creatoreditor
Remote app updated, can create normal and Genius playlists. Awesome. One this I never understood is why you can't remotely control view Party Shuffle playlist, nor switch to it and control it unless it's already the selected mode in iTunes.
Party Shuffle selecting from my main playlist is what I use 99% of the time in iTunes. Sure I could just have a playlist on Shuffle, but that doesn't let me see what tracks are upcoming and let me edit the queue, does it? It's so it's dumb that you have to be at the computer to control it.
Remote app updated, can create normal and Genius playlists. Awesome. One this I never understood is why you can't remotely control view Party Shuffle playlist, nor switch to it and control it unless it's already the selected mode in iTunes.
Party Shuffle selecting from my main playlist is what I use 99% of the time in iTunes. Sure I could just have a playlist on Shuffle, but that doesn't let me see what tracks are upcoming and let me edit the queue, does it? It's so it's dumb that you have to be at the computer to control it.
No, I think you are completely in the clear. Except the bit where you get a bit pissed off.RevenantKioku said:
The problem here is that mobile providers give e-mail accounts in Japan which are essentially pushed to devices by notifying the device that a new message is available. This works for most Japanese most perfectly since it pretty much replaces SMS when properly implemented. It doesn't work the same way as regular push e-mail works on iPhone because this one is standard across all phones in Japan, it's up to the phone to work out what to do with the actual notification.
It seems SoftBank/Apple did a half-assed implementation of that notification. The difference between regular e-mail here appears to be that the iPhone doesn't actually retrieve the message when the notification is pushed to it, only when you open e-mail. That dialog appears to be similar/the same as what would be displayed if you request the IMEI or to get a list of enabled services from the phone.
The way it has been implemented, it doesn't vibrate, which I feel is completely justified to complain about. People are completely missing the point when they say "Duh, use fetch e-mail, haw haw." Since the dedicated e-mail from mobile providers in Japan essentially replace SMS, it's expected that it works like SMS does. So instead of comparing it to how e-mail works in for the rest of us, compare it to how SMS works. That means the phone should get a notification pushed to it as soon as it's received, which it then notifes the user about. Fetching is just plain out of the question in this context. If any one of you had to fetch SMS every 15min, I think you'd be up in arms as well.
The way the notification delivery for this service is implemented on iPhone is just plain stupid, I'm surprised not more people are complaining about it. Could it be that everyone else is continuing life as usual with the more advanced phones designed specifically for the Japanese market, which often go cheaper than the iPhone does? Hmm...
Kung Fu Jedi
Member
hirokazu said:No, I think you are completely in the clear. Except the bit where you get a bit pissed off.
The problem here is that mobile providers give e-mail accounts in Japan which are essentially pushed to devices by notifying the device that a new message is available. This works for most Japanese most perfectly since it pretty much replaces SMS when properly implemented. It doesn't work the same way as regular push e-mail works on iPhone because this one is standard across all phones in Japan, it's up to the phone to work out what to do with the actual notification.
It seems SoftBank/Apple did a half-assed implementation of that notification. The difference between regular e-mail here appears to be that the iPhone doesn't actually retrieve the message when the notification is pushed to it, only when you open e-mail. That dialog appears to be similar/the same as what would be displayed if you request the IMEI or to get a list of enabled services from the phone.
The way it has been implemented, it doesn't vibrate, which I feel is completely justified to complain about. People are completely missing the point when they say "Duh, use fetch e-mail, haw haw." Since the dedicated e-mail from mobile providers in Japan essentially replace SMS, it's expected that it works like SMS does, meaning the phone should get a notification pushed to it as soon as it's received. If any one of you had to fetch SMS every 15min, I think you'd be up in arms as well.
The way the notification delivery for this service is implemented on iPhone is just plain stupid, I'm surprised not more people are complaining about it. Could it be that everyone else is continuing life as usual with the more advanced phones designed specifically for the Japanese market, which often go cheaper than the iPhone does? Hmm...
We've kind of moved on past this awhile a go now, but again, we haven't told him to simply use fetch mail. We've said, on more than one occasion, to get a push e-mail account. Problem solved.
And yes, this is a unique option for the Japanese market, and we get that. It seems like the provider is the one who has made a half-assed implementation. Using a push server, they should be able to do what he needs.
But as I've said, think of the service as using SMS. So what you recommend is about the same as saying "Don't need to use SMS, just use regular e-mail for all your communications needs!" Not really solved, IMO.Kung Fu Jedi said:
No one can really fix the isssue except SoftBank or Apple.
PotatoeMasher
Member
elostyle said:
What else would it do, squash the alarm until after the call is over?
Not being defensive or anything, just curious why it's such a bad thing. It seems like I want to know if a meeting is coming up and I've been on the phone past what I expected or some such.
Kung Fu Jedi
Member
hirokazu said:
No, it's really not. But we've beaten this dead horse.
Email, as a communication protocol, was not designed for short blurbing back and forth. It's Japan's own fault for jury-rigging email to suit a function that SMS/MMS filled without issues. They tried to re-invent the wheel and now suffer the consequences of this bad decision with an international device meant to function on the standard operations of both the internet and mobile markets.hirokazu said:
It is what it is because it was made to be that way long before Softbank and Apple got involved, asking them to fix something they aren't responsible for just ain't going to happen. Suck it up.
RevenantKioku
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Well, the annoying thing is that the technology is obviously there and being unused. If the iPhone knows when a mail has arrived, the hard part is already done! Just make a fucking noise! It's what the thing was designed to do!
I do apologize for assuming that the iPhone worked the same way in all countries, but when I started getting that pop-up, I'd hope you can see where my own confusion stemmed from.
Still, when I say it's making a sound and you ask me to check to make sure that it's not silenced that will kinda drive me batty.
So anyway, my reception is more awesomer after 2.1. Wat? Anyway, what's a usable flickr app? All the one(s) I have been trying suck. PixUp kinda does nothing.
I do apologize for assuming that the iPhone worked the same way in all countries, but when I started getting that pop-up, I'd hope you can see where my own confusion stemmed from.
Still, when I say it's making a sound and you ask me to check to make sure that it's not silenced that will kinda drive me batty.
So anyway, my reception is more awesomer after 2.1. Wat? Anyway, what's a usable flickr app? All the one(s) I have been trying suck. PixUp kinda does nothing.
Yeah, seriously, at this point, the best solution is to get another email provider that does push. That will work exactly the way you want it to and gives you a mail account that's more universally accessible for either Japan's blurby emails or the more traditional long-winded Western kind of emails. A "one-stop shop", basically. The only catch is if these email addresses work just like SMS does where you don't need to know the email address, just the phone number. If these mail messages are done by phone number, then yah, not an ideal solution, I guess.RevenantKioku said:Well, the annoying thing is that the technology is obviously there and being unused. If the iPhone knows when a mail has arrived, the hard part is already done! Just make a fucking noise! It's what the thing was designed to do!
I do apologize for assuming that the iPhone worked the same way in all countries, but when I started getting that pop-up, I'd hope you can see where my own confusion stemmed from.
Still, when I say it's making a sound and you ask me to check to make sure that it's not silenced that will kinda drive me batty.
So anyway, my reception is more awesomer after 2.1. Wat? Anyway, what's a usable flickr app? All the one(s) I have been trying suck. PixUp kinda does nothing.
An APN is an Access Point Name. It's what the iPhone connects to to connect to mobile internet. Usually there's an internet.com APN and a WAP APN specific to your provider (AT&T, Rogers, Fido, etc). Installing the Fake APN sets the APN to one that doesn't exist so that your phone can't connect to mobile internet even if it wanted to.dagZ said:
You mean to upload pictures to from your phone? Try ShoZu. I'm only using it for Photobucket so far but it's awesome for that. It has a Flickr option as well.RevenantKioku said:
Terrell said:
But e-mail's advantage over SMS/MMS is that it goes as part of any data plan cell phone subscribers sell. I find it ridiculous for ATT to charge me $5, $15 or $20 for sending a number of text messages each month. Meanwhile, I'll get an e-mail account that compliments my data plan each month. It's also easier to maintain contact with email addresses than to use SMS. SMS was crafted in an era when phones were still relatively unsophisticated, and therefore suited the nature of older cellphones well.
Ironically, it may be the iPhone's ability to become widespread in the US that makes SMS ancient and redundant. Of course the carriers wouldn't like that since they get no benefit out of it.
Anyway, RK's grievances are really part of the greater picture regarding Apple's dropping of a phone tailored to westerners into a highly advanced and dynamic market like Japan. RK's problem is really, really a drop in the bucket compared to the other issues the Japanese iPhone faces. Which is a shame! I'm probably moving back to Japan in March, which means I have to give up my American iPhone 3G which I love! But there's NO way in hell I'm using the iPhone 3G in Japan until they Japanify it.
Sean said:
Aye, Vista's problems reports and solutions app linked me to http://support.apple.com/kb/TS2280
You say "Western", but... how many millions of unlocked iPhones are in China again? Last I checked, they're not "Western". This is a problem isolated squarely on the insular market of Japan and South Korea.cvxfreak said:
The problem is that Apple, unlike other manufacturers, weren't willing to suck Japanese carrier's dicks and do things Japan's way (no big shock Apple paired with Softbank, the company that wants to introduce more international mobile phone market trends to Japan). But in a world market, having specific rules for what should be considered an international product is unreasonable. Instead of becoming an insular market, Japan should have introduced technologies that could be standardized to the rest of the world. Being a pioneer at the expense of interoperability is one step forward and two steps back, as far as I'm concerned. Being in Vancouver, and knowing a bunch of Japanese people, they get really pissed at the fact that they were FORCED to buy a new phone as soon as they left Japan or South Korea (which operates similarly, I'm told) because their mobile market is only sustainable in their home countries. And a fair majority of Japanese iPhone buyers, according to polls on launch day, were buying it because it's "a really cool phone I can travel with for once". That speaks wonders for the situation. Asking Apple to special-engineer a phone for ONE market out of hundreds is not really acceptable. And besides, if the charts I've been seeing are accurate, it hasn't been hurting iPhone sales there, either.
RevenantKioku
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It's not "special engineering" jack shit. It is taking fully doable technology and giving an option to enable it.
The way my phone is functioning right now shows it CAN behave like I want it to. I just do not have the options for it.
The way my phone is functioning right now shows it CAN behave like I want it to. I just do not have the options for it.
Terrell said:
Uh... how many millions of iPhones exist in the world period? :lol Moreover, what does the iPhone do to specifically address Chinese cellular phone needs? It's easy for me at least to hone in on Japanese and Korean phone habits since I've spent time in both countries.
And hence, they lose out on a potentially and historically profitable market(s) for themselves while crowding themselves out of excellent technological opportunities. Too bad for Apple, who've always cared about their position in Japan with other products.
Then again, Apple is the company that released the AppleTV in Japan despite not having a Movie Store in that country. Go figure that they wouldn't alter the iPhone either.
And Softbank sure does want to introduce international cellphone standards into Japan. They sure do well with their crappy network coverage and miserable customer service. :lol
Why should Japan give it up what it's achieved just because western countries have a different cultural infrastructure? Curse Japan, which has consistently introduced new technologies in many fields, for making phones work underground! Japan sucks for making cell phones with excellent battery life!
Moreover, why is it so hard for Apple to incorporate Japanese smileys into their already extensive firmware system? The concept of using cellphones to pay for train rides doesn't HAVE to be limited to Japan. I can use it here in the Bay Area or even in Vancouver, which I visited recently.
Moreover, cellphone email is not a "technology" that cannot be standardized for the rest of the world. In the iPhone's case, we're not even asking for it to be forced onto the rest of the world; we're only asking for a small software modification to allow it to function like it has in Japan for the last few years.
I'm from San Francisco and we have a Japanese population here too. I've met few Japanese people happy with American cell phones in general. Even Americans who have returned to Japan start to notice the things they've taken for granted, like infrared ports that allow contact information to be instantly changed. Making me call someone to get the information is just retarded in comparison.
ONE gigantic and innovative market. There's a reason why companies like Louis Vuitton, Burberry, Starbucks and McDonalds can succeed in Japan, and it's because they tend to make their offerings fit in the context of the Japanese market. Apple doesn't HAVE to modify the iPhone for Japan physically, but the fact they won't do it on the software scale is just pathetic and lazy, and they deserve any bad rep they get from people who have experience with Japanese phones.
Also, http://www.appleinsider.com/article...cult_to_crack_japanese_cell_phone_market.html
The statistics show that 1-2 million grey market iPhones manufactured by Apple are activated and used in China.cvxfreak said:
And iPhone does not specifically address Chinese cellular needs, because it doesn't have to, as China operates and uses all the same tech standards, INCLUDING GSM, that the rest of the world does. Saying it's a "Western" thing when China, Singapore, Hong Kong and India (as well as several others, I'm sure) don't seem to have any troubles having the phone operate normally on its networks using its features is flagrant mis-labeling of the issue at hand, and I just figured I should call you on it. It's not an East vs. West thing, it's a Japan vs. globalization thing.
Remember how analysts said that iPhone would sink like a stone because it's not a "Japanese" phone? Why would anyone expect Apple to release a region-specific OS for what is supposed to be an international device? Or spend millions on a new production line for a Japan-specific iPhone to get all the other crap keitai-junkies say iPhone will fail without, like 1seg and osaifu-keitai? You bend a little to region-specific demands, and you run the risk of having to bend til you break.cvxfreak said:
Hey, it still works as a media hub for non-iTunes media content. SOMEONE might want it *coughtorrenterscough*cvxfreak said:
And if the holdup for the Canadian movie section of the iTunes Store is any indication, the reason Japan doesn't have one is because of broadcasters and the local film industry, especially Sony, who are kinda VERY anti-Apple in Japan, what with stealing the mobile music player market from them and all.
There you go with that mis-labeling again. And yeah, hooray for them introducing tech with NO intention of introducing it to the rest of the world market! Seriously, how is it that we can rail on companies like Nintendo for not making region-free consoles, but region-specific tech like this gets a free pass?cvxfreak said:
Smileys are written and utilized differently in every region of the world. To implement such a thing, every region would need region-specific firmware. Do YOU see that happening? Cuz all I see is a logistics nightmare in the making if it came to that.cvxfreak said:
No, osaifu-keitai is not in operation in Vancouver. I LIVE here, I would know it. No phones that can operate on Canadian carriers have FeliCa chips. SkyTrain doesn't even have turnstyles to prohibit people from boarding without fares, it's all monitored by transit personnel. You must be thinking of a different city.
Email on cell phones is only NOW being implemented in all devices, and it is accessed in a way that does not replace the function of SMS, because SMS has gained its stranglehold on the North American's cellular usage pattern.cvxfreak said:
I won't deny that notifications for email in the same vein as SMS would be a cool feature, but depending on how the mobile infrastructure implements this system in Japan, it might not be a matter of a "simple tweak", as you refer to it.
I won't deny that North American phones, in many ways, seem almost prehistoric in comparison in a few easy ways, but that's the price the Japanese pay for not having its technology standardized before they began mass implementation into its mobile infrastructure and most of them know it.cvxfreak said:
Terrell said:
Then we're on a different page here. Getting the iPhone to operate in a particular country is not an issue at all, and adding 3G into the iPhone didn't harm its operability worldwide.
I won't even get into the debate of the iPhone's defective Asian text input, but on the issue of Japan vs. globalization: I would agree with you wanting Japan to conform internationally if Japan were overall different but equal or flat out inferior, but this isn't the case at all.
If that's the risk Apple doesn't want to take or doesn't feel they would be rewarded with for the effort, then that's fine. But if Apple gets criticized for it and get accused of offering a technologically subpar phone, then that's the hit they'll have to take, and criticizing Japan for being different doesn't take anything away from their excellent technology.
Mislabeling? If Apple needs the gray market to prove a point, then they've sunk to a new low. These Chinese statistics are just estimates with no solid proof, but if what you say is reality (ignoring things such as the unlikliness of specialized Chinese iPhone websites or App Store apps, the troublesome Asian text input...) then I'll gladly alter my statement to advanced vs. antiquated.
Anyway, how can you say Japan has introduced new technology with no intent to introduce it to the rest of the world? Are they literally preventing the rest of the world from adopting its high class standards, or are you actually asking them to downscale their ambitions because the rest of the world is happy where they are?
The Wii comparison is moot for obvious reasons, since it has nothing to do with conforming to international standards, and Apple wouldn't need to make a different phone or firmware unless they wanted to dig deeper into the Japanese market.
For a company like Apple? Come on now.
You're looking at the iPhone as if it were an ordinary phone, and in that context, I would agree with you. But the thing runs a version of OSX, an international operating system! Apple's never had to make country-specific firmware because it doesn't even have to come down that. Apple could totally work something like emoji or the keitai-mail notification system into their firmware and just note it for Japanese users. I didn't see Apple implode when they decided to include Japanese envelopes as printer paper options in their apps or the Japanese Heisei calendar as a system setting, as an example.
I didn't say that, osaifu-keitai is used in the US because it isn't; I was speaking theoretically, and I'm thinking of SF, which does have the BART system of turnstiles. Either way, I'm going to just make the point that the U.S. (and other places) have a long way to go with the mere usage of refillable cards, so we don't have to get further into a debate about osaifu-keitai.
That's fine! And I've made my peace with that fact in initially choosing the unlimited SMS option after my awesome keitai-mail eperience. The point stands that Apple stands to lose nothing by adding that additional Japanese-oriented functionality into the phone.
"Simple" or not, Apple has the resources to get the software side of the Japan equation working. I won't be as critical of them for leaving out 1Seg or osaifu-keitai, which they have a pretty decent reason for excluding. I find issues like RK's and emoji unacceptable.
But are they really paying a price in practice, when they receive so many other be in return?
Basically, since I'm not out here to argue all day, my gripe with Apple is that they seem unable or unwilling to adjust the Japanese iPhone even on the software side of the equation, and then they or their fans will complain about it's lack of penetration there and in Korea. I can't tell Apple what decisions to make, but they're making a huge mistake if they can develop all these nice iPhone and Mac applications as well as interesting things like MobileMe, but can't even put emoji into their firmware.
If Apple is content selling few iPhones in Japan, then this whole argument is moot and you're right.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
Problem: the headphone jack on my phone isn't letting me plug my headphones in all the way. I really have to push to get them in far enough to get proper sound from both of them and the smallest jiggling of the cord causes the iPod to stop playing. On top of that, assumably because the headphone aren't going all the way in, the mic/pause-skip button isn't working either. This only started happening recently and I've had the 3G model since launch.
This is not a problem with the headphones themselves as I have tried at least 4 others that work fine on my PC, old iPod. Any ideas on what the issue is and how I can get it fixed?
This is not a problem with the headphones themselves as I have tried at least 4 others that work fine on my PC, old iPod. Any ideas on what the issue is and how I can get it fixed?
lionelhutz
Member
Has anyone used the hard cases from the Apple site? I've been looking for one and can't decide. I found a case through iPodLounge http://www.iskin.com/fuze_overview.tpl. They have a hard case that I like but it's not out for the 3G model.
Also, are the screen protectors any good? How well does the touch screen work through the protector?
Also, are the screen protectors any good? How well does the touch screen work through the protector?
Worm_Buffet
Member
Has anyone been able to actually scratch, or in some other way visibly damage their iPhone in any way?
I have had my 3G since launch and have not been using a case or any protection. It still looks as good as new as soon as I wipe of the smudges, so why turn this marvel of industrial design into an ugly, cumbersome brick with some gaudy case?
I have had my 3G since launch and have not been using a case or any protection. It still looks as good as new as soon as I wipe of the smudges, so why turn this marvel of industrial design into an ugly, cumbersome brick with some gaudy case?
Rez>You said:
You sure you're just not pushing hard enough? I assume not, since you've had the phone for a while, but figured I'd throw it out there anyways. I got my iPhone 2 days ago, and was surprised at how hard I had to push to get the jack in. They used a really good headphone jack for the iPhone, compared to previous iPods.
Worm_Buffet said:
I have a phantom scratch or two on the screen. Don't know how they got there. I don't baby my phone because it's proven to be very durable. I have 0 protection for it.
I did drop it on asphalt once and it slide for a foot or so. It was in perfect condition so I have 0 clue how those scratches got there. Maybe I left my keys in the same pocket...
RevenantKioku
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Dude, they already have a script running that pops up a text message. They just need to throw in calls to MakeNoise() and ShakeItLikeYouMeanIt(). Okay, sure, I may be no expert on the iPhone API, but the phone already alerts me with a window when there is an email for me to go fetch, I just want the reasonable addition of noise and vibration.TheExodu5 said:
I set up a yahoo account and I am going to test it out, but it is mostly the principle of the matter!
RevenantKioku
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Hey, I get a mail all the time.TheExodu5 said:
That's pretty much my point though. There is a lack of communication between the two companies here. Or someone is just being stupid.
If it is actually impossible, fine, but I can't believe that.
Worm_Buffet
Member
RevenantKioku said:
No they can't. Hence the poor implementation. Your provider can only send a message, not execute code on your device.
RevenantKioku
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So Apple can't add an alert for provider messages?
Worm_Buffet
Member
RevenantKioku said:
They can, but they won't and they shouldn't. They have an infrastructure for push mail notification in place already.
Kung Fu Jedi
Member
RevenantKioku said:
Most places, the provider sends alerts via SMS. That's the way it's always worked for me anyway, and I've had three different providers. Perhaps Apple can provide something in the OS for Softbank, but it's likely not a priority for them since it's only for one carrier.
kitchenmotors
Banned
Power Support's Anti-Glare film set is the best screen protector for the iPhone, period. Can't even tell it's on the phone, there's no glare and finger prints don't show up and make the screen all messy.
This is the case to get for the iPhone 3G. Every other case pales in comparison in terms of design and usability.
Incase Slider Case
This is the case to get for the iPhone 3G. Every other case pales in comparison in terms of design and usability.
Incase Slider Case
D
Deleted member 22576
Unconfirmed Member
That's a nice case.
I still prefer the homemade variety though.
I still prefer the homemade variety though.
RevenantKioku
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So the question becomes, why are they stupid.Worm_Buffet said:
Here's a free email to link with your phone that isn't push. Awesome.
lionelhutz
Member
kitchenmotors said:Power Support's Anti-Glare film set is the best screen protector for the iPhone, period. Can't even tell it's on the phone, there's no glare and finger prints don't show up and make the screen all messy.
This is the case to get for the iPhone 3G. Every other case pales in comparison in terms of design and usability.
Incase Slider Case
I can't tell from the picture but does it also cover the touch screen? If not, do you use the Anti-Glare protector with the case?
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