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Magic: The Gathering |OT|

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These cards look fantastic.

New mechanic reminds me of a nice twist on Level Up which was a mechanic I really liked. This one looks will hopefully be more constructed viable.

As a huge limited player I have been utterly sick of Mirrodin for months, just loathe the format. The previews so far really are making me salivate to rip open some packs and draft.
 
Guesong said:
If only they would tell us what "transform" implies now.
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I'd imagine their stats turn into the numbers above the normal stats.

Why did I click on this thread. Now I want to start playing again.
 
I'm loving the art for this set. Very happy the artifact sets are done with. Much more flavor with horror and being graveyard based.
 
I'm liking that 1G wurm. So far, I haven't seen much for my EDH decks, but I'm sure it'll be there.

Edit: I lied, enemy duals is amazing. I can't wait to draft this set.
 
gallery got updated with more cards.

the transformed creatures look to be separate cards.
i'm thinking it's something that works like yugioh's fusion deck, where you pull the cards out when you need 'em.
though i'm not sure how this mechanic would play out for drafted and sealed formats...
 
Leunam said:
Enchant player lol
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?
243.jpg
 
r - b - x said:
though i'm not sure how this mechanic would play out for drafted and sealed formats...
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Same. Maro tweeted that that they will be publishing an article at midnight tonight (EST) explaining double-sided cards (with examples), so we wont have to wait long for details.
 
Okay, wow, I'm now the most hyped since Lorwyn. I wasn't really feeling the last two or three blocks, even if I enjoyed them, but this is pushing all the right buttons.
 
The_Technomancer said:
Okay, wow, I'm now the most hyped since Lorwyn. I wasn't really feeling the last two or three blocks, even if I enjoyed them, but this is pushing all the right buttons.
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Same here, man. Read the Planeswalker's Guide to Innistrad yesterday and I haven't been hyped like this since Lorwyn either! It makes me sad that they no longer release novels in fat packs anymore, I loved the Lorwyn ones, and I'd love to read some Innistrad novels!

Also, I loved Kamigawa, sure it had it's mechanical and power-level issues, but thematically it was awesome.

EDIT:
Leunam said:
Wasn't around for that block. Completely new phrasing to me.
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It's cool, man, I just was legitimately confused as to what you were LOLing about. I actually liked that they added the "Curse" sub-type, will be interesting to see if that's actually used for something, or just a flavor change.
 
Cyrillus said:
It's cool, man, I just was legitimately confused as to what you were LOLing about. I actually liked that they added the "Curse" sub-type, will be interesting to see if that's actually used for something, or just a flavor change.
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If they have it on the typeline then it has functionality. Even Zendikar traps had about two or three cards that cared about the subtype.
 
The_Technomancer said:
If they have it on the typeline then it has functionality. Even Zendikar traps had about two or three cards that cared about the subtype.
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I really want them to bring back traps some time. I found it fun being like "You done fucked up now!"

Also, I never noticed how good the two avatars above me match up. Love that movie.
 
rexor0717 said:
I really want them to bring back traps some time. I found it fun being like "You done fucked up now!"

Also, I never noticed how good the two avatars above me match up. Love that movie.
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I honestly wish they'd just start typing instants, sorceries, enchantments, and artifacts like they do creatures. Sure, it would be a little bit of a stretch to do "tribal" with them, but it would still be really damn cool from a flavor perspective. Type-lines like "Instant - Augury" "Artifact - Contraption" "Enchantment - Seal" bring up all sorts of cool mental images and adding them would require no rules changes whatsoever.

And yes, we are Miguel and Tulio! Tulio and Miguel!
ultron87 said:
Double sided cards? Whaaaaaaat?!?
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Kinda-sorta. You get a placeholder version that's used in every zone other than the battlefield, making the two-facer more like a token than anything.
 
Badass people are going to have mega playsets if they use the provided card insert. One playset of the day version, and one playset of the night version.
 
Just finished reading through the Innistrad rules pages on the mothership. Overall it seems reasonable, but it's still an odd change for me.
 
rexor0717 said:
I really want them to bring back traps some time. I found it fun being like "You done fucked up now!"

Also, I never noticed how good the two avatars above me match up. Love that movie.
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I wish they'd bring back a lot more old mechanics/creature types. Like persist, the untap arrow, exalted, evoke, haunt, horsemanship
j/k
, changeling, etc., not to mention stuff that was in futuresight that we still haven't seen re-printed/developed (Steamflogger Boss and Lucent Liminid I'm looking at you). Sure, some mechanics require lots of cards with the same mechanic to be good, but most of the ones I mentioned would be fine as a sub-theme or even just a cycle in a set. I hate Magic's tendency to not fully develop mechanics because they don't want to print them in more than one set.
 
Cyrillus said:
I wish they'd bring back a lot more old mechanics/creature types. Like persist, the untap arrow, exalted, evoke, haunt, horsemanship
j/k
, changeling, etc., not to mention stuff that was in futuresight that we still haven't seen re-printed/developed (Steamflogger Boss and Lucent Liminid I'm looking at you). Sure, some mechanics require lots of cards with the same mechanic to be good, but most of the ones I mentioned would be fine as a sub-theme or even just a cycle in a set. I hate Magic's tendency to not fully develop mechanics because they don't want to print them in more than one set.
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They've been actively trying to reuse mechanics lately. They brought back and experimented with Kicker in Zendikar, dabbled with Scry in 2011, Bloodthirst in 2012 and now they're using Flashback again in Innistrad.

Also wow, actual real double sided cards. The "checklist card" implementation feels clunky but the actual idea of transforming flipping cards seems awesome

The rules term "fight" feels kinda stupid though. So specific, and I think people will think it means any combat at all.
 
The_Technomancer said:
They've been actively trying to reuse mechanics lately. They brought back and experimented with Kicker in Zendikar, dabbled with Scry in 2011, Bloodthirst in 2012 and now they're using Flashback again in Innistrad.
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Yeah I've been happy so far with the throwback mechanics of late, I guess I'm just still salty about their under-use of the untap symbol in Shadowmoor. :-(

Also, do want Moan of the Unhallowed.

Lastly, I'm angered by the fact that Twilight has caused my local playgroup to not be happy with werewolves and vampires as tribes in Innistrad. Fuck Twilight, I had shiny Vampires before they did!
 
Yeah, I've really liked what Magic has done with vampies, from generic badasses in the core sets to the cool tribal thing going on in Zendikar to the traditional "vine? I do not drink...vine" vampires of Inn.
 
The_Technomancer said:
Yeah, I've really liked what Magic has done with vampies, from generic badasses in the core sets to the cool tribal thing going on in Zendikar to the traditional "vine? I do not drink...vine" vampires of Inn.
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I lol'd. I hope some more decent multicolored legends come out of this. I love building commander decks.
 
The implementation of double sided cards seems really haphazard. It is like they had this great idea and then someone said "Shit, everyone doesn't use sleeves."
 
I feel apprehensive about Day/Night transitions and the double-sided cards, but I'll reserve my judgment until I get a few drafts in. Biggest surprise for me? Garruk being good ol' mono green @ a splash-friendly cost of 3G. I can't wait to see what he does.
 
I'm usually not one to complain and raise hell every time Wizards tries something new, but this whole double-sided card business just seems awful in every way. I mean come on, "Checklist Cards"? Seriously? They couldn't have just tweaked the Kamigawa flip mechanic a little bit?

Flavor-wise, it's great, but it's going to cause soooooo many headaches for Limited formats, deck construction, and plain old logistics (and I feel very sorry for judges who have to deal with this).

This may be the first big misstep Wizards has made in many years, after a long streak of home runs. I don't think it's going to hurt their sales, but it's still just clunky, poorly implemented, and it sounds annoying to deal with.
 
I'll reserve judgement until I see how they actually play. Regardless, like always, just because one mechanic sucks, there are always plenty of other cards to use.
 
Using the checklists just seems awkward as hell.

"Hold on. Let me root through these cards I have in my pocket to find the double card I just played."
 
Idk. This seems clunky to say the least. This checklist card don't really get. So you place it in your deck and the flip card is a "token" you bring into play? What's to stop people from just saying they have the card and all they have is the checklist.
 
I do like the Ludevic one. I could see a deck based around getting 5 counters on him asap, using proliferate for instance.
 
alternade said:
Idk. This seems clunky to say the least. This checklist card don't really get. So you place it in your deck and the flip card is a "token" you bring into play? What's to stop people from just saying they have the card and all they have is the checklist.
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Your supposed to clearly mark the checklist next to what card you are bringing out so you opponent and judge can confirm it. But I agree, still clunky. I'd hope judges would just allow you to remove the card from the sleeve and flip it over and place it back in.
 
siddx said:
Your supposed to clearly mark the checklist next to what card you are bringing out so you opponent and judge can confirm it. But I agree, still clunky. I'd hope judges would just allow you to remove the card from the sleeve and flip it over and place it back in.
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but its not required to show that you have said card, the checklist is good enough?
 
alternade said:
but its not required to show that you have said card, the checklist is good enough?
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what it sounds like to me is when you draw the checklist card and decide to play it, you show it to your opponent and then fetch the card marked out of your sideboard or somewhere like that, and put it into play. It it had room for text it would probably say something like "when you play this card, pay the mana cost associated with the card you have marked on the check list. Place the card marked on the checklist onto the battlefield and then remove the checklist from play." Or something a little more intelligible.
 
In other words, I once saw a guy at a few local tournaments who played with power 9 but kept them in a special box. He had proxies in his deck because he didn't want to shuffle his deck with the power in it. So when he drew a proxy and cast it, he'd show it to the opponent and then fetch the real one out of his box and put that on the field/cast it. Then before he shuffled his deck he'd switch the proxy back in. Kinda annoying, but the judge okayed it as long as the opponent was verbally told what was happening and could physically touch and inspect the cards coming into play. I assume this is similar. The checklist is almost like a proxy, and when it's "cast" you fetch out the real card and put that into play instead.
 
siddx said:
In other words, I once saw a guy at a few local tournaments who played with power 9 but kept them in a special box. He had proxies in his deck because he didn't want to shuffle his deck with the power in it. So when he drew a proxy and cast it, he'd show it to the opponent and then fetch the real one out of his box and put that on the field/cast it. Then before he shuffled his deck he'd switch the proxy back in. Kinda annoying, but the judge okayed it as long as the opponent was verbally told what was happening and could physically touch and inspect the cards coming into play. I assume this is similar. The checklist is almost like a proxy, and when it's "cast" you fetch out the real card and put that into play instead.
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Still seems clumsy as all hell and a needless mechanic to just make things more annoying.
 
Zaraki_Kenpachi said:
Still seems clumsy as all hell and a needless mechanic to just make things more annoying.
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I think the mechanic is good, the implementation is poor. They are just flip cards from kamigawa made more difficult to use. I think the morbid mechanic could be more interesting. Especially with all the graveyard effects and cards that benefit from having lots of creatures in the yard.
 
siddx said:
I think the mechanic is good, the implementation is poor. They are just flip cards from kamigawa made more difficult to use. I think the morbid mechanic could be more interesting. Especially with all the graveyard effects and cards that benefit from having lots of creatures in the yard.
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Ya, it seems like a much clumsier version of that which makes it more frustrating. I also hated that mechanic, but this is a step backwards in implementation which is annoying.
 
Best part of the double-faced cards is it's a way to get everybody to use sleeves because nobody is going to want to bother with the checklist cards. Always makes me cringe to see people play without sleeves.

Not sure what's so confusing about the checklist card though. It's just a proxy.

It's also a hilarious wrinkle when it comes to drafting as you'll basically want to snap draft the double-faced cards as quickly as possible and make sure nobody can see it because you're now drafting with open information.
 
darkside31337 said:
Best part of the double-faced cards is it's a way to get everybody to use sleeves because nobody is going to want to bother with the checklist cards. Always makes me cringe to see people play without sleeves.

Not sure what's so confusing about the checklist card though. It's just a proxy.

It's also a hilarious wrinkle when it comes to drafting as you'll basically want to snap draft the double-faced cards as quickly as possible and make sure nobody can see it because you're now drafting with open information.
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But this does also screw with people that have certain type of sleeves. My orange Ultra Pro Standard sleeves are slightly-transparant in the back so either I'm going to have to switch to different type of sleeves or use the checklist cards. Prolly will go with the later despite not fully liking it.
 
y2dvd said:
Yes on that G/B land. Verdant Catacombs are too expensive. I hope to get that new land cheap and early.
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You can all but guarantee they won't be. $5 a pop, at least, probably more.

I thought about the flip mechanics some more and still don't really like how it plays out. The flavour is brilliant, but I can't help but feel it needlessly complicates gameplay. What's funny is that there was one guy on MTGS who kept insisting that double-sided cards weren't completely out of the question like most posters felt, and when he wouldn't drop the idea, all these posters tore him a new one. They're probably feeling quite foolish right now, haha.
 
Zaraki_Kenpachi said:
Ya, it seems like a much clumsier version of that which makes it more frustrating. I also hated that mechanic, but this is a step backwards in implementation which is annoying.
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It's too bad because the idea is interesting. It would have been cool if the card simply said something like "if buttfucker human did damage to an opponent this turn, exile buttfucker human and search your library for a card named buttfucker werewolf and put it into play. If buttfucker werewolf is exiled return it to play"
And buttfucker werefolf's card would say the same thing just opposite. A mechanic that lets you switch out cards back and forth from your deck could lead to some interesting plays.
 
Takuan said:
You can all but guarantee they won't be. $5 a pop, at least, probably more.

I thought about the flip mechanics some more and still don't really like how it plays out. The flavour is brilliant, but I can't help but feel it needlessly complicates gameplay. What's funny is that there was one guy on MTGS who kept insisting that double-sided cards weren't completely out of the question like most posters felt, and when he wouldn't drop the idea, all these posters tore him a new one. They're probably feeling quite foolish right now, haha.
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Yeah, the M10 duals started around that, but now that they've seen their 3rd iteration, they are now around $2. Either way, I'm getting multiples of all of them, my commander decks need better mana bases.
 
siddx said:
In other words, I once saw a guy at a few local tournaments who played with power 9 but kept them in a special box. He had proxies in his deck because he didn't want to shuffle his deck with the power in it. So when he drew a proxy and cast it, he'd show it to the opponent and then fetch the real one out of his box and put that on the field/cast it. Then before he shuffled his deck he'd switch the proxy back in. Kinda annoying, but the judge okayed it as long as the opponent was verbally told what was happening and could physically touch and inspect the cards coming into play. I assume this is similar. The checklist is almost like a proxy, and when it's "cast" you fetch out the real card and put that into play instead.
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This practice is (was) illegal and against DCI policy for sanctioned events. That is because it's so clunky, awkward, and rife with potential for abuse.

No judgment on your friend - I would want to do the same thing if allowed -, but if everyone were allowed to do that it would be a nightmare.

Oh wait - now everyone IS allowed to do this with certain cards in sanctioned DCI events. Well then. That's awkward.

Can you imagine a deck in the finals of a Pro Tour using checklist cards? So ghetto and unprofessional. Where do you keep the real copies of the cards before you play them? With your sideboard? Then what if you get deck-checked - how do they separate the sideboard from the double-sided cards? What if your sideboard contains double-sided cards? Ugh.
 
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