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[Penguins&PolarBears]

We're going in circles now. So what if your Internet goes out occasionally. My electricity goes out all the time and the outages last for hours every single time. I can't play anything without a battery when that happens. Does that mean I won't buy PS4 or 720 and only play games on laptop and tablets because they have batteries?

Utilities have interruptions. I'm not going to allow my electric company to dictate to me the consumer electronic devices I should buy. I buy game devices based upon the games that come out for them. That's all that matters in my buying decision.

 

[José Mourinho]

If I can play the single player without having to be online (after a one time activation even) I'll be completely happy. That doesn't seem like a crazy request, either. So if they won't give me that, I won't give them my money.

Right, which has been the point made by myself and few others in here. Nobody knows how MS will implement this. Shit, it hasn't even been confirmed. However, there have been posts saying the console won't work at all offline. That used games wont exist -- even though they could go the EA route. And blah blah blah. So many people have been in here spouting nonsense about something they know nothing about.

Edit: hold on, you are or you are not even happy with a 1 off activation?

Then people wouldn't be as up in arms, I feel.

The rumor is that no matter the mode, the 720 REQUIRES you to be online. That's what the problem is for most people. The Bioware dude mentioning Diablo 3's online issues (esp. in regards to trying to play that singleplayer) and SimCity (which you can't play offline despite the fact it could be completely modded to play offline) shows examples of the very thing that MS is rumored of trying to do.

People that went through that (or saw it) is why this thread has blown up and the internet that has picked up on this is up in arms. Were you not there for the SimCity fiasco weeks back? That is the same thing here if MS's servers are down or your connection is down due to week-long maintenance or other acts of god.

The rumor is exactly that...

 

[orznge]

Poor guy. His tweets, which for most people amount to nothing more than brain farts, might result in his termination. If this console always online AND you can't play games offline turns out to be true then the market forces will inevitably give Sony the lead. There is no reason to publicly lynch some corporate guy for understandably being defensive about a policy set forth by the whole company that he works for.

wow I feel so bad about how I posted that he should lose his job now that the execs read my post and fired him because of it

 

[Palette Swap]

Wow, that guy really comes off as a condescending cunt.
Thanks for a design choice that will make for an easy purchase decision.

 

[Krappadizzle]

Hmm.... May be this is not the best example, but I have seen this sentiment reaped several times in this and other threads. Folks who'd rather stick with PC because next Xbox is looking like shit. And yet PS4 is not even in consideration. This is just an observation, but if this is reminisce of Sony's past, then they have a very tough battle, even against such hubris displayed by Microsoft.

PS: I apologize to larvi if using your comment as an example offended you!

For me personally, I've got a decent system(i7-920@4Ghz/12gb ram/GTX 680) and what I've seen from PS4 doesn't personally excite me as I've seen things that look on par with it for the better part of 2 years. Crysis 2 modded/Skyrim Modded looked as good or better than anything that was shown at the PS4 conference. So If I just put graphics aside I'd have to look at games, there was nothing I saw that was exclusive to PS4 that sold me. Watch Dogs is coming to PC. The only game I thought looked interesting was the one with the little robot fella who could change into different things. I guess I'm just not wowed by graphics anymore so I need something more to get me excited.

 

[Reiko]

He's lynched himself, brah. How about you don't go on Twitter and talk about a product you're working on that hasn't been announced? He isn't exhibiting a very professional attitude. He should deal with whatever consequences come about.

THIS.

 

[JCreasy]

Let's see:

Halo 5 on an online-locked console?

Or

Bungie's NEW IP, Destiny, on a console that allows me to play games offline and online?

Hmmm

 

[Gattsu25]

The gamer has nothing to do with Nintendo's failure. That's all them.

No, the gamer has everything to do with the WiiU apparent failure. We didn't buy them. We spoke with our wallets.

Some did so because it was poorly communicated.
Others did so because it was too expensive.
Others still because it wasn't compelling enough.

That said, to remove the consumer from the equation when talking about a consumer electronics product is a bit disingenuous.

 

[thebigkahuna]

The amount of negative buzz MS is generating among the hardcore is gonna bite them real fucking hard early on the console's life unless it's cheap, or some huge exclusives are announced.

Huge exclusives/cheap prices will do nothing to stop people from buying an such an incredibly anti-consumer device. My gold subscription ends in a few weeks and that will be the end of my association with Microsoft.

 

[buhdeh]

Perfect reason why no one should ever tweet anything about their work.

 

[nhlducks35]

Let's see:

Halo 5 on an online-locked console?

Or

Bungie's NEW IP, Destiny, on a console that allows me to play games offline and online?

Hmmm

Halo 5 and Destiny on the online-locked console?

 

[valkillmore]

We're going in circles now. So what if your Internet goes out occasionally. My electricity goes out all the time. I can't play anything without a battery when that happens. Does that mean I won't buy PS4 or 720 and only play games on laptop and tablets because they have batteries?

Keep drinking that Koolaid.

 

[jbug617]

Let's see:

Halo 5 on an online-locked console?

Or

Bungie's NEW IP, Destiny, on a console that allows me to play games offline and online?

Hmmm

Destiny is always online.

 

[GillianSeed79]

Hate to be a conspiracy theorist, but the backpedaling saying the "why would I live there?" tweet was a joke sounds an awful lot like a non-denial denial. Yes, it was a dumb thing to say, but the importance of the tweets he made were regarding the notion of always online. He's essentially denying that he meant any ill will regarding the "why would I live there?" tweet, but he doesn't deny anything regarding what appears to be a defense of always online. That's the important thing. It's a non-denial denial.

Quoting All The President's Men for fun:

All non-denial denials--we're dirty guys and they doubt we were ever virgins but they don't say the story is inaccurate.
What's a real denial?
If they ever start calling us goddamn liars, it's time to start circling the wagons.

 

[outunderthestars]

Yeah you are definitely wrong. You do realize he's being lynched because of the WAY he is defending these policies right??? Name calling, etc. The guy is being a complete dick to the very consumers who support the company he works for.

He deserves everything he gets.

Last year I took a course on promoting recreation programs in public parks. Half of the class revolved around the importance of the tone and content of your social media posts. How on Earth does someone that high up the chain of command at MS not have a better grasp on social media than 60 year old park employees?

 

[Phoenician_Viking]

Haha, what a clusterfuck. The back paddling is the best part.

 

[Duffyside]

That's what I'm thinking too: what the fucking fuck are they going to do to prepare for launch day?

I'm no superman computer expert here, but can't they just use their existing infrastructure? They're already prepared for CoD launches... the 720 ain't gonna be bigger than that on day one...

 

[orznge]

We're going in circles now. So what if your Internet goes out occasionally. My electricity goes out all the time. I can't play anything without a battery when that happens. Does that mean I won't buy PS4 or 720 and only play games on laptop and tablets because they have batteries?

please, please make it online-only! I'll be so heartbroken if Microsoft isn't able to shove more focused ads in my face on their new console!

 

[Toki767]

We're going in circles now. So what if your Internet goes out occasionally. My electricity goes out all the time. I can't play anything without a battery when that happens. Does that mean I won't buy PS4 or 720 and only play games on laptop and tablets because they have batteries?

No electricity = nothing works

No internet = only the Durango doesn't work

Kind of a big difference.

 

[KingFire]

God Forgives, GAF Don't

Remember?

.

 

[Iacobellis]

What I cannot fathom is how a company could become so stupid. I've never seen arrogance this bad before, this tops Sony in 2006.

 

[Twilight Gap]

No electricity = nothing works.

No internet = only the Durango doesn't work

^

 

[Replicant]

We're going in circles now. So what if your Internet goes out occasionally. My electricity goes out all the time. I can't play anything without a battery when that happens. Does that mean I won't buy PS4 or 720 and only play games on laptop and tablets because they have batteries?

Look, you may love having access to your games limited only when you have internet connection but the rest of us actually want to still play games even when our internet connection goes down.

 

[ffdgh]

...Well that's that.

Oh and isn't he most likely under a NDA? lol.

 

[JABEE]

This is bad news. It's not a surprise that Microsoft is doing this. This will enable them to sell more ads, push media content that they want to their consumers, and make more people purchase live. If it backfires, then it was never meant to be. This was their plan all along.

 

[ironcreed]

Can't wait until my microwave and toaster have to always be online. Because hey, everything is online now days. It's the world we live in!

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

It's not, your right, but it also doesn't speak towards the future, either. We're talking about a year old PC port. And DRM was (and still is) the least of Diablo 3's problems.

Many will disagree

 

[Reiko]

...Well that's that.

Oh and isn't he most likely under a NDA? lol.

NDA, what NDA? He's a rockstar.

 

[JCreasy]

Halo 5 and Destiny on the online-locked console?

And Gears too

Oooor

Destiny and Killzone Shadow Fall, and Uncharted 4 (or new IP), Infamous Second Son, SSM New IP maybe, RAD's new IP (confirmed), The Last Guardian maybe

Decisions, decisions

 

[Blastoise]

Hopefully this bad press will push Microsoft to actually annonce the damn console.

 

[Pennywise]

We're going in circles now. So what if your Internet goes out occasionally. My electricity goes out all the time. I can't play anything without a battery when that happens. Does that mean I won't buy PS4 or 720 and only play games on laptop and tablets because they have batteries?

Oh....dude....
You're going in circles now, providing the same arguments.

 

[TheSeks]

Remember?

I DON'T WANT TO REMEMBER! D:

Oh and isn't he most likely under a NDA? lol.

Yes, but that doesn't matter if the online-only isn't true as he isn't talking the 720 itself. The tweets are implied given his attitude and the rumor mill. He's talking about the rumor mill which just furthered fanned the fire that makes people think it's confirmed. Then the backlash.

As it is, MS is going to can his ass or definitely reduce his position or something over this if they want to get over the backlash as quickly as they can.

 

[Raxus]

This makes three warnings now. In panic mode.

Guess I will swap the Durango for the Steambox and stick with the PS4 and WiiU.

 

[Codeblew]

lol @ gamers who are threatening a console boycott.

L4D2 boycott. We all know how effective that was. Gamers just talk the talk.

Who is talking boycott? It is more like, should I buy console A or console B first.

 

[Gully State]

Can't wait until my microwave and toaster have to always be online. Because hey, everything is online now days. It's the world we live in!

You also don't own your toaster and microwave. You bought a license to use it in your kitchen.

 

[Trey]

And Gears too

Oooor

Destiny and Killzone Shadow Fall, and Uncharted 4 (or new IP), Infamous Second Son, SSM New IP maybe, The Last Guardian maybe

Decisions, decisions

Destiny is a PS4 exclusive? Sony sure are a crafty bunch.

 

[Zinthar]

Disable second hand games?

It's more than that -- as others have mentioned it's generating more profit from each customer who purchases the console by tracking their spending habits in a manner that would make Facebook envious, if not Google. Their argument will be that by exerting more complete control over the ecosystem in this manner the end user will be guaranteed to have a much better experience.

Even though most people would voluntarily connect online anyway, allowing Microsoft and developers to obtain this information, they've probably calculated that a significant portion of people don't have their console connected to the internet just because it's not terribly convenient (maybe it's in another room) and they don't care enough to do so. They expect that the console sales they lose will ultimately be from low attach-rate consumers who weren't very profitable to them anyway, and will be outweighed by the extra revenue they can take in by forcing everyone to connect.

Additionally, by stamping out the second-hand market, Microsoft may believe they can appeal to developers in a way that Sony and the PC market can't -- publishers will have much less competition, and thus much more pricing power, because there will be no perfect substitutes in the form of the second-hand market for that exact game.

Personally, I absolutely hate it and have fully switched to PC gaming anyway, but I can see the business logic in it. For core gamers the competition between DD dealers in the PC space will likely result in avg. game prices being dramatically lower vs. the 720 -- in the long-run it will probably be the cheaper platform.

There is one major aspect to this that hasn't been discussed, though, and that's competition from mobile devices. As tablets replace laptops, a large portion of the addressable console market may be sated by an iPad, for instance, as "core" games become increasingly commonplace on that platform. X-com, for instance, looks like it will be fantastic on iPad, and there are rumors that Apple is creating a first-party gaming controller for iOS devices -- which is believable because it's low-risk and smart.

 

[rrs]

The twitter conversation points out a key problem with tech writers: They all live and work in major cities and have no clue what internet connectivity is like in rest of the country.

The land the $30-40 overloaded 3/vomit DSL and cable that's like double the cost for anything above that. And that's if you are lucky, you could be stuck with 14.4K dial-up or satellite ISPs that block XBL and about as fast as Sprint 3G.

 

[TimeEffect]

Let's see:

Halo 5 on an online-locked console?

Or

Bungie's NEW IP, Destiny, on a console that allows me to play games offline and online?

Hmmm

I dont think Halo has staying power to begin with anymore. Call of Duty has absolutely been wrecking any competition, Halo numbers are incredibly low with 4 compared to how 3 was doing. Provided MS doesnt get timed rights to COD outright, I don't see exclusives like Halo being as significant factors. And with MMO/F2P games becoming bigger, next gen is going to be really different in terms of what sells consoles.

Honestly, I wonder the power of Halo and Gears going forward. I feel like Halo 4 and Judgment were a bit overkill, unless the next games are really overhauled like COD4 was.

 

[Tylahedras]

Oh shit! This is going to be amazing! I Hate that they are doing it but I love them for the DRAMA. Can't wait to see if they take over the industry or die in a ball of flames. (I hope the latter)

 

[JDSN]

His twitter is locked, the universe is saved again.

 

[Instro]

We're going in circles now. So what if your Internet goes out occasionally. My electricity goes out all the time. I can't play anything without a battery when that happens. Does that mean I won't buy PS4 or 720 and only play games on laptop and tablets because they have batteries?

So what happens when Microsoft's servers are experiencing issues, you're ok with that preventing you from gaming as well?

 

[JABEE]

Hopefully this bad press will push Microsoft to actually annonce the damn console.

Hopefully it will push them to not make always-online a requirement for their system to play games. I wonder if this is how Microsoft plans to win over third-parties? They offer the most control over content and guarantee that all Xbox users will not only be able to be online and purchase DLC, but it will also limit piracy and make pushing content even easier.

 

[Hero_of_the_Day]

We're going in circles now. So what if your Internet goes out occasionally. My electricity goes out all the time. I can't play anything without a battery when that happens. Does that mean I won't buy PS4 or 720 and only play games on laptop and tablets because they have batteries?

Are you a Microsoft Creative Director?

Right, which has been the point made by myself and few others in here. Nobody knows how MS will implement this. Shit, it hasn't even been confirmed. However, there have been posts saying the console won't work at all offline. That used games wont exist -- even though they could go the EA route. And blah blah blah. So many people have been in here spouting nonsense about something they know nothing about.

Edit: hold on, you are or you are not even happy with a 1 off activation?

The rumor is exactly that...

Personally, I'm torn on the idea of one time activation, mainly because the idea that some day those games will just be gone, whereas I have a couple hundred NES/SNES games I can still play right now. At the end of the day, one time activation/no used games wouldn't stop me from buying the console (if they had the games to draw my attention). Always online would, no matter what games they had.

 

[Omni]

GAF is so melodramatic sometimes.

 

[ironcreed]

You also don't own your toaster and microwave. You bought a license to use it in your kitchen.

Don't forget the Gold subscription. I have to pay a monthly fee just to be able to cook.

 

[JCreasy]

Destiny is a PS4 exclusive? Sony sure are a crafty bunch.

Naw

But apparently they'll have next gen exclusivity for offline playing consoles.

 

[Metroidvania]

We're going in circles now. So what if your Internet goes out occasionally. My electricity goes out all the time. I can't play anything without a battery when that happens. Does that mean I won't buy PS4 or 720 and only play games on laptop and tablets because they have batteries?

Personally, I feel there's a pretty big difference in the regions containing people who would normally buy a console game system in availability of internet and availability of water/electricity. People don't generally tend to live in areas without the latter, but a lot of people have spotty access (that still may work for them most of the time) to the former.

edit: You also have no control over spotty electricity (provided it's not on your end, and the company can only do so much). Microsoft is (at least supposedly) intentionally doing this.

And while it obviously depends on how good/bad your internet is, if for any reason, it goes down (or MS borks something), you can no longer utilize the product you paid for to play singleplayer games which require no online connection to work properly.

People won't remember the times something works like it's supposed to, they'll remember how it doesn't work. And if a PSN-hack level screw-up happens on MS' end with Live, they'll have to make huge reparations/changes.

Not saying that everyone will get up in arms to this level, since not everyone is a relatively informed tech enthusiast. But it seems odd to not be concerned on a consumer level for something like this.

 

[Raven77]

What I cannot fathom is how a company could become so stupid. I've never seen arrogance this bad before, this tops Sony in 2006.

Funny cause Josh and I were talking today and he said the same thing. Sony because full of themselves and arrogant. They shit on the consumer and did what they wanted and now they have seemed to realize the error of their ways and have the appearance of becoming more humble and really seem to want to take care of gamers with the PS4.


Now its MS's turn to fall down on their face, they never learn.

 

[FroJay]

Mandatory online and mandatory Kinect 2.0 as well staring you in the face? Unless MS pulls a miracle PS4 is a lock for me. I don't trust Microsoft in a one console future.
And what is with the arrogance these companies undertake when they become a market leader for a generation or are on top going into the next? Sony learned, apparently MS wants to learn next.