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[MoccaJava]

If they heard the PS2 version will have tons of extras, then they wouldn't care near as much as a hardcore gamer would about the wait. If

Umm, no, not if there is a ten month wait in between the games.

What, you think video games are some kind of exception, where casual gamers who see the amazing game NOW are going to say "I'll wait 10 months for the PS2 version."?

You are dead wrong. If anything, it is the hardcore gamer, who is too stubborn to by a GameCube that will end up waiting.

 

[Amir0x]

Umm, no, not if there is a ten month wait in between the games.

What, you think video games are some kind of exception, where casual gamers who see the amazing game NOW are going to say "I'll wait 10 months for the PS2 version."?

You are dead wrong. If anything, it is the hardcore gamer, who is too stubborn to by a GameCube that will end up waiting.

Yes because see unlike hardcore gamers... videogames are not at the center of a casual gamers life. They can afford to wait and not give a fuck, especially if the value at the end of the day would be better.

Note I'm not saying the value will be better here, I'm just saying if there's a compelling reason to wait a casual gamer will have NO qualms waiting. And that's a fact.

Detach -> Geekiness -> Life -> CooL!

 

[Deleted member 284]

Umm, no, not if there is a ten month wait in between the games.

What, you think video games are some kind of exception, where casual gamers who see the amazing game NOW are going to say "I'll wait 10 months for the PS2 version."?

You are dead wrong. If anything, it is the hardcore gamer, who is too stubborn to by a GameCube that will end up waiting.

Unfortunetly, its been shown that PS2-only gamers will wait for an RE game to show up on their console and make it a platinum title. (see RE:CV on Dreamcast vs. RE:CVX on PS2)

 

[border]

If the last two exclusive RE games didn't make casuals pick up a Cube, why would the new one be any different?

 

[MoccaJava]

videogames are not at the center of a casual gamers life. They can afford to wait and not give a fuck, especially if the value at the end of the day would be better.

What world are you living in where people get things they want now except videogames?

I mean even looking at NPD data, you're wrong. There are tons of examples.

It's not even about Resident Evil, most of the time, what you're saying is not true.

If the last two exclusive RE games didn't make casuals pick up a Cube, why would the new one be any different?

Because it's a mega-hyped game that's delivering beyond expectations, has the best graphics on a console this generation, and has gotten a ton of critical acclaim - not to mention it has a lot of advertising power behind it, PLUS the word of mouth it is getting.

 

[Laurent]

It's impossible to choose between them, both of them are chef-d'oeuvre...

 

[Amir0x]

What world are you living in where people get things they want now except videogames?

It's not a matter of getting something you want now or later. It's a matter of easily being able to wait if the value down the line is going to be better. To casual gamers, it just doesn't matter like it does for hardcores. This is a fact. Arguing this fact is futile and only serves to illustrate your isolated perspective on how things work.

I mean even looking at NPD data, you're wrong. There are tons of examples.

Tons of examples of what? People waiting?

You'd be right.

It's not even about Resident Evil, most of the time, what you're saying is not true.

It depends, like I said. You have to give casual gamers a reason to wait, and then they'll do just that. But especially in the case of those who don't already own a Cube it's a non-issue: IF you're a casual gamer and you don't own a cube, there's a 98% (<<made up number) chance you won't be buying one to get RE4. They'll just wait.

Because it's a mega-hyped game that's delivering beyond expectations, has the best graphics on a console this generation, and has gotten a ton of critical acclaim - not to mention it has a lot of advertising power behind it, PLUS the word of mouth it is getting.

As much as we all would love to live in lollipop gumdrop land, the vast majority of people are not going to get a Cube if they haven't already due to this game, especially since it WILL be coming out on a far more popular console down the months.

It's nice to wish and all, and I wish the most success possible for RE4 (it's one of my all time favorite games now), but it simply won't happen. The only way you could conceive of this happening is if you're so utterly blinded by Nintendo fanboyism that your thought process is hampered.

 

[Miburou]

I'm at the end of chapter 1 still, but while the game is nice, I'm not as crazy about the game as some of you are. Does it really get that muc better, or is this the usual GAF hyperbole?

As of now, I'd easily take MGS3 over RE4, although to be fair I've always liked MGS games over the RE game, even though I'm a fan of both.

 

[Amir0x]

I'm at the end of chapter 1 still, but while the game is nice, I'm not as crazy about the game as some of you are. Does it really get that muc better, or is this the usual GAF hyperbole?

It gets much, much better.

 

[border]

Because it's a mega-hyped game that's delivering beyond expectations, has the best graphics on a console this generation, and has gotten a ton of critical acclaim - not to mention it has a lot of advertising power behind it, PLUS the word of mouth it is getting.

Basically none of that really matters when talking about casuals, other than perhaps word of mouth. If casuals gave a shit about reviews and "critical acclaim" then the NPD charts would be completely different. The other two RE games had extensive marketing campaigns AND even better looking graphics than RE4.

Some folks are just caught up in GAF-hype. If GAF-hype was any sort of reliable indicator about "word of mouth", then MGS3 wouldn't be struggling to reach a million.....

 

[dark10x]

I'm at the end of chapter 1 still, but while the game is nice, I'm not as crazy about the game as some of you are. Does it really get that muc better, or is this the usual GAF hyperbole?

As of now, I'd easily take MGS3 over RE4, although to be fair I've always liked MGS games over the RE game, even though I'm a fan of both.

Yes, it gets MUCH MUCH better. If I had posted here upon completing chapter 1, I don't think those impressions would have been too terribly positive. The game really picks up.

 

[Miburou]

OK, thanks everyone.

 

[MoccaJava]

Basically none of that really matters when talking about casuals, other than perhaps word of mouth. If casuals gave a shit about reviews and "critical acclaim" then the NPD charts would be completely different. The other two RE games had extensive marketing campaigns AND even better looking graphics than RE4.

The other RE games had bigger marketing campaigns than RE4?


You underestimate casuals way too much. You think only hardcore gamers are reading magazines with RE4 on the cover and the amazing review for the game?

 

[border]

The other RE games had bigger marketing campaigns than RE4?

Nobody knows which games are getting more ad exposure or more ad dollars, but it certainly isn't like REmake and RE0 weren't advertised at all. REmake in particular was pushed very hard, and had a tie in with the first Resident Evil movie.

The same casual gamers you are talking about ignored Cube amidst positive reviews and cover stories on Metroid Prime, Metroid Prime 2 and the other two RE games. All of a sudden you expect them to do a 180, and outside of the holiday shopping season, no less.

 

[MoccaJava]

When did I ever say anything about doing a 180? All I had been talking about was that casuals won't wait 10 months for the PS2 version. Don't put words in my mouth, thanks.

 

[border]

Well, they waited ~18 months for Code Veronica....

I guess we will know when next month's NPD data comes out. How much do you think Cube sales will increase?

 

[dark10x]

Well, they waited ~18 months for Code Veronica....

I guess we will know when next month's NPD data comes out. How much do you think Cube sales will increase?

Oh yeah, there was quite a gap between the DC release and the PS2 port, yet the PS2 port performed very well at retail.

 

[-SRV-]

Easy choice: RE4.

 

[SantaC]

RE4

 

[explodet]

I'll be replaying BOTH these games over and over again for a while.

 

[Socreges]

They might be the best two games from this generation (+ two of the best ever), and they've come out within two months of each other.

The wait part is only really relevant to hardcore fans who can't wait, like you and I. It's not particularly relevant to most other people since one way or another they're going to get a fantastic game.

Yeah, please establish why this is wrong. If, for instance, a casual gamer has both systems... they might just get it for GC. If they heard the PS2 version will have tons of extras, then they wouldn't care near as much as a hardcore gamer would about the wait. If a casual gamer has only PS2, they're not going to get GC to play RE4 - only hardcore gamers would do that.

Hey, I don't expect anyone to buy a GC purely for RE4 to avoid the wait. I'm talking exclusively about people that own both systems, but choose to wait for the PS2 version because it will have extras (of what substance they don't know), but likely down-graded graphics. They would have to have a hard-on for their PS2, casual or not.

A handful of people have said "I'll wait for the PS2 version", as if they have a choice. Though maybe they're just protecting their egos, while stroking the figurative cock of their favourite system.

 

[lexi]

Times like these you might catch me supporting the OCW.

Fuck I hate it when excellent games become a matter of pissing contests between the respective fanboys.

 

[Broshnat]

Well, they waited ~18 months for Code Veronica....

I guess we will know when next month's NPD data comes out. How much do you think Cube sales will increase?

The GC could do 400k in Jan. And RE4 could do 550k

 

[cvxfreak]

The GC could do 400k in Jan. And RE4 could do 550k

How confident are you? 550K is even higher than November 2004's number.

 

[Broshnat]

How confident are you? 550K is even higher than November 2004's number.

Nov 2004s number?

 

[cvxfreak]

Nov 2004s number?

350K or in that area.

 

[border]

You realize that 400K in January would be a 305% year-over-year sales increase, right? That would be a monumental jump for a system that:

--has recently had year-over-year decreases
--never saw year-over-year leap as large as 300%, even with big price drops and Zelda/Mario

 

[Broshnat]

350K or in that area.

For hardware?

Well I said 400k. 550k for the game.

Look at all the hype and attention it's getting. If it encouraged 250k gamecubes to be sold to new owners then that could make some sense...

 

[Broshnat]

You realize that 400K in January would be a 305% year-over-year sales increase, right? That would be a monumental jump for a system that:

--has recently had year-over-year decreases
--never saw year-over-year leap as large as 300%, even with big price drops and Zelda/Mario

Yeah, but... Mario and Zelda sell to current Nintendo fans who already own the gamecube. It usually sells 100-150k for Jan. As I said before, if RE4 could encurage a couple of hundred thousand people or so to go and buy a cube, it could see a big spike in sales.

The official thread has had 95,000 hits++ in little over a couple of weeks and is still going. The attention and critical praise it's getting is immense.

 

[Amir0x]

Broshnat, you're WAY too optimistic.

There is zero chance of that happening. Zero. 400,000? Are you serious?

I mean, I don't follow charts near as closely as you do... but I'd be willing to bet something on that.

 

[Megafoo Chavez]

I just beat the game like 20 minutes ago. 17 hours and 36 minutes. The final fight was pretty fun but not as fun as MGS3's final battle.

my overall problem with the game is that it is "satanic cult evil" instead of big bad ass corperation making chemical weapons gone bad evil. Just not what i wanted

 

[Peter Porker]

MGS3 for me.

Passing, Gameplay, story, boss fights all are great.

RE4 is more of a really good visual treat. If you are to actually look past the great set peices from one area to the other you'll realize its pretty shallow.

The puzzles seem like they were made for 10 years old to solve not only that but it's basic action horror game puzzles. It's like they took Leon out of RE and put him in gothic type castles or whatnot of DMC with more bullets and zombies.

Now that sounds great fun but it kind of got boring for me 9 hours into the game. Im not even att he second disk yet.

The story is.....well.........different. This is where the game falls the most. After going through rooms and rooms of zombies and puzzles for nearly 3 hours straight I want some story to grab me back into the game, so I will go through 3 more hours of same bullshit over and over again.But the story doesnot do that at all. The characters are annoying to say the least, the voice acting horendous. The cutscenes are well directed, but they try too hard sometimes(the scene with ada and leon. )

Other than the camera, which doesnt annoy me much, I think MGS3 is one of the finest and most perfect games ever made. The pacing is just like a movie, it grabs you and the gameplay so awesome, you'll want to play same areas over and over again just because it's so different every time. While in RE4 the difference is in the envrionments and set peices rather than what you're doing.

RE4 is a must buy game, but I just think people are kind of overrating it a bit . Look past all the nice castles and ligthing. FOr a action game IT is suppose to grab you with its visuals but Gameplay in MGS3 is far better, more open eneded and varied than anything in RE4.

Both are must buy, But MGS3 wins this one.

 

[Razoric]

I agree that these games can be compared... "Japan Strikes Back" comes to mind. Both these games are phenominal. I can't say which I like better.

 

[Floyd]

Res Evil 4 by a very wide margin.

 

[border]

As I said before, if RE4 could encurage a couple of hundred thousand people or so to go and buy a cube, it could see a big spike in sales.

The problem is that big game releases do not cause big spikes in hardware sales. Generally, month-to-month sales increase gradually over time. The only time you see big spikes are in the holiday shopping season, where it's impossible to tell if a system is selling more because of "HUGE MEGA GAME PART 2" got released or becuase it's just people buying systems as gifts.

Outside of October-December period though, big releases have rarely improved sales that much -- and never have year-over-year sales tripled just like that. GameCube might have a better-than-usual January, but if past trends hold true then it's not going to sell 300-400K.

You're losing your perspective if you think some popular thread on GA is really going to mean huge hardware sales. Most of the people here that aren't ridiculous fanboys already own all the systems anyway.

 

[Odnetnin]

The problem is that big game releases do not cause big spikes in hardware sales. Generally, month-to-month sales increase gradually over time. The only time you see big spikes are in the holiday shopping season, where it's impossible to tell if a system is selling more because of "HUGE MEGA GAME PART 2" got released or becuase it's just people buying systems as gifts.

Outside of October-December period though, big releases have rarely improved sales that much -- and never have year-over-year sales tripled just like that. GameCube might have a better-than-usual January, but if past trends hold true then it's not going to sell 300-400K.

You're losing your perspective if you think some popular thread on GA is really going to mean huge hardware sales. Most of the people here that aren't ridiculous fanboys already own all the systems anyway.

well if OA (+your early halo2 impressions) is anything to go by, you're a huge freaking pirate so you don't contribute to the game economy anyway so your opininon = moot


Anyhow... I'd initially thought that this thread was to help Speevy decide which game to buy (see my earlier response)... this is just stupid however. Comparing apples and oranges. Why does it have to be

OR. ..... this OR that.

stupid. why not AND.


spongbob squarepants OR RE4

 

[jett]

Umm, no, not if there is a ten month wait in between the games.

What, you think video games are some kind of exception, where casual gamers who see the amazing game NOW are going to say "I'll wait 10 months for the PS2 version."?

You are dead wrong. If anything, it is the hardcore gamer, who is too stubborn to by a GameCube that will end up waiting.

All I can tell you is that I'm not going to fucking buy a Gamecube *again* just for one game. I'm not that big of a fan of the series, either way. If RE4 wasn't coming to PS2, I wouldn't care. But since it is, I might as well get it when it does.

 

[Doom_Bringer]

ok I change my mind.

MGS3 +1

 

[Peter Porker]

This thread is one of the worse. It's like saying who is more evil. Osama Bin Laden or Bush.

 

[Broshnat]

The problem is that big game releases do not cause big spikes in hardware sales. Generally, month-to-month sales increase gradually over time. The only time you see big spikes are in the holiday shopping season, where it's impossible to tell if a system is selling more because of "HUGE MEGA GAME PART 2" got released or becuase it's just people buying systems as gifts.

Outside of October-December period though, big releases have rarely improved sales that much -- and never have year-over-year sales tripled just like that. GameCube might have a better-than-usual January, but if past trends hold true then it's not going to sell 300-400K.

You're losing your perspective if you think some popular thread on GA is really going to mean huge hardware sales. Most of the people here that aren't ridiculous fanboys already own all the systems anyway.

Why compare year on year numbers?? They don't mean all that much. What did the GC have last Jan, Sonic Heroes?

I'd expect a fair spike from RE4's release simply because it's the one game that has been released on the cube that will appeal to those that don't already own it, and enough so that they will go out and but one just to play RE4. How much can you get a GC and RE4 for now? $120-130? Bargain.

 

[border]

Why compare year on year numbers?? They don't mean all that much. What did the GC have last Jan, Sonic Heroes?

What am I supposed to compare it to? Seems like it would be more unfair to compare it to December and November sales, when there was so much holiday shopping. Year-over-year is more apt because this is a very seasonal industry, comparing January (the slowest month) to something much faster isn't particularly helpful. 300-400K for Cube would be way more than PS2 or Xbox can hope to achieve at this time of year, which would make the system #1 for the first time in a long, long while.....the board would go crazy =) I'm interested to see what will happen, but I'm not as optimistic as some.

The price of playing Resident Evil 4 is roughly between $77 and $120. $78 if you rent the game (Refurb Cube $60, memcard $10, rental price $7) and $120 if you buy it. A hater could probably sell the Cube back for store credit and end up having payed ~$30-40 for the experience....not too shabby, considering.

$160 I guess if you buy a new Cube, new RE4, and memory card.

 

[Broshnat]

What am I supposed to compare it to? Seems like it would be more unfair to compare it to December and November sales, when there was so much holiday shopping. Year-over-year is more apt because this is a very seasonal industry, comparing January (the slowest month) to something much faster isn't particularly helpful. 300-400K for Cube would be way more than PS2 or Xbox can hope to achieve at this time of year, which would make the system #1 for the first time in a long, long while.....the board would go crazy =) I'm interested to see what will happen, but I'm not as optimistic as some.

The price of playing Resident Evil 4 is roughly between $77 and $120. $78 if you rent the game (Refurb Cube $60, memcard $10, rental price $7) and $120 if you buy it. A hater could probably sell the Cube back for store credit and end up having payed ~$30-40 for the experience....not too shabby, considering.

$160 I guess if you buy a new Cube, new RE4, and memory card.

I agree it's both optomistic and would also be unprecidented. But that's the whole point. I was one of the many who would NEVER have expected Halo 2 to have sold 3.2m+ in November, but look what happened? Conventional wisdom would have said it was unlikely GTA:SA would outsell GTA:VC but again it did. RE4 is HUGE. You're right it would be unprecidented, but it's a situation that hasn't occured on the GC (and the N64 for that matter) before, a really really great class A third party game that is based on a long running muti-million selling series that a lot of casual gamers have heard of before, backed up by a great ad campaign.

Lets just wait and see...

Don't forget that my 1.5m in the US number is LTD. It may only just break a million this year, but with some budget sales next year, it can do 1.5m total I think. 550k in Jan would be awesome!

Edit: I guess you could count Soul Calibur 2, but 1) It was multiplatform and 2) The SC series has never been that big.

 

[Alias03]

does anyone have a tally?

 

[Broshnat]

does anyone have a tally?

Tally of what?

 

[Amir0x]

RE4 is HUGE. You're right it would be unprecidented, but it's a situation that hasn't occured on the GC (and the N64 for that matter) before, a really really great class A third party game that is based on a long running muti-million selling series that a lot of casual gamers have heard of before, backed up by a great ad campaign.

It's not going to happen, dude. RE4 is not a Halo 2 level event or a GTA:SA level event. It's an event, but it's much smaller than those, and on top of that it's hampered by being on the Gamecube, a system almost entirely dismissed by casuals. And that's not the last of its problems...

Edit: I guess you could count Soul Calibur 2, but 1) It was multiplatform and 2) The SC series has never been that big.

I wouldn't even count SC2, but technically RE4 isn't different. RE4 will mostly likely be out by the end of 2005 on PS2. That's exclusive for GC for a few months, but those few months are just fine for casuals. No casual will buy a whole new system - especially if they have a PS2 - just to get a game now, ESPECIALLY when the PS2 version will have added features. I mean, you're really stretching it hard. Not to mention that the PS2 version will likely be able to take advantage of being released right around another Christmas rush.

If a person owns both GC and PS2, they probably wouldn't wait. If a videogame casual has a PS2 - which the large majority of them do - I'm sorry but semi-not-really-only-few-months exclusive RE4 isn't going to be the motivating factor.

No WAY it bumps GC sales to 400,000.

 

[Speevy]

Amir0x: The very nature of casuals is that they're stupid, fickle gamers.


I'm not saying the Cube will sell above its usually dismal January figures, but the "only for" mark on the box should mean exactly that to any number of casuals. It will sell what it would sell if it were a Gamecube exclusive forever. Again, I'm not saying that's a particularly high number.

 

[mashoutposse]

I don't know about the official sales performance of either of these games, but the local Best Buy here in NYC actually sold out of MGS3 (I got the last copy )

 

[Odnetnin]

I don't know about the official sales performance of either of these games, but the local Best Buy here in NYC actually sold out of MGS3 (I got the last copy )

yeah? MGS3 had a DISATROUS first month on the NPD.

 

[mashoutposse]

yeah? MGS3 had a DISATROUS first month on the NPD.

Well, I bought it today, so maybe word of mouth is helping it some (I actually picked up the game because of the GAF hype train).

 

[Amir0x]

Amir0x: The very nature of casuals is that they're stupid, fickle gamers.

I think the problem with most hardcore gamers is that they're excessively cynical about any development, and even more cynical about the nature of mainstream gaming. Casual gamers, while stupid, are not SO stupid that they can't hear through various channels that RE4 will be coming to the system they DO own. Most especially, they won't just invest 150 bucks in a new system and a copy of RE4 if there's a remote chance of it coming to the system they already own.

I'm not saying the Cube will sell above its usually dismal January figures, but the "only for" mark on the box should mean exactly that to any number of casuals.

Oh, don't get me wrong... I believe Cube will have a small boost, if only from hardcore gamers who are rebuying their Cube or finally finishing off their trifecta of current gen consoles (not counting DC) because of RE4. But 400,000? 400,000? That's some good drugs Broshnat has. I mean, he knows trends better than I do and follows numbers far more closely, and even he has to recognize how ridiculous such a prediction seems.

It will sell what it would sell if it were a Gamecube exclusive forever. Again, I'm not saying that's a particularly high number.

I agree. HOWEVER, if a casual gamer who owns a PS2 sees RE4 and GC, they're not going to go ahead and purchase a GC because of that game. That's what I'm saying. To think that is just... really... REALLY hoping beyond hope.

A casual gamer will wait for the PS2 version, and those GC owners will buy their game and be content. Console sales for GC will increase minimally for the month of Jan, and that'll be the end of it.