Utter and total shit.
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Law School & Lawyer GAF
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Frank the Great
Banned
job market is horrendous. i am in top 18% + law review + two externships + internship + RA job and haven't got an interview for a stupid state clerkship yet . . .
i know it's still early but i thought i was really qualified for this and others have already gotten offers.
i hope i am panicking for no reason.not terrible...in Texas!
Seriously though, it is what you make of it. Big law won't hire like they used to, and everyone else has scaled back too, but its not terrrrrible. Its swinging back to "not bad" and most of people I know are getting paid something.
Im top half at a top 50 school with law review. I work a paid internship. I find the people who think its "Awwwwwwful" just haven't exhausted all their resources in finding a job or never sold themselves like they should have in their first two years. You have to hustle and never take anything for granted. I have alot of friends who do temp work, or court appointments, and they get by pretty ok (court appointments are actually pretty lucrative in certain areas).
So if you grind hard, you can still find a decent job.
Yeah 2L- so much going on, but like you said this takes a ton of pressure off. Still gonna keep my head down and keep working tho
idlethreats
Member
Just registered for the MPRE. Ofc, the year that I graduate is the year that the state I'll be practicing in decides to adopt the MPRE. Woo.
LowEndTorque
Member
1st week of post O-week law school over.
Lots of reading and lots of conceptual/philosophical/historical/theoretical bullshit. Not really what I was expecting to start with. Waiting to get into some actual substance.
I feel like the profs are taking a month to teach us concepts that could have been explained in 15 mins. I really don't understand the benefit of such a roundabout, circuitous and inefficient teaching style.... But I'm a total noob so what the fuck do I know anyway.
I wonder how much longer till we actually start learning what we need to know for the exams...
Lots of reading and lots of conceptual/philosophical/historical/theoretical bullshit. Not really what I was expecting to start with. Waiting to get into some actual substance.
I feel like the profs are taking a month to teach us concepts that could have been explained in 15 mins. I really don't understand the benefit of such a roundabout, circuitous and inefficient teaching style.... But I'm a total noob so what the fuck do I know anyway.
I wonder how much longer till we actually start learning what we need to know for the exams...
Manos: The Hans of Fate
Banned
What state and and hypothetically what subject?
brucewaynegretzky
Member
Hahahahahahahahahahaha o you're in for a ride. Welcome to law school. Start drinking.
In labor law news: The NHL is locking out. I suggest you all drink as well.
RandomDancing
Member
Between this and the email I just got stating that I'll be getting my bar results the first week of October, I'm thinking 11am is a wonderful time for straight vodka.
brucewaynegretzky
Member
I endorse this message.
Frank the Great
Banned
got two clerkship interviews this week. they are just state trial level but if i can get one i will be happy . . . hopefully by the time i would finish the clerkship in 2014 hiring will have picked up.
EatinOlives
Member
FFS, these logic games on the LSAT are the bane of my existence.
I don't see how it's humanly possible to complete the games sections in their entirety. I feel lucky when I'm stopped halfway through the third game, much less the fourth, much less FINISH the fourth. I consistently just barely finish the second game by the moment the time is called.
What the wat. I'm getting better at all the other sections but the damn logic games just won't budge.
I don't see how it's humanly possible to complete the games sections in their entirety. I feel lucky when I'm stopped halfway through the third game, much less the fourth, much less FINISH the fourth. I consistently just barely finish the second game by the moment the time is called.
What the wat. I'm getting better at all the other sections but the damn logic games just won't budge.
I don't know what's up with my brain but over the pass month I only miss one or two questions on each logic games section with quite a few that I've done perfectly. Logical reasoning is fine. Then I get to READING COMPREHENSION and perform like a 4th grader. It's ridiculous. I mean, reading comprehension of all things.
EatinOlives
Member
Yeah, reading comprehension is weird. Sometimes I blaze through the passage absorbing every word and sometimes I have to read each line twice just to get what they're saying. I think I'm getting better at it, though.
But those logic games...I hate those things. I really want to know what logic process people follow to get through it all in 35 mins.
ZackieChan
Member
I learned through the PowerScore books, and thought they were pretty good at teaching. That was a long-ass time ago, though.
ZackieChan
Member
I wish. All the work I'm doing now doesn't translate into post-grad employment, unfortunately. If anyone is looking for a full time entertainment law intern for the spring, I'm available
SerArthurDayne
Member
Fucker. Early November for me. Big State syndrome I guess. It's okay, I'm using my no-man's land status as an excuse for why I don't have a paying job yet.
Sucks, man. Doing anything right now?
SerArthurDayne
Member
Yeah, I'm actually working as an intern at a Public Defender's Office.
So, you could say I'm doing what I want to do, I'm just not getting paid to do it!
So, you could say I'm doing what I want to do, I'm just not getting paid to do it!
Yeah the PowerScore logic games bible was super useful. Are you taking in October or December?
When's that gig end? And god bless you, that's thankless work. I worked with the PD's office when I was in the capital defense clinic. It was always interesting, that's for sure.
Any chance this turns permanent?
SerArthurDayne
Member
I could probably stay as long as I wanted to.
And it is too uncertain for me to stay long enough for it to become permanent. Technically they have a 1 year experience requirement, but they can waive it. And I will have about 10mos of bar card experience before I even get my real bar card. If I stayed a year I would probably become permanent. I have heard 6mos isn't impossible, either.
But it would most likely take many months, and I can't live for that long with no income. I have a trivial amount of debt, which is to the good. I also have a trivial amount in the bank, which is to the bad.
edit: Trivial isn't really accurate in terms of debt. But compared to what many and most come out with it is.
And it is too uncertain for me to stay long enough for it to become permanent. Technically they have a 1 year experience requirement, but they can waive it. And I will have about 10mos of bar card experience before I even get my real bar card. If I stayed a year I would probably become permanent. I have heard 6mos isn't impossible, either.
But it would most likely take many months, and I can't live for that long with no income. I have a trivial amount of debt, which is to the good. I also have a trivial amount in the bank, which is to the bad.
edit: Trivial isn't really accurate in terms of debt. But compared to what many and most come out with it is.
What a shitty job market. Work for free for one year, and maaaaybe you'll get hired. Though, I suppose, you can pick up appointment work and practice the same type of law while getting similar pay less benefits.
SerArthurDayne
Member
Heh. That is exactly my plan come November. Can't get appointments from the county I'm actually in, but I am hoping to pick up some jail chain within driving distance. Also (half?) jokingly talking about starting up a private practice with another intern, but that scares me: both on the business side, and having me as the most experienced attorney in my office is a terrifying thought.
Starting your own practice is a terrifying thought.
SerArthurDayne
Member
I could handle most of what I would need to do on a daily basis without too much problem. But my training as a lawyer recoils from the potential liability in terror.
Maybe I'll do probate. Texas is privity of contract, so if you aren't the dead guy, I don't want to hear about any malpractice!
Maybe I'll do probate. Texas is privity of contract, so if you aren't the dead guy, I don't want to hear about any malpractice!
Snowden's Secret
Banned
OK, so I have a (functionally useless) Political Science degree and have been bouncing around the idea of going to law school for a couple years. I recently got a job at a law office and that's only reignited my desire to see this through to the end.
Couple of questions for those in the know:
My undergrad GPA is 3.2 or so, is that good enough? If not, should I go and get a masters to boost it or does that even matter?
I'm excellent at test taking, I could easily get a 165 on the LSAT (most of my practice tests are in the low 170s). Would that be good enough? Good enough to balance out my mediocre GPA?
Couple of questions for those in the know:
My undergrad GPA is 3.2 or so, is that good enough? If not, should I go and get a masters to boost it or does that even matter?
I'm excellent at test taking, I could easily get a 165 on the LSAT (most of my practice tests are in the low 170s). Would that be good enough? Good enough to balance out my mediocre GPA?
Well that works out nicely. Probate law always gets nasty.
You can always get into A law school. Whether that law school is worth a damn is another story.
Manos: The Hans of Fate
Banned
They let me in with a 154 lol.
Snowden's Secret
Banned
Depends upon what you want to do and if you have strong connections for landing a job once you graduate. You can see the GPA / LSAT requirements for your chosen school at that link. Outside of the top 10-14 law schools, the reputation of the law school and its ability to help you land a job will be heavily dependent upon its location. I would not to go to Emory Law to try to land a job in California, for example. Of course, there are all sorts of other variables such as alumni and your own personal connections that will factor in as well.
Manos: The Hans of Fate
Banned
Hey I made 69 despite being outside the LSAT range by a point.
All good advice...
Take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt, I'm only a 2L and I'm speaking from the view of someone who just went through the traditional on-campus hiring process at one of the so-called hire ranked schools-
Don't go to law school unless you can get into one of those so-called top schools. Seriously. I know people at wustl in the top 25% of their class who are jobless and feeling super screwed with debt. You can't go into law school thinking its a cure all for an undergrad degree.
I say this about school ranking bc I ended up way below median as far as my class rank goes- normally I'd be suuuuper screwed, but I was able to get job opportunities just based on the rep of the school. And even then hiring was rouuuugh this year, still had to hustle my ass off.
Manos: The Hans of Fate
Banned
Keep in mind there are jobs beyond a top firm. I never wanted to work in that setup, Id fucking want to kill myself.
Oh I totally agree- in fact the happiest ppl at my school are those not going the biglaw route- if you actually just love LAW and don't wanna get paid, then by all means go. I just think that when you mentioned "functionally useless degree" ur clear that a jd is probably riskier financially.
job market is horrendous. i am in top 18% + law review + two externships + internship + RA job and haven't got an interview for a stupid state clerkship yet . . .
i know it's still early but i thought i was really qualified for this and others have already gotten offers.
Wow I'm top 25% and have none of that. I'm doomed. I have a full time job but the chances of getting a legal job in Texas is slim.
I should not have to school part time and work full time.
Frank the Great
Banned
don't panic, my bitching was premature. i wound up getting a handful of interviews, and got a job offer (that i accepted) after my first one.
even though it's just a one-year clerkship it's nice to not have to worry about a job for a while.
I'm probably not the best person to give advice about law school, and it may go without saying, but if you're in any way uncertain or noncommittal at the prospect of being a practicing attorney (or something else from the thin category of JD-required jobs), don't go to law school. It's a huge investment of time, effort, and money, so be sure you want what you're going after.
WonkyPanda
Member
Didn't know this thread existed! Just dropping a "hello."
2L at Boalt. Got a V20 firm job lined up for the summer, and I am being especially lazy in 2L so far. I'd welcome if anyone has questions.
2L at Boalt. Got a V20 firm job lined up for the summer, and I am being especially lazy in 2L so far. I'd welcome if anyone has questions.
Manos: The Hans of Fate
Banned
Eh I still think you can get paid too and not be (and I know you're not saying this) the dirt poor public service attorney.
Bboy AJ
My dog was murdered by a 3.5mm audio port and I will not rest until the standard is dead
Sure, go ahead and ask us questions.
Nerdy Fergy
Neo Member
I have an interview with a Staff Judge Advocate for the Air Force on Monday. I know I am not likely to get selected on my first attempt, but it is still a little nerve racking. Any general advice?
From a pure dollars standpoint... even with scholarship money, a law student sacrifices three years of earnings potential, which must be factored into the equation.
I am not 100% confident leaving "go to top 6 with fair debt" unstriked.
Better listen to him, he's pre-med.
In other words, only go to law school if you can get into HYS? That's ridiculous.
No, it's a somewhat joking, somewhat serious response to the eternal "is it worth it v. the cost" discussion that revolves around law school.
EDIT: I should add that, from a pure dollars standpoint, I take a horribly pessimistic view of law school. In regards to anyone who wants to go because it's truly what they want to do, I take an entirely different stance.
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