-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Kerry: I want to raise minimum wage to $7
- Thread starter Bishman
- Start date
- Status
videogamer
Banned
It's not hard to find jobs that pay $7/hr....
this is also one of those things, like undocumented workers, that actually ends up helping the economy, even though a first-order analysis might come up with the opposite conclusion. i don't know about any of this erkonomics shit though, what i DO know is that it's absolutely ridiculous to have a class of working poor, and that socially it's a detriment to us all that we, as a society, not only allow it, but condone it.
and that's my piece.
and that's my piece.
siamesedreamer
Banned
This is just your typical bone thrown to the unions as union pay is generally based off minimum wage - as in something like minimum wage plus $6.
As someone stated before, all things are relative and the temporary gain for those this benefits is offset by inflation. In other words, minimum wage will always be minimum wage not matter what the set level. The market always corrects itself to ensure that fact.
As someone stated before, all things are relative and the temporary gain for those this benefits is offset by inflation. In other words, minimum wage will always be minimum wage not matter what the set level. The market always corrects itself to ensure that fact.
LittleTokyo
Member
Classical economic thought would tell you that raising the minimum wage is a bad idea. Essentially it will not only cause inflation, but also cause businesses to hire less workers to work less hours. On the other hand, many would argue that with the growing increase in wealth between the upper and lower class, that something must be done.
Personally, as a college student that HAD a job last semester, the current minimum wage was sufficient for my needs.
Personally, as a college student that HAD a job last semester, the current minimum wage was sufficient for my needs.
The problem, in terms of economics, with raising the minimum wage is the same as with any sort of price fixing. Consider it in terms of a marketplace, where the product being sold is labour. That labour has, like in any other market, a range of costs based on perceived value. When you set a minimum price on that labour (a price floor), you do not change the supply and demand dynamic, you simply cut out a piece of the market and create a disparity between supply (the supply of labour for under the minimum wage) and the demand (the number of jobs that are seen as worth that value).
With jobs, however, this is generally seen, at some point, as being an acceptable tradeoff when it prevents jobs that leave the employee in a state of virtual slavery, because they become unable to meet the normal minimum expenses required to live in the society, and so they go further and further into debt they can never escape.
(my explanation of the dangers of price floors is pretty weak. But it gives you enough information -- especially terminology -- that you should be able to google your way to understanding it better)
With jobs, however, this is generally seen, at some point, as being an acceptable tradeoff when it prevents jobs that leave the employee in a state of virtual slavery, because they become unable to meet the normal minimum expenses required to live in the society, and so they go further and further into debt they can never escape.
(my explanation of the dangers of price floors is pretty weak. But it gives you enough information -- especially terminology -- that you should be able to google your way to understanding it better)
RevenantKioku
PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS PEINS oh god i am drowning in them
"Last semester" ?? If you're a college student and you can afford to not work a semester, you're not really one to talk.
LittleTokyo
Member
Well, I don't plan on paying off my college debts with a minimum wage paying job, that'd be pretty ridiculous to even attempt.
Mega Man's Electric Sheep
Member
Celicar said:
Some people have to support others on their minimum wage job. But I guess Bush's "edukashun is the ansurr!" will become the call of those against minimum wage raising. Well, some of them anyway.
Wear do you live and how many hours a week do you work to say that? My main (read: consistent) job pays $6.50/hour, and i work about 38 hours a week. Luckily, i work for a temp agency, because the first job doesn't pay enough to pay the rent, utilities, food, and car (no note, just upkeep).Celicar said:
Edit: Sarcasm?
Saint Cornelius
Banned
Celicar said:
where do you live
Just to give an idea of the financial difference between canada and the US- Right now I make 11.50 an hour , the minimum wage in alberta is 5.90, and the minimum cost of living for a single person in say edmonton for a one bedroom apartment is about 1000 dollars a month.
For americans that's-
roughly 800 USD to live here for a month(that's minimal amount of food + rent + basic utilities)
Minimum wage in alberta= 4.71 USD an hour
My wage- 9.18 USD
Something else to consider, at minumum wage you make under the taxable income line so you keep everything you make except about 5 % for employment insurance + pension.. well if you do your taxes atleast. At my wage I lose 20 % of my income to Taxes + EI and pension. For my current lifestyle , if I lived alone I still wouldn't make enough. I own a car, I have cable and internet, it's all extra shit but if I lived on my own things would be tight.
For americans that's-
roughly 800 USD to live here for a month(that's minimal amount of food + rent + basic utilities)
Minimum wage in alberta= 4.71 USD an hour
My wage- 9.18 USD
Something else to consider, at minumum wage you make under the taxable income line so you keep everything you make except about 5 % for employment insurance + pension.. well if you do your taxes atleast. At my wage I lose 20 % of my income to Taxes + EI and pension. For my current lifestyle , if I lived alone I still wouldn't make enough. I own a car, I have cable and internet, it's all extra shit but if I lived on my own things would be tight.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
Celicar said:
yeah.. florida is cheap as hell .
i have a friend paying $200 a month for rent in Tallahassee. craziness.
videogamer
Banned
fart said:
He could be living on a campground and begging for food. Watches DVDs at the internet cafe. He might have other sources of funds besides work.
Max Sawicky likes the idea. Which isn't surprising, knowing him.
I don't think the inflation/minimum wage connection is as strong as some people have pointed out, since it only applies to a fraction of all workers, and a smaller fraction of a business' costs. I think the effect would be more a distribution effect than anything else.
maharg: I think the counter-argument would be that the demand side of the equation would be elastic enough that . Then again, the only stuff from Econ I remember is that my teacher used to live in a truck.
I don't think the inflation/minimum wage connection is as strong as some people have pointed out, since it only applies to a fraction of all workers, and a smaller fraction of a business' costs. I think the effect would be more a distribution effect than anything else.
maharg: I think the counter-argument would be that the demand side of the equation would be elastic enough that . Then again, the only stuff from Econ I remember is that my teacher used to live in a truck.
Celicar said:
The real preoblem with a federal minimum wage is that it is a flat and fixed sum.
California min is more than federal but in some regions of the state (sacramento, bay area, portions of LA, San Diego) it is not suffiecient to support oneself on in most situations.
Federal min wage won't mean shit untill it is a sliding scale based off of regional/local costs of living and other economic factors such as taxes and services offered in that area.
One step closer to a working (which is key) living wage.
California min is more than federal but in some regions of the state (sacramento, bay area, portions of LA, San Diego) it is not suffiecient to support oneself on in most situations.
Federal min wage won't mean shit untill it is a sliding scale based off of regional/local costs of living and other economic factors such as taxes and services offered in that area.
One step closer to a working (which is key) living wage.
Pachinko said:
Why do you say 'the difference'? This is pretty much par for the course for any North American city of Edmonton's size, I believe. Also, I'm pretty sure you could get by (though I wouldn't wish it on anyone) on around $7-800/mo here in Edmonton. You would be lacking many things, but that would pay for low rent ($400, or significantly less if you're willing to split rent), utilities, and phone. Cable and internet would be a stretch, and it'd be ramen all the way, but you could do it. Just for argument's sake
The differences in taxation between America and the US happen in the upper brackets. For people in what's considered lower middle class and below it's about the same. Living costs just generally vary by a wide degree based on the local rate of inflation, more or less.
Mandark: I'm sure there are tons of arguments for and against. I'm no economist, but that makes some sense to me. I think all arguments become moot once you've got a government basically supporting unlivable wages. Of course, if the government doesn't also provide a fallback for those who can't find work because of an artificial drop in demand, you have problems there too.
$5.15 is ridiculous for minimum wage. Although, I feel Kerry claiming he can raise it to $7 is an extreme promise. I don't know why he even skipped like promising 6 dollars, as I would be thrilled for it to just get there.
Bottom line is Bush totally screwed our economy, 1.6 million jobs gone, I don't understand why anyone but rich corporate assholes and people who are into Bush's moral issues and actually thing he's going to do something for those so-called moral issues, or people who actually think establishing a democracy in Iraq is feasible and beneficial would want for a president.
$5.15 for minimum wage is bull shit. Prices are going up for everything, and our minimum wage has gone nowhere. I'm working 15-28 hours a week at Pizza Hut on top of high school and I feel like I'm barley making anything at $5.15 an hour. Until I pay my car insurance and gas money, and even for the money I do get, I'm working a lot so I don't have time to really enjoy it.
Someone had said that if they raised minimum wage people would get less hours, FINE BY ME, I'd love to have more time.
Bush fucked over the middle class and it's time we get the change the American people deserve.
Bottom line is Bush totally screwed our economy, 1.6 million jobs gone, I don't understand why anyone but rich corporate assholes and people who are into Bush's moral issues and actually thing he's going to do something for those so-called moral issues, or people who actually think establishing a democracy in Iraq is feasible and beneficial would want for a president.
$5.15 for minimum wage is bull shit. Prices are going up for everything, and our minimum wage has gone nowhere. I'm working 15-28 hours a week at Pizza Hut on top of high school and I feel like I'm barley making anything at $5.15 an hour. Until I pay my car insurance and gas money, and even for the money I do get, I'm working a lot so I don't have time to really enjoy it.
Someone had said that if they raised minimum wage people would get less hours, FINE BY ME, I'd love to have more time.
Bush fucked over the middle class and it's time we get the change the American people deserve.
Baron Aloha
A Shining Example
I'm all for raising the minimum wage. Prices are already skyrocketing on everything so I doubt raising the minimum wage could make them go up that much higher. Heck, the very fact that prices keep going up on everything is reason enough to justify an increase. A person who is doing right by society, staying out of trouble, and working a full time job should make enough money to support themselves.
The cost of living in some areas is off the charts. In Maryland the minimum wage is the federal minimum ($5.15). Meanwhile the cost of houses and condominiums has doubled in the past 5 years. The vast majority of places want $1000 a month just to rent an apartment (and a really crappy one at that). Heck, even if you could find a place for $500 a month and you didn't pay a single cent in taxes on each check that would only leave you with $324 a month to pay for food, transportation, car insurance (which there is a law in Maryland that requires that you have it... so thats like another $500 a year easily), and utilities which clearly isn't enough.
The cost of living in some areas is off the charts. In Maryland the minimum wage is the federal minimum ($5.15). Meanwhile the cost of houses and condominiums has doubled in the past 5 years. The vast majority of places want $1000 a month just to rent an apartment (and a really crappy one at that). Heck, even if you could find a place for $500 a month and you didn't pay a single cent in taxes on each check that would only leave you with $324 a month to pay for food, transportation, car insurance (which there is a law in Maryland that requires that you have it... so thats like another $500 a year easily), and utilities which clearly isn't enough.
Tommie Hu$tle
Member
By Haya El Nasser, USA TODAY
You couldn't support yourself or a home on 7/hour. Everything else is going up in price without an increase in wages. You can only squeeze the worker so much.
You couldn't support yourself or a home on 7/hour. Everything else is going up in price without an increase in wages. You can only squeeze the worker so much.
I'm sorry I really don't have pity on people with families that work for minimum wages. It is so easy for low income or minorities to get grants for college now days, that if you don't take advantage of it.. then you deserve your lot in life. After all it is COMPELTELY your fault if you get pregant while you can't support yourself let alone a child. Rape notwithstanding of course.
Outdoor Miner
Member
Mashing said:
But what about for those that DO have college educations and are more than qualified to have an outstanding job, but have to settle on low-paying jobs (much like the article Tommie posted).
Tommie Hu$tle
Member
Sal Paradise Jr said:
I don't think he read that.
MrAngryFace
Banned
This thread is full of stupid opinions on living poor. Why? Cause most of us probably dont live poor enough to give qualified opinions on the subject.
All of us fucking talk about buying our games and our dvds and yes, while we may be eating ramen, we arent poor. None of us are dirt poor, and for that reason wtf. I mean seriously, WTF. Jesus christ motherfuckingshithelldamnfuck.
Minimum Wage sucks right now. Working Poor is on the rise while whats left of Middle Class is rushing to join this new growing class of labor. Exciting times we live in.
All of us fucking talk about buying our games and our dvds and yes, while we may be eating ramen, we arent poor. None of us are dirt poor, and for that reason wtf. I mean seriously, WTF. Jesus christ motherfuckingshithelldamnfuck.
Minimum Wage sucks right now. Working Poor is on the rise while whats left of Middle Class is rushing to join this new growing class of labor. Exciting times we live in.
- Status