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Mother warns gun store about schizophrenic daughter. They ignore her. Tragedy ensues.
- Thread starter Makonero
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JetBlackPanda
Member
yeah I'm sure an Arab man would have no problems in your store.
Mattlikewhoa
Member
Jesus... At what point does it not become okay to sell someone a handgun?!
This could have been avoided, but nope... They wanted to make that sale.
This could have been avoided, but nope... They wanted to make that sale.
lvl99 Pixel
Member
where do you draw that line?
Uhh certainly well before "diagnosed schizophrenic"?
You draw the line at mental wellness. Obviously. If you have any sort of prior history with mental illnesses, you don't get a gun. Granted, I personally believe guns shouldn't be sold *at all*, apart from hunting rifles, obviously.
John Kowalski
Banned
That's what doctors are for.
Even before getting there, a history of gun suicide attempts should be enough to deny someone a gun.
lvl99 Pixel
Member
any at all? so if someones dealt with minor depression for example, theyre excluded entirely from having the same rights as everyone else?
I also dont think guns should be sold this way, but you're throwing everyone into one trashcan at once if you think mental illness is something you can define so simply and fairly. Branding everyone who has dealt with mental health issues as being a potential killer is a horrible standard and keeps the shitty stigma right where it is.
there is no precedent afaik, which is why im asking.
Unfortunately I think that would lead to even more people never getting any help due to fear of losing their guns. Even those with mild depression or anxiety.
You asked a question, the reply was "it should be decided by the actual experts in the field", inquiring further is pointless.
Ideally, the government would work it out carefully with leading field experts to draw the line.
lvl99 Pixel
Member
im asking the users who seem to have decided that mental wellness is just a black and white scenario. Obviously I cant ask "actual experts" here now can I.
Like im interested to know if people here think that someone stable but on antidepressants should be denied
OG_Original Gamer
Member
If you give me a name, that is connected to a phone call, providing information on the mental state of a potential buyer and buyer shows up. I'm not going to sell the gun, there's something seriously wrong with a person that doesn't mind being a part of a murder, although indirectly, its involvement non the less. It's similar to what George W said, "sometimes money trumps piece".
Yep. The amendment needs to go.
So? The purpose of the 2nd amendment is to protect your ability to murder and it works as intended. Granted the founding fathers only thought we'd be murdering run away slaves..
oneils
Member
I think it was settled out of court and all the court did was agree that the mother could sue.
Because the gun makers write those laws in the US. There was a New Yorker article a while back that covered how this ended up happening. Don't remember which issue but I'm sure you can search for it.
Eppy Thatcher
God's had his chance.
Obvious slippery slope and all that aside -
I think the potential dangers of relapse, going off meds for a multitude of reasons, the potential for other latent issues to due with meds (crossing/side effects), the need for continued care and such that isn't always easy or cheap to come by make it a very tricky hill to die on in this debate. Yes you don't want to discriminate against people because of a mental illness but do you make them prove they are on their meds? Do you check in with them regularly? who does that? certainly not the gun store...
At a time when it seems that basically any-fucking-body can buy a gun on a whim it doesn't seem so terrible to throw a blanket over "mental illness" in it's entirety as maybe not the best candidates to sell a glock to... ya know?
But god... what a fuckin tricky conversation to have in this country. What must it be like to actually be scared of your kids like that? So sad.
sturgboski
Member
Thank God Republicans repealed that bill keeping guns from those with mental disabilities. And yes I recognize that since she handled her own economic affairs she wouldn't have been flagged. However, point still stands: we need gun regulation. The 2nd amendment conflicts with the leading mandate of the Constitution regarding life, liberty and pursuit of happiness which mass gun ownership impedes. But thank God we have no evidence because the NRA has ensured Congress won't fund CDC to research it.
Gentleman Jack
Member
I'd like to think that in an ideal world, previous attempts at suicide by firearm would supersede any nondiscrimination requirements that a gun shop owner in this situation would face.
But that's probably not the world I live in.
But that's probably not the world I live in.
I'm angrier at the agencies, and cultural and legal environment the country is in than the gun store. She could easily have gone to another store or bought online. Blame the NRA and the second amendment. Blame the broken health care system. Unless the whole thing is fixed, this would still have happened I think.
Fucked up regardless. That poor woman.
Fucked up regardless. That poor woman.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Mr.Shrugglesツ;231598609 said:
That's all we needed to know. Gun Shop owner was undoubtedly well versed in these legalities. He simply chose the sale over being responsible and here we are now. I bet he doesn't feel a hint of responsibility.
It certainly should be. As Dead Man said, the system failed her along with the gun shop owner. But in the end, the gun shop owner was where the buck stops and instead of using his better judgment, he went with greed.
RecRoulette
Member
Was expecting suicide, but that's much much worse. Terrible.
Another win for the NRA.
Really glad she won I have no idea why some of these gun people value this freedom in the hands of those who should not wield it.
Its like giving a murderous alcoholic a shit-ton of alcohol simply because they are of legal age... Very unfortunate that we have to deal with this. My state, Florida, is giving even more leeway to stand your ground laws so peeps like Zimmerman can stay safe in the face of hooded children.
Really glad she won I have no idea why some of these gun people value this freedom in the hands of those who should not wield it.
Its like giving a murderous alcoholic a shit-ton of alcohol simply because they are of legal age... Very unfortunate that we have to deal with this. My state, Florida, is giving even more leeway to stand your ground laws so peeps like Zimmerman can stay safe in the face of hooded children.
User Name Here
Member
I wonder if this would've happened if Death with Dignity was a thing. People would have the option of dying peacefully via a special procedure if they're sick with an illness that has no cure.
lvl99 Pixel
Member
Afaik from what a quick search tells me, 10% of USA population would instantly be barred from owning guns, because thats how many people take antidepressants.
Even if the statistics showed that the mentally ill are more likely to shoot people (they dont, far from it) it doesn't make sense to just label such a wide array of people as potential murderers.
African American homicide rates are higher, while white people use their guns proportionally more for suicide, but thats no reason to say "dont sell guns to black people" or "whites are just going to kill themselves".
Its far more complicated than just banning a huge group of people based on fear alone, which just makes everyone look bad.
Last time this kind of thread appeared people were calling all trump supporters mentally ill, which is really fun for people who actually suffer from this shit to be compared to so flippantly...
I didn't blame this on Trump. I noted that Trump's administration is going to mean this happens more often, because they don't see this as a problem.
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