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[maeh2k]

How future proof is the base model?
Is i3 really slow?

As for the i3, Windows runs on way slower hardware and has only gotten faster in the last couple of releases. If you don't need it for CPU-intensive tasks, I'd say it's fine.
The question is, if 64GB is enough. That depends on how you use it. You can still add a 128GB micro SD card, but it won't be as fast as the main drive. Of course, you can also use additional USB drives. It's definitely possible to live with 64GB.

 

[lastflowers]

As for the i3, Windows runs on way slower hardware and has only gotten faster in the last couple of releases. If you don't need it for CPU-intensive tasks, I'd say it's fine.
The question is, if 64GB is enough. That depends on how you use it. You can still add a 128GB micro SD card, but it won't be as fast as the main drive. Of course, you can also use additional USB drives. It's definitely possible to live with 64GB.

with Terry at the helm of the OSGroup, the OS should get less and less demanding. He places an incredibly high priority on keeping performance high on lower cost software. I foresee Windows operating under a similar guideline that WP used.

it's not that the previous group's weren't efficient. More that between A and B, where A does a bit more but costs 40% more CPU cycles.....he'd choose B so that lowercost PCs aren't losing perf and getting a bad experience.

 

[dLMN8R]

with Terry at the helm of the OSGroup, the OS should get less and less demanding. He places an incredibly high priority on keeping performance high on lower cost software. I foresee Windows operating under a similar guideline that WP used.

it's not that the previous group's weren't efficient. More that between A and B, where A does a bit more but costs 40% more CPU cycles.....he'd choose B so that lowercost PCs aren't losing perf and getting a bad experience.

Yeah, the system requirements for Windows haven't increased changed since Vista in 2006. In fact, they've gone down quick a bit, especially recently with the version built for tablets with 16GB storage and 1GB ram.

 

[SerTapTap]

There's never going to be a nice sale on SP2, is there? It's a shame, I don't want 3:2 aspect on a media consumption device.

It doesn't stretch 16:9 content, it letterboxes

 

[CrankyJay]

The surface 3 i5/64gb is on sale at Staples for $699 with free S/H with coupon code 11605. Expires 9/6

http://www.techbargains.com/jump.cfm?id=4740&tb_arg_id=32065

I think you mean i3/64gb. At least that's what the link brought me to.

That's coupon code is for $100 off any computer over $499 so this will work on the other models.

 

[MCD]

with Terry at the helm of the OSGroup, the OS should get less and less demanding. He places an incredibly high priority on keeping performance high on lower cost software. I foresee Windows operating under a similar guideline that WP used.

it's not that the previous group's weren't efficient. More that between A and B, where A does a bit more but costs 40% more CPU cycles.....he'd choose B so that lowercost PCs aren't losing perf and getting a bad experience.

Terry introduced "resuming" tho.

 

[aaaaa0]

Terry introduced "resuming" tho.

"resuming" saves a lot of memory...

 

[The Faceless Master]

There's never going to be a nice sale on SP2, is there? It's a shame, I don't want 3:2 aspect on a media consumption device.

I'm sure there will be. It took a while but I got my Surface Pro 1 for $500 this spring.

 

[AlteredBeast]

I just played with an SP3 at the MS store in Mall of America and it was awesome... I need to buy one now, I think!

 

[hadareud]

Got mine yesterday (i5 128gb) and I love it.

It does get rather hot and battery drains quickly once it does (which seems to happen even with simple things like watching youtube etc.) - haven't checked the thread, but is there a fix on the way?

 

[SerTapTap]

Got mine yesterday (i5 128gb) and I love it.

It does get rather hot and battery drains quickly once it does (which seems to happen even with simple things like watching youtube etc.) - haven't checked the thread, but is there a fix on the way?

Not that Im' aware of, but make sure all the updates are installed. It definitely seems to get excessively hot when doing videos, even 25% processor use pump out a fair amount of heat. But I don't have much to compare it to, still better than my old lenovo X200 tablet, and I know it's not going to compare to my infinitely larger desktop.

Is video performance/heat bad outside of Chrome btw? Chrome seems to give me issues on it, pretty frustrating. The touch scrolling occasionally messes up, sometimes the browser freezes, sometimes it hogs 25% CPU for no reason until I kill and restart chrome. Never had such issues outside of the SP3 either. Thanks to Chrome Sync going to Firefox would be rather hard, too.

 

[jagowar]

Got mine in yesterday too... i3/64. It really is an amazing device.

 

[hadareud]

Not that Im' aware of, but make sure all the updates are installed. It definitely seems to get excessively hot when doing videos, even 25% processor use pump out a fair amount of heat. But I don't have much to compare it to, still better than my old lenovo X200 tablet, and I know it's not going to compare to my infinitely larger desktop.

Is video performance/heat bad outside of Chrome btw? Chrome seems to give me issues on it, pretty frustrating. The touch scrolling occasionally messes up, sometimes the browser freezes, sometimes it hogs 25% CPU for no reason until I kill and restart chrome. Never had such issues outside of the SP3 either. Thanks to Chrome Sync going to Firefox would be rather hard, too.

Yeah it seems that the update they released last night (the one that they'd previously pulled) might have fixed the issue. Haven't yet watched any videos, but did some moving of large files and it stayed nice and cool (and the fan didn't kick in at all).

I've been mostly using the modern version of IE, but when I used Chrome for some Sky Go videos yesterday it definitely caused some heat issues.

Time to switch back to FF.

 

[SerTapTap]

Good to hear the i3 is also of acceptable performance. I hope this sells well, it's not perfect but it seems they've finally nailed what they're trying to do with the Surface. They just need to kill the RT lines and bundle in the typecover, kill touchcovers, and work out the remaining kinks.

Hope heat is the main priority of the next device. It's already thin enough, I really don't care what extra they could shave off of it. Heat, battery and weight will always be important though.

Yeah it seems that the update they released last night (the one that they'd previously pulled) might have fixed the issue. Haven't yet watched any videos, but did some moving of large files and it stayed nice and cool (and the fan didn't kick in at all).

I've been mostly using the modern version of IE, but when I used Chrome for some Sky Go videos yesterday it definitely caused some heat issues.

Time to switch back to FF.

Games and videos are about the only time I've ever had it get hot. It also gets warmer when the battery is charging unsurprisingly, but it's not a huge deal.

I disgust myself for asking, but how's modern IE? I'd have to set IE to default to use it, so I haven't, and non-modern IE's UI isn't all that touch friendly, though it's touch scrolling is vastly superior to Chrome's.

 

[hadareud]

Modern ie is great imo.

I've been using it for a couple of years on the surface rt's and with all the gestures etc. it's really very touch friendly.

No plugins apart from flash of course, but the speed and interface make up for it for me.

But it's only for surfing and watching videos etc, for work and heavy lifting you can't get around using a fully featured desktop browser.

 

[dLMN8R]

Chrome absolutely destroys battery life on my SP3. If I'm just watching videos on the web, I just use Desktop or Modern IE.

Modern IE is great for touch, but I don't use it much on my SP3 since usually I'm using it as a laptop which means I want windows on the desktop.

I just set IE as default but usually launch Chrome for the majority of my browsing.


For watching local videos, most Desktop applications don't do any sort of hardware decoding, which means higher battery drain. Using WMP, Xbox Video, or some third-party app like mobile.HD generally gives me much better battery life.

 

[SerTapTap]

yeah I like desktop mode and my surface is 90% a laptop. I really want that Metro In Desktop update.

 

[hadareud]

Yeah if you're using it as a laptop modern IE isn't ideal.

I mostly use it as a tablet so for me it works nicely.

The reading mode alone is worth it for me. Can't go back to read articles in a normal browser.

 

[SerTapTap]

I guess I'm a weird case, but I use it like a laptop but use touch all the time as possible...but lots of UI elements don't make it easy. I'm amazed at the tiny tough points for jumplists in the task bar for example. I have my DPI settings set to max to help with touchability too. Kinda sad Desktop mode still isn't all that touch friendly even just with basic Windows UI elements, 3rd party stuff at least has an excuse. That's the only thing that makes me like Metro apps, but they just don't do what I need done.

 

[Canon]

Anyone else having headphone problems on this? There's a popping sound and other kinds of unpleasant things occasionally with headphones connected, can be heard when nothing is playing.

 

[ncsuDuncan]

Anyone else having headphone problems on this? There's a popping sound and other kinds of unpleasant things occasionally with headphones connected, can be heard when nothing is playing.

I get that low popping sound too when nothing is playing through the headphones.

 

[SerTapTap]

Anyone cleaned their Typecover yet? I got the grey one and it's showing some water stains or I don't know what here and there, probably because I use it in the kitchen. Just water and a paper towel okay/effective? Talking about the fabric not keys.

Anyone else having headphone problems on this? There's a popping sound and other kinds of unpleasant things occasionally with headphones connected, can be heard when nothing is playing.

Pretty common issue with 3.5 outs really, not sure about the SP3 specifically, but I have to fiddle with volumes on my desktop to make sure I don't get static. Try turning SP3 base volume down but headphone/app volume up if possible? It's usually the baseline volume that causes static.

 

[hadareud]

Water stains, or "water" stains?

 

[DaveH]

Anyone else having headphone problems on this? There's a popping sound and other kinds of unpleasant things occasionally with headphones connected, can be heard when nothing is playing.

I have the issue, but it seems limited to the machine itself. Plugged into the dock, I don't get any issues from the 3.5 mm port on the dock.

 

[Canon]

I have the issue, but it seems limited to the machine itself. Plugged into the dock, I don't get any issues from the 3.5 mm port on the dock.

So it is a common Surface Pro 3 problem it seems like. That really sucks since I use this to record piano music and it's distracting.

My headphones work fine on every other device so there's something wrong with the SP3. I doubt exchanging it will help based on these responses.

 

[Rurunaki]

I'm seriously on the fence when it comes to buying this device. How future proof is it and what are the chances surface 4 will come out very soon?

 

[Canon]

I'm seriously on the fence when it comes to buying this device. How future proof is it and what are the chances surface 4 will come out very soon?

Surface 5 will come out soon after Surface Pro 4, etc. Not even a year goes by without an upgrade.

 

[hadareud]

My battery just died

Get a no battery detected error message. Looks like there's no troubleshooting, MS just tell you to replace it.

To be fair it took about three clicks to arrange the replacement and the advance replacement service is free of charge. Still a shame though.

 

[SerTapTap]

Surface 5 will come out soon after Surface Pro 4, etc. Not even a year goes by without an upgrade.

Surface has been rapidly evolving trying to hit a minimum of quality and acceptance, I think after the SP3 we'll see a more regular, yearly upgrade than we've been seeing previously. In terms of ergonomics and form factor they've pretty much nailed it, just need standard better software and spec bumps at this point, plus whatever little bonuses they can add on as they go. I'd be truly amazed if there were another single jump as big as the SP2->SP3, at least.

As for future proof it's...pretty much the same as any mid-grade laptop, processor speeds have been hilariously stagnant and 8GB RAM is still plenty for most applications (not video editing or extreme photoshoping w the biggest RAW files you can find). It's got an SSD and a perfectly fine processor so speed isn't a huge concern considering form factor. Also, it's about 10x more future proof than an iPad, I can tell you that much. one iOS version and my iPad 3 is already slow as hell.

My battery just died

Get a no battery detected error message. Looks like there's no troubleshooting, MS just tell you to replace it.

To be fair it took about three clicks to arrange the replacement and the advance replacement service is free of charge. Still a shame though.

It's a tablet...there's basically no fixing it. Almost all repairs are "send to MS and they'll send you a new one"

 

[hadareud]

I meant software troubleshooting. It looks like on SP1 & 2 the same error can potentially be a software/driver problem while on SP3 it's a known hardware issue.

 

[TKR92]

Uhh, the top 1/3 of touchscreen does not respond with touch. But I can use the area with the pen.
I did not realize the issue until a couple of days ago, because I used mostly with the pen. Sigh~

Anyways, I will send the unit to replace it.

 

[SerTapTap]

Uhh, the top 1/3 of touchscreen does not respond with touch. But I can use the area with the pen.
I did not realize the issue until a couple of days ago, because I used mostly with the pen. Sigh~

Anyways, I will send the unit to replace it.

did you try and reset calibration? I had a weird phantom touch problem until I did that. Multitouch and pen touch are different hardware anyway though so I wouldn't be surprised if one was broken and not the other.

 

[hadareud]

They've already shipped my replacement and I should receive it tomorrow. It was all very swift and uncomplicated, can't moan about that.

Today I had a chat with them and I told them that the tip of my pen is starting to show wear and they're also sending me 3 replacement tips.

Their customer support is really rather good.

 

[TKR92]

did you try and reset calibration? I had a weird phantom touch problem until I did that. Multitouch and pen touch are different hardware anyway though so I wouldn't be surprised if one was broken and not the other.

Yes. I tried recalibration, Refreshing Windows and what not. But no luck

 

[Chezzymann]

I did a battery report and my surface pro 3 i3's battery only lasts about 4 hours with 40% screen brightness... Now, granted, I usually have like 20 internet explorer tabs open, Photoshop CC, Skype, Spotify, and random programs that I forget to close out like Lego Digital Designer. Is 4 hours normal with that type of usage, or is there something wrong with my battery? I should probably mention that I damaged my charging cable a little, but I quickly wrapped some electric tape around it and it still charges pretty fast to 100%.

 

[markot]

These still all turn into i3s when they run after awhile on battery?

New driver for wacom is out for pro 1 and 2. Gives you a lot of options and improves the fell a bit. Less lag better edge detection.

Called the feel driver.


Microsoft is pretty stupid though. Why release the pro 3 before the better Intel cpu come out? Was demand that high?

 

[Septimus Prime]

Holy smokes! The docking station's sides pull apart so you can snap the SP3 right in!

Previously, I'd be trying to jam it in diagonally like a sucker. I'm glad I didn't break anything.

 

[Pooya]

I did a battery report and my surface pro 3 i3's battery only lasts about 4 hours with 40% screen brightness... Now, granted, I usually have like 20 internet explorer tabs open, Photoshop CC, Skype, Spotify, and random programs that I forget to close out like Lego Digital Designer. Is 4 hours normal with that type of usage, or is there something wrong with my battery? I should probably mention that I damaged my charging cable a little, but I quickly wrapped some electric tape around it and it still charges pretty fast to 100%.

My Surface Pro 1 lasts 4 hours with lots of web, wifi and office usage, so that doesn't look normal. I'm guessing keeping photoshop open is a bad idea.

open task manager to see what process uses the most CPU time when idling and kill it.

 

[Sai]

Holy smokes! The docking station's sides pull apart so you can snap the SP3 right in!

Previously, I'd be trying to jam it in diagonally like a sucker. I'm glad I didn't break anything.

... Yikes.

 

[JaggedSac]

These still all turn into i3s when they run after awhile on battery?

New driver for wacom is out for pro 1 and 2. Gives you a lot of options and improves the fell a bit. Less lag better edge detection.

Called the feel driver.


Microsoft is pretty stupid though. Why release the pro 3 before the better Intel cpu come out? Was demand that high?

There will probably be refreshes in March or April when Threshold launches.

 

[Septimus Prime]

... Yikes.

...yeah. On the bright side, it does work that way, too, albeit not as well.

Anyway, it's been about a month since I ditched f.lux, and my SP3 is still rock solid. It definitely was that that was giving me problems.

 

[Totakeke]

I've been using my SP3 in my classes for more than a week now and it's great. Now I only wish I had a second screen because I can't refer to an e-book and write on it at the same time that well. Maybe I'll try using it horizontally with snap more often.

But yeah, the start button is pretty annoying when taking notes so I turn it with the start button on top when I'm using it vertically starting recently. I do find that the battery life seems insufficient though. Maybe OneNote and Drawboard eats up battery life faster?

 

[MarkusRJR]

Has there been any rumors on a Surface 3 RT? I love my Surface RT but would love an upgrade. Surface Pro 3 is way too expensive for what I'm looking for and I don't want to go iOS or Android.

 

[Irminsul]

After having used my SP3 for a nearly two weeks, I can give a short overview of what I like and what I don't:

Like:

- It's everything I ever wanted from a tablet because it's no fucking tablet. Seriously, I wanted to like tablets. I wanted to like the iPad my parents have but rarely use. I wanted to like the Nexus 10 I sometimes use at my workplace. And yes, I both borrowed them for a prolonged time period but didn't use both after a rather short while. At some point I always ended up at a point where I say "okay, time to get my laptop". And that's stupid. It shouldn't be that way. Not so with the SP3, because…
- …it's also a great laptop. Okay, it could be a bit better suited for gaming, but honestly, most games I play work decently and that's enough for me. For everything else, it's just like my previous laptop. And that's exactly how it should be.
- The combination of both deserves another point. I finally get Windows 8. I even use some Metro apps. Didn't think I'd ever say that just a few weeks ago. Seriously, being able to effortlessly switch between "tablet use" and "laptop use" is great. Yes, the Desktop isn't really well-suited for being used with your fingers, but mine are slender, so that's no problem (most of the time).
- The pen. And OneNote. I just said to me "okay, let's try if I can substitute notepads (actual dead tree notepads) with this." And I can. That's actually surprising to me. It's also great for photo editing, although perhaps I should invest in some good software instead of GIMP where everything semi-works.

Don't like:

- OneNote Metro or OneNote 2013? Sadly, both have their pros and cons, and switching between these is only possible when I have Internet access because sharing of notes works via OneDrive. What the fuck. At least that's what I think is the only way to share stuff. OneNote 2013 can definitely do more things, but OneNote Metro is better suited for being used with a pen. That's stupid.
- The complete different ecosystems Metro apps and programs live in, generally. Yes, you can switch easily between them, but they should be more integrated and not exist nearly independent of each other.
- I can't use Metro IE when it's not the standard program to open websites. WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY.
- The charge LED isn't a charge LED as it's always white. What's so bad about orange and green, MS? Seriously.

Overall, I'm even more happy with it than I thought before. It's not the definition of what a tablet should be because the Desktop is too awkward to use, but it's definitely more than a media consumption device most tablets are (in my opinion). Great device!

 

[SerTapTap]

I've been using my SP3 in my classes for more than a week now and it's great. Now I only wish I had a second screen because I can't refer to an e-book and write on it at the same time that well. Maybe I'll try using it horizontally with snap more often.

But yeah, the start button is pretty annoying when taking notes so I turn it with the start button on top when I'm using it vertically starting recently. I do find that the battery life seems insufficient though. Maybe OneNote and Drawboard eats up battery life faster?

The mini-displayport can connect to another scree if you're talking stationary at home.

I wish the start button were on the left, but I guess maybe left handers would then just have the same problems I do. I kinda wish start button were disabled if the type cover were in active use or something, or have an option to that effect.

Has there been any rumors on a Surface 3 RT? I love my Surface RT but would love an upgrade. Surface Pro 3 is way too expensive for what I'm looking for and I don't want to go iOS or Android.

I dunno about that. They'll probably introduce a third RT with the next iteration of the Surface Pro just to spec bump and include some enhancements, but they're clearly focusing on the Surface Pro line now for good reason. Are there sales on the Surface 2 RT? I've seen refurbed Surface RTs down to $200, almost bought one for shits and giggles, thought RT 2 might hit similar price points at some point.

- It's everything I ever wanted from a tablet because it's no fucking tablet.

So much this. I never touch the iPad anymore and I only use the Nexus 7 when my phone is dead. I can't stand apps, the Surface just does everything I need even with nothing in the windows store. Can't believe it took them this long to focus on this direction, this is exactly what I've wanted since I first used a fat, heavy, expensive Toshiba tablet PC back in 2007. Also, the pen, so glad MS is keeping pens around. Though I hate how anti-portable it is. The pen loop is the worst part of the design by far. Fix the pen and heat and I'll buy another just for that honestly.

Don't like:

- OneNote Metro or OneNote 2013? Sadly, both have their pros and cons, and switching between these is only possible when I have Internet access because sharing of notes works via OneDrive. What the fuck. At least that's what I think is the only way to share stuff. OneNote 2013 can definitely do more things, but OneNote Metro is better suited for being used with a pen. That's stupid.
- The complete different ecosystems Metro apps and programs live in, generally. Yes, you can switch easily between them, but they should be more integrated and not exist nearly independent of each other.
- I can't use Metro IE when it's not the standard program to open websites. WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY.
- The charge LED isn't a charge LED as it's always white. What's so bad about orange and green, MS? Seriously.

Overall, I'm even more happy with it than I thought before. It's not the definition of what a tablet should be because the Desktop is too awkward to use, but it's definitely more than a media consumption device most tablets are (in my opinion). Great device!

Allegedly Win 8 is going to have metro in windows, so your second bullet point should eventually be mostly fixed. Windows 8.1 fixed a hell of a lot more than I ever would have expected, with surprisingly few/little changes, too. I absolutely hated win 8 on my old tablet, now it's...almost entirely better than windows 7...but Metro is still awkward. And what's funny is I like some Metro apps, at least the style, but I have almost no reason to ever use 'em.

The downgrades in Metro Onenote are a big bummer because classic onenote is the best thing MS has ever made IMO, Metro onenote is a bit more convenient but the lacking features are a bit annoying. But I only have ontenote 2007 and no desire to pay for more office, so I'm sticking with Metro now. The IE thing is insane.

I honestly kinda prefer the white charge LED as I never stress over it. But I'm never too worried about battery as it's an at-home device for me. Maybe a "heartbeat" pulse while charging and a solid color when full would be nice yet subtle though.

 

[Irminsul]

And what's funny is I like some Metro apps, at least the style, but I have almost no reason to ever use 'em.

I actually use a few, even though I never thought it'd be more than you do, admiring the style.

There's a public transport app for Germany that's pretty handy when you quickly want to check when the next bus arrives. I use another app to check petrol prices. I really like Hyper for YouTube, its user interface is clearly better than that damn ever-changing website. And finally, Xbox Music is great when I want to stream music via DLNA, because there's finally an option via the "Devices" charm that's as simple as using AirPlay via iTunes. I can even scrobble to Last.fm with Duet while streaming which is really great.

 

[SerTapTap]

Youtube apps would be wonderful, but I actually made videos for Youtube so I really do need the site, so I never touch apps for it.

The sad thing is the apps I miss most for Win 8 are Google apps. Google Now live tiles would be amazing, some sort of voice assistant would be nice too--is Cortana planned for desktop windows too? And a real google calendar would be great, I have to use this weird hack and make my calendar public to use it in the Metro app. All my photos are in Google + (it's actually great for photos) since my phone backs up to there, and a Google Voice app would be great because all my texts go through there.

Speaking of, are there any good Live Tile apps? I love the idea but I don't use any at all but the weather and calendar ones.

 

[LukasTaves]

The mini-displayport can connect to another scree if you're talking stationary at home.

I wish the start button were on the left, but I guess maybe left handers would then just have the same problems I do. I kinda wish start button were disabled if the type cover were in active use or something, or have an option to that effect.



I dunno about that. They'll probably introduce a third RT with the next iteration of the Surface Pro just to spec bump and include some enhancements, but they're clearly focusing on the Surface Pro line now for good reason. Are there sales on the Surface 2 RT? I've seen refurbed Surface RTs down to $200, almost bought one for shits and giggles, thought RT 2 might hit similar price points at some point.



So much this. I never touch the iPad anymore and I only use the Nexus 7 when my phone is dead. I can't stand apps, the Surface just does everything I need even with nothing in the windows store. Can't believe it took them this long to focus on this direction, this is exactly what I've wanted since I first used a fat, heavy, expensive Toshiba tablet PC back in 2007. Also, the pen, so glad MS is keeping pens around. Though I hate how anti-portable it is. The pen loop is the worst part of the design by far. Fix the pen and heat and I'll buy another just for that honestly.



Allegedly Win 8 is going to have metro in windows, so your second bullet point should eventually be mostly fixed. Windows 8.1 fixed a hell of a lot more than I ever would have expected, with surprisingly few/little changes, too. I absolutely hated win 8 on my old tablet, now it's...almost entirely better than windows 7...but Metro is still awkward. And what's funny is I like some Metro apps, at least the style, but I have almost no reason to ever use 'em.

The downgrades in Metro Onenote are a big bummer because classic onenote is the best thing MS has ever made IMO, Metro onenote is a bit more convenient but the lacking features are a bit annoying. But I only have ontenote 2007 and no desire to pay for more office, so I'm sticking with Metro now. The IE thing is insane.

I honestly kinda prefer the white charge LED as I never stress over it. But I'm never too worried about battery as it's an at-home device for me. Maybe a "heartbeat" pulse while charging and a solid color when full would be nice yet subtle though.

I can't wait to see how more capable W9 metro apps will be. Hopefully they will have capability to completely replace desktop apps bar anti viruses and others that require lower system level.

Oh, and Onenote is free now, on all platforms! Even the 2013 desktop version.

 

[SerTapTap]

I can't get excited for metro apps "replacing" anything. I do too much with the file system, play too many games and do too much editing for a one-app-at-a-time thing to ever work well for me I think. Will be interesting to see how much w9 improves things though. I mostly want improvements to make Desktop work better for touch (and games) than I want improvements to Metro. There's a reason I use this instead of an iPad and it's not metro.

Oh I figured only Metro onenote was free, I'll have to try that out then.

 

[Septimus Prime]

Supposedly Cortana is going to arrive in Windows 9 sometime in the future. I probably wouldn't hold my breath for seeing it before 9.1 or something, though. It's in the same "future feature" list as active live tiles. Hopefully 9 itself will be a free upgrade from 8.1 or at least for SP3 users. I'm still miffed that SP2 comes with Office while SP3 doesn't. It makes NO sense at all to me how MS's $1500 flagship device doesn't have Office.

I almost never enter the Start screen. Like with Windows 7, I just pin almost everything I use and then just hit the Windows key and start typing when I need something else. I never touch charms, either, so I'm not going to miss them when they're gone.

As for OneNote, what are the differences between the desktop and metro versions? I just use the metro, since I mostly use the pen to take notes.