LOST 06.17/18/18.5: "The End" (Everything Else Was Just Progress)

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BenjaminBirdie said:
Yeah, man I just realized the significance of everything. It wasn't purgatory it was a specifically manufactured scenario in which the plane landed so they could understand how important their time on the island was.

- DUH. How did I not put all that together?

They also formed the sideways as an opportunity to get over any final, lingering issues that they couldn't on the island. That was their final task before finally moving on and achieving final enlightenment.

  • Jack gives himself a son in the sideways, so that he could be the father he was never able to be, as well as the father that he never had in his own life.

  • Jin and Sun are able to experience the pending birth of their child together, an opportunity that was taken from them in the real world.

  • Sawyer is still angry in the sideways, but he's a cop and he doesn't pursue the other Sawyer with the same unrelenting rage and vigor, killing innocent people in he process. He ultimately learned to fully let go with the help of Miles, Kate and Juliet.

  • Hurley no longer carries around bad luck in the sideways. It's the direct opposite. He's able to live a life where he purely helps people, with nothing getting in the way, which is what he always wanted.

  • John Locke is miraculously fixed by Jack and is able to walk - this repairs and greatly strengthens both his own resolve and his relationship with Jack. This does the same for Jack himself. The two old rivals find peace in each other.

  • Ben is forgiven by Locke, who he had killed. Locke was already at peace. Ben finds peace.

  • Charlie finally got over his heroin addiction and found peace with Claire.

  • Sayid ultimately realized that Nadia was not the right person for him. She belonged to another. Shannon, who he met on the island, was.

And so on.
 
I really like this from the IGN review:

Those who were struggling to find peace were setting up their own barriers and keeping themselves from being happy. Sayid wouldn't allow himself to believe he was anything more than a killer and Locke continued to struggle with his disability. They never allowed themselves an opportunity to let go, instead, they let their weaknesses define them.

Weren't Desmond and Hurley (the two fastest people to "wake up") the "happiest" in the alt-verse? Hurley always had good luck and Desmond's relationship w/Widmore was great?
 
Oh Meier. Do all FSU fans have to have everything explained to them???

The picture. Is a POV Shot.

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MiamiWesker said:
After this thread is gone, we need to make "The Church" thread where all of LOST-GAF could meet again and talk about the show forever.

LOST 0.00: "The Waiting Room" (Because I Can't Do It Alone)
 
I'm racking my brain, and I think Lost may just be my favorite piece of fiction, ever. I just can't believe the finale was that incredible. I think it might be my favorite episode of TV, period.

God, I just want to wipe my memory and watch it over again.
 
Lion Heart said:
After a few weeks when my brain accepts that Lost is over, I think I'll check out Supernatural. TBH it looks stupid from my limited impressions but I also wrote Lost off when I read a synopsis about the show in S1 (never watched til late S2) so I will not be doing that again.

I thought both Lost an Supernatural looked stupid, especially Supernatural. But the both turned out to be fantastic shows....Supernatural might even edge out Lost for me personally.
 
Zeliard said:
They also formed the sideways as an opportunity to get over any final, lingering issues that they couldn't on the island. That was their final task before finally moving on and achieving final enlightenment.

  • Jack gives himself a son in the sideways, so that he could be the father he was never able to be, as well as the father that he never had in his own life.

  • Jin and Sun are able to experience the pending birth of their child together, an opportunity that was taken from them in the real world.

  • Sawyer is still angry in the sideways, but he's a cop and he doesn't pursue the other Sawyer with the same unrelenting rage and vigor, killing innocent people in he process. He ultimately learned to fully let go with the help of Miles, Kate and Juliet.

  • Hurley no longer carries around bad luck in the sideways. It's the direct opposite. He's able to live a life where he purely helps people, with nothing getting in the way, which is what he always wanted.

  • John Locke is miraculously fixed by Jack and is able to walk - this repairs and greatly strengthens both his own resolve and his relationship with Jack. This does the same for Jack himself. The two old rivals find peace in each other.

  • Ben is forgiven by Locke, who he had killed. Locke was already at peace. Ben finds peace.

  • Charlie finally got over his heroin addiction and found peace with Claire.

  • Sayid ultimately realized that Nadia was not the right person for him. She belonged to another. Shannon, who he met on the island, was.

And so on.

THIS.
 
I really liked the finale but I don't know if I liked the season as a whole. The flash sideways/pre heaven universe used up so much of the time we could've spent learning just a little more about what was actually going on on the island.

But thinking on in it now, pretty much any answer they might have given about the island probably would've just disappointed me anyway, so it's probably better that they just didn't worry about it.

And due to the other universe we got to see Desmond being even more awesome than he usually is. So I can't complain about it that much.

Random notes:

-I won five bucks because I bet my friend back in Season 3 that Jack would be dead by the end of the series.
-Frank being alive got the biggest cheer from the group I was with.
-Jack flying through the air about to punch Smokey in the head was an amazing/hilarious cut to commercial.
-I demand a Hurley/Ben duo show about their crazy hijinks on the island.
 
Last night, I decided to just watch the show solely as an emotional experience: hoping for closure to this part of the characters' lives, but not looking for answers.

I figured I could pick it apart intellectually, later, if I wanted. But my primary incentive was to enjoy myself for a few hours. What good would it do me to look for reasons to be disappointed? I do that enough. Hell, I do it all the time with Lost.

So, for one night, I gave myself over to the show. I let down my guard. I decided to let go.

I let the things that usually bother me about the show (e.g., this season's whole X timeline) flow past with a shrug, and I gave all the characters and relationships (even the ones I never gave a crap about) a chance to win me over, one last time. Every time the musical cues all but said, "You are supposed to cry in a minute," I welled up.

It all worked, and it was kind of freeing, actually. I should try it more often.


(I know you also could be a critical/analytical viewer and have legitimate reasons to love -- or hate -- the finale. But I decided to let myself and the show off the hook this one last time -- even knowing that some part of my brain wanted to complain about it.)
 
Alucard said:
This is no less infuriating than Losties who will not find fault with the show at all.

HAW HAW YOU DIDN'T LIKE LOST? You just missed the point, man!

There's a difference between finding faults with show and letting the faults take down the show.

For me the faults don't really matter. The sums was greater than the parts. The experience of Lost was great, and I can't imagine it happening any other way. That's includes the ups and downs of the show. The experience was perfect even if the show lacked some consistency overall.

I just don't see the point on harping on the faults when it got so much right. It's like being pissed or depressed about your life because you made a few bad decisions here and there. A lot of good things have happened, and I'm currently very happy with my life. It does me no good now to focus on shitty aspects.

StoOgE said:
Phantom Menace just got a 2 hour youtube review.

Not sure sparking discussion means something it did something right. It could also mean it did something very wrong.

But no one is having philosophical discussions about TPM. We are doing that about Lost. Not to mention a 2 hour review isn't exactly discussion. It's just a review, anything can be reviewed. And correct me if I'm wrong but not many if any people disagreed with guy and got into heated discussions about the ramifications of the themes from TPM and what they mean for the Star Wars Saga. No was was trying to justify the importance of TPM, even the people who liked the film.

If something was truly bad we'd all just ignore it. Who devotes time to something they think is truly bad? Defending something you like to anonymous people is crazy enough. It's just art, if you don't like it, forget it.
 
diztrukted said:
That being said. WHY THE F*CK did the dharma initiative take Michael's son? what happened to Mr. Eko and the paulu and the chick (tv show star). What about froyo guy? Where they all dead the whole time? What happened to desmond? he never died!

You're joking.

Dear God, please be joking.
 
diztrukted said:
I can actually join this thread now that i've seen everything there is to see.
I'm sure there are plenty of questions and plot holes and things like that, but rather than putting blame on the show itself, i think it'd be fun to dwell on these questions and determine the answers on collectively.


That being said. WHY THE F*CK did the dharma initiative take Michael's son? what happened to Mr. Eko and the paulu and the chick (tv show star). What about froyo guy? Where they all dead the whole time? What happened to desmond? he never died!

Have you ever actually watched this show.
 
YoungHav said:
:lol @ all the crying going on. You guys must get into fistfights at funerals.

Nah, I actually don't really cry at all. I'm not a depressed, or particularly emotional person.

For whatever reason, TV (especially) and movies can get me though.
 
CrankyJay said:
I think another important loose end they didn't really tie up (or maybe we just mislead ourselves) on why it seemed Aaron was so important...and that it was important that he was not "raised by another."

The psychic was a fraud. Aaron didn't have a special destiny. The others wanted him just because they wanted children. He played an entirely nonsupernaturally important role in the lives and plots of Claire and Kate et al. That's all there is to it.


On this show the answer to many questions of the form "Why was X true" is "when Y said X was true Y was ignorant or lying."
 
Alucard said:
Yeah, but what did they need to happen in order for the loop to end and for them to get off the island? MiB has always been obsessed with leaving the island, and...ugh, I can't even muster up the brain power to try and make sense of the time travel story again and how it still fits into the story after season 6 and the relationships/motivations of MiB and Jacob.
the infinite time loop thing was just a theory I had when S5 ended. I figured the loop would end when MIB finally killed Jacob.
 
This is going to sound passive-aggressive/bitter no matter how I say it but I'm genuinely curious:

To the people that loved the finale, what sort of ending(s) would have disappointed you?
 
Soo this morning I watched it, and already commented here in this thread. On one hand the finale was amazing, especially the on island stuff. However I feel that some things were certainly left unanswered, and it gave me a slightly hollow feeling this morning.

The X timeline or purgatory.. however you want to call it? I loved it, until the moment I found it was purgatory. So just for these Losties, they have been living this life ( well not really living but hey ) in the X timeline, for how long? I find it really weird that that is supposed to be purgatory. Why was it important to send Desmond to that timeline? Ofcourse to get them together, but what the fuck did Widmore have to do with that?

The 'awakening' moments were great and amazing, some made me tear up ( especially Charlie etc ). But the fact that they all had to find eachother before they could move on is kind of ridiculous and puts a downer on the ending imo.

Why was the Island so important? What was the full extend of MIB's power? These are questions which imo are way more important than the purgatory bullshit, and I would have loved to see answers for these questions. I dont give a fuck about the Dharma Fooddrop or who shot at Sawyer in the boat.

Aside from that I feel that I should watch it again right now, after I got home because I stayed up waaaaaaaay too long before I could watch it this morning, and I was pretty fucking beat. Sleepy and half groggy may have impacted my opinion of the end.

Oh and I must say that I REALLY enjoyed the Jack/MIB stuff in this episode :D.
 
I was thinking how great the title of the episode is in retrospect.

We thought it just meant "The End" of the show, but the storyline takes it one beautiful step further.
 
leroy hacker said:
The psychic was a fraud. Aaron didn't have a special destiny. The others wanted him just because they wanted children. That's all there is to it.

and because aaron was born on the island which is something that was special to the others
 
MomoPufflet said:
This is going to sound passive-aggressive/bitter no matter how I say it but I'm genuinely curious:

To the people that loved the finale, what sort of ending(s) would have disappointed you?

A gigantic reset/reboot that invalidated anything that's ever happened. Specifically, that would've killed the final episode for me.
 
water_wendi said:
i cant tell if this is brilliant trolling or not :lol :lol


;-) see what I did there?

seriously though, nikki and paolu were obviously "B" characters but what made me enjoy the show was that "everything" mattered. I guess I should've known since they were killed off so quickly. Lost is/was a great show. Honestly, it was the first show I've ever felt emotionally attached to and I started watching it in January. Through the magic of Hulu and Netflix, I was able to watch it on TV for the first time with the rest of the world. I really hope they answer all the questions with DVD coming out. We have some closure, but not all the answers we had hoped for.
 
MomoPufflet said:
This is going to sound passive-aggressive/bitter no matter how I say it but I'm genuinely curious:

To the people that loved the finale, what sort of ending(s) would have disappointed you?

Any ending Stooge, Spire, the rest would cook up. Egyptians hauling rocks and building shit, Jacob explaining the secrets of the island from a podium, the smoke monster being scanned by an x-ray. Or a reset.
 
So I just watched the finale this morning, just wanting to make sure I got this right. The alternate universe was in fact a place where all the characters met up after everyone had died in real life, correct? Obviously some died sooner than others, but they all met up on the other side after everyone had lived out their lives I guess.
 
MomoPufflet said:
This is going to sound passive-aggressive/bitter no matter how I say it but I'm genuinely curious:

To the people that loved the finale, what sort of ending(s) would have disappointed you?


Hard to say, I'm pretty forgiving of my TV Shows.

But the thought that first popped in my head, when Des X was talking about "Leaving", I did not think he meant what he ended up meaning (To "nirvana/heaven/etc"). I thought he was talking about merging the X Conciousness back to the real world.

Meaning something like, they'd go around "waking" people up, just to force merge back into the real world, and the likely result would have been: The people that had died by that point, would "die again" in a sense. They'd cease to be. That Des, Jack, Kate, Sawyer etc X would merge over and be "ok", but Charlie, Boone, Juliet X would cease to be because they would be dead. All this, so Locke X could merge back into MIB/Locke, and that'd be how they'd kill MIB.

Only person that would probably like this, would be Solo ;P

That's an ending that felt possible, early in the episode. And I'm glad it did not happen that way.
 
That being said. WHY THE F*CK did the dharma initiative take Michael's son? what happened to Mr. Eko and the paulu and the chick (tv show star). What about froyo guy? Where they all dead the whole time? What happened to desmond? he never died!

WHY THE F*CK did the dharma initiative take Michael's son?

That was the others, not the DI. With no kids being born on the island, they decided to nap kiddywinks instead. Also, he proved a useful bargaining chip for the Candidates.

what happened to Mr. Eko

The actor didn't want to live in Hiwaii, so he was killed off.

the paulu and the chick (tv show star).

People fucking hated those douchebags, so the writers killed them off. They were buried alive with their stash of diamonds, which Miles dug up and used to buy a robot dinosaur when he hit solid ground.

What about froyo guy?

Burning arrow to the heart, yo.

Where they all dead the whole time?

Yeah. The six seasons were pretty much for nowt I'm afraid. sorry you wasted your life.

What happened to desmond?

He's alive and on the island. With Hurley being the new Jacob, he might just let the poor Scottish bastard leave.

While we're at it; the polar bears were used for scientific research and to move the donkey wheel. Walt grew about eight feet. The numbers were the Valenzeti equation and the numbers of the candidates. Who knows what the fucks up with David Shephard. Juliet's got a rocking rack. Lost rocks.
 
Oh and I know that the show isn't what I want it to be, but I'm kind of dissapointed they didn't go in another direction with the X timeline stuff. Certainly I cannot be the only one who feels this way?
 
MomoPufflet said:
This is going to sound passive-aggressive/bitter no matter how I say it but I'm genuinely curious:

To the people that loved the finale, what sort of ending(s) would have disappointed you?
Judging by this thread, an ending that attempted to make sense of the remaining mysteries and thematically fit into to show would have been a tremendous disappointment.
 
MomoPufflet said:
To the people that loved the finale, what sort of ending(s) would have disappointed you?

If they had answered every lingering question with some stupid catch all answer. I am much happier with stuff left unexplained.

I'm looking at you Battlestar Galactica finale.
 
KevinCow said:
Have you ever actually watched this show.


no, i read about it in a forum similar to this one.

McBacon said:
That being said. WHY THE F*CK did the dharma initiative take Michael's son? what happened to Mr. Eko and the paulu and the chick (tv show star). What about froyo guy? Where they all dead the whole time? What happened to desmond? he never died!



That was the others, not the DI. With no kids being born on the island, they decided to nap kiddywinks instead. Also, he proved a useful bargaining chip for the Candidates.



The actor didn't want to live in Hiwaii, so he was killed off.



People fucking hated those douchebags, so the writers killed them off. They were buried alive with their stash of diamonds, which Miles dug up and used to buy a robot dinosaur when he hit solid ground.



Burning arrow to the heart, yo.



Yeah. The six seasons were pretty much for nowt I'm afraid. sorry you wasted your life.



He's alive and on the island. With Hurley being the new Jacob, he might just let the poor Scottish bastard leave.

While we're at it; the polar bears were used for scientific research and to move the donkey wheel. Walt grew about eight feet. The numbers were the Valenzeti equation and the numbers of the candidates. Who knows what the fucks up with David Shephard. Juliet's got a rocking rack. Lost rocks.
I can sleep better now

also, juliet's rack is amazing. I'm a fan!
 
What are everyone's thoughts on how Eloise always knew what was up? I still can't quite wrap my head around it. Present day, 70's, the purgatory-esque thing... she always knew exactly what was going on and knew how things were "supposed" to happen.
 
ultron87 said:
If they had answered every lingering question with some stupid catch all answer. I am much happier with stuff left unexplained.

I'm looking at you Battlestar Galactica finale.

Word. The answer to flash-sideways was left late, and it didn't try to cover everything else, so it was fine.
 
MMaRsu said:
Oh and I know that the show isn't what I want it to be, but I'm kind of dissapointed they didn't go in another direction with the X timeline stuff. Certainly I cannot be the only one who feels this way?
I'm pleased with the ending, but yes I totally expected a different direction for them to go with the flash sideways.
 
gdt5016 said:
I was thinking how great the title of the episode is in retrospect.

We thought it just meant "The End" of the show, but the storyline takes it one beautiful step further.

Yes, it's a rich tapestry with layer upon layer of intrigue. *half sarcasm*
 
ultron87 said:
If they had answered every lingering question with some stupid catch all answer. I am much happier with stuff left unexplained.

I'm looking at you Battlestar Galactica finale.

Let's not try to spoil any other shows in here m8.
 
The "faults" that the rational people are upset about aren't little tiny things that could be ignored as little continuity problems or niggling details.

For me, there are two kinds of "faults" that concern me and GREATLY undermine my enjoyment of the show because of this finale and how it concluded.

Category one is the glaring omission of any explanation for something incredibly important:

What was with the huge statue and/or the lighthouse?


Category two is the show not playing by its own established rules:

Why couldn't Jack or Hurley use the same magical healing powers Jacob used to heal Jack?


Does that clear up the kinds of problems people aren't as willing to forget?
 
NZNova said:
Well after that finale they can pretty much shut down TV, it's done. All downhill from here.
Off the top of my head, next season of Dexter, Spartacus prequel and Supernatural next season whenever it comes around, says no to you.
 
A few small things. I think the last episode was simply fine. A "C" grade from me.

I'm amazed at how many people did not understand the alt universe stuff around the internet.
I'm constantly amazed at how many people ask questions to which there is no answer and get mad about it.

Why was Walt special? Well, why is anyone psychic? who the fuck cares:lol

I saw the finale in the theater and it was pretty rad to see it like that, but it was a flawed episode with some amazing moments

Also, am I the only one who thought Locke was gonna wake from his surgery as MiB? I imagined him saying, "it worked"
and jack saying "what? naw too soon to say doggie."
Locke (grabbing jack by the neck) says, "IT WOKED!"

would have been a better twist
 
MomoPufflet said:
This is going to sound passive-aggressive/bitter no matter how I say it but I'm genuinely curious:

To the people that loved the finale, what sort of ending(s) would have disappointed you?

I was expecting a Dan Brown ending which would have been ok depending upon how it was written.

I was secretly hoping for a Dark Tower ending just for the internet rage.

But a total half-assed science explanation would have pissed me off the most.
 
MMaRsu said:
Oh and I know that the show isn't what I want it to be, but I'm kind of dissapointed they didn't go in another direction with the X timeline stuff. Certainly I cannot be the only one who feels this way?

Of course you're not. The past dozens of pages have been devoted to people arguing over how they ended the show, many of whom were not wholly satisfied with how the X timeline was resolved, and whether or not it cheaped a good chunk of season 6, when now we know that the X timeline was just a bunch of people stumbling around waiting to find each other in purgatory, so they could move on to heaven/the next phase of existence.
 
MMaRsu said:
Oh and I know that the show isn't what I want it to be, but I'm kind of dissapointed they didn't go in another direction with the X timeline stuff. Certainly I cannot be the only one who feels this way?
I honestly can't think of another way that would have been as satisfying.

1. They could simply destroy it and merge to two. However, we had concern for the x timeline characters and some were alive. How would that work? plus it would be pretty cold-blooded for a last episode. If they had continues with what Eloise started, then maybe I could see this option.

2. The X timeline woud stand on it's own. However, this makes no sense from a storytelling angle since it was pointless and would provide no closure.

This episode took care of our love for the island Losties and the concern we had for the X Losties.
 
Instro said:
So I just watched the finale this morning, just wanting to make sure I got this right. The alternate universe was in fact a place where all the characters met up after everyone had died in real life, correct? Obviously some died sooner than others, but they all met up on the other side after everyone had lived out their lives I guess.
Yep, we saw many of the deaths (Libby, Shepard, the Kwons, Syed, etc.) and some we can assume occured years (Kate, Claire, Aaron) or centuries (Hurley, Linus) later. They all met in the sideways universe to be together one more time before moving on to the next plane (plane of existence, not airplane).
 
BigFwoosh said:
What are everyone's thoughts on how Eloise always knew what was up? I still can't quite wrap my head around it. Present day, 70's, the purgatory-esque thing... she always knew exactly what was going on and knew how things were "supposed" to happen.

It's a subtle answer, but I believe alot of her "powers" came from knowing how things were going to happen, from having Daniel's Notebook from the future. After he died, she had it. So, whatever it is that he had written in there, helped her.

Though, I doubt he'd have put anything from the Flashes Before Your Eyes episode in it.
 
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