ShadowSwordmaster
Banned
Not this shit again.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
NYMag: The Uninhabitable Earth - Famine and economic collapse sooner than you think
- Thread starter AuthenticM
- Start date
- Status
Arkage
Banned
A worthwhile counterpoint to the article:
https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2017/07/is-the-earth-really-that-doomed/533112/
https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2017/07/is-the-earth-really-that-doomed/533112/
This article is basically the climate change equivalent of that "what happens when the Pacific Northwest is hit by a super quake" article in the New Yorker.
Hyperbole, but worth thinking about, and certainly worth continuing to plan. I do think the article is right to point out that rising sea levels are really just the tip of the iceberg (climate change puns!) in terms of challenges climate change will bring, but it's usually the one that dominates discourse.
Hyperbole, but worth thinking about, and certainly worth continuing to plan. I do think the article is right to point out that rising sea levels are really just the tip of the iceberg (climate change puns!) in terms of challenges climate change will bring, but it's usually the one that dominates discourse.
fierrotlepou
Member
This is definitely an important piece. The more people realise that climate change isn't a fucking joke, the better. Too bad that most people that can actually do something about it are hypocritical politicians.
People just hate thinking about the future. It all seems so far away for them, but it's definitely not that far off. Their children will experience the full effects of climate change.
I love it when I read about the Fermi Paradox though. The Great Filter is something that we must try to overcome as a species by colonising other planets. That's a whole other discussion though.
People just hate thinking about the future. It all seems so far away for them, but it's definitely not that far off. Their children will experience the full effects of climate change.
I love it when I read about the Fermi Paradox though. The Great Filter is something that we must try to overcome as a species by colonising other planets. That's a whole other discussion though.
Red Liquorice
Member
One of many reasons I'm glad I most likely won't be here 20 years from now.
I'm not sure how its hyperbole? Its a look at the worst case scenarios, its doing what the scientists as the other article says, are almost to afraid to speak of. The majority of people dont have a clue how bad its going to get, its not a pressing issue at all to them when it should be. They elected someone whom is going to do a lot of damage that cannot be undone, not with a great amount of effort, maybe not at all.
I dont believe in this paralysis thing, not when it involves large populations, they havent been paralysed by lead, cfc's, and a million other possible problems we've encountered. If there are no possible actions only an extreme minority would even be paralysed. And its not like in this case there are no possible actions.
If you dont tell them the probable, real worst dangers then maybe they can blame you? "You should have told me the worst that could happen, I would have done something sooner if I'd have known". They might say.
If they'd have sugar coated the possible effects of no ozone layer, would people have been so urgent to do something about it. Imagine if we hadnt even studied the ozone layer at all, like we were aware of it, but didn't bother to keep track of it, why would we need to. Imagine the disaster we could have sleep walked into. Would we have been oblivious then paralysed until it was to late?
I mean thats what the US government seems to be proposing or attempting to do with global warming, making sure its as hard as possible to study. Like who knows what could happen how things could change, if we know and have as much detailed and up to date information as possible, then we can make the best choices. That kind of ignorance has to be challenged, the danger has to be emphasised to anyone with half a brain, to stop these small minority of fuckers from screwing it up for everyone.
And even if it was hopeless and we couldn't do anything would people really be standing around paralysed. No, they'd be digging holes and tunnels, or building ships and things, anything for that minuscule hope of survival. I feel like we are sleep walking into these worst case scenarios, like it'll be fine we'll figure it out just in time, there is no time, the time we lose is time we cannot get back, and it makes the effort all the harder and more impossible.
ShadowSwordmaster
Banned
It's not what people afraid to speak about, it's more about what it could be.The article talks about the worst case but other scientists have come out against this piece saying it's not going to be like this, while some have said it could. You just need to look at the Atlantic article above to see that.
Where you gonna go? Reddit?
Ownage
Member
Coming soon to a region near you.
nush
Member
Do we need to wait another 5 years?
InverseAgonist
Banned
This article is rubbish and the people who agree are fools. It is the same sort of myopic, psychological self-loathing that humans are infamous for. The same linear-thinking that brought us The Great Horse Manure Crisis of 1894, bring us Global Warming today. Or Climate Change or whatever en vogue horseshit you're selling today.
Is the world warming? Sure? Humans fault? Maybe. Does 2deg over the next century mean we should invest and slow our GDP today? Fuck No! Just like how a bunch of intellectuals in 1894 gathers to discuss the 'fact' that London and NYC will be "In 50 years, every street in London will be buried under nine feet of manure" -- and within 20 years the horse basically vanished and was replaced wholesale by the automobile. Problem solved by engineering. Trying to extrapolate the future given a model of warming and a linear understanding of technological gains is just foolish -- there is Knightian uncertainty looming large. It's like asking someone in 1900 to predict today, they don't even really understand atomic structure and you expect them to understand ASICs and microchips and the internet or MRIs or Tesla and SpaceX and any number of things, large or small that we now have? It's ridiculous.
As Elon Musk, myself and the poster below note, there are tons of engineering solutions that will solve this problem at a fraction of the cost and without all the bullshit theatrics of this thread. Freeman Dyson talked about the number of trees necessary and the potential for genetically engineering them to enhance carbon capture. There are many solutions by clever people -- the types of which the climate fearful are not.
I predict this article will age about as well as this one:
Or this Time article from 1974: https://web.archive.org/web/2006110...m/time/magazine/article/0,9171,944914,00.html
Hell there are people running around here saying:
I mean this is ridiculous.
No, you're one of the only sound people in this thread.
Is the world warming? Sure? Humans fault? Maybe. Does 2deg over the next century mean we should invest and slow our GDP today? Fuck No! Just like how a bunch of intellectuals in 1894 gathers to discuss the 'fact' that London and NYC will be "In 50 years, every street in London will be buried under nine feet of manure" -- and within 20 years the horse basically vanished and was replaced wholesale by the automobile. Problem solved by engineering. Trying to extrapolate the future given a model of warming and a linear understanding of technological gains is just foolish -- there is Knightian uncertainty looming large. It's like asking someone in 1900 to predict today, they don't even really understand atomic structure and you expect them to understand ASICs and microchips and the internet or MRIs or Tesla and SpaceX and any number of things, large or small that we now have? It's ridiculous.
As Elon Musk, myself and the poster below note, there are tons of engineering solutions that will solve this problem at a fraction of the cost and without all the bullshit theatrics of this thread. Freeman Dyson talked about the number of trees necessary and the potential for genetically engineering them to enhance carbon capture. There are many solutions by clever people -- the types of which the climate fearful are not.
I predict this article will age about as well as this one:
Or this Time article from 1974: https://web.archive.org/web/2006110...m/time/magazine/article/0,9171,944914,00.html
Hell there are people running around here saying:
I mean this is ridiculous.
No, you're one of the only sound people in this thread.
Last edited:
Every time I see one of these scaremongering articles, I think of this from 2004:
www.theguardian.com
(Big claim: Britain will have a Siberian climate by 2020)
For the record, I am by no means a climate change denier, but all the scaremongering is not only bullshit but counter-productive in encouraging indulgent fatalism rather than coming up with practical, workable solutions. Things will get worse if nothing is done - particularly by the China, the US and India - but it'll be a long, long time before there's any danger of an apocalypse scenario and that's assuming no game-changing scientific advancements, which the human race happens to be very good at when we put our mind to a problem.
Pentagon tells Bush: climate change will destroy us
· Secret report warns of rioting and nuclear war· Britain will be ‘Siberian’ in less than 20 years · Threat to the world is greater than terrorism.
www.theguardian.com
(Big claim: Britain will have a Siberian climate by 2020)
For the record, I am by no means a climate change denier, but all the scaremongering is not only bullshit but counter-productive in encouraging indulgent fatalism rather than coming up with practical, workable solutions. Things will get worse if nothing is done - particularly by the China, the US and India - but it'll be a long, long time before there's any danger of an apocalypse scenario and that's assuming no game-changing scientific advancements, which the human race happens to be very good at when we put our mind to a problem.
Ownage
Member
No pronouns, please.
Bernd Lauert
Banned
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
I don't think people are really paying attention.
All we need to do is plant more trees. that's the best "machinery" we have at this point in time for carbon storage. When tech gets better, than we can move to machinery for it. So far, though. any man-made machine is still not as efficient as just planting trees.
Ownage
Member
I also read recently about seeding oceans with trace amounts of iron to stimulate growth of CO2-eating phytoplankton. Sounds similar to nitrogen in dirt for plant growth. Why not? Get f'in to it.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Life on earth wont die. Insects and other hardy animals will survive if humans die out and evolve into new life forms over the next couple billion years. Carbon etc will eventually stabilize with plants as it did before. Not a lot of comfort to humans living now or our kids/grandkids etc.
All moot when the sun expands and explodes but ya.
TonyK
Member
Frightening article. But at the same time it says there is no solution, we are doomed, so why to worry about something you don't have any control? I think that if you explain the problem but at the same time you say there is no solution (space ships or whatever are not a solution for regular people), people will continue with their lives and do nothing, because nothing can be done. The thing is, what do they want regular people do with this information?
Last edited:
Cyberpunkd
Member
As someone who had a few colleagues doing PhD and working in academia you cannot imagine how much pointless research is being done and research papers are being published since being quoted is like a street cred for a scientist.
If the article like this exists it’s for the above.
p_xavier
Authorized Fister
Academia is now just a big activism industry, including science. As for me on the subject, I'm a survivalist at heart. I can live here for a year without electricity. I have enough food prepared for that length and water filters to purify some.
ResilientBanana
Member
This article is probably why so many space programs are currently in place.
Pegasus Actual
Member
Thank you so much for bumping this commie bullshit on this totally non-political forum.
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
These are worst case scenarios based on complete inaction and everything working out the worst way possible. We will see changes, I don't know when or what they will be but we will see action against climate change (especially as it starts to effect the bottom line).
Vicetrailia
Banned
Unfortunately there is no way to avoid this until shit hits the fan. Greed reigns supreme. So iif your children and their children have the resources to get to the right geography, well you're good.
I don't think so. The ones who have means will adjust to the new lifestyle required, rather than being able to make adjustments to the benefit of everyone.
I don't think so. The ones who have means will adjust to the new lifestyle required, rather than being able to make adjustments to the benefit of everyone.
Last edited:
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
They will adjust so they continue to have the means, hell a lot of them will make billions solving the problems they created.
ManaByte
Gold Member
Vicetrailia
Banned
They are adjusting now technically, but haven't done what is needed. How do they address rising emission output due to demand growth, despite emission reductions investment, and yet climate change is showing its ugly head? As long as their business performs they will continue until we are in a very different place. And then the other problem is that governments lag behind on addressing involuntary action. In the end, signs point to too little too late, so there will have to be change based on survival.
Last edited:
Torrent of Pork
Banned
Let me just guess, all we have to do to stave off the disaster is to give up all autonomy over our lives, give everything to our gracious overlords who won't ever be called to sacrifice a damned thing, eat bugs while they dine on fillet, and above all else submit.
Last edited:
El Pistolero
Banned
By the end of the century? Something tells me our demise will take place much sooner than that...
China pollutes more than the entire rest of the world. The Middle East is also a huge polluter.
Nico_D
Member
People have been prognosing the end of the World for hundreds of years. Still waiting.
Besides, let's say that that all came true by the end of the century. Why the scare tactics? People who need to know that already do, the rest can't do anything about it.
If anything this kinds of articles just feeds people's anxiety and other mental issues and makes their life harder if not intolerable. That's irresponsible.
Life your life, makes kids. The World will change eventually anyway, one way or another, and when that happens people will live in that reality then. Preparing for the future is smart, fear of it is stupid.
Besides, let's say that that all came true by the end of the century. Why the scare tactics? People who need to know that already do, the rest can't do anything about it.
If anything this kinds of articles just feeds people's anxiety and other mental issues and makes their life harder if not intolerable. That's irresponsible.
Life your life, makes kids. The World will change eventually anyway, one way or another, and when that happens people will live in that reality then. Preparing for the future is smart, fear of it is stupid.
derrickchase
Member
Even though I wouldn't mind the end of the world just because it'd stop Nintendo from ruining Metroid even more, let's get real.
StormCell
Member
I've never seen so many soft fragile people. I see all your posts about not wanting to have kids and being glad you'll be gone before the shit hits the fan. I'm planning on and planning for the shit to hit the fan. I'm making plans to ride it out, to be sufficient through the hard times, and I'm raising offspring to be part of a generation who will persevere, adapt, and build tomorrow. That is to say, the more of you who whose bloodlines end, the more space for me and mine! 
Don't be so fragile. If you and yours are lucky, me and mine will build an array of shields/bubbles to help shade the earth and reduce the solar intake of our planet's atmosphere. There are a lot of possible solutions to help us avoid catastrophe. Instead of arriving at doom and gloom, think of it as opportunity!
Don't be so fragile. If you and yours are lucky, me and mine will build an array of shields/bubbles to help shade the earth and reduce the solar intake of our planet's atmosphere. There are a lot of possible solutions to help us avoid catastrophe. Instead of arriving at doom and gloom, think of it as opportunity!
FunkMiller
Member
MikeM
Member
People are free to make their own choices, whether you agree or not.I've never seen so many soft fragile people. I see all your posts about not wanting to have kids and being glad you'll be gone before the shit hits the fan. I'm planning on and planning for the shit to hit the fan. I'm making plans to ride it out, to be sufficient through the hard times, and I'm raising offspring to be part of a generation who will persevere, adapt, and build tomorrow. That is to say, the more of you who whose bloodlines end, the more space for me and mine!
Don't be so fragile. If you and yours are lucky, me and mine will build an array of shields/bubbles to help shade the earth and reduce the solar intake of our planet's atmosphere. There are a lot of possible solutions to help us avoid catastrophe. Instead of arriving at doom and gloom, think of it as opportunity!
StormCell
Member
Or does it?...
Scientists want to build huge ‘space bubbles’ to protect the Earth from overheating
The bubbles would inflate between the Earth and the Sun, reflecting some of its rays and keeping the planet cool
StormCell
Member
- Status