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[DJ_Tet]

It's breaking news on Sportscenter right now. They are reporting that Giambi admitted to using steroids in his Grand Jury testemony. He said he got the roids from Barry Bond's trainer.

He was noticably smaller coming into this season, and had a tumor etc. Rough year for Giambi. Hopefully he's clean, it's obvious his body didn't agree with them.

Should be interesting to see what happens because of this, can Giambi rebound as a clean player? Will he be smaller than his brother now? Can Barry slide through the questions again?

He's the second league MVP to admit to steroids, joining recently deceased Ken Caminiti.

 

[BigJonsson]

So does Delgado get the MVP from the year Giambi robbed him of it now?

I mean, Delgado was clean that year and had a better season then Giambi in the first place

 

[AstroLad]

Bonds coming out is going to be about as shocking and exciting as Rosie's coming out.

If he ever does it, that is, he's such a bonehead I doubt he will ever admit it regardless of the evidence.

 

[Joe]

i forgot rosie o'donnell was a lesbian.

100 bucks says steinbrenner tries to use this as leverage to void giambi's contract.

and im not sure if espn's take on this "this will change the game forever" is espn hype machine going or im just not fully understanding the pending backlash of all this.

 

[DJ_Tet]

i forgot rosie o'donnell was a lesbian.

100 bucks says steinbrenner tries to use this as leverage to void giambi's contract.

and im not sure if espn's take on this "this will change the game forever" is espn hype machine going or im just not fully understanding the pending backlash of all this.

No doubt the Yankees try and void Giambi's contract over this.

I don't think this "changes the game forever", but it does put in black and white what everyone with a brain already knew. The records are fairly bogus. Steriods didn't make Bonds/Giambi/McGuire great hitters, but they didn't hurt by any stretch. My favorite is the fact that Bonds' head is oh...3 times bigger than it was when he was 25. In 10 years we'll start seeing these athletes dropping dead like flies, just like pro wrestlers are doing now.

 

[Catchpenny]

I can't wait until a lab catering primarily to NFL players is busted. It was suspicious, but hitting a lot of homeruns in the current era still seems more plausible than 260 pound motherfuckers running a 4.4

So does Delgado get the MVP from the year Giambi robbed him of it now?

A-Rod was better than Delgado or Giambi in 2000...and Pedro should've won MVP but sportswriters don't like giving it to pitchers.

 

[Alex Anderson]

He's the second league MVP to admit to steroids, joining recently deceased Ken Caminiti.

Don't forget 1988 AL MVP Jose Canseco.

Watching Giambi last year was frustrating as hell. I hope the Yankees break him off as soon as possible.

 

[hiryu]

I just think it's funny that the yankees are going to be stuck paying this piece of shit's huge contract for the next 4 years as he waste away and has more and more health problems. I hope they can't get out of it and maybe it will change baseball for the better.

 

[DCX]

Messed up, it shouldn't be a surprise but you know you still have a feeling of shock anyway. This will change things, but just how people think and awareness kinda like Magic with HIV/AIDS and 9/11/ with terrorism and politics.

DCX

 

[Donkeypuncher]

It was already very evident that Giambi was on the sauce without him having to admit it.

 

[Pimpwerx]

Bonds is clean.

*runs*

PEACE.

 

[Incognito]

I believe Bonds is clean, too. Using steroids doesn't enhance your ability to hit a ball. The guy's been a wizard with the wood for 17 some odd years. He should have his own section in the Hall of Fame.

 

[Team Rancid]

Dammit! His 2 hrs in game 7 of the 2003 ALCS should be changed to outs and the Sox awarded 2003 AL champs trophy!

 

[theo]

 

[Dilbert]

I believe Bonds is clean, too. Using steroids doesn't enhance your ability to hit a ball. The guy's been a wizard with the wood for 17 some odd years. He should have his own section in the Hall of Fame.

Sure it does! More strength = greater batspeed (which allows the batter to handle a greater range of pitch speeds effectively) and greater distance on "missed pitch" swings in which the batter doesn't perfectly time his swing.

Furthermore, a lot of Bonds' records are based on lifetime stats, and clearly drugs help extend the productive part of your career.

Yes, you require some talent to begin with in order to be a good hitter -- you couldn't put a bat in the hands of Joe Musclehead and expect him to make the majors -- but arguing that steroids/HGH/whatever-the-hell-he's-on wouldn't be a huge positive for him is flat-out ridiculous.

 

[Eminem]

anyone who says bonds is clean...fucking please.

this giambi testimony has the most solid evidence, aside from it being bonds' trainer as well:

In his testimony, Giambi said he asked Anderson about the things Bonds was doing to stay at an elite level.


"So I started to ask him: 'Hey, what are the things you're doing with Barry? He's an incredible player. I want to still be able to work out at that age and keep playing,' " Giambi testified. "And that's how the conversation first started."

clean? no fucking way.

 

[evil solrac v3.0]

*bangs head against wall until brains ooze out*

FUCK FUCK FUCKING FUCKITY FUCK THE FICKING FUCK UP FUCKER DUMB FUCK FUCKING COCK SUCKING FUCKING FUCKER FUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Miguel]

*bangs head against wall until brains ooze out*

FUCK FUCK FUCKING FUCKITY FUCK THE FICKING FUCK UP FUCKER DUMB FUCK FUCKING COCK SUCKING FUCKING FUCKER FUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Next up, testing Steinbrenner's checkbook for HGH.

 

[Orin GA]

WELL, THAT BOUT WRAPS IT UP FOR MR BONDS

 

[Mike Works]

My favorite is the fact that Bonds' head is oh...3 times bigger than it was when he was 25.

Heh, anyone have a picture of Ken Griffey Jr with gigantism on the Simpsons?

 

[theo]

 

[AstroLad]

Ah... so this is the cause of Bonds' literal head-swelling:

 

[Eminem]

man, i didn't think the public opinion on bonds was so freakin' bad.

from espn.com's vote:

8) Jason Giambi admits to receiving steroids from Greg Anderson, weight trainer for Barry Bonds. Does this change your opinion about Bonds' possible steroid use?


82.2% I always thought Bonds used steroids.

10.6% I didn't believe Bonds used, and I still don't.

7.1% I didn't believe Bonds used, but I do now.

yikes.

 

[DJ_Tet]

I don't think anyone thinks Bonds isn't the best hitter in our generation, nor do steroids make someone like me into someone like Bonds. But anyone with open eyes can tell that Bonds has done something to his body to put on that amount of muscle mass after he turned 32. It just doesn't happen, never has, never will.

It's like Ben Johnson being bigger than a weightlifter and running 100 yards in about 3.7 seconds. It's just not right.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

so much for Yankees being a "class" organization. Its ok to roid up or play like a sissy (Arod's 'slap' against the RedSox) so long as your clean shaven, right?

 

[Bat]

At this point, anyone who thinks Bonds is clean or that his steroid use does not play a huge factor in his current dominance is beyond delerious.

 

[DJ_Tet]

At this point, anyone who thinks Bonds is clean or that his steroid use does not play a huge factor in his current dominance is beyond delerious.

I wouldn't say "huge factor" but it's always struck me as weird that he wasn't a renowned home run hitter earlier in his career. The guy has an awesome eye, always has, but he just didn't hit HRs like that when he was younger.

McGuire put on a ton of weight in his career too, probably with the help of steroids. But Big Mac also hit 49 HRs as a rookie. Bonds was lucky to top out over 30 in his Pittsburgh days.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

In his testimony, Giambi described how he had used syringes to inject human growth hormone into his stomach and testosterone into his buttocks.

another Yankee that likes to take it in the ass.

[Jason] Giambi testified that he didn't know what the pills were, though he thought the white one might have been Clomid, a female fertility drug that can enhance the effectiveness of testosterone. His use of the drug was reflected on a calendar, the prosecutor said.

so he didn't even know what the shit was, other than that it might be a FEMALE FERTILITY DRUG, and he took'em anyway? Jesus christ.

 

[DJ_Tet]

The A's are laughing all the way to the bank on this deal. Glad they didn't pay for the hulk.

What's funny/sad is that he was a mini-me during training camp and said he only "lost 4 pounds." Does he think the public are blind or just stupid? Also, the tumor makes you think too.

My ex-gf thinks that Lance Armstrong got all his cancer from juicing up. She may be right.

 

[Bat]

I wouldn't say "huge factor" but it's always struck me as weird that he wasn't a renowned home run hitter earlier in his career.

Actually, I think huge is an understatement. I compiled his pre-2000 stats (where he began a myserious and enormous jump in productivity...at age 36) and his stats since then:


HR/OBP/SLG/AVG

1986-2000: 31.8 0.407 0.561 0.288
2000-2004: 51.6 0.535 0.782 0.341
Jump : 19.8 0.128 0.221 0.054

I mean....those are really outrageous jumps. And I can't emphasize this enough: they happened when he was 36 years old a time when his numbers should be going in the opposite direction.

Steroids turned Bonds from a very good hitter (someone at the level of a Hideki Matsui or so) to the best hitter ever at an age where he'd otherwise be declining...end of story.

 

[DJ_Tet]

Those are impressive stats, but you also have to factor in that 30 home runs in the late 80's-early 90's was a lot more than it is today. Still, your point was made. The fact of his age at when he made a meteoric jump is paramount to me.

 

[Musashi Wins!]

An asterisk next to Roger Maris? HO HO HO!

 

[Nerevar]

McGuire put on a ton of weight in his career too, probably with the help of steroids. But Big Mac also hit 49 HRs as a rookie. Bonds was lucky to top out over 30 in his Pittsburgh days.

No, big Mac admitted to using Androstenedione. It's not really a steroid per se, but it does metabolize and produce a very similar effect in your body. It wasn't illegal back then, but it is now. The situation regarding that was very different though, considering that McGuire basically said he used it as a supplement and it was legal, and if it wasn't he would've never used it.

 

[Bat]

Those are impressive stats, but you also have to factor in that 30 home runs in the late 80's-early 90's was a lot more than it is today. Still, your point was made. The fact of his age at when he made a meteoric jump is paramount to me.

Yeah but a big reason for that rise is steroids. Also, it would be one thing if Bonds gradually increased his production over the 90s as the game changed to a more offensive one, but instead his jump is almost immediate. In fact, the year before 2000 was one of his least productive (which you'd expect because he was getting old even then) and then BOOM he explodes.

 

[DJ_Tet]

No, big Mac admitted to using Androstenedione. It's not really a steroid per se, but it does metabolize and produce a very similar effect in your body. It wasn't illegal back then, but it is now. The situation regarding that was very different though, considering that McGuire basically said he used it as a supplement and it was legal, and if it wasn't he would've never used it.

Yeah, that's what he admitted to using. Sometimes you have to read between the lines though. He would have never admitted to using it had a reporter not spotted the bottle. And as far as it being legal, up until two years ago, steroids were "legal" in baseball too, as far as they weren't tested for. I'm a huge Big Mac fan, but I have a hard time believing he went from tall and lanky to a hulk using an over-the-counter supplement alone.


And as far as the Matsui comparison, that's pretty far off base. Bonds won 2 or so MVP awards when he was skinny and with the Pirates. Most people argue that he should have won in 1990 when Pendleton won as well. I'm not taking away from Matsui, but Bonds was considered the best player in baseball before he went to the Giants and roided up. Now he's considered one of the best of all time. Matsui is not a valid comparison for what Bonds was pre-Frisco.

 

[Bat]

Well, I was comparing him to Matsui in terms of hitting and purely on numbers (ie Bonds average was comparable to Matsui's 2004 season).

A big reason Barry was one of the best players then was his defense and stolen bases, as well as being a very good hitter (think Carlos Beltran, who is not a much better hitter than Matsui) so using his MVPs as a measure of how good of a hitter he was is off base.

 

[Nerevar]

Yeah, that's what he admitted to using. Sometimes you have to read between the lines though. He would have never admitted to using it had a reporter not spotted the bottle. And as far as it being legal, up until two years ago, steroids were "legal" in baseball too, as far as they weren't tested for. I'm a huge Big Mac fan, but I have a hard time believing he went from tall and lanky to a hulk using an over-the-counter supplement alone.

Andro metabolizes in your body and stimulates testosterone production. Therefore, it basically "mimics" a steroid. It's been illegal in the olympics for quite some time now. But when he used it, it wasn't illegal over the counter, and it certainly would've added quite a bit of bulk to him. Plus, you have to consider his physical build in the first place - Big Mac is built more like a football player in the Frank Thomas mold, so he's going to put on muscle more naturally.

 

[Meier]

hahaha I cant believe Lonestar is still saying he doesnt think Barroid juices. :lol :lol

 

[Donkeypuncher]

It's common knowledge in baseball circles that McGwire and Canseco were on some serious juice during their days with the A's. Why do you think they were always on the DL? Also, HGH is not called "the fountain of youth" for nothing and I'm sure Bonds knows this full well.

 

[DJ_Tet]

Well, I was comparing him to Matsui in terms of hitting and purely on numbers (ie Bonds average was comparable to Matsui's 2004 season).

A big reason Barry was one of the best players then was his defense and stolen bases, as well as being a very good hitter (think Carlos Beltran, who is not a much better hitter than Matsui) so using his MVPs as a measure of how good of a hitter he was is off base.

I was using his MVPs as a measure of how good a player he was, not hitter. I'm just saying that I don't think that his steroid use is soley responsible for his statistical jump. If it was that easy, then everyone would do it. I just don't think you're giving Bonds the player enough credit. I'm not saying that I think he's been clean.

 

[Joe]

both the new york post and new york daily news are reporting in tomorrows (todays) papers that barry bonds also told the grand jury that he also used steroids.

http://nypost.com/news/regionalnews/32397.htm

The game received another jolt late last night when it was revealed that megastar Barry Bonds told the grand jury he used a clear substance and a rubbing cream supplied by his trainer, who allegedly gave steroids in similar form to Giambi, the San Francisco Chronicle reports today.

ny daily news articles arent up yet but their front and back pages are up on their site and they are saying the same thing.