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[dgrdsv]

Which workloads would that be?

And is it because it came out the same year as PS4Bone and as such was made without the knowledge of how PS4Bone games would be coded?

Mixed graphics and compute, DX11+ capabilities, 8GB of RAM, all the usual suspects. Plus some things which are fast on GCN1 are slow on Kepler and with consoles being the main optimization target these things are being used widely sinking Keplers down. These things also happen to be what was fixed in Maxwell mostly and thus Maxwell is doing much better.

If you look closely at where exactly Kepler struggles you'll notice that it's almost always console ports while in games built on 3rd party engines (UE/Unity/CryEngine) it's doing alright for the most part as these engines are heavily PC optimized since their main clientele is on PC these days.

Kepler came out in Spring 2012, new consoles launched in Autumn 2013 and the choice of platform for both of them were made when Kepler was in full production already. Not that it would change much otherwise as Kepler was pretty specifically designed for the workloads of its time - and that's why it was so good back when it was launched.

good try, wont indulge you.

Cheers

So you'll just dump a bunch of unrelated info into the thread about Pascal, do a mysterious look and won't explain anything. Ok, gotcha.

 

[ShogunDarius]

I thought non founder cards were expected in June? why are people saying longer?

 

[LabouredSubterfuge]

Mixed graphics and compute, DX11+ capabilities, 8GB of RAM, all the usual suspects. Plus some things which are fast on GCN1 are slow on Kepler and with consoles being the main optimization target these things are being used widely sinking Keplers down. These things also happen to be what was fixed in Maxwell mostly and thus Maxwell is doing much better.

If you look closely at where exactly Kepler struggles you'll notice that it's almost always console ports while in games built on 3rd party engines (UE/Unity/CryEngine) it's doing alright for the most part as these engines are heavily PC optimized since their main clientele is on PC these days.

Kepler came out in Spring 2012, new consoles launched in Autumn 2013 and the choice of platform for both of them were made when Kepler was in full production already. Not that it would change much otherwise as Kepler was pretty specifically designed for the workloads of its time - and that's why it was so good back when it was launched.



So you'll just dump a bunch of unrelated info into the thread about Pascal, do a mysterious look and won't explain anything. Ok, gotcha.

It's reasonably clear that he believes AMD is da bestest,

I'm just sad he didn't outline the fantastic advantages of GCN and mention how great Polaris is going to be. He needn't be shy about it.

 

[SneakyStephan]

As an amd user from 2003 till 2015 : amd users are in for a wake up moment the SECOND amd finally stop selling GCN rebrands.

Saw it with my radeon 9800 pro, saw it with my hd4870, saw it with my hd6870

Don't worry, amd are just as good at making you feel like a second class citizen with older hardware as nvidia are. That's how things work, that's how they always worked, that's how they always will work.
Big architecture change = gpu vendor only does token support for the old one within a few months.

It sucks, and as someone who'se been burned by amd gpus like this several times in the past it makes me cringe to see people pretend that amd are your friends who will look out for you. They're a faceless corporation. Their support for old GCN cards only happened because they kept selling them, not because they want to do right by their customers. And it'll change when polaris is out.

 

[Kikorin]

I waited so long for these card to come out, now it's time for me to make a new pc. I've been out of pc hardware business for years, there is a topic where can I ask advices for a new pc? How much time we have to wait before the custom GTX 1080 starts to come out? I've just taken a pretty big work and would be pretty difficult for me do it with my old pc, so I'm really close to make the decision to buy a new one, but if we have the custom cards in little time, maybe I can wait.

 

[jambo]

I waited so long for these card to come out, now it's time for me to make a new pc. I've been out of pc hardware business for years, there is a topic where can I ask advices for a new pc? How much time we have to wait before the custom GTX 1080 starts to come out? I've just taken a pretty big work and would be pretty difficult for me do it with my old pc, so I'm really close to make the decision to buy a new one, but if we have the custom cards in little time, maybe I can wait.

There's a huge PC hardware and support thread here

 

[Kikorin]

There's a huge PC hardware and support thread here

Thanks *-*

 

[Durante]

I want to see how games like Street Fighter 5 & Dark Souls 3 would handle at 4K on the 1080.

Must have gone through 10 sites in the OP and its like they're all benchmarking the same ultra heavy realistic games.

That's a general issue with GPU benchmarking, there might be tons of sites out there who do it but the set of games used is very homogeneous.

Is there any review where they test Simultaneous Multi-Projection, specifically for VR?

I don't think so, there isn't software for it yet.

This is what I was looking forward too, but it's looking more like it would have to be patched in on a game by game basis. Unless I am wrong..?

Not so much a game by game basis as an engine by engine basis.

(This distinction is relevant since ~90% of all VR games released or in development seem to be using one of two engines)

I don't understand the workloads either... shouldn't a game just be making calls to DirectX in Xbone just like in PC?

Shaders for console games are written and optimized with a particular architecture in mind, and this can go as far as fundamental choices in algorithms.

 

[bltn]

I don't think so, there isn't software for it yet.

Does this need to be implemented on a SteamVR or engine level? Or is it just through GameWorks VR that no-one seems to be using yet?

Having a hard time picturing who's responsible for what here, but I'd guess engine + GameWorks, meaning we actually wont see it in many titles.

 

[Backfoggen]

Reminder: I called it.

I just didn't call the long, ridiculous price gouging that is forcing us to wait.

This is a joke at this point.

 

[Renekton]

As an amd user from 2003 till 2015 : amd users are in for a wake up moment the SECOND amd finally stop selling GCN rebrands.

Big architecture change = gpu vendor only does token support for the old one within a few months.

I'm not sure if we will ever see that again.

Based on the man-century cost of developing for new node and architecture, both vendors might just opt for modest enhancements over existing architecture each generation instead of a do-over.

 

[Iced]

edit: nevermind, not worth it

 

[Dahaka]

Reminder: I called it.

I just didn't call the long, ridiculous price gouging that is forcing us to wait.

congratulations, you must be new to upgrade cycles.

 

[Alexious]

People right now are comparing a reference 1080 model with overclocked 980Ti custom designs. The thing is: 3d party 1080 models will be (probably) able to reach 2ghz. The 30% gap will most likely stay.

IMO:

You don't care, you want the best: Wait for the 1080Ti or at least for 3d party 1080 models.
4k: Wait for 1080Ti and vega benchmarks .
1440p (owning a 980Ti or Fury X): No need to upgrade atm
1080p (owning a 980 or 390X): No need to upgrade atm, if you're willing to set shadows to very high instead of ultra.
1080p (owning a 970 or 390): Are you unhappy with overall high-v.high quality settings and 1080p@60fps? Wait for Polaris 10 and 1070 benchmarks.
Are you still gaming on a 2500k/3570k (OC) and want a 1080?. Get a new CPU first.

Everybody else: Wait for Polaris 10 and 1070 benchmarks or go for the 1080 if you want to go above 1080p.

Just my opinion, people have different reasons for upgrading. Some really feel the urge to be able to max out everything, other want to feel VR ready, other want to own the very best other want to 'future proof'. It's all viable.

2 Ghz was easily reached even on the review cards, with custom models it can probably go even further.
The card is a bigger upgrade than anticipated even for the higher end of the spectrum. GTX 980Ti is not really enough to play performance intensive games at 4K unless you're willing to drop a ton of details. GTX 1080 gets much closer, though for 4K@60 an SLI is required.

 

[napata]

No problem. Every buyer should be aware

Buyers should also be aware that these sites all use overclocked $1000 cpus. Because AMD sucks at dx11 driver overhead this will massively benefit them. Hell, better cpus might even be part of the reason why AMD cards get better over time versus Nvidia.

Obviously most people don't have $1000 cpu's so the results on these sites aren't actually representative of the performance they will get. Whereas with Nvidia cpus matter way less. I bet if they were to do these benchmarks on a 2500k you will get very different results.

 

[michaelius]

2 Ghz was easily reached even on the review cards, with custom models it can probably go even further.
The card is a bigger upgrade than anticipated even for the higher end of the spectrum. GTX 980Ti is not really enough to play performance intensive games at 4K unless you're willing to drop a ton of details. GTX 1080 gets much closer, though for 4K@60 an SLI is required.

We shouldn't look at 2Ghz like it's some super OC - what matters is percentage over stock.

And stock boost is around 1770

so 2050Mhz boost is modest 13% oc (i'm getting bit more oc on my reference 980ti)
even 2400Mhz would be 35% oc which is similar gain as high end AIB 980 ti had

 

[jediyoshi]

Wow the framerate jump from 1440p to 1080p in Tomb Raider is nuts

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

Do we know when the 1070 benchmarks are coming?

 

[Xyber]

Buyers should also be aware that these sites all use overclocked $1000 cpus. Because AMD sucks at dx11 driver overhead this will massively benefit them. Hell, better cpus might even be part of the reason why AMD cards get better over time versus Nvidia.

Obviously most people don't have $1000 cpu's so the results on these sites aren't actually representative of the performance they will get. Whereas with Nvidia cpus matter way less. I bet if they were to do these benchmarks on a 2500k you will get very different results.

The difference in games between a $300 and $1000 CPU is very small though. If you are thinking about buying a $6-700 GPU you should definitely upgrade from the very old 2500K already, because the cost definitely isn't your top priority.

 

[BrettHeazy]

Do we know when the 1070 benchmarks are coming?

I came here to post the same question, anyone got any idea when the 1070 embargos up?

3/4 weeks?

 

[ISee]

2 Ghz was easily reached even on the review cards, with custom models it can probably go even further.
The card is a bigger upgrade than anticipated even for the higher end of the spectrum. GTX 980Ti is not really enough to play performance intensive games at 4K unless you're willing to drop a ton of details. GTX 1080 gets much closer, though for 4K@60 an SLI is required.

I agree and that's the 'biggest problem' for me with the 1080. It's a great card for everything but UHD and I don't need another card for sub 4k atm, especially not at a price point around 850€ - 900€ (for a good 3d party design according to some rumors).
I'd spend ~850€ for a capable 4k/60 card and get a shiny new UHD-HDR monitor to accompany it, but the 1080 can't do that. And spending up to 1800€ for a dual sli setup? Ah well no, that's too much for me. Can't justify that. I'll stay a year longer on 1080p and my gtx 980 and see what we'll get in 2017.

 

[napata]

The difference in games between a $300 and $1000 CPU is very small though. If you are thinking about buying a $6-700 GPU you should definitely upgrade from the very old 2500K already, because the cost definitely isn't your top priority.

Yes, for Nvidia. It is not so true for AMD. I'll try to find a benchmark that highlights this but they are pretty rare. I remember seeing one where going from a 4 core to an 8 core cpu gave a massive increase for a Fury x but not for a 980ti.

 

[Xyber]

I came here to post the same question, anyone got any idea when the 1070 embargos up?

3/4 weeks?

Most likely not until after the 1080 launch at least. They don't want people to look at the numbers and realise that the 1070 is the better buy of the two.

 

[Momentary]

I don't get why people are comparing a 1080 to a 980ti and brushing it off as nothing. Shouldn't they be comparing it to a 980? 70 to 90 percent increase in performance?


I feel like the 1080ti should be directly compared to the 980ti.


If anything, seeing the 1080 outperforming flagship maxewell cards has me more than excited for its bigger sibling. It would be awesome if we could get 70 percent increase in performance. Hell, even 40-50 would be impressive to me.


I think those of you who have waited 4 years for this shrink in die can wait a little longer for the definitive version of the GP100 line.

Spoiler

I did sort of had a moment of weakness a tear ago and bought a laptop with a 980m.

Then another 4 years down the Line GV200 will. All according to plan.

 

[forknknife]

Reminder: I called it.

I just didn't call the long, ridiculous price gouging that is forcing us to wait.

You waited and waited so your comment was at the top of the page, didn't you?...

 

[Zackat]

You waited and waited so your comment was at the top of the page, didn't you?...

I mean he has been successfully trolling you all so.

 

[ISee]

I don't get why people are comparing a 1080 to a 980ti...

Mostly because of the premium price point.

 

[riflen]

I don't get why people are comparing a 1080 to a 980ti and brushing it off as nothing. Shouldn't they be comparing it to a 980? 70 to 90 percent increase in performance?


I feel like the 1080ti should be directly compared to the 980ti.


If anything, seeing the 1080 outperforming flagship maxewell cards has me more than excited for its bigger sibling. It would be awesome if we could get 70 percent increase in performance. Hell, even 40-50 would be impressive to me.


I think those of you who have waited 4 years for this shrink in die can wait a little longer for the definitive version of the GP100 line.

Spoiler

I did sort of had a moment of weakness a tear ago and bought a laptop with a 980m.

Then another 4 years down the Line GV200 will. All according to plan.

They are doing this (falsely in my opinion), because of pricing. They just look at performance per dollar and nothing else is a concern.
16nm finFET is expensive, more expensive than the planar processes we've used up until this very GPU release. You will pay accordingly.

 

[Vuze]

As an amd user from 2003 till 2015 : amd users are in for a wake up moment the SECOND amd finally stop selling GCN rebrands.

Saw it with my radeon 9800 pro, saw it with my hd4870, saw it with my hd6870

Don't worry, amd are just as good at making you feel like a second class citizen with older hardware as nvidia are. That's how things work, that's how they always worked, that's how they always will work.
Big architecture change = gpu vendor only does token support for the old one within a few months.

It sucks, and as someone who'se been burned by amd gpus like this several times in the past it makes me cringe to see people pretend that amd are your friends who will look out for you. They're a faceless corporation. Their support for old GCN cards only happened because they kept selling them, not because they want to do right by their customers. And it'll change when polaris is out.

Yeah, it's so weird how a lot of people act like AMD will "save" us or generally is the good guy of the dGPU market. Both are unscrupulous companies aiming for max profit no matter what.
I will be keeping a close eye on how older cards hold up once Pascal is out for a few months.

 

[holygeesus]

Mostly because of the premium price point.

Some people also just want the fastest card so are probably trying to justify upgrading their 980ti Titan. Not enough improvement to justify the cost. I'd definitely upgrade if I had a 980 or a 970 though. I still think it's worth biting the bullet and getting in on the ti upgrade cycle though at some stage.

 

[jim2point0]

Reminder: I called it.

Reminder: I have no idea what it is that you called and I do not care.

good try, wont indulge you.

Yeah, silly him for asking a question relevant to the very thread we are in.

Geez, what is up with this thread?

 

[Wag]

Being that I have 3x 980Tis for 4k, I think I'll wait for HBM2. Tempted tho, the numbers look good.

 

[Latvian Hitman]

I don't get why people are comparing a 1080 to a 980ti and brushing it off as nothing. Shouldn't they be comparing it to a 980? 70 to 90 percent increase in performance?

It's true that the 1080 is a drop-in replacement for the 980, but Nvidia has decided to price the 1080 as if it's a Ti part. The 980 launched at $549, while the 1080 is effectively launching at $699.

 

[KurtSloane]

This is a joke at this point.

Also seems to enjoy gloating over those who bought a 980ti and bow have an inferior card.

Sad altogether.

 

[Skel1ingt0n]

I would buy the 1080 Day One at $599, even with a shitty cooler, as I'm going to water cool it. But waiting for EK + waiting for a reasonable price is really killing my hype

 

[viveks86]

Does this need to be implemented on a SteamVR or engine level? Or is it just through GameWorks VR that no-one seems to be using yet?

Having a hard time picturing who's responsible for what here, but I'd guess engine + GameWorks, meaning we actually wont see it in many titles.

Yup. Will most likely be all of the above, just like VR SLI. It will take a while... but unlike other gameworks features, the VR specific enhancements aren't extraneous bells and whistles, so I'm optimistic that it will catch on eventually

 

[takriel]

Being that I have 3x 980Tis for 4k, I think I'll wait for HBM2. Tempted tho, the numbers look good.

 

[saskuatch]

I bought a 980 ti in October, I dint think I will be upgrading till the next generation. For now Ill just stick to 1080 or 1440 for most games. If anything now may be the opportunity to get a cheaper used 980ti and sli them.

 

[Elios83]

Good cards but really expensive.
400$ is the top price I'd spend on a GPU so atm I'd only consider the 1070.
If AMD could release great Polaris based cards we might see a bit of price war.
Otherwise we're stucked with these prices until nVidia announces more high end Pascal based cards at the end of this year.

 

[Barzul]

I would buy the 1080 Day One at $599, even with a shitty cooler, as I'm going to water cool it. But waiting for EK + waiting for a reasonable price is really killing my hype

Honestly don't think the release rollout is smart at all. It really just deflates hype because pretty much every website benchmarking and reviewing this card is saying wait for the custom cooler cards. Wonder why Nvidia thought this was a good idea.

 

[dgrdsv]

Do we know when the 1070 benchmarks are coming?

I came here to post the same question, anyone got any idea when the 1070 embargos up?

3/4 weeks?

Around 1st of June probably as that would put them 10 days before June 10th start of sales just like 1080's benchmarks were released 10 days prior to sales start.

 

[draughn101]

https://youtu.be/xtely2GDxhU?t=7610

Tom Petersen from Nvidia discussed the Founder's Edition a bit in this video (around 2:09:00), he says they intended it to be in the middle of the product stack price/quality wise.

We've known that, but have chosen to ignore it.

Honestly don't think the release rollout is smart at all. It really just deflates hype because pretty much every website benchmarking and reviewing this card is saying wait for the custom cooler cards. Wonder why Nvidia thought this was a good idea.

It's up to the partners to release. There's nothing stopping them.

 

[Latvian Hitman]

I would buy the 1080 Day One at $599, even with a shitty cooler, as I'm going to water cool it. But waiting for EK + waiting for a reasonable price is really killing my hype

EK usually hits right on launch with their stuff. My guess is you'll be waiting longer for a reasonably priced AIB model than you will for a waterblock. One thing to think about since you're going to be putting your card underwater: you might want a card with an additional 6/8 pin connector to deliver more power.

There are two walls the FE cards are hitting when overclocking. The first is temps, which are limited by the reference blower. You'll be addressing that when you add the card to your loop. The second is voltage. Even with a modded bios to increase the voltage limit, you can only deliver so much over a PCIe slot and one 6-pin connector. I don't know how much further the 1080 can go beyond 2.1-2.2 Ghz, but it seems clear that you won't be able to go any further than that without being able to feed the card more power, regardless of temps.

 

[ISee]

a couple of benchmarks from gamestar.de (with 980 sli performance)
more at their website

 

[OldGangWarily]

Reminder: I called it.

I just didn't call the long, ridiculous price gouging that is forcing us to wait.

Reminder: Nobody fucking cares.

 

[Psyrgery ES]

^ damn those charts.

My 970 am cry 😭

 

[KingV]

Good cards but really expensive.
400$ is the top price I'd spend on a GPU so atm I'd only consider the 1070.
If AMD could release great Polaris based cards we might see a bit of price war.
Otherwise we're stucked with these prices until nVidia announces more high end Pascal based cards at the end of this year.

I'm waiting to see all the cards on the table before making any decisions about when to upgrade. If Polaris 10 or Vega are great values or performers, then I'm sure there will be price competition, and it will be a great time to snag one.

1080 doesn't seem worth it from a 970 right now. It's roughly double the performance at roughly double the launch price. The march of technology makes me want to wait until I can get more Performance per $.

1070 might be worth it if it's nipping at the heels of the 1080, but I suspect the relative gap will be bigger between 1070 and 1080 than 970 and 980.

970 was so close to the 980, it made the 980 almost irrelevant.

 

[xplicitone]

Like an extra 20 FPS from 980 Ti, MY GOSH.

WHY?!

I need to hurry up and sell my old card :\

 

[etrain911]

Are there any rumors regarding when the 1080ti is set to launch? My 770 is looking long in the tooth and might be ready to be put out of its misery.

 

[Onemic]

Are there any rumors regarding when the 1080ti is set to launch? My 770 is looking long in the tooth and might be ready to be put out of its misery.

probably some time next year