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[Explosive Zombie]

Narrows down the field, now there's more chances it'll be Half-Life 3, right guys?

 

[kyliethicc]

I posted on the other thread, but I'll post it here too since it's on topic. A little spec comparison between both consoles based on what they seem to be:

                PS5 |  XSX
CUs              36 |  52                +44%
GPU Clock   2.23Ghz |  1.83Ghz           -18%
ROPs             64 |  64                +0%
TMUs           144? |  208?              +45%?
Bandwidth   448GB/s | 560GB/s (optimal)  +25%
Str.Prcs.      2304 | 3328               +45%

A few things I'd like to say:

- We don't know how well performance scales with clocks on RDNA 2. But from what we see on modern GPUs there are some things which have a good uplift with higher clocks, others not so much.
- I think both consoles will be bandwidth starved, so probably we won't have that many games in 4K especially after 3 years or so. I could be wrong though.
- XSX GPU is obviously stronger, not as in 5% but actually a significant amount (I'd say 20%+ especially if it has 80 ROPs. At 64 maybe not that much). Then again, we still don't know what Sony has done with PS5, we do know there are custom HW parts but what are they?
- From what we've heard from devs and insiders (which could pretty much be bullshit anyway) PS5 is the more efficient system due to its insane I/O speed, considering this is true the gap could be less than theorical numbers seem to show.

you got the bandwidth wrong.

 

[azertydu91]

I feel underappreciated, I think I contributed a fair amount to the list.

Do you want a fud poster list? Maybe a tier list ?With points aawarded based on just false rumors that could be in good faith to biased FUD and the most points about being a fake insider/dev wiiligfully spreading FUD .... and bonus multiplicator when any of those terms are used : Ponies, Xbots,Sonygaf etc ....

 

[Wraith Phantom]

Next week is going to be a game fest. The games are coming lads.

 

[SportsFan581]

Do you want a fud poster list? Maybe a tier list ?With points aawarded based on just false rumors that could be in good faith to biased FUD and the most points about being a fake insider/dev wiiligfully spreading FUD .... and bonus multiplicator when any of those terms are used : Ponies, Xbots,Sonygaf etc ....

Sounds fair. Though I do think dramatics and storytelling should also be weighted in the final score. I need some points to make up for TimDog out scoring me so badly on brashness.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

I like how you quote certain pieces, but not the main ones, of what I said.

My original text:



What this meant is clearly at this time, we have no idea what is going on with Ps5, as it's RDNA feature set is yet to be confirmed. You same idiots have been taking about RDNA 3 for ages.



Come on guys, play the game here, use your heads. The number after isn't actually important. What it DOES, it's feature set, is what defines it. At this stage in time, we have absolutely nothing concrete on several prominent features, and as such, we can't compare to them.

I swear, you people love a little bit of controversy. PS5 could be RDNA 1, it could be RDNA 17.6. Who gives a shit What they call it. It can officially be called RDNA 2 without certain features, and this is what we need to know; what is missing, and what's been changed. Stop putting so much focus on the number, it doesn't actually matter.

Edit: as a side note, if Sony came out and said "yes, we are using RDNA 1.5", but the feature set of this was vastly superior to that of xboxes RDNA 2, would that be an issue? Or would you suddenly realise that that this is all pathetic and stop being complete and total tits? Just a thought.

 

[Vaztu]

I feel underappreciated, I think I contributed a fair amount to the list.

You are nothing compared to the legends.

Sadly, most of them moved to twitter due to our Mod's Spartan Rage.

 

[azertydu91]

Sounds fair. Though I do think dramatics and storytelling should also be weighted in the final score. I need some points to make up for TimDog out scoring me so badly on brashness.

You would need to seriously step up your game to beat Timdog but whatever you'll try you can't beat misterxmedia.
He basically created a Gaf surogate spreading more fud than it is humanly possible beating Timdog is like thinking you finished the game when in fact you just beat the tutorial.

 

[Killer Sakoman]

I like how you quote certain pieces, but not the main ones, of what I said.

My original text:



What this meant is clearly at this time, we have no idea what is going on with Ps5, as it's RDNA feature set is yet to be confirmed. You same idiots have been taking about RDNA 3 for ages.



Come on guys, play the game here, use your heads. The number after isn't actually important. What it DOES, it's feature set, is what defines it. At this stage in time, we have absolutely nothing concrete on several prominent features, and as such, we can't compare to them.

I swear, you people love a little bit of controversy. PS5 could be RDNA 1, it could be RDNA 17.6. Who gives a shit What they call it. It can officially be called RDNA 2 without certain features, and this is what we need to know; what is missing, and what's been changed. Stop putting so much focus on the number, it doesn't actually matter.

What defines RDNA2 is performance per watt not features. Thus both consoles are full RDNA2.

 

[geordiemp]

I like how you quote certain pieces, but not the main ones, of what I said.

My original text:



What this meant is clearly at this time, we have no idea what is going on with Ps5, as it's RDNA feature set is yet to be confirmed. You same idiots have been taking about RDNA 3 for ages.



Come on guys, play the game here, use your heads. The number after isn't actually important. What it DOES, it's feature set, is what defines it. At this stage in time, we have absolutely nothing concrete on several prominent features, and as such, we can't compare to them.

I swear, you people love a little bit of controversy. PS5 could be RDNA 1, it could be RDNA 17.6. Who gives a shit What they call it. It can officially be called RDNA 2 without certain features, and this is what we need to know; what is missing, and what's been changed. Stop putting so much focus on the number, it doesn't actually matter.

Edit: as a side note, if Sony came out and said "yes, we are using RDNA 1.5", but the feature set of this was vastly superior to that of xboxes RDNA 2, would that be an issue? Or would you suddenly realise that that this is all pathetic and stop being complete and total tits? Just a thought.

A quake modder, we dont believe a word you say. And drop the term dev stuff please, you have not made any game and will never.

You did enough damage hounding that poor Sony developer who has a real job, and getting him in trouble by your fake persona and luring him into your trap.

And who is the tit ? Have you seen any UFOs lately ?

 

[Gavin Stevens]

What defines RDNA2 is performance per watt not features. Thus both consoles are full RDNA2.

Perf per watt is absolutely one, but not the only defining feature. Hardware RT and VRS are also large parts of it, as well as being on 7nm+. We already know that Ps5 uses 7nm zen2*, so it shouldn't be in theory, however that's not a rule when you're making it custom like this. Xbox is on what they call 7nm enhanced, and I would imagine Sony would do the same.

* again, at this moment, this is all we know.

This is exactly why I didn't compare the two and said we need more info, because we just don't know for sure what's going on.

edit: listen, I'll just back the hell back out of this toxic dump of a thread. You guys do what you need. Enjoy.

 

[geordiemp]

Perf per watt is absolutely one, but not the only defining feature. Hardware RT and VRS are also large parts of it, as well as being on 7nm+. We already know that Ps5 uses 7nm zen2, so it shouldn't be in theory, however that's not a rule when you're making it custom like this. Xbox is on what they call 7nm enhanced, and I would imagine Sony would do the same.

You know nothing about semiconductor hardware so why are you pretending to know this stuff ?

Do you know what Litho is, do you know about Finfet, do you know critical ALD and high K gates ? Have you ever been to TSMC ? No

Probably looking for aliens again. Coo Cooo

 

[Mr Moose]

PS5 could be RDNA 1

No, it couldn't.

 

[saintjules]

Next week is going to be a game fest. The games are coming lads.

 

[geordiemp]

No, it couldn't.

At least timdog was funny and more honest.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

IMO: 7nm "enhanced" is just 7nm "P" with another year+ of maturity over the process used for the 5700. Or marketing/PR if you like.

 

[geordiemp]

Perf per watt is absolutely one, but not the only defining feature. Hardware RT and VRS are also large parts of it, as well as being on 7nm+. We already know that Ps5 uses 7nm zen2*, so it shouldn't be in theory, however that's not a rule when you're making it custom like this. Xbox is on what they call 7nm enhanced, and I would imagine Sony would do the same.

* again, at this moment, this is all we know.

This is exactly why I didn't compare the two and said we need more info, because we just don't know for sure what's going on.

edit: listen, I'll just back the hell back out of this toxic dump of a thread. You guys do what you need. Enjoy.

See ya, come back when you make a game, which will be never, and thanks for the RDNA1 FUD

If you want to know more about Semiconductor fabrication I will be happy to explain but I know your not technical so I dont expect you to ask.

 

[sircaw]

Perf per watt is absolutely one, but not the only defining feature. Hardware RT and VRS are also large parts of it, as well as being on 7nm+. We already know that Ps5 uses 7nm zen2*, so it shouldn't be in theory, however that's not a rule when you're making it custom like this. Xbox is on what they call 7nm enhanced, and I would imagine Sony would do the same.

* again, at this moment, this is all we know.

This is exactly why I didn't compare the two and said we need more info, because we just don't know for sure what's going on.

edit: listen, I'll just back the hell back out of this toxic dump of a thread. You guys do what you need. Enjoy.

I have a serious non-technical question for you

Do you follow these guys blu nogroho and misterxmedia on twitter?

 

[azertydu91]

See ya, come back when you make a game, which will be never, and thanks for the RDNA1 FUD

If you want to know more about Semiconductor fabrication I will be happy to explain.

When proven wrong just call everyone toxic ....It's like playing chess with a pidgeon no matter what you'll do, it will shit on the board and act like he won.... So fitting after all those pidgeons.

 

[geordiemp]

I have a serious non-technical question for you

Do you follow these guys blu nogroho and misterxmedia on twitter?

He is insider, the alter ego of MisterXmedia, coo coo

 

[Darklor01]

I would love to know all possibilities of what RDNA2 supports so I can understand what Full RDNA2 actually is. I haven't seen a list from AMD.

I just think without a proper list of what defines "Full RDNA2" from AMD, any claim to it is speculative at best.

 

[sircaw]

You know nothing about semiconductor hardware so why are you pretending to know this stuff ?

Do you know what Litho is, do you know about Finfet, do you know critical ALD and high K gates ? Have you ever been to TSMC ? No

Probably looking for aliens again. Coo Cooo

Consider your self lucky Geordie, i was about to put you in your place, but i decided, na not tonight.

I don't get out of bed for no less than 300 an hour.

I said out, out of bed fs

 

[MasterCornholio]

No more pigeons I had enough of them!!!!!!

 

[Gavin Stevens]

I have a serious non-technical question for you

Do you follow these guys blu nogroho and misterxmedia on twitter?

I do, for the same reason I follow Trump. For laughs. I don't take them seriously, but I like to see what's said.

Same reason I come here, actually.I enjoy a lot of you guys, but some of you need help.

 

[kyliethicc]

This is exactly why I didn't compare the two and said we need more info, because we just don't know for sure what's going on.

We actually do know they're both custom RDNA 2 + Zen 2. Just like both current gen are custom GCN + Jaguar.

AMD, Sony, and Microsoft have been quite clear about this.

 

[geordiemp]

I would love to know all possibilities of what RDNA2 supports so I can understand what Full RDNA2 actually is. I haven't seen a list from AMD.

I just think with a proper list of what defines "Full RDNA2" from AMD, any claim to it is speculative at best.

Its a marketing term, AMD use it for both node and logic changes between the last releases vs new and is used quite loosely.....

Fabs at TSMC will use litho which is either DUV and EUV for critical layers, so not each one, only a few. They can call it RDNA2 if its AMD, or 7nm, or 7nm +, 7nm enhanced.

 

[sircaw]

I do, for the same reason I follow Trump. For laughs. I don't take them seriously, but I like to see what's said.

Same reason I come here, actually.I enjoy a lot of you guys, but some of you need help.

It's not a good look to your credibility. i am sure you know that.
Lie with dogs you get flee's.

Those two cretins are the worst of the worse in spreading fud.

 

[Killer Sakoman]

Perf per watt is absolutely one, but not the only defining feature. Hardware RT and VRS are also large parts of it, as well as being on 7nm+. We already know that Ps5 uses 7nm zen2*, so it shouldn't be in theory, however that's not a rule when you're making it custom like this. Xbox is on what they call 7nm enhanced, and I would imagine Sony would do the same.

* again, at this moment, this is all we know.

This is exactly why I didn't compare the two and said we need more info, because we just don't know for sure what's going on.

edit: listen, I'll just back the hell back out of this toxic dump of a thread. You guys do what you need. Enjoy.

Ok

I am celebrating my favorite team winning the UCL with PS5 in the background. So I don't have time to waste. May talk later.

 

[SportsFan581]

You would need to seriously step up your game to beat Timdog but whatever you'll try you can't beat misterxmedia.
He basically created a Gaf surogate spreading more fud than it is humanly possible beating Timdog is like thinking you finished the game when in fact you just beat the tutorial.

They are the masters, I can only watch and learn. Must be nice getting the twitter responses from Xbox brass.

 

[Darklor01]

Its a marketing term, AMD use it for both node and logic changes between the last releases new and is used quite loosely.....

Fabs at TSMC will use litho which is either DUV and EUV for critical layers, so not each one, only a few. They can call it RDNA2 if its AMD, or 7nm, or 7nm +, 7nm enhanced.

Right, but the question boils down to, what gives any company the ability to say its use is full RDNA2... implying other company's use isn't?

 

[yewles1]

stopped at 52 points. There was just too much. It is never-ending, sometimes it feels that the fud was coming out fast than i could write it down, and i pasted and copied a lot, so that's saying something.

I asked some of the xbox fans to make their own list but well they just left the thread.

Just imagine if we keep updating it till the actual release of the console.

Might of got to 200 points lol.

A point for each XSX CU.

 

[geordiemp]

Right, but the question boils down to, what gives any company the ability to say its use is full RDNA2... implying other company's use isn't?

Because its a node as well, and at 50 % Perf / watt improvement and logic changes so higher frequencies are coming for RDNA2 than RDNA1.

So lets say RDNA1 5700 is about 1.9 Ghz right ?

So we would expect RDNA2 to clock up to 2.2 or 2.3 Ghz for same power and bottlenecks have been removed that restricted rdna1 propagation.

So Ps5 at 2,23 Ghz sure is on that node, Lets wait for pC parts, I also expect them to be 2.1 Ghz (size dependent, as ps5 is 36 CU its going to be on the faster end of teh RDNA2 range)

XSX is a lower frequency than 5700, maybe as its server application design ?

 

[roops67]

It's all fun and immersive until someone thinks their trigger got stuck and breaks the mechanism trying to get it to move

LoL I doubt it will break like that. From what I understand it will be different levels of squeeze that can be set at different points through the travel range of the triggers, nothing like a dead stop. So could imagine for a successful firing of bullet there will be resistance near the beginning of the trigger travel and then a release of resistance when gun is fired with a jolt from the haptics, as for a stuck barrel there will be full resistance through the whole travel of the trigger

 

[azertydu91]

Its a marketing term, AMD use it for both node and logic changes between the last releases new and is used quite loosely.....

Fabs at TSMC will use litho which is either DUV and EUV for critical layers, so not each one, only a few. They can call it RDNA2 if its AMD, or 7nm, or 7nm +, 7nm enhanced.

Nah Ps5 is GCN not RDNA2 not even RDNA1 you can believe me, I developped a small C++ game in computing school.
I never would've thought it would be more than a lot of "insiders" but here we are.
I can also tell you that the ps5 doesn't overheat ... it simply just explodes I heard from a very reliable racist uncle that it was sony's revenge after Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

It 's all a conspiracy they're all comploting about that RDNA 2, It was obvious all along add all the letters and you get 333 then multiply by 2 because it's RDNA 2 and you have 666. Add those numbers and you get 18 add those again and you get 9 .....9 LIke in 9 TF.
In conclusion of my FUD talk I'll just conclude by not saying it's the illuminati ... but it's them.

 

[azertydu91]

They are the masters, I can only watch a learn. Must be nice getting the twitter responses from Xbox brass.

I heard that even Satya Nadella bow to them, out of respect.

 

[sircaw]

Right be good people, don't want to come back tomorrow and see blood everywhere, mind you in the water that's ok, unless you on a period, that's a big fucking no.

Sweet dreams angels
Dark angels, she was hot aghh. tomorrow is another day.

apparently your taller when you wake up in the morning after a long sleep,

Perhaps think about hibernating yewles1

 

[SportsFan581]

I heard that even Satya Nadella bow to them, out of respect.

Amazing. Might have to start using Twitter other than just following people. I guess I'll have to start posting "my truth" directly on every Sony twitter feed to get noticed? Not sure how I'd get started with that.

 

[kyliethicc]

I would love to know all possibilities of what RDNA2 supports so I can understand what Full RDNA2 actually is. I haven't seen a list from AMD.

I just think without a proper list of what defines "Full RDNA2" from AMD, any claim to it is speculative at best.

Its because the feature set is maleable. Cerny knows this, Lisa Su knows this, everyone gets this except Xbox fanboys.

There is no such thing as "full RDNA2" because even the PC GPUs will lack some of the console customizations. "Full" is theoretical and flawed in premise.

A true full RDNA2 would be if all the features and tweaks of the PS5, XSX, and AMD 6000 GPUs were magically combined into 1 unity GPU. Never gonna happen.

Its a chicken + egg thing for some I guess. Sony & Microsoft both work with AMD PC architecture to form their consoles, which then influences the AMD PC parts. Its a cycle.

Cerny even told everyone on stage, if you see a graphics card from AMD someday that resembles the PS5, thats because they liked our customizations and used it, because we collaborate. But some of the customizations are just for us. Some of that feature set is used by all. These custom consoles don't just use stock PC CPU/GPU feature sets.

AMD already has their ideas for RDNA2 before, then they collab, and all influence each other. Thats why its not even true to say "PS5/XSX has some stuff from RDNA 3" or whatever, because RDNA 3 is going to be formed later on, partially by incorporating custom stuff from one/both of the consoles. If anything, its the other way around.

 

[geordiemp]

Nah Ps5 is GCN not RDNA2 not even RDNA1 you can believe me, I developped a small C++ game in computing school.
I never would've thought it would be more than a lot of "insiders" but here we are.
I can also tell you that the ps5 doesn't overheat ... it simply just explodes I heard from a very reliable racist uncle that it was sony's revenge after Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

It 's all a conspiracy they're all comploting about that RDNA 2, It was obvious all along add all the letters and you get 333 then multiply by 2 because it's RDNA 2 and you have 666. Add those numbers and you get 18 add those again and you get 9 .....9 LIke in 9 TF.
In conclusion of my FUD talk I'll just conclude by not saying it's the illuminati ... but it's them.

I remember writing games in assembler before C++ was around you young wipper snapper.

 

[HAL-01]

Breaking: 1 man game studio with no games and no CS knowledge tries to convince you their take on gpu microarchitecture is Very Relevant, calls everyone an idiot and bounces as soon as theres pushback

 

[azertydu91]

Amazing. Might have to start using Twitter other than just following people. I guess I'll have to start posting "my truth" directly on every Sony twitter feed to get noticed? Not sure how I'd get started with that.

Just do what I just did write everything that is on your mind, bullshit the numbers (like RDNA would add up to 333even worse I don't even know the result why would I?)then assume that everybody disagreeing with you is either dumb, toxic or paid (if you feel daring on twitter you can also say homophobic, racist or sexist).Then boom insider,it works for every side Xbox or playstation.

 

[Killer Sakoman]

Because its a node as well, and at 50 % Perf / watt improvement and logic changes so higher frequencies are coming for RDNA2 than RDNA1.

So lets say RDNA1 5700 is about 1.9 Ghz right ?

So we would expect RDNA2 to clock up to 2.2 or 2.3 Ghz for same power and bottlenecks have been removed that restricted rdna1 propagation.

So Ps5 at 2,23 Ghz sure is on that node, Lets wait for pC parts, I also expect them to be 2.1 Ghz (size dependent, as ps5 is 36 CU its going to be on the faster end of teh RDNA2 range)

XSX is a lower frequency than 5700, maybe as its server application design ?

Anyway, it doesn't matter if it's RDNA 1 or 4. One of the companies is very proud of their GPU and are expecting AMD to copy their design in desktop gpus. They likely engineered something better than what AMD have.

 

[geordiemp]

Its because the feature set is maleable. Cerny knows this, Lisa Su knows this, everyone gets this except Xbox fanboys.

There is no such thing as "full RDNA2" because even the PC GPUs will lack some of the console customizations. "Full" is theoretical and flawed in premise.

A true full RDNA2 would be if all the features and tweaks of the PS5, XSX, and AMD 6000 GPUs were magically combined into 1 unity GPU. Never gonna happen.

Its a chicken + egg thing for some I guess. Sony & Microsoft both work with AMD PC architecture to form their consoles, which then influences the AMD PC parts. Its a cycle.

Cerny even told everyone on stage, if you see a graphics card from AMD someday that resembles the PS5, thats because they liked our customizations and used it, because we collaborate. But some of the customizations are just for us. Some of that feature set is used by all. These custom consoles don't just use stock PC CPU/GPU feature sets.

AMD already has their ideas for RDNA2 before, then they collab, and all influence each other. Thats why its not even true to say "PS5/XSX has some stuff from RDNA 3" or whatever, because RDNA 3 is going to be formed later on, partially by incorporating custom stuff from one/both of the consoles. If anything, its the other way around.

The fact that some argue about full RDNA2 shows they do not understand hardware, its clear. And is often the case, they dont really want to.

Now RDNA2 can also refer to logic blcoks in the PC silicon to some posters, which is not released yet, consoles were first. And lets face it, these are APUs anyway.

What matters is how well the slicon performs in running typical game code which is what it is designed to do. Each console maker will have slighly different view on that.

 

[SportsFan581]

Just do what I just did write everything that is on your mind, bullshit the numbers (like RDNA would add up to 333even worse I don't even know the result why would I?)then assume that everybody disagreeing with you is either dumb, toxic or paid (if you feel daring on twitter you can also say homophobic, racist or sexist).Then boom insider,it works for every side Xbox or playstation.

I'm taking notes on all of this.

 

[azertydu91]

I remember writing games in assembler before C++ was around you young wipper snapper.

Yep I'm young .... and yet I find some "devs" childish. That's a bit sad actually.

 

[Imtjnotu]

didnt think id come in here to see gavin talking his shit first hand.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Honestly there's two things that Cerny said they stood out to me.

1. It's custom RDNA2
2. The CUs are RDNA2 CUs

Everything else is up to debate since features are added or removed depending on whet Sonys goals are.

 

[azertydu91]

I'm taking notes on all of this.

Dude with that attitude you'll never even reach them.Why on earth would you have a sense of humor when you can be (the holy grail of everything) offended ominous ghospel.

 

[yewles1]

Right, but the question boils down to, what gives any company the ability to say its use is full RDNA2... implying other company's use isn't?

This might answer it somewhat.

AMD Sheds Light on the Missing "+" in "7nm" for Zen 3 and RDNA2 in its Latest Presentation

AMD at its Financial Analyst Day 2020 presentation made a major clarification about its silicon fabrication process. It was previously believed that the company's upcoming "Zen 3" CPU microarchitecture and RDNA2 graphics architectures were based on TSMC's N7+ (7 nm EUV) silicon fabrication...

www.techpowerup.com

 

[geordiemp]

This might answer it somewhat.

AMD Sheds Light on the Missing "+" in "7nm" for Zen 3 and RDNA2 in its Latest Presentation

AMD at its Financial Analyst Day 2020 presentation made a major clarification about its silicon fabrication process. It was previously believed that the company's upcoming "Zen 3" CPU microarchitecture and RDNA2 graphics architectures were based on TSMC's N7+ (7 nm EUV) silicon fabrication...

www.techpowerup.com

Its critical layer EUV around the gates, some AMD slide said partial EUV, but how many layers around the FINFET will be a close TSMC secret for sure. You will never find out.