I've grown confused and frustrated with the "moe culture", and I need to vent.

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D3RANG3D said:
This Kenshiro, and Guts are moe.
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Guts is so kawaii, uguu
guts.jpg
 
Don't really have a problem with it. People like what they like. I wouldn't really watch it, but I watch about one anime a year so I don't really know what the scene is like. I just ask my friends who are into the animoo. No judgement here.

I don't get people coming in and commenting about others' relationship status or what not. I do get where you are all coming from, but do you really think you're going to turn a moe follower who likes his anime figures and who might be very shy and introverted for reasons that have nothing to do with anime into an alpha male bro-dude who drinks and makes business deals like Don Draper with your strongly worded letters? It doesn't really happen, and if it does it happens slowly with a lot of time and effort. I'm sure people like that have enough pressure from the people who care about them already. That may not be the case and they might have their shit together and moe is just a quirk. That would make it officially Not A Big Deal, at least to me.

GAF has been great for me personally, since I joined a few years ago. Discovered a lot of great tips about life skills through different threads over the years. I was in a bad place a few years ago, since then I moved out of my mam's, went to college, got a job and am slowly losing weight. I even *GASP* grew a beard although I specially shave my neck since I am still fairly fat. If someone posts a thread wanting help with their life, by all means offer advice (actual advice, not "SACK UP BY YOUR BOOTSTRAPS BRO and meme.gif). Otherwise, maybe think before your post. Constructive criticism is always welcome on GAF, IMO.

tl:dr You guys are sound to advise people, but you could be nicer about it sometimes.

I realise the irony of my post, BTW.
 
Dice said:
In some of these reported otaku obsessives that the industry is apparently pandering to, can it also come from some dysfunction difference of sexuality in how it is received and manifests in a person socially, as some kind of stand-in for normal relations that spin out into greater extremes of their base constructs of admirations for cuteness/loveliness/innocence/sexuality which end up combined in depictions? Apparently so, but while that may be demonstrative of a social problem difference, I don't see why that would directly equate to or present a social danger of predatory deviance to warrant legitimate concern without evidence.

I mean, in a normal relationship you will at times view your partner with sexual desire, other times admire their loveliness, other times perhaps the innocent sides of their character, and at different moments these may mix and match. Art tends to do all these things as well, but there are ideas of "classy" ways that specify acceptable borders and contexts which make them appropriate. These animes seems to be throwing it all together and turning the dial up to louder levels, and that may be demonstrative of a rejection or escape from normal rules of subtlety and contexts of real life sociability, but I don't really see it as fundamentally different from what anyone else does all the time with only stronger compartmentalization, perhaps to safeguard social roles and contexts from getting blurred as they have them more prominently in their life focus whereas these otaku may hold themselves more distanced or isolated and not need that.
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I think I get where you're coming from. The idolization of "innocent" figures along the very axies that their innocence supposedly insulates them from just provokes a visceral reaction in me. I really don't believe you could draw a correlation between this and actual predatory behavior but damn if it doesn't feel that way, fantasizing over sexualized depictions of characters who's main character traits are how completely non-sexual they are (or, in the broader sense, desirous fantasies over characters who exhibit no similar desire)
 
I'm a hot-blooded alpha male. The kind that most of you Zelda-tee wearing dorkuses would cross the road just to avoid breathing in my testosterone soaked pheromones and I like me some cutesy anime shit from time to time. I don't overthink it though, it's just some cute anime shit. People going to war over this is hilarious.
 
TetraxShards said:
Don't really have a problem with it. People like what they like. I wouldn't really watch it, but I watch about one anime a year so I don't really know what the scene is like. I just ask my friends who are into the animoo. No judgement here.

I don't get people coming in and commenting about others' relationship status or what not. I do get where you are all coming from, but do you really think you're going to turn a moe follower who likes his anime figures and who might be very shy and introverted for reasons that have nothing to do with anime into an alpha male bro-dude who drinks and makes business deals like Don Draper with your strongly worded letters? It doesn't really happen, and if it does it happens slowly with a lot of time and effort. I'm sure people like that have enough pressure from the people who care about them already. That may not be the case and they might have their shit together and moe is just a quirk. That would make it officially Not A Big Deal, at least to me.

GAF has been great for me personally, since I joined a few years ago. Discovered a lot of great tips about life skills through different threads over the years. I was in a bad place a few years ago, since then I moved out of my mam's, went to college, got a job and am slowly losing weight. I even *GASP* grew a beard although I specially shave my neck since I am still fairly fat. If someone posts a thread wanting help with their life, by all means offer advice (actual advice, not "SACK UP BY YOUR BOOTSTRAPS BRO and meme.gif). Otherwise, maybe think before your post. Constructive criticism is always welcome on GAF, IMO.

tl:dr You guys are sound to advise people, but you could be nicer about it sometimes.

I realise the irony of my post, BTW.
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Not only do I like moe anime, but gaming and other neckbeard activities. Thank god I met my hot girlfriend on gaf who also loves anime, has a growing figure collection, and love for gaming. We were both dangerously close to becoming closeted nerds who never leave the house. Gaf actually SAVED ME from becoming a 30 year old wizard.
 
"My sister can't be that cute" is straight up about incestuous perversites.

Tbh, I would not let someone who enjoy watching that show near my sister or the sister of anyone else.
 
Horse Detective said:
Not only do I like moe anime, but gaming and other neckbeard activities. Thank god I met my hot girlfriend on gaf who also like anime and has a growing figure collection, and love for gaming. We were both dangerously close to becoming closeted nerds who never leave the house.
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Sorry, sorry, thought I was being helpful. Guess not.
 
TetraxShards said:
Don't really have a problem with it. People like what they like. I wouldn't really watch it, but I watch about one anime a year so I don't really know what the scene is like. I just ask my friends who are into the animoo. No judgement here.

I don't get people coming in and commenting about others' relationship status or what not. I do get where you are all coming from, but do you really think you're going to turn a moe follower who likes his anime figures and who might be very shy and introverted for reasons that have nothing to do with anime into an alpha male bro-dude who drinks and makes business deals like Don Draper with your strongly worded letters? It doesn't really happen, and if it does it happens slowly with a lot of time and effort. I'm sure people like that have enough pressure from the people who care about them already. That may not be the case and they might have their shit together and moe is just a quirk. That would make it officially Not A Big Deal, at least to me.

GAF has been great for me personally, since I joined a few years ago. Discovered a lot of great tips about life skills through different threads over the years. I was in a bad place a few years ago, since then I moved out of my mam's, went to college, got a job and am slowly losing weight. I even *GASP* grew a beard although I specially shave my neck since I am still fairly fat. If someone posts a thread wanting help with their life, by all means offer advice (actual advice, not "SACK UP BY YOUR BOOTSTRAPS BRO and meme.gif). Otherwise, maybe think before your post. Constructive criticism is always welcome on GAF, IMO.

tl:dr You guys are sound to advise people, but you could be nicer about it sometimes.

I realise the irony of my post, BTW.
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Well if theres one thing Im not, its shy or introverted lol.
 
The Silver said:
this is more about fanservice but man do I hate when it's inserted into shows I would otherwise really like.


Recently I just felt like watching a good fun shounen, see this new one called Seven Deadly Sins. Of course within the first episode I see the typical oblivious shy girl with a 10/10 body who constantly ends up "sexy" situations. Main character is a pervert who grabs her boobs while she stands there oblivious and blah blah you all know this story.

Goddamn anime, I just want some good dumb fighting shit.
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This so much omg.


I've heard nice things of Nanatsu no taizai (Seven deadly sins) and I tried to watch it but the ridiculous fan service turned me off instantly, I can't fudging stand it, I even felt embarrassment watching that scenes of "innocent" Elizabeth getting abused and doing nothing, or just panty shots, is really pathetic. They really treat the girls like sex objects or something... Why do they have to include fan service in this, smh. Same with the likes of one piece anime, they (I suppose the director of OP anime?) recently feel the need to add lot of fan service with nami and shit, I'm glad I read the manga because the manga is pretty different (Oda doesn't really do that type of shit) and don't have that crap fan service but still sometimes I want to watch the anime but the fan service uhh...


Same with Kill la kill, I couldn't watch more than a few episodes because the fan service/ecchi crap was ridiculous. I understand is supposed to be a parody but it went too far imo, can't stand it. Doesn't help that the serie does 0 sense all the time, I need a bit of logic in series I watch/read, I don't ask for real logic but at least keep it somehow consistent within the world that it's portrayed. Another example of non sense would be Bleach, that the power consistency between characters is non existent, but well that is other subject. I apologize for this brief derail.

About moe things, if some people like moe things then fine, make "moe" anime and such (even though I feel that it's really creepy), but what annoys me particulary is the fan service, when directors feel the need to include fan service in already existent on going series that doesn't need it at all, and even could turn off some older audience of the series. This fan service trend is really annoying.
 
I think I'm weird.

I like cute, but I hate "waifus", if that makes any sense. The anime industry and a lot of modern anime fans definitely seem to be pretty infactuated with that. It's kind of a shame.

I noticed it around the release of K-on!, and it just seems to have gotten worse.

Now, it seems the vast vast majority of anime is made with these people in mind, so I just get maybe one show a season that isn't garbage.

And yes, that might come as a surprise to people looking at my avatar.
 
The Technomancer said:
I think I get where you're coming from. The idolization of "innocent" figures along the very axies that their innocence supposedly insulates them from just provokes a visceral reaction in me. I really don't believe you could draw a correlation between this and actual predatory behavior but damn if it doesn't feel that way, fantasizing over sexualized depictions of characters who's main character traits are how completely non-sexual they are (or, in the broader sense, desirous fantasies over characters who exhibit no desire)
Click to expand...
I get that, but then I turn the examination back on me to see if similar things can be found. I see that I have appreciation for pop stars in their sexy performances, and yet while this is an admiration for them that is playing to sexual titillation, it's not like I have any illusions of possible relationship with them, or that such performances have any sort of correlation to my real-life relational expectations or perceived contexts, or even who they are as people apart from their performances. It is just a stage show where things aren't the same as normal life, a celebration of different aspects of humanity expressed to be enjoyed for the fact they are existent and are pretty great.

Is that so different from how otaku explain their love of these shows? It doesn't seem too different to me. It's just that, like I said, their shows tend to blend many more concepts together than the pop music performances I like. The artistic expressions that I enjoy tend to keep themes and contexts more compartmentalized, even though they are every bit as removed from reality for me, and would be likewise disturbing for me to think of as having personal social implications. If I grant myself and most everyone else the right to that without presumptions, I don't see why I should withhold that from anime fans. And that applies to all kinds of socially disturbing themes, not just sexual. My sister's boyfriend is a huge fan of horror movies, which are severely distasteful to me, but I don't question him as a person at all.
 
gngf123 said:
I think I'm weird.

I like cute, but I hate "waifus", if that makes any sense. The anime industry and a lot of modern anime fans definitely seem to be pretty infactuated with that. It's kind of a shame.

I noticed it around the release of K-on!, and it just seems to have gotten worse.

Now, it seems the vast vast majority of anime is made with these people in mind, so I just get maybe one show a season that isn't garbage.

And yes, that might come as a surprise to people looking at my avatar.
Click to expand...

Youre not weird.
 
gngf123 said:
I think I'm weird.

I like cute, but I hate "waifus", if that makes any sense. The anime industry and a lot of modern anime fans definitely seem to be pretty infactuated with that. It's kind of a shame.

I noticed it around the release of K-on!, and it just seems to have gotten worse.

Now, it seems the vast vast majority of anime is made with these people in mind, so I just get maybe one show a season that isn't garbage.
Click to expand...
Thing is just - they are the people who pay. And again it's not like the companies don't experiment and that there are no good shows. Stop with the 90% and the 1 show per season. It just isn't true. There are plenty decent shows in every season.

It's pretty difficult to fault the companies for pandering to their paying audience, when anime like Shinsekai Yori get slapped in the face on the market.
 
Chariot said:
Thing is just - they are the people who pay. And again it's not like the companies don't experiment and that there are no good shows. Stop with the 90% and the 1 show per season. It just isn't true. There are plenty decent shows in every season.

It's pretty difficult to fault the companies for pandering to their paying audience, when anime like Shinsekai Yori get slapped in the face on the market.
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I've got a long history of liking anime that sells like shit, I'm more than aware :-P.

These people are definitely a huge market, especially one you factor in merchandise. I just kind of wish it wasn't as much of a dominating market as it is.
 
gngf123 said:
I've got a long history of liking anime that sells like shit, I'm more than aware :-P.

These people are definitely a huge market, especially one you factor in merchandise. I just kind of wish it wasn't as much of a dominating market as it is.
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That I can understand. There are quite a few tropes that are overused in anime and moe is one of them. Less of it would do just fine for me and I would be glad if the anime market would be a bit braver and more diverse.
 
Chariot said:
Thing is just - they are the people who pay. And again it's not like the companies don't experiment and that there are no good shows. Stop with the 90% and the 1 show per season. It just isn't true. There are plenty decent shows in every season.

It's pretty difficult to fault the companies for pandering to their paying audience, when anime like Shinsekai Yori get slapped in the face on the market.
Click to expand...

Shin sekai yori is awesome. I basically recommend it to everyone.
i was highly impressed by it. Again though how would a company market it? The characters wouldnt be particularly interesting figurines.
 
The Technomancer said:
I think I get where you're coming from. The idolization of "innocent" figures along the very axies that their innocence supposedly insulates them from just provokes a visceral reaction in me. I really don't believe you could draw a correlation between this and actual predatory behavior but damn if it doesn't feel that way, fantasizing over sexualized depictions of characters who's main character traits are how completely non-sexual they are (or, in the broader sense, desirous fantasies over characters who exhibit no similar desire)
Click to expand...

As long as you can understand how some can feel the same provocative visceral reaction that comes from idolization of badass killers in television shows, and people can feel like violent video games/horror movies/etc be directly correlated to real violence and/or create problematic behavior. It's the same kind of (I would say irrational) fear for a different kind of real-world problem.

Dice said:
I get that, but then I turn the examination back on me to see if similar things can be found. I see that I have appreciation for pop stars in their sexy performances, and yet while this is an admiration for them that is playing to sexual titillation, it's not like I have any illusions of possible relationship with them, or that such performances have any sort of correlation to my real-life relational expectations or perceived contexts, or even who they are as people apart from their performances. It is just a stage show where things aren't the same as normal life, a celebration of different aspects of humanity expressed to be enjoyed for the fact they are existent and are pretty great.

Is that so different from how otaku explain their love of these shows? It doesn't seem too different to me. It's just that, like I said, their shows tend to blend many more concepts together than the pop music performances I like. The artistic expressions that I enjoy tend to keep themes and contexts more compartmentalized, even though they are every bit as removed from reality for me, and would be likewise disturbing for me to think of as having personal social implications. If I grant myself and most everyone else the right to that without presumptions, I don't see why I should withhold that from anime fans. And that applies to all kinds of socially disturbing themes, not just sexual. My sister's boyfriend is a huge fan of horror movies, which are severely distasteful to me, but I don't question him as a person at all.
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Well put.
 
cajunator said:
Shin sekai yori is awesome. I basically recommend it to everyone.
i was highly impressed by it. Again though how would a company market it? The characters wouldnt be particularly interesting figurines.
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There are surely ways to make "Oppressive society full of psychics indoctrinates children in a strange world with dangerous creatures" interesting.
 
Hm, this thread has taught me that English speaking anime culture is now about 'pre-k-on' and 'post-k-on' instead of 'pre/post lucky star' or before that 'pre/post love hina' or 'pre/post dbz/sailor moon'
 
Owlowiscious said:
Hm, this thread has taught me that English speaking anime culture is now about 'pre-k-on' and 'post-k-on' instead of 'pre/post lucky star' or before that 'pre/post love hina' or 'pre/post dbz/sailor moon'
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There's always a non-existent "golden age" in every medium. And the goal posts always move.

In a few years it'll be something like pre/post Love Live or something.
 
RurouniZel said:
There's always a non-existent "golden age" in every medium. And the goal posts always move.

In a few years it'll be something like pre/post Love Live or something.
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exactly, anime's always had the same good/bad ratio, but the bad shows get forgotten over time while the good shows stay in people's minds and it creates this weird idea that it was so much better back in the day when it's always been the same
 
Owlowiscious said:
Hm, this thread has taught me that English speaking anime culture is now about 'pre-k-on' and 'post-k-on' instead of 'pre/post lucky star' or before that 'pre/post love hina' or 'pre/post dbz/sailor moon'
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Yeah, I think it's the shift from girls doing mundane slice-of-life things, to girls doing niche hobby things.

Lucky Star is the former, and K-On is more of the latter (the first season anyway, second season erroneously leans much more on SoL antics).

RurouniZel said:
In a few years it'll be something like pre/post Love Live or something.
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Probably. Idols are huge in Japan, so that as a genre is only going to get more prevalent in anime.
 
cajunator said:
Fair enough I suppose. Its probably more odd because they are displayed next to football stuff than anything. Again though not really sure what age has to do with it. Teenagers cant afford these figures. They are 70- 90$ each on average and can go upwards of 200$
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Congrats. You've made them just creepy in general.
 
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