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[Panajev2001a]

In my opinion it was a mistake that Epic stopped making their own games

Still making Fortnight, but that is it :/.

 

[GymWolf]

Why would I want FOX Engine when MGS looks like freaking this:

It's just gaf special move, crying about ue5

 

[deriks]

But every remake is like that, every remake has the gatekeepers that ll hate no matter what, If god itself remade NG2 ppl would still complain about It.

Would for sure, but the art direction that changed into a generic one and everyone agrees that is a standard with this engine? Maybe not

 

[mrMUR_96]

FOX Engine was amazing and had such a good feel to it. I'd gladly sacrifice some modern visual doo-dads to go back to that tech. I don't even have to think about it.

What does engine have to do with feel. They did absolutely fantastic work on the gameplay and animations in mgsv, but that's not due to the engine, that's down to the teams animators and game designers. Nailing the "feel" of a game is not restricted to the engine. Does dead space (remake) feel like battlefield or need for speed or fifa? because that's all frostbite. Does Death stranding feel like horizon because they're both decima. What about comparing UE5 shooters, let's say the finals, fortnite, stalker and valorant. They all feel and play entirely differently with different animation weight, physics interactions, traversal speed etc. What about PES and MGSV actually, because they're both fox engine.

 

[GymWolf]

What does engine have to do with feel. They did absolutely fantastic work on the gameplay and animations in mgsv, but that's not due to the engine, that's down to the teams animators and game designers. Nailing the "feel" of a game is not restricted to the engine. Does dead space (remake) feel like battlefield or need for speed or fifa? because that's all frostbite. Does Death stranding feel like horizon because they're both decima. What about comparing UE5 shooters, let's say the finals, fortnite, stalker and valorant. They all feel and play entirely differently with different animation weight, physics interactions, traversal speed etc. What about PES and MGSV actually, because they're both fox engine.

 

[Knot3D]

Fox engine gave me Motion Sickness, so NO THANKS.

 

[Katajx]

Not really, just look at the announcement trailer for the game straight out of the PS5 reveal event:



That vertical slice looks orders of magnitude better than the final game, so the underlying technology is clearly not the problem.

Then what happened? Probably that Luminous Productions, as a AAA development team, lacked the resources (and in some areas, technical talent down there in the trenches) to execute on such a high level across an open-world action game that has 30 to 40 hours worth of content.

Fuck, even the Citadel -- crafted in 2013 under Nomura's short-lived time at the helm of Final Fantasy XV -- completely surpasses both Final Fantasy XVI and Final Fantasy VII Rebirth when it comes to visuals on all fronts:

In regards to the FOX Engine, in some areas, it even surpassed the latest version of Decima that, at the time, went on to power the original Death Stranding. In fact, had it been developed while at Konami, I'm tempted to say that the game would've benefited of a slightly more sophisticated lighting, a day and night cycle and perhaps 60FPS on, at the least, the PS4 Pro, as well as an overall less clinical look to the visuals.

But going outside "what if" territory, I'll just say that the visuals in display in P.T. are still to this day just as breathtaking -- if not richer in some regards! -- than the interiors from Silent Hill 2 and f, and needless to say the artistic shitshow that is the MGS Delta remake.


Because that's all a merit of the hardware running the game -- allowing for higher resolutions, higher polycounts and more detailed textures -- not of the underlying technology which sucks dick comparatively speaking to the results achieved by the FOX Engine a decade ago on a game that was targetting the PlayStation 3, which, yes, had 256MB of VRAM.

The lighting work in the Snake Eater remake is horrendous compared to The Phantom Pain, which if it came out next week on the Switch 2 would instantly become the best looking and most performant game on the hardware. It already is the best looking game you can play fully maxed out on the Steam Deck at rock-solid 60fps.

Yeah, we are just gonna have to agree to disagree there. Historically they would build an engine for the needs of a particular game.

Luminous engine was good for what they wanted to do with XV. I'll just say that just because something looks good in photo mode, doesn't mean that it's suitable to make multiple genres of games.

Square made FF7 Remake with Unreal and it was a more impressive and better playing game than XV or Forspoken.

 

[mrMUR_96]

Fox engine gave me Motion Sickness, so NO THANKS.

The engine itself lmao? What game, what settings, what framerate? Maybe it's one of the post processing effects (motion blur, dof, CA, lens effects) or a bad/inconsistent framerate in whatever you were playing. Not directly aimed at you, but there are some absolutely clueless takes in this thread and whenever discussion about engines come up, people have no idea what they're talking about and are just repeating whatever clueless streamer or youtuber they follow says about engines. MGSV played great at the time and ran well, but that's because it wasn't visually demanding, they were just very smart in nailing realistic lighting and materials (for the time) and visual direction (cinematography in cutscenes, strong art direction etc) whilst the actual assets and other elements were quite basic (it ran on PS3 and360!). Fox is heavily outdated these days and there's not many devs who know how to use it well and Konami wouldn't want to spend the money to update it to modern standards, it's just not worth it.

 

[poodaddy]

Konami should remake and flesh out Metal Gear and Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake

I've only been saying this for like a decade now. Honestly, why are they remaking the Solid titles when the originals are in so much greater need of an update? I hope they're considering it after the success of Delta at least.

 

[Knot3D]

The engine itself lmao? What game, what settings, what framerate? Maybe it's one of the post processing effects (motion blur, dof, CA, lens effects) or a bad/inconsistent framerate in whatever you were playing. Not directly aimed at you, but there are some absolutely clueless takes in this thread and whenever discussion about engines come up, people have no idea what they're talking about and are just repeating whatever clueless streamer or youtuber they follow says about engines. MGSV played great at the time and ran well, but that's because it wasn't visually demanding, they were just very smart in nailing realistic lighting and materials (for the time) and visual direction (cinematography in cutscenes, strong art direction etc) whilst the actual assets and other elements were quite basic (it ran on PS3 and360!). Fox is heavily outdated these days and there's not many devs who know how to use it well and Konami wouldn't want to spend the money to update it to modern standards, it's just not worth it.

Both Ground Zeroes and MGS V. Only other game that caused the same issue was Half Life 2 Source Engine.

 

[Killer8]

What does engine have to do with feel. They did absolutely fantastic work on the gameplay and animations in mgsv, but that's not due to the engine, that's down to the teams animators and game designers. Nailing the "feel" of a game is not restricted to the engine. Does dead space (remake) feel like battlefield or need for speed or fifa? because that's all frostbite. Does Death stranding feel like horizon because they're both decima. What about comparing UE5 shooters, let's say the finals, fortnite, stalker and valorant. They all feel and play entirely differently with different animation weight, physics interactions, traversal speed etc. What about PES and MGSV actually, because they're both fox engine.

You can really tell in these threads who hasn't actually played Delta. Most of the new movement and animations were lifted wholesale from The Phantom Pain. And in fact some things like prone movement actually feel better in Delta.

 

[mrMUR_96]

Both Ground Zeroes and MGS V. Only other game that caused the same issue was Half Life 2 Source Engine.

sounds like camera motion blur to me, I remember that looking awful in HL2. That's not an engine thing though, that's just a post processing setting that you can turn off.

 

[Danny Dudekisser]

What does engine have to do with feel. They did absolutely fantastic work on the gameplay and animations in mgsv, but that's not due to the engine, that's down to the teams animators and game designers. Nailing the "feel" of a game is not restricted to the engine. Does dead space (remake) feel like battlefield or need for speed or fifa? because that's all frostbite. Does Death stranding feel like horizon because they're both decima. What about comparing UE5 shooters, let's say the finals, fortnite, stalker and valorant. They all feel and play entirely differently with different animation weight, physics interactions, traversal speed etc. What about PES and MGSV actually, because they're both fox engine.

I'm using "feel" as a generic term for "it doesn't seem to have issues with stuttering, loading in large worlds, etc." Not in direct reference to gameplay (though Unreal games do tend to struggle with input lag).

 

[TGO]

If more than 5 people working at nu-Konami know how to work with and code in FOX Engine I'd be shocked. It's dead man.

Despite reports that the majority of the team left with Kojima, that's not entirely true
Most newer staff which was the bulk of KjP at the time but a lot of the people that worked on MGS1/2/3 are still at Konami

As Metal Gear Solid turns 27 years old, Hideo Kojima says "there are only a handful of people who participated" on the seminal classic who are "still a part of the new 'Kojima Productions'"

While the current Metal Gear series producer had a "Special Thanks" credit in the game

www.gamesradar.com

 

[diffusionx]

Despite reports that the majority of the team left with Kojima, that's not entirely true
Most newer staff which was the bulk of KjP at the time but a lot of the people that worked on MGS1/2/3 are still at Konami

As Metal Gear Solid turns 27 years old, Hideo Kojima says "there are only a handful of people who participated" on the seminal classic who are "still a part of the new 'Kojima Productions'"

While the current Metal Gear series producer had a "Special Thanks" credit in the game

www.gamesradar.com

what does MGS2 have to do with Fox Engine?

And even if people did work on Fox Engine in 2013 or whatever that doesn't mean they an just load it into Visual Studio and get to work.