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[dimb]

Hotfix patch preview

"We want Vlad to be a late game carry

... so we're nerfing his damage in later levels"


Significant buffs for MF and Cait.

Rengar W AP ratio nerfed but it also comes with a crap load of buffs.

I guess they were right, Vladmir changes are controversial if that's the thing you're going to complain about. Base stats are what makes champions strong in the mid game before they really start building up items. Vladmir should be fine when it comes to damage once he gets those items under his belt. It really is too easy to keep full stacks up, and Vladmir is obviously too strong right now.

I'm a big fan of the Ziggs change. I think he's a cool champion and I'd love to see more of him. This is the kind of change I think bring more to him without throwing his damage out of whack.

I like that cast times are being pulled off of abilities they really didn't need to be on increasingly. It speeds up the game and make champions feel more responsive.

The Yorick nerfs are pretty sizable, but I can't say I disagree with them. He's just way too save in lane and offers so much harass at such little cost.

well league has this aversion to any hard cc

who knows why

Because the idea is to have counterplay. This isn't hard to figure out. When someone slaps a 13 second silence on you your options are pretty limited, and it really is anti-fun. At least to me.

After dropping 500 hours into DotA2 I feel like supports in that game often bring more to the table than in LoL, but it comes down to a bunch of differences in design.

The role of support in League is often undersold severely. The impact that they can have on the fight can be huge though, and the control of map vision, a prime responsibility for supports, is one of the most game changing things. If you really think of supports as baby sitters rather than aggressors you're conceptually mistaken.

Personally I'm not really a fan of creep pulling. It feels like a rather droll duty thrown on a person in a manner that makes them seem like the weakest and least essential member of the team.

One thing I was thinking about, I wonder if Heimerdinger could be retooled so his turrets worked more like Venomancers plague wards, could be too OP.

We already know about Heimer's rework. It sounds much more interesting than Venomancer, who is an incredibly simplistic and boring hero.

 

[Snowman]

Can anyone tell me why people don't use ziggs a lot now? He seems pretty good to me.

 

[dimb]

Can anyone tell me why people don't use ziggs a lot now? He seems pretty good to me.

Unreliable. It's also difficult to really make use of some of his damage, and his burst is fairly low without his ultimate.

 

[lazorexplosion]

Ezreal at 55% win rate and picked in 50% of all games and not even a small nerf? SMH.

 

[Hasphat'sAnts]

Can anyone tell me why people don't use ziggs a lot now? He seems pretty good to me.

high mana costs early. Gets bullied out of lane by more popular mids.

 

[scy]

posting pics of good games, I can be cool now?!

 

[mercviper]

posting pics of good games, I can be cool now?!

Dat scarra smurf

 

[Solune]

I think overall I'm just tired of the stagnant meta of LoL.

I've been trying to think which DotA2 heroes would be most broken in LoL. Chaos Knight would probably be one of the most "Anti-Fun" heroes possible. Tide Hunter's Ravage would be pretty crazy too.

I feel the same too, that's why I've been playing alot more Dominion and ARAM lately. But even then those modes themselves have dumb stuff going on.

Also pretty much any character with a hard stun, Invoker and other heroes controlling DotA meta. Morphling, Siren, Enigma, Dark Seer. Maybe even Faceless Void.

 

[kiunchbb]

posting pics of good games, I can be cool now?!

Love you long time!

Stream please!

 

[les papillons sexuels]

Hotfix patch preview

"We want Vlad to be a late game carry

... so we're nerfing his damage in later levels"


Significant buffs for MF and Cait.

Rengar W AP ratio nerfed but it also comes with a crap load of buffs.

they want him to build as a late game carry, which means nerfing ealier levels so that he's forced into building more defensive items until the dmg develops.

 

[Snowman]

Unreliable. It's also difficult to really make use of some of his damage, and his burst is fairly low without his ultimate.

Weird, he's my favourite champ to play mid with, even when people are pretty good at dodging the Q, I'm generally not the one getting bullied, I assumed I just wasn't playing against people high skill enough to take advantage of his weaknesses though. This buff sounds awesome though, I always thought his W was a bit dodgy/underpowered.

 

[LCGeek]

When is the hotfix patch coming out?

 

[Volimar]

When is the hotfix patch coming out?

I just opened the client and had a teeny patch download. Not sure if that was it though.

Watching Nhat stream. He's playing support teemo with stacked cdr. Mushrooms everywhere...

 

[lazorexplosion]

Now that most of the traditional supports have been nerfed repeatedly theres so much experimentation with new supports.

 

[LCGeek]

I just opened the client and had a teeny patch download. Not sure if that was it though.

Watching Nhat stream. He's playing support teemo with stacked cdr. Mushrooms everywhere...

Got my wish and tested out the vayne ms buff.

 

[Q8D3vil]

rengar jumps are so much better now, W is much better too.
still slow jungling start but much better at later levels.

 

[zkylon]

Figures, I buy RP and immediately have three terrible matches in a row.

 

[Snowman]

Why is amumu banned nearly every game? is he really that OP?

 

[LCGeek]

Why is amumu banned nearly every game? is he really that OP?

Basically with the right teams extremely hard intiation that can be impossible to come back from. If you add fiddles, vlad, ashe, gp, kennen, and other types in to the mix it's insane what amumu allows for in just a few seconds.

Cannot state my love for the vayne buffs. Chase was so bad made the leona rage quit. Starting off with 371ms without passive was just nuts.

 

[dimb]

Why is amumu banned nearly every game? is he really that OP?

I don't really notice this. Amumu is strong but very weak to counter jungling. It is pretty common to see invades on him because he's so blue reliant.

 

[Ken]

I played a game today. I don't want to play again.

 

[Boken]

You couldve played with me

 

[Ken]

You couldve played with me

You don't believe in watermelons.

 

[Inskipp]

Why is amumu banned nearly every game? is he really that OP?

Last time I saw an Amumu banned was in the 1500's (ie. a long time ago)

He's not bad, but his early game is so vulnerable. You need a strong lvl1 comp to protect his start.

 

[Q8D3vil]

always steal blue from amumu, always.

 

[Koomaster]

always steal blue from amumu, always.

This. Ward his blue, steal his blue, watch him cry.

 

[Telaso]

Is anyone else going to IPL5? I had a blast at IPL4 and found out afterwards a few gaffers were there as well.

 

[Blizzard]

posting pics of good games, I can be cool now?!

How do you get people to sit still when you ult? Or do you just kill with your W? Lulu alone has 2 ways to disrupt the ult, and you had neither gunblade for burst and slow nor rylais for slow. Did they just like, not move?

 

[Boken]

How do you get people to sit still when you ult? Or do you just kill with your W? Lulu alone has 2 ways to disrupt the ult, and you had neither gunblade for burst and slow nor rylais for slow. Did they just like, not move?

There was like 1 team fight that game.

In other news, Rengar is now strong as fuck

people saying hes instaban/pick now

 

[Blizzard]

There was like 1 team fight that game.

In other news, Rengar is now strong as fuck

people saying hes instaban/pick now

Is it because of the buffed Q, or because W has no cast time, or because of the sheen proc on E? Or a combination of the above? Or is there some mechanic I don't understand now?

Also I think everyone should take a week or two for Rengar to settle down. Don't forget the post(s) on here about how Rengar was the equivalent of Veigar damage + overpowered etc. in the jungle or whatever, when he was in PBE.

 

[scy]

How do you get people to sit still when you ult? Or do you just kill with your W? Lulu alone has 2 ways to disrupt the ult, and you had neither gunblade for burst and slow nor rylais for slow. Did they just like, not move?

Most my kills weren't in team fights since, as boken says, we had like one or two big team fights that game. Actually, I straight up dumbed one engage and moved out of my ult as soon as I started it and missed an easy clean-up triple (didn't get any kills that fight if I recall). Got a few kills mid but mostly I pushed lane to tower, harassed Karthus, and then roamed bot. Just did my best to cs well and kept Karthus from farming until like 20-ish minutes in (at ~23m I had 250 cs to his 100, oboy).

As for the ult, the 2s duration means that a point-blank ult will deal at least half damage if they escape it which is still a good chunk of damage. QEW was doing about 50% or more of their life anyway so even a half-ult was enough to kill someone. Even if it didn't, this meant that they were escaping for 1s in a team fight instead of doing something important like killing someone. Lulu ult to interrupt does work but it still comes down to I get to channel for at least however long it takes for them to react.

Is it because of the buffed Q, or because W has no cast time, or because of the sheen proc on E? Or a combination of the above? Or is there some mechanic I don't understand now?

Unsure on the Sheen bit (since I never built it before on him) but it's basically the tweak to his passive, the fix to his Q Haste, and the two W changes (lack of cast time, no lost autos). His ult change is nice as well. AD Rengar is kind of a lane bully that can backdoor amazingly well. Oracle's still fucks his day though.

To be fair, though, I think AD Rengar was always better than people gave him credit for. These just kind of smooth out how he operates.

 

[Inskipp]

In other news, Rengar is now strong as fuck

people saying hes instaban/pick now

I was afraid that this might happen, he was already a decent top- laner before the hotfix. To think that they'd buff him like this for the world championship boggles the mind.

 

[Blizzard]

One of the main problems I think I still have as AP mid is not wanting to push the wave to the enemy turret and/or not playing champions who CAN push waves very well. I hate leaving myself open to the jungler before I get river wards, so I try to play safe, and of course odds are that you won't get midlane ganks and/or the enemy champion will be someone like Ahri or Kassadin or Talon who would be nearly impossible to get with a gank.

 

[Neki]

I guess they were right, Vladmir changes are controversial if that's the thing you're going to complain about. Base stats are what makes champions strong in the mid game before they really start building up items. Vladmir should be fine when it comes to damage once he gets those items under his belt. It really is too easy to keep full stacks up, and Vladmir is obviously too strong right now.

I'm a big fan of the Ziggs change. I think he's a cool champion and I'd love to see more of him. This is the kind of change I think bring more to him without throwing his damage out of whack.

I like that cast times are being pulled off of abilities they really didn't need to be on increasingly. It speeds up the game and make champions feel more responsive.

The Yorick nerfs are pretty sizable, but I can't say I disagree with them. He's just way too save in lane and offers so much harass at such little cost.

Because the idea is to have counterplay. This isn't hard to figure out. When someone slaps a 13 second silence on you your options are pretty limited, and it really is anti-fun. At least to me.

The role of support in League is often undersold severely. The impact that they can have on the fight can be huge though, and the control of map vision, a prime responsibility for supports, is one of the most game changing things. If you really think of supports as baby sitters rather than aggressors you're conceptually mistaken.

Personally I'm not really a fan of creep pulling. It feels like a rather droll duty thrown on a person in a manner that makes them seem like the weakest and least essential member of the team.

We already know about Heimer's rework. It sounds much more interesting than Venomancer, who is an incredibly simplistic and boring hero.

Thing is a hero with a 13 second silence isn't even OP in DotA, and you're still allowed to auto-attack in team fights. The counter-play in DotA2 is all about positioning, you won't get chain stunned to death if you spread out effectively, and have people peeling for you through silence/stuns when you do get picked. But different strokes for different folks. Tide Ravage is basically a bigger and better version of Amumu's ultimate, so it's not really that different.

Another thing in League is that because of summoner spells/how prominent snares/slows are in the game, once a hero gets on you, you're usually not going to make it out unless you have flash. Most League heroes have such abilities to stick on to someone that one they gain an advantage, you can never get away from them. Juking is much more prominent in DotA2 because cooldowns are longer, and not every hero has inherent slow or snare to keep chasing. I feel like if I'm low health in League and someone jumps on me, and if my flash is on cooldown, there's basically a 90% of me dying because there's no way I can affect my opponent to stop him from chasing me down.

 

[scy]

One of the main problems I think I still have as AP mid is not wanting to push the wave to the enemy turret and/or not playing champions who CAN push waves very well. I hate leaving myself open to the jungler before I get river wards, so I try to play safe, and of course odds are that you won't get midlane ganks and/or the enemy champion will be someone like Ahri or Kassadin or Talon who would be nearly impossible to get with a gank.

With Kat, I basically push the lane up, see if I can harass, and then grab Wraiths. If there's a possibility I can roam, I'll take it instead of wraiths. Basically, I can keep pushing the lane up and forcing them to farm under tower while I supplement my csing with wraith camp clears and try to roam to ease pressure off one of the lanes.

Edit: If they're farming well under tower, I'll force the lane to push up and get them to have to come play in the middle of the lane. Just engage the minion wave early and pull them to the side. It'll get the AI to focus fire on your minions and the lane will push back for you. If you're against someone else who wave clears really well, mid lane tends to be pretty barren :x

Thing is a hero with a 13 second silence isn't even OP in DotA, and you're still allowed to auto-attack in team fights. The counter-play in DotA2 is all about positioning, you won't get chain stunned to death if you spread out effectively, and have people peeling for you through silence/stuns when you do get picked. But different strokes for different folks. Tide Ravage is basically a bigger and better version of Amumu's ultimate, so it's not really that different.

Keep in mind that the duration differences also must take into account that they are, quite frankly, fundamentally different games. A few seconds stunned out for League tend to mean something else than a few seconds stunned in DotA2, for instance.

Another thing in League is that because of summoner spells/how prominent snares/slows are in the game, once a hero gets on you, you're usually not going to make it out unless you have flash. Most League heroes have such abilities to stick on to someone that one they gain an advantage, you can never get away from them. Juking is much more prominent in DotA2 because cooldowns are longer, and not every hero has inherent slow or snare to keep chasing. I feel like if I'm low health in League and someone jumps on me, and if my flash is on cooldown, there's basically a 90% of me dying because there's no way I can affect my opponent to stop him from chasing me down.

Where DotA2 has hard CC, League has gap closers and slows :x

 

[Telaso]

I woke up early today, so I played a bot game before I went to work.

I got a penta kill with vayne. It's a bot game, but i'll take what I can get ><

 

[Q8D3vil]

rengar is not bad character, not op imo after trying him in 3 games.

 

[Inskipp]

Thing is a hero with a 13 second silence isn't even OP

Storm Spirit might disagree.

 

[scy]

Sounds like the Soraka visual update is coming soon. Then again, "soon" means anything.

Also, Syndra buffs coming hooray 28% winrate.

 

[dave is ok]

The role of support in League is often undersold severely. The impact that they can have on the fight can be huge though, and the control of map vision, a prime responsibility for supports, is one of the most game changing things. If you really think of supports as baby sitters rather than aggressors you're conceptually mistaken.

Aggression is fine for Alistar, Leona, Blitz and Nunu.

Soraka, Janna, Sona, Lulu, Karma... notsomuch

 

[AcridMeat]

I played a game today. I don't want to play again.

I'm sorry I wasn't there.

 

[dimb]

Aggression is fine for Alistar, Leona, Blitz and Nunu.

Soraka, Janna, Sona, Lulu, Karma... notsomuch

If a support is playing passively they really aren't doing their job. Even like Soraka or Lulu are based around harass.

 

[LCGeek]

Aggression is fine for Alistar, Leona, Blitz and Nunu.

Soraka, Janna, Sona, Lulu, Karma... notsomuch

Sona and Lulu in the right hands are not to be messed with unless you're tanky.

 

[Barrel Cannon]

Sona and Lulu in the right hands are not to be messed with unless you're tanky.

I haven't gotten into the groove of using lulu properly(I should really purchase her) but damn does sona's Q sting hard at early levels. It's excellent harass in many match-ups. Just being careful not to spam it or use it when minions are too close so you don't push the lane and/or steal your AD's CS.

 

[Neki]

I've figured out that I only need to press all the keys in one form for Jayce, then switch to the other form, and press all the other keys! Easy hero!

 

[mercviper]

Sona and Lulu in the right hands are not to be messed with unless you're tanky.

It's all about that auto, Q, Power Chord. Roughly 150-200 damage at level 1 lol.

Or auto, E, Power Chord, Q, auto once you've got them on the run @ level 4. This one you can spam every 6 seconds too.

 

[LCGeek]

I haven't gotten into the groove of using lulu properly(I should really purchase her) but damn does sona's Q sting hard at early levels. It's excellent harass in many match-ups. Just being careful not to spam it or use it when minions are too close so you don't push the lane and/or steal your AD's CS.

Well she is one of the best to have in a kill bot with me. The as feeds in to my setup that plus her morphing and shield make a lot of people think twice about trying to zone let alone harass us.

 

[Koomaster]

Sona and Lulu in the right hands are not to be messed with unless you're tanky.

From my experience with Sona, people tend to view her as weak. I have gotten so many kills from low health champs who see me as free lunch.

Just yesterday I had a down on his luck Volibear try to rush at me to throw me around. I just stood there and q + power chorded him to death.

Respect Sona people!

 

[zkylon]

It's all about that auto, Q, Power Chord. Roughly 150-200 damage at level 1 lol.

Or auto, E, Power Chord, Q, auto once you've got them on the run @ level 4. This one you can spam every 6 seconds too.

Yup, it's pretty good at higher levels too, with Q power cord you can last hit squishies that think you're a pushover because you're support pretty easily. The combo might do about 400-500 damage?

 

[Barrel Cannon]

I find the whole face rolling joke about her to be a bit exaggerated. She's an easy-to-use champ but not that easy. If you face roll before you get good mana regen or to a higher level you'll run dry on mana so quick and become useless during a gank.

I usually go Q>W>E and then max out Q as priority. The heal and speed buff are nice nice and all but they are both mana hogs at early levels. The bonus armor+magic resist and speed buff are only useful for when getting ganked or locked down by the enemy support because with rune pages most people have the armor pen to get by that armor buff. The only reason I drop a single point in W and E at lvl 2/3 is because of the attackspeed/slow debuff effect you get on your next auto attack.

edit: mercviper that's the combo I use too!