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- Thread starter BenjaminBirdie
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Angry Fork
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This is the reason. It's unfortunate but oh well. That's the kind of stuff Erigu has a huge problem with and what people rag on Lost about in general towards the later seasons. They're correct but I personally don't have that big of a problem with it. A lot of the inconsistencies/stupid things tend to revolve around characters I don't care much about (like Christian).Secret_Riddle said:
Drealmcc0y
Banned
Except for Christian clothes being very random.
Every Christian moment is fine.
They are either MiB Christian or ghost Christian.
You figure out for yourself which one is which.
Every Christian moment is fine.
They are either MiB Christian or ghost Christian.
You figure out for yourself which one is which.
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
Perfect way of putting it.dave is ok said:
When that scene played, I literally said out loud, "Are you fucking kidding me?"
Drealmcc0y
Banned
You guys seem to forget Jack is making a mistake.
He sits back ever since he came back to the island, making sandwiches and shit waiting for his "purpose" that Locke tells him about. Faraday comes back shouting his mouth off about "We can change our destiny".
Then Jacks like "Ok, this is it, this is why were here, this is my destiny" He's not thinking clearly. He is infact erasing the fact that he ever had a destiny!
What does Jack say in season 6 finale to Desmond?
"Desmond I tried that once, there are no short cuts, no do overs, what happened, happened, trust me I know."
He sits back ever since he came back to the island, making sandwiches and shit waiting for his "purpose" that Locke tells him about. Faraday comes back shouting his mouth off about "We can change our destiny".
Then Jacks like "Ok, this is it, this is why were here, this is my destiny" He's not thinking clearly. He is infact erasing the fact that he ever had a destiny!
What does Jack say in season 6 finale to Desmond?
"Desmond I tried that once, there are no short cuts, no do overs, what happened, happened, trust me I know."
Drealmcc0y said:
Those were my thoughts. That the MIB did impersonate Christian due to finding the coffin..but that the spirit of Christian itself also made an appearance (when he is in clothes, when he makes direct references to Jack and his old life)..primarily at the end of Season 4..and in the flash forward when he says hello to Jack, causing him to go on a pill bender.
Unless of course that really was just a hallucination caused by the island to bring Jack back..like Hurley said or could that have been the MIB and..oh my I've gone cross eyed.
Basically it comes back to this: if, at the end of Season 4, that was just the MIB..that entire stretch loses the majority of it's emotional weight. I feel like the answer is deliberately vague. The show writers leave a logical answer there (it could be the MIB) that's consistent with the show's mythology..but they also leave you with a more interesting and unanswered possibility to chew on.
dave is ok
aztek is ok
It doesn't matter if what he is doing is right or wrong when his motivation is so unbelievable. A truly 'great' or even 'good' show would have never gone there. And if they did, by some horrible accident, they would have handled it better.Drealmcc0y said:
Drealmcc0y
Banned
dave is ok said:
Well if you say so, it must be true,
His motivation is that he is looking for his "leap of faith" moment. It turns out, it wasnt quite time yet.
"It only ends once, anything that happens before that is just progress"
Drealmcc0y
Banned
Secret_Riddle said:
To me...
Christian in the cabin is always MiB, manipulating Locke and/or Ben
Christian at the donkey wheel is MiB, getting Jack back to the island to.... wait you havent seen season 6.... I wont tell you why needs some people back to the island.
Christian on the freighter that explodes and in the hospital are both Ghost MiB.
Thats it to me.
dave is ok
aztek is ok
His motivation was that the writers needed to find a way to explode a nuclear warhead as an end of season climax, and couldn't figure out how to do it - and that was painfully obviousDrealmcc0y said:
Drealmcc0y
Banned
dave is ok said:
Dude you could say this with any show.
I give you a perfectly good fucking reason that totally goes with the journey of Jack Shephard
Drealmcc0y
Banned
Lets talk about garbage final seasons?
Season 5 of The Wire was a borefest.
Politics and a newpaper company. What a load of shit that was.
The Wire was only good when it focused on the gangsters and dirty cops.
Season 5 of The Wire was a borefest.
Politics and a newpaper company. What a load of shit that was.
The Wire was only good when it focused on the gangsters and dirty cops.
Drealmcc0y
Banned
Erigu said:
Sure, you could say anything that happens in the show is just because the writers wanted it that way.
Even if the characters motivations fit perfectly for that character.
dave is ok
aztek is ok
We are on some level aware that what we are watching is fictional, that doesn't mean you should be able to see the puppet strings plain as day. Character motivation is important to not fuck up - because when you do something the audience can't relate to the suspension of disbelief is broken.Drealmcc0y said:
Drealmcc0y
Banned
dave is ok said:
More bullshit from you.
I could just say "I can see the puppet string in the Wire from a mile a way. It dont matter if the character motivation fits in perfectly for that character."
People cant relate to wishing they could reset time to change things?
Drealmcc0y
Banned
Erigu said:
Why? Because you fucking said so?
Jacks motivations fit in PERFECTLY with it.
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
I'm with you on that part of Jack's development, but my point of contention centers around Jack's "I had her, then I lost her" spiel. It was a pretty laughable moment, in an otherwise high stakes situation. The thing is, Jack had already stated a pretty compelling motivation for latching onto Farraday's ultra risky "time reset" plan in "Follow the Leader":Drealmcc0y said:
It's a grand proposition, one that would conceivably justify the guilt ridden doctor's wild actions. So many people died under his leadership, why the hell wouldn't he want to erase such a heavy burden?
But then, in "The Incident", we supposedly get to the heart of the matter. What was really at the root of Jack's troubled soul? What was truly driving him to put hundreds of lives in danger with a NUCLEAR DEVICE? ... Juvenile heartbreak. "I had her, then I lost her." Oh give me a break.
It was already implied that heartache was an underlying contributing factor for Jack wanting a time reset:
That's all the we needed. Right there! But for some reason, the writers couldn't help themselves. They felt the need to force the issue, choosing to bring this petty "shipper" nonsense to the forefront. Making it a main focal point for Jack's nuclear argument in the season finale was truly misguided. It just disappointed me that they didn't show restraint and keep that angle as subtext. Jack's other motivation (giving all those dead people a second chance) was much grander in scope, and easier to root for.
dave is ok
aztek is ok
Basically this. Saving the lives of 50 people should mean more to Jack than getting back together with his ex-fiance who he could probably get back together with anyway without blowing up the universe, if he really wanted to.Catalix said:
Huge misstep by the writers.
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
lol harsh. But were you young at the time? Can't discount that factor. Keep in mind, Jack's a grown ass man with years of heartbreak under his belt (a divorce even!). I'm supposed to take this dude seriously.Blader5489 said:
I've had some shitty breakups, but I don't think I could ever let my emotions rule me to that extent. Shit ain't worth it, imo.
or maybe I'm just dead inside. I haven't ignored that possibility.
Catalix
And on the sixth day the LORD David Bowie created man and woman in His image. And he saw that it was good. On the seventh day the LORD created videogames so that He might take the bloody day off for once.
She used an innocent child as leverage for her get out jail free card.Erigu said:
And in her imaginary afterlife construct, she even conjures up a scenario where she is in fact innocent of her premeditated crime. The nerve of this woman!
D
Deleted member 12837
Unconfirmed Member
Erigu said:
Just so you don't think I'm dodging this question:
Fry8 and Willy105 both touched on some of the reasons. So many great moments, scenes and episodes that make me smile/laugh/give me goosebumps/insert-other-emotion. Heck, I even cracked a huge grin as I scrolled through the images in Fry8's post.
Production value is top-notch, music is great...it was just an enjoyable experience for me overall, and continues to hold up on re-watches. I can't say that about many shows. It captivated me over 6 years, and I thoroughly enjoyed it (despite some of my gripes with it...talking overall experience here).
So yeah, that's why the show is special to me.
I really need to do a re-watch one of these days, I just don't have the time...
dave is ok
aztek is ok
We don't know how old you are. A month ago means nothing without your ageBlader5489 said:
Did the relationship end because you forced her to watch Season 6 of Lost?
To the point where you would single out the show as "really special"? And add "Erigu is a cuckoo", which, to me, kinda implies this isn't a mostly subjective matter?404Ender said:
I already commented on the music, and while the show obviously was a fairly expensive one (except for the CGI, but I don't expect much in that area anyway, on TV), it all felt... unremarkable, in the end. Recent AMC shows have far better photography, for example...
Erigu said:
Well, AMC shows (Mad Men and Breaking Bad) do have decent (but sterile) cinematography (there are times however where BB has some really great shots), but nothing to talk about.
However, Giachinno's score for Lost certainly is not unremarkable. That is a grave understatement.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Willy105 said:
Breaking Bad is the only show that's better looking than Lost consistently (Deadwood is better looking than both, for the record). This season pushed it over the top. Lost had incredible camera-work but Hawaii did at least 40% of the legwork of making it the best looking show on television at the time. But it had to be shot properly for that to work. Hawaii 5.0 looks like sterile garbage and is shot on pretty much the exact same locations.
But Breaking Bad not only does landscape, it does dynamic, it does quiet, it does everything, and it takes chances all over the place, doing whatever it takes to achieve a character-based intimacy that's critical to the series' dramatic success.
As far as Yung Giacc goes, you'll get no argument from me, but plenty from everyone else. I think he's the best in the biz, but a lot of people think he's a manipulative hack.
But then, no one liked Soul Coughing either.
LordPhoque
Banned
The music was amazing during this scene too. Makes me want to cry each time I see it. Probably my favorite of the show.
Erigu said:
Sure, by the end of the show, cinematography got downgraded to normal TV fare (compared to stuff like the pilot), with the camera always close up to the character's face and never showing the environments. Hardly a complaint though.
If you find Lost's fantastic score to be "overbearing" or "annoying", then it's no wonder so many movies and TV shows have garbage playing the background nowadays.
Well, "unremarkable", like I said...Willy105 said:
Yeah, I'm familiar with that opinion of yours...
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
big ander said:
Glad someone wasn't too busy arguing with the unarguablewith to pick up what I'm putting down.
;D
dave is ok
aztek is ok
Michael Slovis is basically a god. Although his New Mexico looked a lot better than New York did on Rubicon.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
dave is ok said:
Someone else pointed it out, but that time lapse bit on the latest? And the camera slowly dollying in during? Fucking genius.
cloud_sleep
Member
dave is ok said:
And then everyone went along with his plan instead of repeatedly hitting him in the face with a rifle butt like the dangerous lunatic that he was deserved. Certainly a low point in the show's writing. Characters deciding to detonate a nuke, probably killing themselves in the process, on the slight chance that some nutty professor's theory is right. One of the worst examples of plot-driven characterization instead of character-driven plot in the show's history.
What I liked a lot about S1 in particular was that you had this group of survivors who seemed like real people in a desperate situation and who's actions seemed to be a result of who they were. By the end of the show's run they were idiots who were performing whatever outlandish antics were demanded of them by the script, logic or consistency be damned.
D
Deleted member 12837
Unconfirmed Member
Erigu said:
I guess I glanced over that part. I do think you're kind of crazy with your obsession, but that wasn't what I meant to pull into the discussion. When I said "And what if he has and still feels that way?" I was referring solely to the "really special" comment.
And yes, if I can only name a handful of shows that affect me the same (positive) way that I described, then that, to me, qualifies as "really special". Do you think I'm being too loose with the term? Should it be reserved for a single show rather than a handful?
Erigu said:
I've seen your comments on the music (that it's overbearing, annoying, etc), and I simply disagree. I think the music fits quite well and I really enjoy it. I appreciate more subtle scores as well, I just wouldn't want one in Lost. Wouldn't have the same "epic" feel.
Pretty unrelated, but out of curiosity, have you seen The Social Network? What did you think of its score? I only ask because it's another piece of work where the score is one of my favorite parts of the whole picture, rather than something I wouldn't think of mentioning.
BenjaminBirdie said:
Yes! So true. It's one of the reasons I continue to be compelled to watch it immediately when it comes on, despite the story lagging a bit during stretches of the past 2 seasons.
BenjaminBirdie said:
First thing I thought of when you brought it up
And after Miles pointed out the obvious, too ("hey, don't you guys think you might be about to cause the incident? yeah? you're going anyway? well, okay then...").cloud_sleep said:
Obviously, the characters knew they were:
1) in the season finale, so a big explosion was probably on the program
2) on Lost, so detonating a nuke sounded like an a perfectly sound idea that might even send them back to the 2000s [it did, naturally]
Exactly.
(and even some parts of the first season were a bit... I mean, Shannon's fake death, as has been mentioned earlier, for example... oh, that Locke and his fancy drugs!)
This explains that, I guess...404Ender said:
And I think it's cute how you guys like to call me "obsessed"... You know me so well.
I... honestly don't remember. Guess it didn't bother me, at least.
I'll try and pay more attention, next time around.
Drealmcc0y
Banned
Its funny, it wasnt until The Incident/LA X that I grew to care deeply about the characters.
I mean when they dropped that bomb and the scene where Juliet falls. Good lord, gets me every time.
I mean when they dropped that bomb and the scene where Juliet falls. Good lord, gets me every time.
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