Man loses hands AND feet to a pack of pit bulls
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Only three of the sixteen pictured dogs have any pit bull ancestry. There are over twenty breeds of dogs that are commonly confused with pit bulls - and that's just the purebreds - and because of the misconceptions of ignorant people, when someone sees a medium-sized block-headed dog that just attacked a person, they are going to make a cognitive leap that the dog is a pit bull, regardless of whether that is or isn't accurate.
Comfort Jones
Banned
People really let headlines sweep them up in the hysteria. Really glad you're posting this but I'm sure people will do their best to ignore/forget it.
Read through the details of some of those examples and tell me they aren't the fault of owners. Free roam pitbulls is the fault of terrible owners, probably breeding for dogfighting. A lot of the young children dying are stupid owners that don't know how to introduce their young children to dogs, and don't see the signs of the a child annoying the dog.
Pitbulls have some of the highest potential for tragedy, but, they aren't much different than any other breed with respect to their actions being tied to their ownership. Well treated Pitbulls are some of the best breeds possible, like I said, they are like a Sports car. In the right hands, they have amazing potential, or an idiot can wrap it around a pole and explode in a fiery crash.
Comfort Jones
Banned
What are you actually asking for here, dude.
It just seems like people care more about people saying mean things about pit bulls on the internet than stopping maimings. Maybe I'm wrong but that's certainly the impression these threads give.
Comfort Jones
Banned
And how are they supposed to be stopping maimings?
Well, apparently nothing can be done. People being maimed is just the cost of the freedom for anyone to own as many pit bulls as they want.
Comfort Jones
Banned
Gonna just refer to #304 and throw my hands up in the air here.
So you're agreeing that there's absolutely nothing that can be done to stop maimings and we should just accept them because pit bulls are cute and other dogs attack people too.
So pit bull supporters, why have so many governments around the world passed laws against these dogs then? All baseless data based on media hype? Most of these laws apply to pure bred and mixed.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-specific_legislation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-specific_legislation
blainethemono
Member
Nothing can be done if you're totally unwilling to even consider the arguments from people who are trying to raise awareness and offer counter arguments to the unreliable statistics and generalizations being posted all over the place. Nothing is going to change your mind no matter how hard we try
I just want to hear from the pit bull lovers what their solution for maimings is. If they put as much effort into this as they do their arguments in support of pit bulls it should be easy.
Comfort Jones
Banned
¯\(ツ
/¯Sure. Yeah. That was my point. I imagine you looked at the post, #304, and went "lol whatever" and just kept going on with this agenda of yours. I'm waiting for at least one person to refute what's being claimed in that post.
I keep my dog on a Leash and control it in public. I don't let it get near other dogs or people unless they are willing to introduce themselves or their dog to my dog. I do what I can to keep my dogs segregated when new people enter my home, if they are interested in my dogs, I will bring them and hold them by their collar as they smell and get to know the new person. I am controlling the dog until it accepts the new person and is friendly, which in the case of my dogs, is practically instantly. They are immediately looking for affection from anyone, and are very willing to please with compassion and love.
I put plenty of effort into making people feel more confident and accepting of Pitbulls, plenty of friends and acquaintances have been impressed by my dogs and have selected a Pitbull as their next family dog.
More pit bulls in society doesn't sound like a solution to maimings to me. How do you know those acquaintances are going to train them as well as you?
I mean, it just snapped. It had happily lived with two small Jack Russell Terriers for three or four years. It wasn't being introduced to anything. One day they were all chilling in the back garden and then, in a flash, it snapped. Tore the other two dogs up while we had to sit behind a patio door and watch.
Call it ignorance but I knew that dog from a pup, and I knew the owners (two middle aged ladies) all my life. It just snapped. There was no history of mistreatment. No provocation. Until that day it had been a family dog happily living with the other two, and we all adored her.
When it comes to ignorance, your last comment takes the biscuit. The dog had already killed two dogs and was pacing around covered in blood. It had to be exterminated on the spot by a professional because anyone stupid enough to have gone out to the dog would have been killed or maimed.
I know it's just an anecdote, and I'm sure you can find a million ways to rationalise it away. I'm just saying that I don't think any of the strong defenders of APBTs has ever actually seen what happens when shit goes south. In fact, I'm almost certain of it.
EndlessSky
Member
You answered your own question. The solution to stopping maimings is proper training and precautions. If an owner isn't willing to do that, then they shouldn't own any breed.
Parallax
best seen in the classic "Shadow of the Beast"
how about not let them get into the hands of someone who wont properly take care of them. like many have said in this thread. proper licensing as well as education would help, but like with all things, if a douchebag wants something, then nothing will stop them from acquiring it, and we would still have threads like this, despite all the responsible owners of the breeds
So you support regulations for dangerous dogs?
blainethemono
Member
That's what happened to me actually. Around the time I was looking for my first dog, one of my co-workers had an american bulldog and I was just impressed with how well-trained she was. Loved everything about her. Great personality, playful, looked beautiful, and just seemed like a perfect fit for me. So I decided I had to have one just like her. Then like a few weeks after that he tells me that the dog's mother was having another litter and I ended up getting one of those.
Before that I didn't really know anything about pitbulls or any bully breed. My first experience raising and training a dog. So when people ask if it took more work to train her or whatever, I really don't have any frame of reference. It just wasn't really anything special.
EndlessSky
Member
If by dangerous dogs you mean any dog that has a big enough mouth to cause damage to a person and not just pit bulls, then yes.
There's a guy that walks his Pitbull around my street and it's the calmest dog I've ever seen. My dog is a wiener dog and he's just a son of a bitch, would rather have that chill Pitbull. Someone above said that Pitbulls are just misunderstood and I agree. Sometimes you hear on the news about a Pitbull attacking and maiming an 8 year-old child but who doesn't make mistakes from time to time? We aren't perfect.
pack it up.
and this is an awful analogy. i never knew a sports car can snap and rip people to shreds because it was bred to fuck things up.
Couldn't be more fucking wrong if you tried.
That's not how you classify a dangerous dog. For reference, the following are classified as dangerous dogs in the UK:
Pit Bull Terrier (except Staffs)
Japanese Tosa
Dogo Argentino
Fila Brasileiro
(And any crossbreeds of the above)
It has nothing to do with the size of their mouths. That's just silly talk.
Both of my Pitbulls have come from the streets of Compton and East Gardena in Los Angeles. One of them has legit PTSD from its abuse, we fostered and adopted out another one that had been thrown 40 feet into the Alameda Corridor. My mom has spent the past 20 years in Animal rescue, I have seen scores of animal mistreatment and tragedy. I just don't buy the "it just snapped" idea, Jack Russell terriers are among many a small dog that are annoying and aggressive. It's not worth trying to explain your anecdotal evidence, but the "it just snapped" is just a lack of understanding.
"It just snapped" has happened with every breed ever, the most beautiful Golden Retriever has eaten a young child, seemingly out of nowhere, on and on. They are animals and they are unpredictable, it's not just a Pitbull problem, they just have the opportunity to fuck some shit up. I wouldn't suggest small dogs with big dogs in the first place, they can't play and interact the same, there is automatically a conflict of interest with their size difference.
Lazyslob said:
I disagree with the entire idea of "just snapping" as an excuse. Like someone accelerated too much and couldn't handle the oversteer of a sports car, they didn't understand what happened, the car "just snapped." It's a stretch, I know, but the "just snapped" part of animal reactions is what I am arguing against. We don't know another living beings intentions or motive, it's a lack of understanding. The Pitbull didn't just snap, the same way the car didn't just lose control, we just happen to understand what causes car crashes, but we don't understand what causes dogs to attack. We aren't banning sports cars because we understand their potential for danger, we don't understand Dogs, so we just jump to the eliminate the "problem" breeds conclusion.
EndlessSky
Member
My point was that any dog can be dangerous if not trained well or the right precautions taken. Pit bulls are the subject of the public's scorn because media coverage is biased towards them, even though every breed has attacked a human before.
Which kind of tells you something. Both are essentially the same thing, in the sense that they're both Old English Bull Dog and Terrier mixes.
Any bad traits can be fixed through good breeding practices. In other words, make sure you buy a dog from a reputable breeder and not some back street breeder down the road.
That said, I think a large part of the problem is still the owners.
Well, let's just say we weren't going to sit down with the dog and ask it nicely how it was feeling and whether there was anything we could do to cheer her up.
Anyway, we've all seen this conversation a million times before. Pit Bull owners will defend their dogs to the death because theirs is different, and sure, they probably are. Meanwhile people will continue to get savaged and people will continue to blame the owners and the media (who do share some of the blame with the breed, no doubt). I'll be glad I live in a country that banned them, you can be glad you have the freedom to own one. The world keeps spinning.
All I wanted to say with my original point is that I doubt anyone strongly defending the breed has ever witnessed a Pit Bull attack first hand. The ferocity isn't something you quickly forget.
The end result is absolutely not the same thing. Although a Staff can look every bit as mean as a Pit Bull, they have an utterly different temperament. The exemption wasn't put in for shits and giggles, Staffs deserved it.
Temperament is something that is bred though. It is something that can be fixed through good breeding practices. You breed for temperament.
I'm not even sure there is evidence that their temperament is utterly different anyway. You can always get bad dogs no matter what breed. If your experience of that breed is a negative one, you may end up with a biased view of that breed in general.
In fact I know someone who had their staff put down. They were good owners who didn't treat the dog bad at all, but it would just attack humans. Mainly joggers running past. They think he was just being protective believing they were somehow a threat. Not all Staffs are like that though of course.
I think personally that could have been fixed, but they were nto willing to risk it so they put him down.
I don't know if you should be taking that as gospel. Is this from research or just an image assembled from various dog owners? Those tests are known to have issues giving a precise lineage as well.
Usually the problem in these news reports is the owner. Like the dog being left un-neutered, is off leash on walks, not socialized properly yet is allowed access to people or other animals, not kept inside, owner doesn't understand or downplays their dog's bad temperament, etc etc. I've seen this kind of behavior from owners of large dogs to small dogs.
Not to say that there aren't any asshole dogs out there, but they aren't all just hardwired to be like that. Pitbulls aren't inherently aggressive to people, but they are really strong. There are certain breeds with certain temperaments that some people just can't or won't learn to handle properly. I think there should be some kind of a solution, but banning pitbulls outright won't help in the long run if people will just pick up the next popular large dog breed.
Not to say that there aren't any asshole dogs out there, but they aren't all just hardwired to be like that. Pitbulls aren't inherently aggressive to people, but they are really strong. There are certain breeds with certain temperaments that some people just can't or won't learn to handle properly. I think there should be some kind of a solution, but banning pitbulls outright won't help in the long run if people will just pick up the next popular large dog breed.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
Funny. A few days ago a staffordshire bull terrier viciously attacked a dog I was walking. It bit her on the back and left 5 puncture wounds and a £300 veterinary bill for us to pay.
Other dogs have bitten or attacked but only that one has done it to such vicious degree (evidently to kill) and all without any provocation.
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