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Michael Moore wants to head an Occupy-like movement against Donald Trump

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entremet

entremet

Member
Kid Kamikaze10 said:
I want no part of this.

Whenever I hear "it's about class/economy", I always think of this conclusion.

White middle class getting benefits, maybe the working class too, POCs getting the trickle down at best. And the poor? Hah.



We're dying on the streets right now. In so many ways.


If the plan is us getting scraps, I don't want it. Economic plans better pay attention to race, gender, and orientation along with class. Intersectionally.

And I don't think Michael is the guy to make a platform like that. He doesn't have the mindset.
Click to expand...
That's fine, but many things can be worked on at once. I don't this movement being antagonistic to BLM. It's about building allies.
 
L

Lord Frieza

Member
Netherscourge said:
This will sound bad, but here's the truth:

Democrats need to warm up a lot more to veterans, the active military, fiscal conservatism, Nationalism and national security if they want to get back in the game.

Because those are the exact things that got Trump elected.

Less environment, less constitutional activism, less regulation, less social programs and more state-to-state legislation.

I know that's anti-progressive, but the swing voters don't want that stuff. They don't want a healthcare mandate. They simply want more income and access to cheap healthcare options, at their own choosing.

That's how you bring more undecideds and conservatives around to your side.

And before you say she won the popular vote, 46% of eligible voters didn't vote at all. They would have probably came out for her MORE if she did lean more toward the center and maybe even a tad to the right.
Click to expand...

So, become Republicans basically? Okay, got it.
 
B

Boney

Banned
people should give a listen to the round cable discussing the legacy of Martin Luther King Jr. held by Bernie, Nina Turner, Dr. West and Killer Mike.

https://youtu.be/befhumio-wo

MLK's focus against the establishment and class equity is key. If you try to dissociate race and class from each other you have exactly what the rich want, which is in fighting.
 
S

samn

Member
Netherscourge said:
This will sound bad, but here's the truth:

Democrats need to warm up a lot more to veterans, the active military, fiscal conservatism, Nationalism and national security if they want to get back in the game.

Because those are the exact things that got Trump elected.

Less environment, less constitutional activism, less regulation, less social programs and more state-to-state legislation.

I know that's anti-progressive, but the swing voters don't want that stuff. They don't want a healthcare mandate. They simply want more income and access to cheap healthcare options, at their own choosing.

That's how you bring more undecideds and conservatives around to your side.

And before you say she won the popular vote, 46% of eligible voters didn't vote at all. They would have probably came out for her MORE if she did lean more toward the center and maybe even a tad to the right.
Click to expand...

If the democrats were any less focused on the environment than they have been then you can kiss goodbye to the human species and almost every other species on planet earth because we will be gone within the century.

More national security? How can you be more national security than the terrifying and all-powerful surveillance state that Barack Obama has just handed over to Donald Trump?
 
ThisGuy

ThisGuy

Member
ZackieChan said:
Dude's been putting in work since he made Roger & Me and wrote Stupid White Men. GAF has been sleeping on him for some reason. He's hella lit 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Click to expand...
Damn 9 flames lit?

Alright, I'm listening.
 
F

Frustrated_me

Member
Boney said:
people should give a listen to the round cable discussing the legacy of Martin Luther King Jr. held by Bernie, Nina Turner, Dr. West and Killer Mike.

https://youtu.be/befhumio-wo

MLK's focus against the establishment and class equity is key. If you try to dissociate race and class from each other you have exactly what the rich want, which is in fighting.
Click to expand...
Bernie :(

I still can't get over how the DNC fucked him over.

Just listen to this man, he actually fucking cares, you can feel it when he speaks. You can sense his intention to do well for the common folk, you know he understands minority struggles. You're left assured he will stand for the people and not for the corporations.. And so on.

Coulda, woulda, shoulda.
 
P

phanphare

Banned
Boney said:
people should give a listen to the round cable discussing the legacy of Martin Luther King Jr. held by Bernie, Nina Turner, Dr. West and Killer Mike.

https://youtu.be/befhumio-wo

MLK's focus against the establishment and class equity is key. If you try to dissociate race and class from each other you have exactly what the rich want, which is in fighting.
Click to expand...

yep

Our whole campaign in Alabama has been centered around the right to vote. In focusing the attention of the nation and the world today on the flagrant denial of the right to vote, we are exposing the very origin, the root cause, of racial segregation in the Southland. Racial segregation as a way of life did not come about as a natural result of hatred between the races immediately after the Civil War. There were no laws segregating the races then. And as the noted historian, C. Vann Woodward, in his book, The Strange Career of Jim Crow, clearly points out, the segregation of the races was really a political stratagem employed by the emerging Bourbon interests in the South to keep the southern masses divided and southern labor the cheapest in the land. You see, it was a simple thing to keep the poor white masses working for near-starvation wages in the years that followed the Civil War. Why, if the poor white plantation or mill worker became dissatisfied with his low wages, the plantation or mill owner would merely threaten to fire him and hire former Negro slaves and pay him even less. Thus, the southern wage level was kept almost unbearably low.

Toward the end of the Reconstruction era, something very significant happened. (Listen to him) That is what was known as the Populist Movement. (Speak, sir) The leaders of this movement began awakening the poor white masses (Yes, sir) and the former Negro slaves to the fact that they were being fleeced by the emerging Bourbon interests. Not only that, but they began uniting the Negro and white masses (Yeah) into a voting bloc that threatened to drive the Bourbon interests from the command posts of political power in the South.

To meet this threat, the southern aristocracy began immediately to engineer this development of a segregated society. (Right) I want you to follow me through here because this is very important to see the roots of racism and the denial of the right to vote. Through their control of mass media, they revised the doctrine of white supremacy. They saturated the thinking of the poor white masses with it, (Yes) thus clouding their minds to the real issue involved in the Populist Movement. They then directed the placement on the books of the South of laws that made it a crime for Negroes and whites to come together as equals at any level. (Yes, sir) And that did it. That crippled and eventually destroyed the Populist Movement of the nineteenth century.

If it may be said of the slavery era that the white man took the world and gave the Negro Jesus, then it may be said of the Reconstruction era that the southern aristocracy took the world and gave the poor white man Jim Crow. (Yes, sir) He gave him Jim Crow. (Uh huh) And when his wrinkled stomach cried out for the food that his empty pockets could not provide, (Yes, sir) he ate Jim Crow, a psychological bird that told him that no matter how bad off he was, at least he was a white man, better than the black man. (Right sir) And he ate Jim Crow. (Uh huh) And when his undernourished children cried out for the necessities that his low wages could not provide, he showed them the Jim Crow signs on the buses and in the stores, on the streets and in the public buildings. (Yes, sir) And his children, too, learned to feed upon Jim Crow, (Speak) their last outpost of psychological oblivion. (Yes, sir)

Thus, the threat of the free exercise of the ballot by the Negro and the white masses alike (Uh huh) resulted in the establishment of a segregated society. They segregated southern money from the poor whites; they segregated southern mores from the rich whites; (Yes, sir) they segregated southern churches from Christianity (Yes, sir); they segregated southern minds from honest thinking; (Yes, sir) and they segregated the Negro from everything. (Yes, sir) That’s what happened when the Negro and white masses of the South threatened to unite and build a great society: a society of justice where none would pray upon the weakness of others; a society of plenty where greed and poverty would be done away; a society of brotherhood where every man would respect the dignity and worth of human personality. (Yes, sir)
Click to expand...

http://kingencyclopedia.stanford.ed...dress_at_the_conclusion_of_selma_march.1.html

sounds eerily familiar to today, with the media playing a big role in deceiving the masses
 
K

Kid Kamikaze10

Member
Boney said:
I don't think you understand what class is.
Click to expand...

Do tell. Because I hear a lot of "anti-establishment" and "class" talk that doesn't talk about how every populist movement all the way to the New Deal everyone loves, found a way to fuck over black people.


I do not want a movement that will fall for the same okie doke. And that involves giving a shit about the details. What is going on in the immediate for pocs lives. Poor, working, middle, etc.


Smash it all together and it will fail again. Nuance fucking matters.
 
A

Adam_Vania

Banned
if the left flocks to Michael Moore does that mean it's safe to criticize the Iraq War/Patriot Act/etc. again? it's been a long year and a half of being told to shut up whenever you bring that up.
 
F

fantomena

Member
Septy said:
The right wing smear campaign against him has only been surpassed by the one against Clinton.
Click to expand...

Might be the thing. Ive seen many of his films etc. and have nothing against him. I might would have if I lived in the US. Ive actually never heard about anyone here in my country who have something against him.
 
M

MogCakes

Member
Adam_Vania said:
if the left flocks to Michael Moore does that mean it's safe to criticize the Iraq War/Patriot Act/etc. again? it's been a long year and a half of being told to shut up whenever you bring that up.
Click to expand...

Dems have always had in-fighting between leftists and neoliberals. There's no party for leftists to call home anymore so they go to the D side, and the neolibs there don't want anything to do with them, as evidenced by their treatment of Bernie and his supporters in the primary.
 
B

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Adam_Vania said:
if the left flocks to Michael Moore does that mean it's safe to criticize the Iraq War/Patriot Act/etc. again? it's been a long year and a half of being told to shut up whenever you bring that up.
Click to expand...
Is that even true?

I mean even Trump was using Hillary's support for the Iraq War to bludgeon her over the head.
 
B

Boney

Banned
phanphare said:
yep



http://kingencyclopedia.stanford.ed...dress_at_the_conclusion_of_selma_march.1.html

sounds eerily familiar to today, with the media playing a big role in deceiving the masses
Click to expand...
The epitome of the black pastor. His legacy being white washed as just the Rosa Parks incident is so disheartening. I do not blame the southern strategy for the deep rooted racial divide, but democrats giving up for generations.

Kid Kamikaze10 said:
Do tell. Because I hear a lot of "anti-establishment" and "class" talk that doesn't talk about how every populist movement all the way to the New Deal everyone loves, found a way to fuck over black people.

I do not want a movement that will fall for the same okie doke. And that involves giving a shit about the details. What is going on in the immediate for pocs lives. Poor, working, middle, etc.

Smash it all together and it will fail again. Nuance fucking matters.
Click to expand...
Each individual experiences the same class struggles in a different manner. As a concept, being black is being poor in America, or rather a rogue slave. They will face even harsher conditions of marginalization which will be dragged with any individual class mobility. It is not the people that are racist, but the system. The same system that exploits the 90% of the people. Without giving value back to a man's work, his dignity will keep being deprived of him. Unions and collective bargaining, worker's rights includes gender, races and age, but not to homogenize the experience, but to enrich it's strength with the diverse struggle that is being shared.
 
I

ishibear

is a goddamn bear
So Moore apparently thinks the DNC should have gone with Oprah or Tom Hanks instead of Hillary.

Oprah no doubt would have won this shit omg
 
E

ElectricThunder

Member
Also started in on the Give a Chance nonsense...

Further, Moore's 2nd To Do list he threw on twitter today shows him getting carried away again---cringing reminder of when he tried the whole Coach for Obama bit...
 
F

Foffy

Banned
Boney said:
people should give a listen to the round cable discussing the legacy of Martin Luther King Jr. held by Bernie, Nina Turner, Dr. West and Killer Mike.

https://youtu.be/befhumio-wo

MLK's focus against the establishment and class equity is key. If you try to dissociate race and class from each other you have exactly what the rich want, which is in fighting.
Click to expand...

Indeed. MLKs last days were trying to unite the poor regardless of color together. He made sure to not make them distinct, but go so far as to imply they were the same, and their lack of unity prevented them from having the mobility towards fairness.
 
E

excelsiorlef

Member
I would need him to fully repudiate Assange and wikileaks as well.

He's as responsible for normalizing them as anyone. He was a massive cheerleader for him in 2010 to the point of being a rape apologist.

Wikileaks is the enemy of the left going forward flat out
 
B

Bounceounce

Member
aspiegamer said:
Your hopes are hinging on a core of white, male millennials leading the charge against Trump? The ones with, by far, the least to lose and the least likely to notice any impact to their day-to-day lives? A demographic that actually voted majority Trump? Uh, good luck with that.
More dank memes! Sweet! Maybe if some non-profit offered mobile wifi hotspots and charging stations there'd be higher participation. I'm not even kidding. The revolution will be streamed, so long as it's within 6ft of a wall outlet. 1080p tho.

Screw it, I'm in. Literally the worst possible thing has already happened. Normal disclaimer: I'm white as hell and angry, and yeah I won't pretend to know what any actual discrimination is like or might be like.
Click to expand...
Bernie was getting women and young minorities as well.
 
B

Boney

Banned
Foffy said:
Indeed. MLKs last days were trying to unite the poor regardless of color together. He made sure to not make them distinct, but go so far as to imply they were the same, and their lack of unity prevented them from having the mobility towards fairness.
Click to expand...
Which is the reason he got murdered. The FBI considered him the most dangerous individual in the country.

It's fucked up.
 
U

Unknown Soldier

Member
MogCakes said:
Dems have always had in-fighting between leftists and neoliberals. There's no party for leftists to call home anymore so they go to the D side, and the neolibs there don't want anything to do with them, as evidenced by their treatment of Bernie and his supporters in the primary.
Click to expand...

The Democratic Party belonged to the working class first. The neoliberals arrived with the "Third Way" and have infiltrated every level of the party starting in the 1990's. The reality is that this country only needs one party of the wealthy, and the Republicans have been fine with that role for decades. The reason why the Democratic Party is losing everything is because it's become utterly superfluous, the nation doesn't need 2 parties of the wealthy when it's only a 2-party system. They can either go back to being the party of the working class or they can continue to slide towards extinction, because they are completely superfluous right now. The Unnecessary Party.
 
F

Foffy

Banned
Boney said:
Which is the reason he got murdered. The FBI considered him the most dangerous individual in the country.

It's fucked up.
Click to expand...

Imagine how better off we, as a society, would be if his desires got accomplished.

Maybe these death caws of neoliberalism wouldn't be here, and of course wouldn't have to live through its metastasization in regards to the future.

If neoliberalism has no answer for an automated, jobless future to some core degree, why would fascism? Aren't these really the fault for socioeconomic insecurity? They are problems, not solutions.
 
M

MIMIC

Banned
There is clearly a movement taking place right now (or at least the signs of the beginning of one). For Moore to step up and try to be the leader is a good thing. It needs direction, so I'm all for it. Just hope it doesn't fizzle out by the time election day (midterms and general) comes rolling in.
 
TheLaughingStock

TheLaughingStock

Member
Netherscourge said:
This will sound bad, but here's the truth:

Democrats need to warm up a lot more to veterans, the active military, fiscal conservatism, Nationalism and national security if they want to get back in the game.

Because those are the exact things that got Trump elected.

Less environment, less constitutional activism, less regulation, less social programs and more state-to-state legislation.

I know that's anti-progressive, but the swing voters don't want that stuff. They don't want a healthcare mandate. They simply want more income and access to cheap healthcare options, at their own choosing.

That's how you bring more undecideds and conservatives around to your side.

And before you say she won the popular vote, 46% of eligible voters didn't vote at all. They would have probably came out for her MORE if she did lean more toward the center and maybe even a tad to the right.
Click to expand...

Most of what you said about why Trump won is false rather than the truth. However, in terms of the OP Michael Moore is right about one thing and that is both parties have failed the American people. The fact that Obama is so popular after selling out the people and trying to cut entitlements is something I'll never understand. This country is on the wrong track.
 
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