Petrae
Member
This number is within 10K for PS3.
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NPD June 2012 Results [Up1: Microsoft/Nintendo Hardware, Lego Batman 2, Lollipop]
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
This number is within 10K for PS3.
metalslimer
Member
What I was getting at is that people seem to come with the notion that because it has a library of games you like the library is good. Vita's first year library has actually been very good in terms of quality, but when looking at in sales perspective the Vita's first year is pretty terrible. Contrast this with the 3DS that just had very little released in general but stuff like Ocarina of Time 3D is probably a bigger system seller than almost the entire Vita library so far.
Sony wishes its other initiatives would fail like Move did.
Trouble is, the handhelds are brand new. I can accept the consoles sucking wind at this point, but the handhelds ought to be selling.
metalslimer
Member
Well Nintendo has yet to release its surefire handheld seller in Pokemon and its clear why Vita isn't selling. I think another year is really needed to look at the dedicated handheld market as a whole and see a big problem
Edit: I actually think some other company will easily take Sony's place in the dedicated handheld market. Perhaps Samsung releasing a stand alone system or something.
GAF didn't think 360 would succeed in the west really. Between launch and the PS3 launch people were underwhelmed by sales and technical performance. Expectations got much lower for this generation by 2007 (graphically) and MS did a great job actually increasing sales every year.
The thing is, circumstances change from when you make a prediction and when things come out.
PS3/3DS? Coming off the backs of hugely popular system, sure successes.
Oh wait, $600/$250? Oh well who knows maybe the market will support that anyway, surely Sony/Nintendo are smarter than us...
Oh they're failing? Holy shit, no one could have predicted that.
Etc. etc.
And the other thing is, we've seen time and time again that over time the fortunes of a system can definitely change and drastically, so predicting the Vita to doom or the 3DS to mediocrity is very short-sighted.
ShockingAlberto
Member
To their credit, they're trying hard to replicate that success by not providing any support to their other initiatives, too. I'm not sure what else you could ask of them!
MightyHedgehog
Member
Right. It's going to end up being a pure loss for Sony and will only have negatively affected what they could have done on the next Playstation thanks to diverting talent and money away from platforms that have a chance. Unless they pull out a miracle this year, it seems like they'll only lose billions on it when it's all said and done.
AdventureRacing
Member
Really? As far as i can tell pretty much every form of gaming outside of the traditional console/handheld market is growing quickly.
Absolutely yes. Not only did it sell much worse than its predecessor (whilst the competition flourished and gained a strong foothold in the market with big implications for the future) it cost them billions of dollars to subsidize the PS3 to reach that point.
I think it's silly because the system has been out for just a few months so far. We know a COD and an AC has been announced for it. Before writing off the potential of future announcements, people should wait to see what exactly will be announced at least in the next few major events such as Gamescom and TGS.
And the lack of games comments come up all over the place, my response was a more general one aimed at everything. But it applies to sales aspect as well. 3DS did absolutely horrible in the first few months with a horrendous launch line up. ~$100 price cut + bundles + 3 of its biggest games + colors = sales Momentum. This is 'without' a proper non nintendo rival in the market also at the time. Vita is doing just fine imho and it's no way in form doomed. There's still many things it can do and the results to be seen before such a mentality to sink in. It's the higher priced system, new to the market so the game library is still building, and have a rival console who is selling well.
Not saying it's all peachy, just that people are overly negative when it comes to vita that's all. Give the system some time. If sony plays it right they have a winner on their hand. The foundation is strong because the hardware itself is a thing of beauty. Now they got to get the other things right and I'm willing to wait at least until end of TGS to see how they handle it.
And the lack of games comments come up all over the place, my response was a more general one aimed at everything. But it applies to sales aspect as well. 3DS did absolutely horrible in the first few months with a horrendous launch line up. ~$100 price cut + bundles + 3 of its biggest games + colors = sales Momentum. This is 'without' a proper non nintendo rival in the market also at the time. Vita is doing just fine imho and it's no way in form doomed. There's still many things it can do and the results to be seen before such a mentality to sink in. It's the higher priced system, new to the market so the game library is still building, and have a rival console who is selling well.
Not saying it's all peachy, just that people are overly negative when it comes to vita that's all. Give the system some time. If sony plays it right they have a winner on their hand. The foundation is strong because the hardware itself is a thing of beauty. Now they got to get the other things right and I'm willing to wait at least until end of TGS to see how they handle it.
test_account
XP-39C²
The handheld market has really taken a hit. Bringing back the PS3 vs GBA (3DS) picture almost seems approriate as a comparison to how the big ones did in the previous generation. But, i'm still optimistic for this holiday season 
I think that the sales can be good enough even if it is much lower compared to the previous generation.
I think that the sales can be good enough even if it is much lower compared to the previous generation.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Matt said:
Its perfectly simple dude: If/when more big software launches and fails to increase sales then its time to do something more drastic. A price cut is one thing, and so is another round of heavy marketing or ideally a combination of the two.
Doing anything before that point would be grotesquely stupid, as is expecting a drastic change in the status quo of Vita's fortunes without something major happening to cause it.
As usual it seems like noone is taking into consideration the amount of time and work it takes to create a big title on such a powerful piece of hardware as the Vita. This is a powerful system, to leverage it properly is neither quick nor cheap - and its especially problematic as there's nothing else quite like it to cross-port from/to.
It was always going to be a slow-burn in its first year.
Stealth20k
Banned
The handheld market has really taken a hit. Bringing back the PS3 vs GBA (3DS) picture almost seems approriate as a comparison to how the big ones did in the previous generation. But, i'm still optimistic for this holiday season
the handheld market is fine.
That wouldnt be the actual case ( in terms of everything doing better)
You see I think the ps3 was a massive success but that is me
The 3ds is selling, relax
Sigh, I realize now I will have to be the positive voice on this forum too.
I dont know where the doom and gloom gene comes from
GBA x PS3 all over again.
Sarcastic Response
Banned
Oh people get it, but those who have Vitas are not going to listen to the same doom and gloom that gets brought up every month. The thing is barely reaching 5 months old and yet you already have people talking as if it's already dead and Sony has discontinued it. I'd love to see the sales of the 3DS at the same time because I'm pretty sure they weren't any better at this point. Of course, in saying that, I can expect 101 people to go, "Yeah but nobody really thought the 3DS was going to fail with the Trinity coming that fall!" Hindsight is always 20/20 and at the same time nobody knew what to expect. I just find this entire notion that Vita is the blunder of the century ridiculous.
Sammy Samusu
Member
Actually, I believe GAF said Move would sell better than Kinect (more hardcore games, precision, price, etc), lol.
test_account
XP-39C²
I hope that it can maintain even if it is lower sales compared to previous generation. I am optimistic about it.
That would work too
I think that the PS3 x 3DS is also fitting actually (considering how the systems did in the previous generations).ho ho ho
For what it's worth, I unfortunately don't think you're too far off the mark there. SCEA has pretty much proven they don't give a shit about Vita. SCEJ is trying but unfortunately can't do much, and SCEE's gonna do what SCEE's gonna do.
SkylineRKR
Member
How many handheld games from powerhouse Nintendo actually and usually chart? I figure its Pokemon, Mario, and a slight few other IP.
Sony doesn't have an IP thats even remotely close to that. They never had a chance to begin with. The Vita isn't offering the Nintendo IP, nor its offering many tablet functions. Its only for gamers, worse yet, its a glorified PSP.
I love the Vita mind you, but the longer I have it the more I start to think its pretty much the PSP with some improvements. Sony did learn some things, but its too late anyway. The market changed and on top of that Sony along with its games aren't the ones to beat anymore. The PSP being a portable PS2 was in bigger demand before it hit shelves.
What can Sony do? They won't have a system seller for sure. And just a price drop isn't going to cut it...
Sony doesn't have an IP thats even remotely close to that. They never had a chance to begin with. The Vita isn't offering the Nintendo IP, nor its offering many tablet functions. Its only for gamers, worse yet, its a glorified PSP.
I love the Vita mind you, but the longer I have it the more I start to think its pretty much the PSP with some improvements. Sony did learn some things, but its too late anyway. The market changed and on top of that Sony along with its games aren't the ones to beat anymore. The PSP being a portable PS2 was in bigger demand before it hit shelves.
What can Sony do? They won't have a system seller for sure. And just a price drop isn't going to cut it...
metalslimer
Member
What is TGS going to offer thats going to save the system in North America? The problem is this is turning into a situation where people keep going wait for ???. The 3DS sold terribly its first couple of months and it still was doing much better overall than Vita and had the promise of huge games that Nintendo themselves would make. Now you have to rely on 3rd parties to come out of nowhere to make games for this system when they have much better options to go to.
And the reason people are writing Vita off like never before is that the announced lineup and sales are the worst of a major platform in a long time. This isn't just unnecesary concern. At least on the PS3 you had 360 multiplats and big exclusives like MGS4.
Yes they were.
Petrae
Member
The pessimist in me is concerned about where the handheld sector is going, but I think that Nintendo could come through this OK with 3DS moving forward. Mario + 3DS XL in August could be a catalyst, then Pokemon Black & White 2 comes shortly after. Then we're into Q4, and we see if 3DS maintains that momentum.
As for Vita, games are needed. More of them and prominent ones at that. I don't think it's entirely fair to crucify Vita without a few important games hitting the market first. Consumers will either start to buy in at that point, or Sony will have to resort to other measures. (Yeah, price cut.)
We have to be balanced. Concern is fine, but there's certainly a chance that handhelds recover and sell closer to the numbers that we expect. We just have to try and be a little patient.
The handheld market has really taken a hit. Bringing back the PS3 vs GBA (3DS) picture almost seems approriate as a comparison to how the big ones did in the previous generation. But, i'm still optimistic for this holiday season
The current handhelds are nowhere near as exciting as the previous generations. The future looks good, yeah, but there is little to no reason for anyone to grab either a 3DS or a Vita straight away.
Although they have unique experiences, they, so far, pale in comparison to their predecessors.
I know you weren't implying the relevancy of the smartphone market, but I felt like I should have included my two cents before it all breaks loose.
It has been a far slower burn then they predicted. I knew that was true when Target clearanced out so many of its accessories less then 2 months after launch...
Stealth20k
Banned
I hope that it can maintain even if it is lower sales compared to previous generation. I am optimistic about it.
That would work too
The 3ds is selling higher right now than any previous handheld.........The consoles have to recover too
I mean its easy to point the finger to the handhelds
but the only system with growth is 3ds this month
I think Sony has actually been intelligent in limiting how much of a money sink a failing Vita could become by ensuring that a lot of money isn't lost in the sale.
Even considering that, breaking even is not a favorable scenario for the Vita in any way.
Version 3.0
Member
Old platforms are doomed.
New platforms are doomed.
Is there anything that isn't doomed besides smartphones?
Great games are not doomed...even though they're a bit scarce at the moment.
This industry can really use a shake-up. I only find it scary because of the awful conclusions that are being drawn about it by the industry itself.
metalslimer
Member
THe shelf space I've seen given to Vita has really been quite pathetic from what I've seen.
Sarcastic Response
Banned
See that's your problem from the get-go. Vita doesn't need saving. It needs games, time, and patience to build up it's install base and attract more potential buyers.
AgentP
Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
Based on what? I doubt they have lost a dime, the Vita is pure profit. Unsubsidized hardware, huge margins on accessories, DD games that cut out the middle man, etc. If anything Sony is milking the price for early adopters and will drop the price when the timing is good.
Stealth20k
Banned
AdventureRacing
Member
F2P games are rapidly growing, the PC market is growing, facebook gaming and mobile gaming are growing. Where outside of the traditional console/handheld market is gaming struggling?
It sold far less than the PS2 whilst allowing its competitors a foothold in the market after having them backed into a corner the gen before. They also lost billions of dollars in the process. How can this be looked at as a success?
This isn't a slow burn. This is like saying Dreamcast's post-PS2 performance is a slow burn.
test_account
XP-39C²
Yeah, i just ment that it is a pity to see that the handheld market is much smaller now compared to before. But i still think that the market can survive, at least i hope so
I'm only saying that the handheld market have taken a hit compared to previous generation. It is a pity to see that. I'm not saying that anything is doomed or anything like that. I think that the handheld market can survive even if lower sales, and i hope it does, so i'm optimistic about that
There is no way that Sony has come close to recouping the costs of the Vita by now.
Yes and what is 3ds? The successor the highest selling handheld console of all time in gaming. It still did horrible. The release dates etc for their bigger games such as MH and MK were announced way later. iirc they revealed them closer to the price cut reveal.
PSP didn't do that well against DS either but that didn't stop it from getting some really great high quality 3rd party software now did it? Even now 3rd parties in the west have shown support for the system..I think maybe even more so than for the 3ds.
You make it sound like vita owners have been waiting for years or something. We have been getting some real good software already and it's only been around 4 months for crying out loud. This is not turning into such a dramatized situation as you put it yet. If nothing good is announced by the end of it's first year please come back. PS3 didn't do too hot either first year software wise and look how it is now. Nintendo was getting bitch slapped by sony but see how things changed for them. Console sales are not decided based on a few months. It's a long term investment for the companies. Sony have yet to abandon any of their major consoles and I doubt it's going to start now.
Exactly. But the really disturbing thing is it has gotten WORSE, and really fast. That makes it even harder for it to come back.
darkside31337
Tomodachi wa Mahou
And thats why a price cut doesn't make sense regardless of people clamoring for one.
I love my Vita to death, it's my favorite piece of gaming hardware I've bought in ages. But its pretty obvious that it doesn't have a gaming library that appeals to the average consumer.
So why drop the price if the sales aren't going to increase as a result? It's being aimed at a specific demographic and thats the demographic that is buying the device right now (and said demographic is unfortunately not all that large much to GAF's chagrin).
Dropping the price will make people more interested but if the software isn't there with it they're not going to buy it enough to the point to justify dropping the price right now.
Stealth20k
Banned
f2p isnt growing like people think more games fail that way than succeed, pc market grew only because of diablo 3, 1 title, facebook gaming is crashing, and mobile gaming for alot of the bigger names is contracting more than you might think according to gameindustry.
Ok, so it sold less than the ps2.
But it made profit, It had great games, and thats all a business would want.
Ok, so it sold less than the ps2.
But it made profit, It had great games, and thats all a business would want.
Colonel Mustard
Banned
Sales beget software begets sales begets software begets sales.
This is completely cyclical. Without software, we have no sales. Without sales, we have no software being greenlit.
The Vita is doing horribly, the 3DS' sales were mediocre yet still above it's predecessor.
We also now know that the decision for MoHun 4/TriG was made way before the 3DS even launched. There was never any inclination that Mario Kart 7 and 3D Land weren't going to be holiday-launches.
metalslimer
Member
Developers have had Vita dev kits since 2010. To not even have logos at this point is indicative that it isn't some huge time problem which is why Vita big support hasn't shown up yet
Stealth20k
Banned
Yeah, i just ment that it is a pity to see that the handheld market is much smaller now compared to before. But i still think that the market can survive, at least i hope so
I'm only saying that the handheld market have taken a hit compared to previous generation. It is a pity to see that. I'm not saying that anything is doomed or anything like that. I think that the handheld market can survive even if lower sales, and i hope it does, so i'm optimistic about that
I dont think we can say that yet when it just literally started and the 3ds is outpacing the ds, and the vita, well it needs time, and games
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
Call of duty and assCreed are the two biggest ips this Gen from western developers. 3ds which is supposedly doing well has neither of these games on it. When 3ds was selling like crap they canceled it and turned it into revelations. When vita is selling like crap they make an exclusive version designed specifically for vita and so far looks really good. When vita is selling good it gets its own CoD ( one of the biggest IPs in media history ) and 3ds is selling well its no where to be found on that system. I can't name a western 3rd part game in DS that's not a port. 3ds and vita suck at western 3rd part support but because of AssCreed and CoD vita edges it out IMO. And lol at declassified not hitting this year. I guess the ps3/wii/PC version of black ops won't be hitting this year due to lack of footage XD.
^^^^ wat da fuk. Where do people get these ideas from.
More than twice anything else on the list? Nice. I hadn't heard any sales numbers since the great first month. I wonder what its LTD is now on the 360.
I just checked the PC version and it's over 6.5 million and seems to still be doing over $200,000 USD sales per day before fees/taxes/whatever, unless I did my math wrong.
SkylineRKR
Member
Objectively speaking, the PS3 is the biggest failure ever I think.
How many did Sony lose on it, 8 billion? Plus their leadership, plus a lot of exclusivity, plus goodwill... The whole empire Sony built with the Ps1 and Ps2 was being burned down in a matter of mere months.
To be fair though, one could expect that Sony wouldn't repeat the Ps2. I mean we were dealing with a cornered Nintendo being on time and a hell bent moneyhat throwing Microsoft here. Thats a different ballgame than Sega and a very late Nintendo. Sony would lose marketshare regardless... but this big... thats a failure.
Ps3 is my console of choice, but I've got difficulties calling it a success.
How many did Sony lose on it, 8 billion? Plus their leadership, plus a lot of exclusivity, plus goodwill... The whole empire Sony built with the Ps1 and Ps2 was being burned down in a matter of mere months.
To be fair though, one could expect that Sony wouldn't repeat the Ps2. I mean we were dealing with a cornered Nintendo being on time and a hell bent moneyhat throwing Microsoft here. Thats a different ballgame than Sega and a very late Nintendo. Sony would lose marketshare regardless... but this big... thats a failure.
Ps3 is my console of choice, but I've got difficulties calling it a success.