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Just finished Tales of Symphonia rant/rave thread

Gruco

Banned
Whee. That was fun. The combination of an addictive game and a lot of free time isn't pretty.

This was only the second in the series I've played, but the Tales games are growing on me very quickly. I now have the urge to pick up Destiny for PS1, and probably do a bit more bitching about Phantasia in the future.

Reasons this game was awesome.

Combat. I liked it here a little bit more that I did Eternia. The changing planes of attack made a little more effort and thinking involved. At first I thought the pauses to switch all the time were going to be a pain, but they were completey effortless. And the team attacks ended up being a great feature too. I wish I played around with it more. Anyways, this added too a combat system that was already top of the line (only VP and Grandia reach the same tier IMO) and made it better.

Dungeons. This surprised me. Eternia's dungeons were all very straightforward. I actually didn't mind that at all, because it just made the game's focus on it's obvious strength, combat. But here they just steadily developed the length and level of involvement in the dungeons, and they were for the most part excellent about half way through and after. The various forms of the sorcerrer's ring gave it almost a Wild Arms appeal, with various tools to apply to each situation.

Cooking! Okay, this isn't really any different from Eternia, but still, cooking is one of the best ideas in any RPG. Avoids the tedium of manually recharging after battle, but still leaves some of the wear and tear you should go though during a dungeon. And actually, this had an autocook feature after every battle, so it is a little better than Eternia!

Characters. All the little cut scenes and conversations really fleshed out the personalities. I felt the exact same way with Eternia. The story may not be anything particularly special, but the conversations and various interactions with the characters are so well done that it hardly matters. Just a lot of scenes that make you laugh or smile or whatever. Is this a strength for the rest of the series as well? I remember Shouta saying something about it once...eh...

Music was sorta meh....a few memorable tracks but overall pretty bland.

Minigames were a step down from Eternia, but still some pretty fun ones.

Down sides -

Dialogue got to be a little preachy and over the top towards the end. Despite the conversations being a big plus overall, there were still some we could do without.

One of the biggest dissapointments was the lack of the Craymel Cage system. That was such a big part of Eternia, and one of my favorite parts of the game. Without it, there was less to mess around with in terms of ability setups, summons became less important, and the role of offensive magic in battles was diminished. The last point isn't all bad though, because there was more character in combat diversity this way.

FINAL JUDGEMENT! This game is awesome. Easily one of the best 3 RPGs this gen, if not best. Everyone should play it. And Namco should give me Tales of Destiny 2.
 

belgurdo

Banned
Bleah...Craymel Cage sucked. Since you basically didn't get the spells anyway until the monsters hit a certain level/times used, and you lost spells depending on how you mixed them, just getting the spells via level up is much more simple.
 

Gruco

Banned
It was better when you lose spells when you mix them! That way you have to think about the the advantages and disadvantages each way. It is more simple to get them by level up, but a system with cost benefit considerations will more likely than not be superior to a simple one.
 

Wario64

works for Gamestop (lol)
Yeah, how long was your game time?

At the rate I'm going, I'm hoping to finish it in a couple days
 

kiryogi

Banned
Now if you could only make the connections to Phantasia :D And Craymel Cage is Eternia only. Symphonia is along the lines of Phantasia.. for the most part.
 

AniHawk

Member
I'm 40 hours in, and I still don't see the end of the game yet. Made it to disc two on the 36th hour. Gonna do the sidequests, but this should be a 50 hour game when all is said and done.

I've been playing it pretty much nonstop since Thursday too.
 

Wario64

works for Gamestop (lol)
kiryogi said:
Now if you could only make the connections to Phantasia :D And Craymel Cage is Eternia only. Symphonia is along the lines of Phantasia.. for the most part.

Another reason why they should port ToP to the states!
 

Gruco

Banned
JJConrad said:
How long did it take you?

Or better yet, how much free time do you have?

My end game save is 37:37.

Normally I expect to be a bit faster than average, but I did a lot of the Z conversations, and putzed around a bit, so that my be a good indicator. I think any serious attempt to do side quests would be a lot longer though.

And I just gradated college and don't work for another month yet, so I have all the free time in the word :)

How do most people rank the series? Is there anything that makes Phantasia or Destiny stand out?
 

kiryogi

Banned
Phantasia tends to be the most loved for nostalgic reasons. It'd be a huge step back to play it now, especially after playing Symphonia, but it's the game that started the series. Tales of Destiny is the least liked of the bunch. (But it was the scape goat required to remake ToP for the psx) Anyway, give Phantasia a shot in some form. (other than the SFC version..)

on a current note, have you tried the arena yet in Symphonia?
 

Gruco

Banned
Yeah, I kinda thought that might be the answer about Phantasia...

The only thing I did in the arena was the necessary plot fight. I need to figure out what each side quest involves/rewards you with before I tackle 'em....
 

kiryogi

Banned
Arena = basically the best weapons. There's also a fun "hard" cameo fight. I'd suggest you do all the sidequests for the extra outfits.. here's a teaser:

Image000.jpg

Image007.jpg
 

MrCheez

President/Creative Director of Grumpyface Studios
Just started playing yesterday...

I...love...this... game !!!

I think I like it even more than the mighty Skies of Arcadia so far!! O_O
 

Mejilan

Running off of Custom Firmware
Can someone please, in spoiler tags, link up ToS and ToP for me?

Also... that crazy-awesome song that plays when you fight a Summon Spirit, Fighting of the Spirits (I think its called), isn't that a ToP song? Is that the only ToP song remake?
 

Wario64

works for Gamestop (lol)
Mejilan said:
Can someone please, in spoiler tags, link up ToS and ToP for me?

Also... that crazy-awesome song that plays when you fight a Summon Spirit, Fighting of the Spirits (I think its called), isn't that a ToP song? Is that the only ToP song remake?

That song is from ToP? Ugh, too lazy to go through the soundtrack...someone find the track # for me :p

The song is awesome btw. Been listening to the ToS soundtrack as I progress through the game
 

Wario64

works for Gamestop (lol)
Just started disc 2. How many hours do I have left, minus side quests?

Btw, I'm 24 hours into the game
 

Gruco

Banned
I can't really be exact, but probably around....twelve...

I think it took me longer than that to get to disc two, but I don't really remember......

Sorry, I'm pretty useless....
 

Wario64

works for Gamestop (lol)
Hey, any estimate is good. I gotta pace myself so I'll at least be able to finish it in time. I'm in "rush through the game" mode :p
 

AniHawk

Member
Wario64 said:
Just started disc 2. How many hours do I have left, minus side quests?

Btw, I'm 24 hours into the game

Depends. I got to disc two on the 36th hour, and I'm now 52 hours in and checking the sidequests out (though I got to the final boss and turned back at the 48th hour).
 

AniHawk

Member
Okay, I'd like to know the following, if people could help:

How do I trigger events in Exire (haven't met anyone in particular yet)?
What do I do after the final battle in the single advance mode of the Meltokio Arena?
How the hell do I get into the secret dungeon in Sybak?
 

Mejilan

Running off of Custom Firmware
I've confirmed that Fighting of the Spirits, the theme in ToS that plays when you are being tested by a Summon Spirit, is indeed a remake of a song from Tales of Phantasia. Awesome.
 

kiryogi

Banned
Other remixed/arranged songs with be Mizuho's theme, Flanoir's, Ymir forest, Derris Kharlan/Vinheim and finally the ending theme *not credits

and for some Symphonia to Phantasia bits.. if you've seen the ending for Symphonia

I'm positive that basically nobody knows what the tree was named unless you played Phantasia, am I correct? Ill mention more when I get responses.
 

Shouta

Member
Yeah, it was I who said that the Tales series greatest draw is the characters. It`s a crying shame that ToDII and ToS didn`t do anything for me in that department. It`s still a fun game but I just didn`t enjoy it like I did Eternia or Destiny I
 

Gruco

Banned
kiryogi said:
I'm positive that basically nobody knows what the tree was named unless you played Phantasia, am I correct? Ill mention more when I get responses.
Correct!
Shouta said:
It`s a crying shame that ToDII and ToS didn`t do anything for me in that department.
Jerk! Oh...I mean...that's too bad.

I thought this was right around with Eternia in that area. All the little random conversations on the map were good, the personalites worked well together, although I guess they didn't click quite the same way the smaller crew in Eternia did...nor did Lloyd or Zelos make me laugh as hard as Max did.

Argh, need to play Destiny....
 

Shouta

Member
Destiny is my favorite in story and characters. It feels the least off-beat in those departments. I think it has to do with the fact it uses a more traditional medieval archtype as opposed to the other games. The character designs were also damn badass and didn`t look so "colorful" ;p
 

AniHawk

Member
Docpan said:
Don't you people have jobs?

How can you have 50+ hours on it already?

:(

Been playing night and day... I'm on vacation, and I'm almost done with it.

Just need three more things, and I'll go on to the final boss, but nobody so far has been able to provide me with an answer.
 

ferricide

Member
Shouta said:
Destiny is my favorite in story and characters.
wow, really? that's got to be the only RPG where i (A) gave every character a stupid custom name because i didn't care about them at all and (B) by the end, just jammed on the button without reading the text to get rid of the dialogue as fast as possible. (i mean doing both of these without giving up on the game, of course.)
 

kiryogi

Banned
AniHawk said:
Okay, I'd like to know the following, if people could help:

How do I trigger events in Exire (haven't met anyone in particular yet)?
What do I do after the final battle in the single advance mode of the Meltokio Arena?
How the hell do I get into the secret dungeon in Sybak?

Err sorry.

1:
Are you talking about Refill/Genius' mother or Maxwell?
2: what do you mean? anything left?
3: You'll need the evil sealing stone.. (err.. sacred stone in english?) found in vinhelm. Then refer to a villager in heimdall and you should finally have access. (I assume you've already investigated the book)
 

Shouta

Member
Destiny rocked. Rutea > Ferricide

Destiny 1`s gameplay wasn`t bad. First step into the PS era and beyond for the series.
 

AniHawk

Member
kiryogi said:
Err sorry.

1:
Are you talking about Refill/Genius' mother or Maxwell?
2: what do you mean? anything left?
3: You'll need the evil sealing stone.. (err.. sacred stone in english?) found in vinhelm. Then refer to a villager in heimdall and you should finally have access. (I assume you've already investigated the book)

1. Any one of them.
2.
Well I saw Seles and Yukanuga. I didn't know what I was supposed to do after that
3. Thanks. I found it. :)
 

kiryogi

Banned
1: Listen to what people say about Virginia then go to the house in the south west with Refill as your leader. You'll get to meet mrs. Sage. (However I think this event is over if you're past summary event 154..) The other thing to do in Exile is to face Maxwell, go around a certain house near an island where a woman is talking to her grandmother. Keep going and you'll find a stone tablet. Equip Earth, Water, Fire and Wind elemental rings (That you got from each spirit) on to the lead 4 in your party (one each.) And all with all contract battles, you must have Shihna in your party.

2: Well that's basically it if you beat celes and got Last Fencer. Try to beat single arena with everyone though, you basically get the best weapons and titles. Also give team battle (advanced) a shot for a fun last match. (good equipment to be won too)
 

AniHawk

Member
kiryogi said:
1: Listen to what people say about Virginia then go to the house in the south west with Refill as your leader. You'll get to meet mrs. Sage. (However I think this event is over if you're past summary event 154..) The other thing to do in Exile is to face Maxwell, go around a certain house near an island where a woman is talking to her grandmother. Keep going and you'll find a stone tablet. Equip Earth, Water, Fire and Wind elemental rings (That you got from each spirit) on to the lead 4 in your party (one each.) And all with all contract battles, you must have Shihna in your party.

2: Well that's basically it if you beat celes and got Last Fencer. Try to beat single arena with everyone though, you basically get the best weapons and titles. Also give team battle (advanced) a shot for a fun last match.

1. Aww, so now I'm at the end of the game, I can't get that first part anymore? That sucks. I may have also sold the elemental rings, so I can't do the other thing either.

2. Damnit. I beat it with Lloyd and not Zelos..
 

kiryogi

Banned
If you have patience, dl this vid gruco: http://kir.sytes.net/Movies/suck.rar

it's me giving the advanced party a run (with my victory against the tales cameo, but not my best one). it's 34 megs and I have a slow connection. So have patience. XD

note: it's named suck since it's been awhile since i played (you'll notice as I pull off incomplete uattacks and spam some attacks more than need be XD)
 

ferricide

Member
Shouta said:
Destiny rocked. Rutea > Ferricide
OMG NOEZ

Shouta said:
Destiny 1`s gameplay wasn`t bad. First step into the PS era and beyond for the series.
yeah, which is why i kept playing. fun. also, i'd just come off of xenogears, and i was so sick of it that destiny seemed like the obvious and excellent opposite of it in every way. yei~
 

AniHawk

Member
Finally beat the game. It's gonna take a while for this to sink in, since I've been playing it pretty much nonstop since Thursday, but man, what a ride.

The gameplay, my god, is that a breath of fresh air for an RPG (for me). It's the perfect blend of KotOR + Grandia + total control over your characters. For me, it was constantly fun, and I'm real hard to please when it comes to RPGs in the gameplay department (only others I found fun were Grandia I and II, and KotOR).

I really liked most of the characters except for Collete (who I hated). Can't we for once have a female character who's supposed to save the world and actually have second thoughts halfway through, or something to mix up that clichéd role just a bit? My favorite characters were Zelos and Lloyd. I liked Zelos since he reminded me a ton of Gilder from Skies of Arcadia, and Lloyd seemed like Vyse, but a complete moron (which I enjoyed since he wasn't an unintentional moron, the writers made sure to point it out over and over again). The rest of the party was alright, not spectacular, but good enough.

In regards to the story... I think it's the only RPG where I saw 90% of the plot twists coming.
From the beginning, I thought, "I bet Remiel's a bad guy. He's probably not really Collete's dad." That Kratos was probably a villain, definitely knew he was Lloyd's father (it was in Triet). And I had a small feeling that Mithos was Yggdrassil, but the age difference kept it just at that small feeling. I didn't expect Zelos to betray the party, and for EVERYONE to be "killed off" before the second fights with Pronyma and Yggdrassil, to be rescued again by Zelos.
Though, I don't think it all was trying to shock the gamer with the surprises since they were so clichéd, and that they did some heavy foreshadowing with certain events.

Onto the graphics... I thought they were just bland and basic in the beginning. Towards the end, it felt a lot more immersive, and the world was more colorful and lively (
like when floating above the ground in Exire
). The battle animations were very well done as well, and I got over the whole cutesy look as well. I wished there was more to the anime cutscenes. The intro and ending were very well animated, and looked gorgeous. A shame we weren't able to see more than those 5 minutes of animation (or so).

The sidequests were plentiful.
I rebuilt Luin, defeated both advance classes in the arena, met with Levin, saved Hilda, showed Noah a Katz, got the beach costumes, formed a pact with Maxwell, solved the Aifread mess, saved Clara, and there was still the cursed book, the sword dancers, the Dark Weapons sidequest, and more to do. I can see easily where one might spend 80 hours or more trying to do everything.

Onto the sound, there were only three songs which stuck in my head: the intro anime music, the credits music, and the final boss battle music. Everything else got annoying after awhile since I'd played so much of the game so quickly, but even then, nothing really struck me as particularly great. And while we're on the subject of annoying, who the hell thought that the voice of "Ducky" from those Land Before Time sequels would be a good choice for the female lead!? They could have easily had Jennifer or Tara doing two voices (though Tara was doing two already). It wasn't so much the voice as much as the whisper-talking she did in some words. For example, in italics, she'd sigh the word out: "People shouldn't be made to suffer!"

Otherwise, I thought everyone did a good job. I would've liked to have heard Tara Strong and Cam Clarke give a bit better performance, but they were fine the way they were. Scott Menville and Shiloh Strong really seemed to know what they were doing. Jennifer Hale did a great job too. Some of Lloyd's lines really struck me as memorable from how well they were delivered. Yuan, Yggdrassil, and
Mithos were also voiced well. I especially liked Mithos' "die" and "JUDGMENT!" in the final battle.

The ending was good. Preachy, but good.
Kinda surprised Lloyd sprouted wings, but upon reviewing it, I saw that Mithos was sucked into Lloyd's exsphere (I think). Liked how we don't find out the name of the tree, and I liked Lloyd's final line of that scene ("I've got it! The tree's name is-!"). Could have done without the scene of everyone at the end. Would have preferred it been like Skies of Arcadia where we see what happens to the characters in shots of them at the end of the game in the credits.

I only have two questions regarding the ending:
What is the tree's new name? Apparently it's in Tales of Phantasia, but I don't remember much from the little I played of that title. Also, Kratos isn't a half-elf. Why did he say "As long as a half-elf of Cruxis remains...?" What becomes of Yuan as well? Does he take off with Kratos or what?

All in all, a great game. I think. Like I said, it still has yet to sink in, but from the time I spent with it, it was very enjoyable, and well worth the money spent.

My final stats were as follows:

Final time: 54 hours, 22 minutes, 34 seconds
693 encounters
1,563,000 Gald spent
Max combo did 11,567 in damage
1445 GPs
 

kiryogi

Banned
The tree's name is Yggdrasil. Very given to all Phantasia players. I can't explain much about Yuan, he sorta fades into the background in the final moments. Not too positive about Krato's Cruxis comment either. *Hmm, is Yuan halfelf? XD

Now for some fun details that theortically link this to Phantasia. It's about 1000 years before Phantasia takes place even. Let's see:

Shihna is Suzu's ancestor (Both share the last name Fujibayashi and Shihna's chief outfit is what Suzu wears)

The Eternal Sword, Flamberge, Vorpal blade. It was thanks to Lloyd's pact about humans being able to use the Eternal Sword that Cless is able to use it as well a millenium later in Phantasia.

The ending, the combination of Sylvarant and Tethe Alla in theory is Aselia (I think thats the name of the planet Phantasia takes place on) There's also mention of about the two moons named Sylvarant and Tethe Alla in Klarth's library in Phantasia.

Derris Kharlan. This was supposedly the place where ToP villian Dhaos originated from.

Yggdrasil Tree. The mana tree Aselia depends on, with the goddess Martel watching over it.

Toize Valley Mine. It's believed that the door leads to the Morlia Gallery

Ymir forest/Heimdall/BUSHBABY: Both are in present day Phantasia, and both inhabit elves that hate halfelves.

That's all I can recall for now.. There are naysayers about this, but for all we know, Tales Studio probably rewrote Phantasia canon.
 

AniHawk

Member
kiryogi said:
The tree's name is Yggdrasil. Very given to all Phantasia players. I can't explain much about Yuan, he sorta fades into the background in the final moments. Not too positive about Krato's Cruxis comment either. *Hmm, is Yuan halfelf? XD

Now for some fun details that theortically link this to Phantasia. It's about 1000 years before Phantasia takes place even. Let's see:

Shihna is Suzu's ancestor (Both share the last name Fujibayashi and Shihna's chief outfit is what Suzu wears)

The Eternal Sword, Flamberge, Vorpal blade. It was thanks to Lloyd's pact about humans being able to use the Eternal Sword that Cless is able to use it as well a millenium later in Phantasia.

The ending, the combination of Sylvarant and Tethe Alla in theory is Aselia (I think thats the name of the planet Phantasia takes place on) There's also mention of about the two moons named Sylvarant and Tethe Alla in Klarth's library in Phantasia.

Derris Kharlan. This was supposedly the place where ToP villian Dhaos originated from.

Yggdrasil Tree. The mana tree Aselia depends on, with the goddess Martel watching over it.

Toize Valley Mine. It's believed that the door leads to the Morlia Gallery

Ymir forest/Heimdall/BUSHBABY: Both are in present day Phantasia, and both inhabit elves that hate halfelves.

That's all I can recall for now.. There are naysayers about this, but for all we know, Tales Studio probably rewrote Phantasia canon.

That's all pretty cool. I guess it's potentially the biggest surprise in the game if it's true.

What do you mean by "Phantasia canon?"
 

Bebpo

Banned
Everyone should do the dark weapons sidequest after finishing the game. It's probably the best boss fight that keeps you on your toes without feeling cheap (The ToE/ToD crew at the arena felt more annoying than fun for me), and wow playing around with the dark weapons is sooooo much fun (though it makes the end game stuff really easy, so theoretically you should beat the game and then go back and do the dark weapons). I had like 1000+ encounters when I finished the game and so my dark weapon Lloyd was a freaking monster :) It's a great payoff for the effort you put into the dark weapon boss.
 

Eric-GCA

Banned
who the hell thought that the voice of "Ducky" from those Land Before Time sequels would be a good choice for the female lead!?

The same type of peeps who cast her in an almost identical role in Grandia 2, and while not identical, she was the lead in Eternal Darkness.
 

belgurdo

Banned
Why do Raine and Genis
call themselves half-elves when they are captured and taken across the bridge early into Tethealla?
Are they trying to fool Zelos or did the writers forget the distinction?
 

Tabs

Member
Ok, so I haven't fully started the game yet (just got up to the first few fights to see what it was like before I really get into it). My question is how are you guys playing out the battles, as in, are you only playing one character at a time or do you switch? I'm a bit concerned over the real time nature of the combat. I'm afraid I'm not going to have the control over the fights like I'd want, unless I played one character exclusively (which I also don't want).

So, can someone who's made some progress give me an idea of what happens in a typical fight?
 
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