Me and the 'ol girl. She graduated from Baylor Law this weekend.
Congrats! How did she survive being in Waco for three years? And what's she planning to do job-wise?
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Law School & Lawyer GAF
- Thread starter SD-Ness
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Congrats! How did she survive being in Waco for three years? And what's she planning to do job-wise?
TrueGrime
Member
Very carefully! She took constant trips back home here to DFW and I visited her when she couldn't come. She'll take the bar in July while already being cleared to go Airforce JAG in March of next year.
Advocatus Diaboli
Member
Does she have her selection of which two bases she can choose from yet? Or is .mil-to-.mil going to be a little different for her? That's how I remember it going down for me-- I had my pick of North Dakota and Okinawa, Japan.
So guys my girlfriend's father wants me, 1L with final grades pending, to help him draft a construction agreement. He paid a million for the restaurant and will pay 400k for the construction, but doesn't want to pay the 5k to his lawyer.
I told him these contracts are extremely complex and I do not feel comfortable helping with so much money at stake and now he's pissed at me.
Unreasonable right?
I told him these contracts are extremely complex and I do not feel comfortable helping with so much money at stake and now he's pissed at me.
Unreasonable right?
Jag
Member
Don't do it. Stick to your guns. Better to have him pissed off now then potentially screwed later (no offense).
Get used to telling people that you can't help them because you may not possess a specific skill set. In fact, it also gets you out of people trying to take advantage, but mostly you should never provide legal assistance if you are not familiar with the subject matter because it's a pretty good bet the other guy is.
(especially with construction contracts, it's probably an AIA form too)
Bboy AJ
My dog was murdered by a 3.5mm audio port and I will not rest until the standard is dead
Get used to it. Somehow, people will never grasp that you're doing them a favor by referring out. People will spend a crap ton of money on nonsense but they will absolutely refuse to hire a lawyer. I have no idea why. They see it as a thing they'd rather chance, I guess.
Better him pissed at you now over this than pissed when he gets fucked over by a poorly drafted contract.
SouSouRocket
Member
Frank the Great
Banned
I did pretty good at my PD interview, I think. After drilling me on the hypothetical for an hour, they said I had great instincts and that I "get it." They said they were surprised considering I have no criminal law background. I picked up on some things in the fact pattern that other applicants missed.
I completely fluffed the summation though. They said I had good presence, voice, and eye contact, but the content was terrible. I took the completely wrong approach and used one of those textbook arguments with boilerplate language. Oh well.
I hope I did will enough to get an offer.
I completely fluffed the summation though. They said I had good presence, voice, and eye contact, but the content was terrible. I took the completely wrong approach and used one of those textbook arguments with boilerplate language. Oh well.
I hope I did will enough to get an offer.
Dr_LawyerCop
Member
Just got a job offer from a law firm in Pittsburgh. More money than I would have even thought to ask for. Feels pretty good after a couple years bouncing around, sending out tons of resumes without getting any responses. Pretty glad the Air Force and Army JAG didn't take me this fall.
Advocatus Diaboli
Member
You probably made the right choice.
Signed,
An Air Force JAG probably getting fired this summer (and who went to school in Pittsburgh)
Fired or RIFed?
Advocatus Diaboli
Member
Same end result, I suppose, but at least it doesn't have the negative connotation of being "fired." I'm sure you got a ton of experience that will hopefully let you land another job quickly if you do get RIFed.
Congrats. Good city to work in.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
This is an argument I received in response to a Motion to Remand to state court. I moved to remand because instead of producing documents showing that the amount in controversy, they just submitted the declaration of their own employee saying that the records showed the amount in controversy requirement was met. In opposition, they stated:
"Plaintiff has objected to the Witness Declaration on the basis of hearsay and lack of foundation. However, the Witness has laid the appropriate foundation for the business record hearsay exception. See Witness Decl. Therefore, Plaintiff's objections fail."
This is dumb as hell on so many levels. Mostly because its not actually an argument, its just a statement. Also because, you know, the business records exception is to admit the business records themselves, not double hearsay about what they say.
"Plaintiff has objected to the Witness Declaration on the basis of hearsay and lack of foundation. However, the Witness has laid the appropriate foundation for the business record hearsay exception. See Witness Decl. Therefore, Plaintiff's objections fail."
This is dumb as hell on so many levels. Mostly because its not actually an argument, its just a statement. Also because, you know, the business records exception is to admit the business records themselves, not double hearsay about what they say.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
Yess took two tries but finally passed the bar and completed the transition from law school GAF to lawyer GAF. Feels good!
ZackieChan
Member
Can't you just trust him? Why would he lie? :/
I'm glad I'm not a litigator. Though I've had some pretty dumb attorneys/clients on the other side of trademark disputes...
No. Now on to the bar exam.
Don't think about the bar. Go out with friends and spend your free time at your favorite bar and don't let this huge, upcoming and life-determining event bar you from enjoying the next week. I know it will be stressful, but over the last three years you really raised the bar for our expectations of you, so try your hardest and do your best.
Bboy AJ
My dog was murdered by a 3.5mm audio port and I will not rest until the standard is dead
Yep. Take a couple of weeks off and just study everyday like it is your job. Looks at my past posts here. I took the last two weeks off before the bar. Well, not off completely but definitely not the grind. Put in honest work and you'll be fine. We have no doubt you'll pass if you put in the work.
I carpooled to the tests with a friend. She was stressed out and studying during the entire car ride. I drove the whole time. I passed. She didn't. She probably didn't put in any work beforehand. Knowing that, who would have bet on her, anyway? Can't cram for it.
I carpooled to the tests with a friend. She was stressed out and studying during the entire car ride. I drove the whole time. I passed. She didn't. She probably didn't put in any work beforehand. Knowing that, who would have bet on her, anyway? Can't cram for it.
I spent the first three weeks upon graduation marathon playing D3 like it was a 20 hour a day investment banking job (Blizzard gave me the best graduation gift possible with that release date). Hell, the earliest iteration of the game was just stock trading by playing the AH for arbitrage opportunities.
After I sufficiently scratched that 10+ year itch, I studied for the bar for about 6 solid weeks. You always feel underprepared throughout the process until the test is over and you realize you were way overprepared.
After I sufficiently scratched that 10+ year itch, I studied for the bar for about 6 solid weeks. You always feel underprepared throughout the process until the test is over and you realize you were way overprepared.
Jag
Member
So much this.
Frank the Great
Banned
Seems like my interview with the Public Defender was well received, as I suspected. PD is a statewide agency in my state, and the central authority has recommended me to one of the local offices, where I am now scheduled for yet another (third) interview.
Since I already interviewed with the head of the agency who has recommended to hire me, I am assuming/hoping that this last interview is just so I can meet everyone at the local office, so they can get a sense of my personality to see if I will fit in.
It's strange how this worked out, I never once thought I'd be a criminal lawyer when I was in law school.
Since I already interviewed with the head of the agency who has recommended to hire me, I am assuming/hoping that this last interview is just so I can meet everyone at the local office, so they can get a sense of my personality to see if I will fit in.
It's strange how this worked out, I never once thought I'd be a criminal lawyer when I was in law school.
Great news!
Metaphoreus
This is semantics, and nothing more
Did you all see this story?
This is insane.
EDIT: The pass rate is quite a bit less concerning when considering that only 17 students from UT took the exam in February, but the rest of the story is still insane.
SECOND EDIT: The July 2013 Texas Bar passage rate from UT was 95.52%, second only to Baylor. So apparently it's just UT dummies/poor-test-takers taking the February exam.
Raw Story said:
Watchdog.org said:
This is insane.
EDIT: The pass rate is quite a bit less concerning when considering that only 17 students from UT took the exam in February, but the rest of the story is still insane.
SECOND EDIT: The July 2013 Texas Bar passage rate from UT was 95.52%, second only to Baylor. So apparently it's just UT dummies/poor-test-takers taking the February exam.
Wouldn't you score higher than a 128 just by bubbling all of the answers "a" and making sure you enter your name correctly on the answer sheet?
From that article:
So, yeah, I'm sure bubbling "a" would give you a higher score than a 128. Jesus. :jnc
Guileless
Temp Banned for Remedial Purposes
Here's a story only lawyer-GAF could appreciate. My client's wife's paramour is accusing him of stealing videogames from him when he was "renting" a room at the marital home. Seriously. I think I'm going to subpoena Gamestop for the records of his account showing the games he bought there on his Power Up Rewards card.
Pollux
Member
Oh, I'm taking it seriously. I'm just not starting until Wednesday. The BARBRI class starts then and I'm taking 2 months off to just do nothing but review for the bar exam.
We'll see how it goes.
I've been bored as shit for the last week, so as crazy as it sounds, I'm actually now looking forward to beginning bar review.
Byakuya769
Member
Bu..bu...but affirmative action is allowing grossly unqualified students to take MY spot.
Hi everyone,
been lurking here for a long time and since I'm in a fairly unique situation, I was wondering if someone could give me some pointers.
I'm in law school, with a bachelor in asian studies. I speak fluently (as in, native speaker level) English, French, Portuguese and will (hopefully) get my HSK5(mandarin examination. HSK6 is max) level soon. I also have a conversational level of spanish.
I'm trying to figure out if it would be possible to go to the US when I graduate law school (still 2 years left) and find a job related to law (obviously). What can I do with said skills in the US job market? I'm not planning on staying in my country.
I appreciate the help. Thanks!
been lurking here for a long time and since I'm in a fairly unique situation, I was wondering if someone could give me some pointers.
I'm in law school, with a bachelor in asian studies. I speak fluently (as in, native speaker level) English, French, Portuguese and will (hopefully) get my HSK5(mandarin examination. HSK6 is max) level soon. I also have a conversational level of spanish.
I'm trying to figure out if it would be possible to go to the US when I graduate law school (still 2 years left) and find a job related to law (obviously). What can I do with said skills in the US job market? I'm not planning on staying in my country.
I appreciate the help. Thanks!
LowEndTorque
Member
It depends on where you are doing your degree right now.
In the USA the Bar is administered at the state level. Some states will only let you take the bar exam if you graduated from an ABA accredited school. Other states will make you apply to take the bar and will review your degree (which can take up to a year) then either accept your application and let you write the exam or defer it . If you get deferred you will have to do a 1 year LL.M in the US before you qualify to write.
If youre doing your degree in a country that has civil law rather than common law you will probably have a hard time. And you should be aware that the job market for lawyers in the US is atrocious and completely over saturated right now.
Frank the Great
Banned
I got a job offer from the Public Defender! My first ever job offer as an attorney.
I still need to think a little bit before I accept. The pay is higher than I expected but I never saw myself doing criminal law
I still need to think a little bit before I accept. The pay is higher than I expected but I never saw myself doing criminal law
Awesome! Congrats!
RandomDancing
Member
Congrats! What did you end up deciding to do?
Is it just my circle of friends or is two years into your first job when everyone starts getting antsy? In the last month it seems like half of my friends are trying to either change firms or change the type of law they're practicing altogether.
Frank the Great
Banned
Thanks guys. I haven't decided yet, I only received a verbal offer and am awaiting an official offer to come by mail.
In the meantime I also got another interview with the State's Attorney General's office later in the month, with the Director (I've already interviewed with them before).
In the meantime I also got another interview with the State's Attorney General's office later in the month, with the Director (I've already interviewed with them before).
HSK6 + random LLM degree + random US bar gets you a ton of contract attorney jobs paying $55-$65/hour with overtime.
Why not take it for at least a years experience. Add to a resume and bird in the hand kinda thing.
Congrats, now please try not to turn into a bleeding heart "their misguided environment
Made them do it" kinda lawyer.
I sorta come from the other side, but congrats again!
Thanks for the info!
My degree is based on civil law so I know that's a wall coming into the US. Regarding the LLM, I also thought about doing it but have no idea where and also the costs are pretty crazy (compared to europe).
I also wouldn't mind pursuing other career choices. Are consulting or teaching positions possible?
One other option I'm considering is going to Macau but I have my reservations about it. Too small a place and some aspects of the culture there really put me off.
Bboy AJ
My dog was murdered by a 3.5mm audio port and I will not rest until the standard is dead
numble, what's attorney work like for US people in China? How's the work culture out there?
Do you guys know of any good resourceful law websites that provide either 1) in-depth knowledge about particular areas of law, and/or 2) tips/advice and info on how to start your own practice?
^^^ preferably for immigration law, but will entertain other areas. Is there a GAF-equivalent message board for attorneys?
^^^ preferably for immigration law, but will entertain other areas. Is there a GAF-equivalent message board for attorneys?
stn
Member
Folks, I'm at a bit of a cross-road at the moment. I finished my law degree but at a very "decent" level. My overall average was about 69%, so just barely under a 'B'. I have other skills and areas that I'm strong in (ex. I'm a good mooter and have the credentials to show it) but I don't know how to compensate for my grades.
Any insight, please?
Any insight, please?
RandomDancing
Member
Have you done any networking? What kind of jobs did you have over the summers and/or during law school? Do you have any connections through people you met while working?
It is difficult to find a legal job in this economy when you have credentials that make you stand out, let alone when your grades are average. One thing you can always do is to get out there and network. Volunteer, attend alumni association events, put yourself out there. At the very least you'll get experience in navigating awkward introductions and small talk (a very helpful trait in the legal world) and best case scenario, you find someone who will eventually help you get a foot in the door.
stn
Member
I did pro bono work, enjoyed it. I'm going to continue to build connections and see what I can do, I've just lost my lust for the field. I know I already disqualified myself from a million jobs just due to my grades, it hurts. And I don't even know what I want to practice. I thought I greatly enjoyed trusts law, for example, and I put in so much time approaching the seminar instructors and going over problem scenarios and the like. I felt good. It ended up being my lowest mark, lol. Fucking fuck. It stings because I legitimately enjoyed it and wanted to pursue it further. Guess not. Fuck.
I thought pursuing a masters to get a "fresh" transcript with better grades would help, problem is I don't think I'd be accepted with my current grades. Its a brilliant trap I've set for myself.
Any more insight would be greatly appreciated. Thank you VERY MUCH for the help so far.
I thought pursuing a masters to get a "fresh" transcript with better grades would help, problem is I don't think I'd be accepted with my current grades. Its a brilliant trap I've set for myself.
Any more insight would be greatly appreciated. Thank you VERY MUCH for the help so far.
Two quick questions:
I left my old job ("A") for a new job ("B"). I was offered the job April 14, and started April 28. On May 22 my boss informs me she is retiring and closing down the firm on May 30 due to hating the business aspect of running a firm (one of the partners had died during my first week so she had to run it herself). She said she did not know she was closing the firm down when she hired me. Due to my going on vacation, May 22nd was my last day. Do I have any legal recourse against her?
I am also on the job hunt, what should I do as far as my resume is concerned? Should I list job B and write in parenthesis "(Firm closed down)" to explain my unemployment or should I not mention job B, and list job A as still being my current employer? It's hard out here for a pimp. Help!
I left my old job ("A") for a new job ("B"). I was offered the job April 14, and started April 28. On May 22 my boss informs me she is retiring and closing down the firm on May 30 due to hating the business aspect of running a firm (one of the partners had died during my first week so she had to run it herself). She said she did not know she was closing the firm down when she hired me. Due to my going on vacation, May 22nd was my last day. Do I have any legal recourse against her?
I am also on the job hunt, what should I do as far as my resume is concerned? Should I list job B and write in parenthesis "(Firm closed down)" to explain my unemployment or should I not mention job B, and list job A as still being my current employer? It's hard out here for a pimp. Help!
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