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Iran Update: Failed IEAE inspection, Preemptive Strikes and SL declaring no nukes

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Walshicus

Member
Yes, truly we are the bad guys here. The middle east is not a boiling pot of bad fucking vibes waiting to explode and the only medicine is nuclear aspirin, in which all tensions for war will suddenly fade away and peace and love will reign under a nuclear rainbow.

It's really boring working through your sarcasm.


If the actual threat of nuclear weapons were the concern there would be an effort to convince Israel to abandon it's own. This isn't about proliferation in of itself, because we've already allowed and indeed support the proliferation of nuclear weapons to Israel.

The Iranian regime is not pleasant, but it has legitimate reasons for pursuing the means and methods of securing itself against outside aggression. And let's not delude ourselves; Iran has been the victim of Western imperialism and continues to be.
 

ChiTownBuffalo

Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider

Parch

Member
American officials will never use the phrase "weapons of mass destruction". It's on the naughty catchphrase list after the last embarassment. What they do now is use the phrase "nuclear weapon" in large quantities. That's the propaganda catch this time around.
 

ChiTownBuffalo

Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
Guys, I know this is a thread about Iran refusing to cooperate with the IAEA following a report (suggesting Iran was attempting to obtain a nuclear weapons capability) and censure by the UN. That said, I think we should talk about Israel instead.

VIDEOBOMB.gif
 

ToxicAdam

Member
It's so gross:
Late last week, amid little fanfare, Senators Joseph Lieberman, Lindsey Graham, and Robert Casey introduced a resolution that would move America further down the path toward war with Iran.

The good news is that the resolution hasn't been universally embraced in the Senate. As Ron Kampeas of the Jewish Telegraphic Agency reports, the resolution has "provoked jitters among Democrats anxious over the specter of war." The bad news is that, as Kampeas also reports, "AIPAC is expected to make the resolution an 'ask' in three weeks when up to 10,000 activists culminate its annual conference with a day of Capitol Hill lobbying."

In standard media accounts, the resolution is being described as an attempt to move the "red line"--the line that, if crossed by Iran, could trigger a US military strike. The Obama administration has said that what's unacceptable is for Iran to develop a nuclear weapon. This resolution speaks instead of a "nuclear weapons capability." In other words, Iran shouldn't be allowed to get to a point where, should it decide to produce a nuclear weapon, it would have the wherewithal to do so.

http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/02/aipacs-push-toward-war/253358/
 

Gaborn

Member
Do you believe in ZOG?

Hell no. I believe any good intelligence agency probably has informants with people who get access to places that are normally unavailable to outsiders though. It has nothing to do with a conspiracy theory and everything to do with believing the Israelis are not insane. I'd place money on the US having people in place too, and probably a Russian agent as well
 

CiSTM

Banned
Has this been posted? If Israel attack they will probably attack hand in hand with US.
From New York Times
Iran Raid Seen as a Huge Task for Israeli Jets

WASHINGTON — Should Israel decide to launch a strike on Iran, its pilots would have to fly more than 1,000 miles across unfriendly airspace, refuel in the air en route, fight off Iran’s air defenses, attack multiple underground sites simultaneously — and use at least 100 planes.

That is the assessment of American defense officials and military analysts close to the Pentagon, who say that an Israeli attack meant to set back Iran’s nuclear program would be a huge and highly complex operation. They describe it as far different from Israel’s “surgical” strikes on a nuclear reactor in Syria in 2007 and Iraq’s Osirak reactor in 1981.

“All the pundits who talk about ‘Oh, yeah, bomb Iran,’ it ain’t going to be that easy,” said Lt. Gen. David A. Deptula, who retired last year as the Air Force’s top intelligence official and who planned the American air campaigns in 2001 in Afghanistan and in the 1991 Gulf War.

Speculation that Israel might attack Iran has intensified in recent months as tensions between the countries have escalated. In a sign of rising American concern, Tom Donilon, the national security adviser, met with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel in Jerusalem on Sunday, and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Gen. Martin E. Dempsey, warned on CNN that an Israeli strike on Iran right now would be “destabilizing.” Similarly, the British foreign secretary, William Hague, told the BBC that attacking Iran would not be “the wise thing” for Israel to do “at this moment.”

But while an Israeli spokesman in Washington, Lior Weintraub, said the country continued to push for tougher sanctions on Iran, he reiterated that Israel, like the United States, “is keeping all options on the table.”

The possible outlines of an Israeli attack have become a source of debate in Washington, where some analysts question whether Israel even has the military capacity to carry it off. One fear is that the United States would be sucked into finishing the job — a task that even with America’s far larger arsenal of aircraft and munitions could still take many weeks, defense analysts said. Another fear is of Iranian retaliation.


“I don’t think you’ll find anyone who’ll say, ‘Here’s how it’s going to be done — handful of planes, over an evening, in and out,’ ” said Andrew R. Hoehn, a former Pentagon official who is now director of the Rand Corporation’s Project Air Force, which does extensive research for the United States Air Force.

Michael V. Hayden, who was the director of the Central Intelligence Agency from 2006 to 2009, said flatly last month that airstrikes capable of seriously setting back Iran’s nuclear program were “beyond the capacity” of Israel, in part because of the distance that attack aircraft would have to travel and the scale of the task.

Still, a top defense official cautioned in an interview last week that “we don’t have perfect visibility” into Israel’s arsenal, let alone its military calculations. His views were echoed by Anthony H. Cordesman, an influential military analyst at the Center for Strategic and International Studies in Washington. “There are a lot of unknowns, there are a lot of potential risks, but Israel may know that those risks aren’t that serious,” he said.

Given that Israel would want to strike Iran’s four major nuclear sites — the uranium enrichment facilities at Natanz and Fordo, the heavy-water reactor at Arak and the yellowcake-conversion plant at Isfahan — military analysts say the first problem is how to get there. There are three potential routes: to the north over Turkey, to the south over Saudi Arabia or taking a central route across Jordan and Iraq.

The route over Iraq would be the most direct and likely, defense analysts say, because Iraq effectively has no air defenses and the United States, after its December withdrawal, no longer has the obligation to defend Iraqi skies. “That was a concern of the Israelis a year ago, that we would come up and intercept their aircraft if the Israelis chose to take a path across Iraq,” said a former defense official who asked for anonymity to discuss secret intelligence.

Assuming that Jordan tolerates the Israeli overflight, the next problem is distance. Israel has American-built F-15I and F-16I fighter jets that can carry bombs to the targets, but their range — depending on altitude, speed and payload — falls far short of the minimum 2,000-mile round trip. That does not include an aircraft’s “loiter time” over a target plus the potential of having to fight off attacks from Iranian missiles and planes.

Scott Shane contributed reporting.

Sivu 2 / 2
In any possibility, Israel would have to use airborne refueling planes, called tankers, but Israel is not thought to have enough. Scott Johnson, an analyst at the defense consulting firm IHS Jane’s and the leader of a team preparing an online seminar on Israeli strike possibilities on Iran, said that Israel had eight KC-707 American-made tankers, although it is not clear they are all in operation. It is possible, he said, that Israel has reconfigured existing planes into tankers to use in a strike.

Even so, any number of tankers would need to be protected by ever more fighter planes. “So the numbers you need just skyrocket,” Mr. Johnson said. Israel has about 125 F-15Is and F-16Is. One possibility, Mr. Johnson said, would be to fly the tankers as high as 50,000 feet, making them hard for air defenses to hit, and then have them drop down to a lower altitude to meet up with the fighter jets to refuel.

Israel would still need to use its electronic warfare planes to penetrate Iran’s air defenses and jam its radar systems to create a corridor for an attack. Iran’s antiaircraft defenses may be a generation old — in 2010, Russia refused to sell Iran its more advanced S-300 missile system — but they are hardly negligible, military analysts say.

Iranian missiles could force Israeli warplanes to maneuver and dump their munitions before they even reached their targets. Iran could also strike back with missiles that could hit Israel, opening a new war in the Middle East, though some Israeli officials have argued that the consequences would be worse if Iran were to gain a nuclear weapon.

Another major hurdle is Israel’s inventory of bombs capable of penetrating the Natanz facility, believed to be buried under 30 feet of reinforced concrete, and the Fordo site, which is built into a mountain.

Assuming it does not use a nuclear device, Israel has American-made GBU-28 5,000-pound “bunker buster” bombs that could damage such hardened targets, although it is unclear how far down they can go.

Earlier this month, a Bipartisan Policy Center report by Charles S. Robb, the former Democratic senator from Virginia, and Charles F. Wald, a retired Air Force general, recommended that the Obama administration sell Israel 200 enhanced GBU-31 “bunker busters” as well as three advanced refueling planes.

The two said that they were not advocating an Israeli attack, but that the munitions and aircraft were needed to improve Israel’s credibility as it threatens a strike.

Should the United States get involved — or decide to strike on its own — military analysts said that the Pentagon had the ability to launch big strikes with bombers, stealth aircraft and cruise missiles, followed up by drones that could carry out damage assessments to help direct further strikes. Unlike Israel, the United States has plenty of refueling capability. Bombers could fly from Al Udeid air base in Qatar, Diego Garcia in the Indian Ocean or bases in Britain and the United States.

Nonetheless, defense officials say it would still be tough to penetrate Iran’s deepest facilities with existing American bombs and so are enhancing an existing 30,000-pound “Massive Ordnance Penetrator” that was specifically designed for Iran and North Korea.

“There’s only one superpower in the world that can carry this off,” General Deptula said. “Israel’s great on a selective strike here and there.”
 
American officials will never use the phrase "weapons of mass destruction". It's on the naughty catchphrase list after the last embarassment. What they do now is use the phrase "nuclear weapon" in large quantities. That's the propaganda catch this time around.

What?


President controls the military. I could see Obama fighting if they ever really tied his hands
 
Do you believe in ZOG?

Okay seriously what is your problem?

You know that international espionage is A Thing that happens in real life?

You also know that Israel's spy agency Mossad has successfully attacked and killed Iran's top scientists in the recent past?

Do you agree or disagree that Iran has a valid reason to be paranoid about it's top secret shit?
 

Jenga

Banned
If the actual threat of nuclear weapons were the concern there would be an effort to convince Israel to abandon it's own. This isn't about proliferation in of itself, because we've already allowed and indeed support the proliferation of nuclear weapons to Israel.

Yeah, it's called diplomacy. Backing up our allies and all that.

The Iranian regime is not pleasant, but it has legitimate reasons for pursuing the means and methods of securing itself against outside aggression. And let's not delude ourselves; Iran has been the victim of Western imperialism and continues to be.

Here's a delusion right here: The US wants to start war with Iran.

What isn't a delusion: Israel and Saudi Arabia want to go to war and are probably as happy as pigs in shit that Iran is pursuing nuclear weaponry in order to instigate a war involving us.
 

Vaporizer

Banned
It's really boring working through your sarcasm.


If the actual threat of nuclear weapons were the concern there would be an effort to convince Israel to abandon it's own. This isn't about proliferation in of itself, because we've already allowed and indeed support the proliferation of nuclear weapons to Israel.

The Iranian regime is not pleasant, but it has legitimate reasons for pursuing the means and methods of securing itself against outside aggression. And let's not delude ourselves; Iran has been the victim of Western imperialism and continues to be.

Precisely. If iran goes nuclear tonight, there will be nothing israel will do about it. They know that.


So all efforts are being made to stop iran having one. because once you have that first bomb, you've got some leverage on the table
 

Jenga

Banned
I think you're a fool. And that's not purely a personal attack. I just think that is a very foolish and baseless thing to believe.
Why? I think you're a fool and all the rest for thinking that the proliferation of nuclear weaponry within the middle east will makes things better and not worse. Yes, western allied nations are nuclear and oppositional states aren't. Tough shit. I don't give a damn about what's fair in geopolitics.
 

Ikael

Member
i mean, come on

the middle east is relatively peaceful and there is no hatred between any major countries in the region

it's not like they'll be any nuclear standoffs between iran and israel or saudi arabia or anything fo'get about et

1- Iran is not, technically, a part of the Middle East
2- Pretty much everyone and their mother in the ME hates Israel, yet they haven't pursued a nuclear arms race despite of Israel's nukes

The whole "Iran having nukes will create a nuclearized ME" theory is bullshit. Yet "war against Iran will close the Ormuz straight and make the oil prices spin out of control" is a very real treat that we don't need in the middle of a recession.
 

Derwind

Member
So they say they don't want nukes then what are they hiding in the rooms where they won't let the UN inspectors go? I mean, if there's nothing to hide, then there's nothing to hide. Obviously, they're hiding something which is scarier than them admitting they are going after nukes. Because if they say they aren't, and all indications now point that they are, you have to wonder why they are lying and what they plan on doing once they get a nuke.

And the US allows foreign inspectors to inspect all their facilities..

Why don't we give them a colonoscopy as well, there's nothing to hide right?

Personally I don't like a Theocracies at all and the risk of them getting a serious weapon doesn't strike me as something good, but at the same time they have a right to pursue Nuclear Energy and wherever that may take them....

/shrug
 
— Should Israel decide to launch a strike on Iran, its pilots would have to fly more than 1,000 miles across unfriendly airspace, refuel in the air en route, fight off Iran’s air defenses, attack multiple underground sites simultaneously — and use at least 100 planes.

I've been saying this for awhile. The jets that bombed th Iraqi plants were already spitting fumes.
 
Have they? How do you know it was Mossad?

-_-

A nuclear scientist was killed in a blast in Tehran on Wednesday morning, an Iranian news agency reported, in the latest in a string of attacks that Iran has blamed on Israel.

A motorcyclist placed a magnetic bomb under Mostafa Ahmadi Roshan's Peugeot 405, the state-run IRNA news agency said. The blast also wounded two others, IRNA said.

State television channel Press TV reported later Wednesday that Roshan's driver, Reza Qashqaei, had died in a hospital from his injuries.

Mohammad Khazaee, Iranian ambassador to the United Nations, condemned what he called "cruel, inhumane and criminal acts of terrorism against the Iranian scientists."

http://articles.cnn.com/2012-01-11/...ar-scientists-natanz-isfahan?_s=PM:MIDDLEEAST

So "someone" is using very sophisticated methods to target Iran's top scientists. Yes, it is "possible" that it is not Mossad, but you know what? It doesn't fucking matter! If it's the CIA or the Russians or the lizard people even then Iran is still justified in clamping down on access to secure sites.
 
Then again, while the Koran says you really shouldn't lie, there are passages where it's actually encouraged. So the Ayatollah can feel comfortably lying about nuclear intentions and won't feel like he is going against the Quaran.

source: http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Quran/011-taqiyya.htm

(site is a little biased the quotes are true)

I´m pretty sure those lying quotes are only to not be killed or hurt do for being a muslim. See the reconquista in Spain.
 
Except no, he did a fairly reasonable job at pin-pointing most of the arguments. Nearly all antagonism to the big bad west seems to spring mostly (if not all) from GWB's reign of terror.


Not only do I believe Iran is stupid enough, I think Israel is equally dumb enough to start shit if and when Iran goes nuclear.

And I think it hit a nerve.

Also if this were to go down. The worlds oil supply would either be disrupted or mass speculation of disruption would cause oil prices to go sky high. There's a reason the US doesn't want Israel to strike now and it's not because the administration is anti-Israel, but because it will potentially fuck with oil shipments.
 

ChiTownBuffalo

Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
Okay seriously what is your problem?

You know that international espionage is A Thing that happens in real life?

You also know that Israel's spy agency Mossad has successfully attacked and killed Iran's top scientists in the recent past?

Do you agree or disagree that Iran has a valid reason to be paranoid about it's top secret shit?

My problem?

They weren't killed by car bombs. They were killed by magnetic bombs.

A car bomb is when the vehicle is used as a vector for the explosive device.

A couple paid Iranians on a motorcycle is a drive by sticking/blowy uppy thing.
 

Vaporizer

Banned
Why? I think you're a fool and all the rest for thinking that the proliferation of nuclear weaponry within the middle east will makes things better and not worse. Yes, western allied nations are nuclear and oppositional states aren't. Tough shit. I don't give a damn about what's fair in geopolitics.

Mate, with your attitude, is it any suprise countries like iran are looking to have nukes?


And you never answered my question? who in the middle east is dumb enough to start a nuclear war if iran gets nukes?
 
My problem?

They weren't killed by car bombs. They were killed by magnetic bombs.

A car bomb is when the vehicle is used as a vector for the explosive device.

A couple paid Iranians on a motorcycle is a drive by sticking/blowy uppy thing.

Ok. Thank you for the semantic clarification.

Again, this seems to be a justifiable reason to clamp down on access to secure sites since "someone" is targeting and killing top scientists.

Thus, it seems like a very valid reason for Iran to refuse access to a non-nuclear site towards to IAEA.

Agree or Disagree?
 

Alucrid

Banned
Ok. Thank you for the semantic clarification.

Again, this seems to be a justifiable reason to clamp down on access to secure sites since "someone" is targeting and killing top scientists.

Thus, it seems like a very valid reason for Iran to refuse access to a non-nuclear site towards to IAEA.

Agree or Disagree?
But thy allow them to their actual nuclear sites?
 
Okay seriously what is your problem?

You know that international espionage is A Thing that happens in real life?

You also know that Israel's spy agency Mossad has successfully attacked and killed Iran's top scientists in the recent past?

Do you agree or disagree that Iran has a valid reason to be paranoid about it's top secret shit?

With that arguement you would be saying that Mossad is killing nuclear scientists that aren't in development of a nuclear weapon.

Iran definitely has a reason to be paranoid about it's top secret "nuclear" shit.
 
CHEEZMO™;35379413 said:
What's ZOG?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=ZOG

EDIT: I've heard some whoppers in my time, but suggesting Iran denied IAEA inspectors access to their secret nuclear institutions for fear they were undercover government agents is a whole new level. No sense arguing with Inflammable Slinky, Iran can clearly do no wrong.
 
Guys, I know this is a thread about Iran refusing to cooperate with the IAEA following a report (suggesting Iran was attempting to obtain a nuclear weapons capability) and censure by the UN. That said, I think we should talk about Israel instead.

EDIT: Are people seriously trying to suggest Iran denied the IAEA access just in case they were Mossad agents?
The IAEA was used to spy on Iraq in the lead up to the war, so it only makes sense that it does so in Iran.
Furthermore, this is what the last IAEA head had to say about working with the US and the EU. “They weren’t interested in a compromise with the government in Tehran, but regime change—by any means necessary.”
You cant view any of the standoff through the prism of "the good ole USA" trying to be a cop on the beat. The US wants nothing less than regime change, for its own cynical reasons.
 

ChiTownBuffalo

Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
Ok. Thank you for the semantic clarification.

Again, this seems to be a justifiable reason to clamp down on access to secure sites since "someone" is targeting and killing top scientists.

Thus, it seems like a very valid reason for Iran to refuse access to a non-nuclear site towards to IAEA.

Agree or Disagree?

Disagree

The extensive weapons development activity at Parchin made sense for weaponization work for Iran's nuclear program. Yes, the Parchin complex represents the center of Iran's arms industry, so a nuclear weapons program would already have all the scientist, knowledge, etc needed within close distance. The alleged nuclear part of Parchin was physically isolated from the rest of the complex, suggesting that it was not part of the conventional weapons programs. The construction there was also consistent with the construction at other parts of Iran's bomb program, and the recent completion of construction was consistent with estimates at the time of when Iran would get the bomb.
 

effzee

Member
every time iran claims israel should be wiped off the face of the map is just their way of kidding

totally should let them have nukes, it'll be ok bro

Sarcasm aside you honestly believe Iran would use nukes or Israel would?

Nobody uses the nukes because they know in return other nations could wipe them off the earth just as well. On top of that Israel has within its borders many Muslims and holy sites for Islam. Iran would have to be downright retarded and wishing for its own destruction by the hands of other Muslims if it ever did something like that.


Yeah, it's called diplomacy. Backing up our allies and all that.



Here's a delusion right here: The US wants to start war with Iran.

What isn't a delusion: Israel and Saudi Arabia want to go to war and are probably as happy as pigs in shit that Iran is pursuing nuclear weaponry in order to instigate a war involving us.


While SA and Iran aren't best buddies, I doubt even SA would be stupid enough to align itself with Israel to go to war with Iran. The recent political protests have put SA in a very delicate political position. They have had to squash the protests in their own country and if they ever stood by or supported Israel's war against Iran, they might be looking at their own end by the hand of their own people.

Can anybody point me the relevant passage(s) in the Koran that support this statement?

There isn't any. He might be expanding the meaning in general of warnings about arms and weapons.
 
So is it very unfashionable on GAF to feel that states with a recent history of internal conflicts and violent rhetoric should not be encouraged to build nuclear weapons?
 

marrec

Banned
So they should let the inspectors in because they're being pressured to let the inspectors in? That is not a sound legal principle. In fact, I'm VERY curious now. Would the US have the right or not have the right to deny access to Area 51 or a similar base to IAEA inspectors?

I'm a little late on this but,

I'm not an expert on international law, but I think the refusal of IAEA inspectors is more something that doesn't get you a stamp of approval. Like an ISO Audit. The reason your question doesn't make sense is because America doesn't need IAEA approval for anything. Not because we're better than Iran, but because we aren't in the position that Iran is. If IAEA came to America to inspect Area 51 they'd probably get access and probably wouldn't find any state secrets, but it doesn't matter because Iran isn't in a position to refuse an international sanctioning body like America is.
 

Vaporizer

Banned
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=ZOG

EDIT: I've heard some whoppers in my time, but suggesting Iran denied IAEA inspectors access to their secret nuclear institutions for fear they were undercover government agents is a whole new level. No sense arguing with Inflammable Slinky, Iran can clearly do no wrong.

Well where did 10 years of sanctions and weapon inspections get iraq? Nowhere. Regime change is the name of the game these days.
 
Disagree

The extensive weapons development activity at Parchin made sense for weaponization work for Iran's nuclear program. Yes, the Parchin complex represents the center of Iran's arms industry, so a nuclear weapons program would already have all the scientist, knowledge, etc needed within close distance. The alleged nuclear part of Parchin was physically isolated from the rest of the complex, suggesting that it was not part of the conventional weapons programs. The construction there was also consistent with the construction at other parts of Iran's bomb program, and the recent completion of construction was consistent with estimates at the time of when Iran would get the bomb.

lol, whose estimates? Iran has 3-5 years from a bomb for the last two decades now. Give me your source, please.
 
Sorry, I'm having trouble parsing this statement. Could you restate it differently please?

Just saying in espionage it's about intelligence (what you know). Now first you're assuming Mossad is responsible for it. While they most likely are it's not been said out right.

Anyway assuming Mossad is behind it what reason would they have to assasinate nuclear scientists if there was not credible intelligence about them working on weapons tech?

Also don't compare it the GWB CIA Iraq intelligence please. CIA is shit.
 
Disagree

The extensive weapons development activity at Parchin made sense for weaponization work for Iran's nuclear program. Yes, the Parchin complex represents the center of Iran's arms industry, so a nuclear weapons program would already have all the scientist, knowledge, etc needed within close distance. The alleged nuclear part of Parchin was physically isolated from the rest of the complex, suggesting that it was not part of the conventional weapons programs. The construction there was also consistent with the construction at other parts of Iran's bomb program, and the recent completion of construction was consistent with estimates at the time of when Iran would get the bomb.

That is certainly a possibility.

Another possibility is Iran is freaking out over having its top scientists murdered in targeted killings, thus they restrict access to secure sites up to and including refusing access to the IAEA except in the case where they are legally obligated to provide access to the IAEA. Parchin is not one of those cases.

I don't make any claim as to which of these possibilities is more likely, but one cannot simply assume nukes are being worked on at Parchin due to refused access.

Just saying in espionage it's about intelligence (what you know). Now first you're assuming Mossad is responsible for it. While they most likely are it's not been said out right.

Anyway assuming Mossad is behind it what reason would they have to assasinate nuclear scientists if there was not credible intelligence about them working on weapons tech?

Also don't compare it the GWB CIA Iraq intelligence please. CIA is shit.

Ah, I see. Two possibilities occur to me. Either Israel assumes that Iran is working on nuclear weapons without evidence and target their nuke scientists to be on the safe side, or Israel targets their top scientists to reduce their arms tech readiness just to ensure military superiority in any hypothetical conflict in the near future. I don't think one can conclude that Mossad's alleged targeting of Iran's scientists provides evidence of Iran's nuke program one way or the other.
 

Dude Abides

Banned
Sarcasm aside you honestly believe Iran would use nukes or Israel would?

Nobody uses the nukes because they know in return other nations could wipe them off the earth just as well. On top of that Israel has within its borders many Muslims and holy sites for Islam. Iran would have to be downright retarded and wishing for its own destruction by the hands of other Muslims if it ever did something like that.

You are forgetting the fundamental axiom of international relations: mooslems be ca-raaaaaazy!
 

yarden24

Member
What isn't a delusion: Israel and Saudi Arabia want to go to war and are probably as happy as pigs in shit that Iran is pursuing nuclear weaponry in order to instigate a war involving us.

by want to go to war do you mean israel and saudi arabia want to attack iran themselves/ aided by the US, or that they want the US to attack Iran by itself?


Mate, with your attitude, is it any suprise countries like iran are looking to have nukes?


And you never answered my question? who in the middle east is dumb enough to start a nuclear war if iran gets nukes?

what I honestly dont understand is why people believe in fariness in geopolitics, why do countrys that share the west's ideals get to have nukes and others dont?
because its better for the west. ( and because I share the same ideals, better for me)

and the reason iran is trying to get nukes is it to shift the balance of power in its favor, and to give it a freer reign to project its influence.
 

effzee

Member
So is it very unfashionable on GAF to feel that states with a recent history of internal conflicts and violent rhetoric should not be encouraged to build nuclear weapons?

Iran getting nukes or being allowed to get nukes doesn't mean people are happy or encouraging it. I certainly am not. Hell I would love for a world without nukes. But this isn't reality and the US and Israel of all nations have no standing in the eyes of Iranians to tell them what to do regarding Nuclear technology.
 
I'm a little late on this but,

I'm not an expert on international law, but I think the refusal of IAEA inspectors is more something that doesn't get you a stamp of approval. Like an ISO Audit. The reason your question doesn't make sense is because America doesn't need IAEA approval for anything. Not because we're better than Iran, but because we aren't in the position that Iran is. If IAEA came to America to inspect Area 51 they'd probably get access and probably wouldn't find any state secrets, but it doesn't matter because Iran isn't in a position to refuse an international sanctioning body like America is.

well neither is Brazil and it had a stand off with the IAEA over access to sensitive sites. Iran's refusal to cooperate on this matter is not an exclusive case.
 

jimi_dini

Member
So they say they don't want nukes then what are they hiding in the rooms where they won't let the UN inspectors go? I mean, if there's nothing to hide, then there's nothing to hide. Obviously, they're hiding something which is scarier than them admitting they are going after nukes. Because if they say they aren't, and all indications now point that they are, you have to wonder why they are lying and what they plan on doing once they get a nuke.

Exactly.

And even if they would let the UN inspectors in and show them everything, it would only prove that they have hidden those scary things somewhere else. Because they let us in, you have to wonder, why they are letting us in. They got to be lying. We need to find out what they plan on doing.
 

ChiTownBuffalo

Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
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