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[ido]

There are some concerns but let's come back to earth, things still sound great and the kinks are being worked out. This is kind of unprecedented for consumers to be able to buy these at this stage in dev. The unit isn't fina.


I don't think it's a massive issue and certainly something that can be addressed before launch.

Sounds like it's being addressed in the next SDK update from the comments on reddit. Hopefully anyway.

At first I was kind of bummed about not having mine until next week, but I don't really mind anymore. By the time I get mine(thursday), all of the setup and installation kinks will have been figured out and there will be more to experiment with software wise.

 

[Soi-Fong]

What I find strange is nobody reported this while playing EVE the past few months. Hundreds if not thousands of people gave it a try, and I didn't hear anything about this smear.

It's not only Eve. People are forgetting they recently demo'd the Aliens demo as well at E3 and we got no reports of the smearing whatsoever.

 

[Betta Lines]

Perhaps there was a late change of panel? It sounds like a hardware problem, and their 'fix' is some kind of software compensation... why would this kind of thing be caused by software?

 

[Jedi2016]

Remember that the "smearing" only occurs on full black... RGB 0,0,0, when the pixel is actually turned completely off. Different technology, remember, not LCD like we're all used to. If a game is displaying anything at all, even 1,1,1 (which most people probably wouldn't even notice unless they knew what to look for, and is probably still darker than your LCD at 0,0,0), then you get no smearing at all.

 

[Sothis Krieg]

Sounds worrying, i just preordered mine a few days ago for september shipping. I hope future SDK or fixes will come until then. But well dev kit is dev kit so...

 

[Soi-Fong]

Remember that the "smearing" only occurs on full black... RGB 0,0,0, when the pixel is actually turned completely off. Different technology, remember, not LCD like we're all used to. If a game is displaying anything at all, even 1,1,1 (which most people probably wouldn't even notice unless they knew what to look for, and is probably still darker than your LCD at 0,0,0), then you get no smearing at all.

1,1,1 won't fix the problem since it'll introduce a sort of green hazing because of the majority of the pixels being green.

 

[YuShtink]

I wouldn't let it totally kill your hype guys I'm still really impressed overall. Everyone should have known going into it that it wouldn't be perfect. Sounds like there will be a pretty good software fix for the smearing. The device is still more comfortable than the DK1. The visuals are much clearer. Colors actually pop. Head tracking is much smoother. The whole world doesn't smear when you look around (only blacks lol). Positional tracking is amazing.

And going back to FOV - I'm starting to wonder if it's really less FOV or if the larger lenses simply let you see more of the screen housing around the image.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

It's not only Eve. People are forgetting they recently demo'd the Aliens demo as well at E3 and we got no reports of the smearing whatsoever.

The most important things to take away are that people who have tried stuff like that have not cared enough to complain. Not that it isn't an issue but let's not make a mountain out of a mole hill.

Sounds like it's being addressed in the next SDK update from the comments on reddit. Hopefully anyway.
.

As anticipated.

 

[Betta Lines]

1,1,1 won't fix the problem since it'll introduce a sort of green hazing because of the majority of the pixels being green.

Interesting. It was the first thing I noticed about my Vita, the first 'decent' OLED I'd ever used. Dark greys look green. It only looks black when it's really black. I can see the pixels turn on at anything beyond full black and they're clearly green. I get shot down whenever I mention it in Vita threads however.

 

[ido]

And going back to FOV - I'm starting to wonder if it's really less FOV or if the larger lenses simply let you see more of the screen housing around the image.

Being able to see the borders doesn't sound good to me. DK1 had a decent FOV. The RiftUP lessened that, and it was noticeable. Really hoping the FOV thing is people not remembering DK1 clearly.

 

[Hale-XF11]

So they charged my card on thursday evening but it still says more order is ready and just waiting for inventory. Does that mean I didn't get in the first shipment?

There were two shipments (one on Thursday and another on Friday) already and we missed both of them. Then next batch likely doesn't go out until sometime on Monday. For whatever reason, I'm still stuck in processing myself, even though many orders placed well after mine have been shipped out already. It's frustrating not knowing why they're shipping out of order.

 

[Soi-Fong]

I myself can't really comment on the FOV. I've only tried the Rift twice before and they were on Macs struggling with the demos. Couldn't really focus on FOV when I was too busy trying not to throw up because of the below par framerates along with the full persistence.

 

[jon_dojah]

My tracking # now shows arrival being Tuesday by end of day. I'm in San Francisco, CA and its coming from the Los Angeles area. I'm sure most people here who's kits shipped will be receiving them this week mon-wed!

 

[Doc Holliday]

Being able to see the borders doesn't sound good to me. DK1 had a decent FOV. The RiftUP lessened that, and it was noticeable. Really hoping the FOV thing is people not remembering DK1 clearly.

You will notice borders on horizontally. So instead of a panoramic view it feels like you looking through a vertical rectangle. Not sure why they went this route. Even if it is a dev kit, this might make harder to plan for.

They might have to go with curved screens or somehow improve the lenses. Or maybe my contacts are screwing with things?

 

[Vesper73]

If you set the 'eye relief' setting in the config util, you can adjust how much of a 'black box' you see near the edge of the screen. They should have defaulted it all the way 'in' because it makes a huge difference!

Note: this only really matters if you have the actual headset all the way 'in' as well.

For max FOV: headset adjusted all the way 'in' and the 'eye relief' setting in the configuration utility all the way 'in'. I do realize that this isn't suitable for everyone. Just wanted to put it out there.

 

[Soi-Fong]

Alright, regarding FOV. I'm seeing new information now browsing through Reddit and Frontier (Elite Dangerous) forums. People who've been trying demos in "extended window" mode are getting much wider FOVs than even the DK1.

There might be a direct mode issue.

Edit: Demo being thrown around a lot with this wider FOV is Radial-G.

 

[Faith]

If you're processing you're probably good. I got my shipping notification a minute ago. I ordered at 9:00AM PDT and receiving it in Texas.

I'm still on processing.

Did anyone get his DK2 in Europe?

 

[ThatsMytrunks]

Mine gets here Wednesday. Can't wait. Hopefully UE4 gets patched before then, though I won't get my hopes too high.

 

[Appleman]

Interesting. It was the first thing I noticed about my Vita, the first 'decent' OLED I'd ever used. Dark greys look green. It only looks black when it's really black. I can see the pixels turn on at anything beyond full black and they're clearly green. I get shot down whenever I mention it in Vita threads however.

From my understanding it shouldn't happen with the Vita since it has a full RGB OLED and doesn't use a PenTile pixel arrangement

 

[Soi-Fong]

From my understanding it shouldn't happen with the Vita since it has a full RGB OLED and doesn't use a PenTile pixel arrangement

Makes me wonder why Oculus didn't go with an RGB OLED.

 

[Blizzard]

Horizontal view may be one of the single biggest issues with the DK1 besides the resolution, so I would hope they find a reliable solution before trying to release a product.

I'm interested in trying it next week to see for myself.

 

[Faith]

Horizontal view may be one of the single biggest issues with the DK1 besides the resolution, so I would hope they find a reliable solution before trying to release a product.

I'm interested in trying it next week to see for myself.

Curved 4K OLED, believe

 

[epmode]

I tried DK2 at PAX East and I was surprised by how easy it was to notice the sides of the screen, especially after all that talk of the Rift filling your vision. I figured the device was just not calibrated properly.

edit:

Alright, regarding FOV. I'm seeing new information now browsing through Reddit and Frontier (Elite Dangerous) forums. People who've been trying demos in "extended window" mode are getting much wider FOVs than even the DK1.

There might be a direct mode issue.

Edit: Demo being thrown around a lot with this wider FOV is Radial-G.

WELL THEN. Maybe it was miscalibrated! I hope you're right about this.

 

[Blizzard]

I'm looking forward to trying Project CARS with the DK2, if/when DK2 support is in.

 

[Betta Lines]

From my understanding it shouldn't happen with the Vita since it has a full RGB OLED and doesn't use a PenTile pixel arrangement

Welp. It's there clear as day. And I've seen it on others so I'm quite sure mine isn't faulty. Perhaps it's a different phenomenon though.

 

[YuShtink]

Here's a cool new little demo someone put out:

https://developer.oculusvr.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=11074

DL Link: https://mega.co.nz/#!7QJVzCiS!kevxYDChzqTx2WsYDxIH9TrOeE65GJbyhsukxvI2MrQ

Just a black environment with raining matrix code, but it worked instantly and it's pretty fun dodging the pieces of falling code with the positional tracking. Also for whatever reason I'm not noticing any black smearing in this demo. Does a great job of showing off just how deep those blacks can be.

 

[Absinthe]

Alright, regarding FOV. I'm seeing new information now browsing through Reddit and Frontier (Elite Dangerous) forums. People who've been trying demos in "extended window" mode are getting much wider FOVs than even the DK1.

There might be a direct mode issue.

Edit: Demo being thrown around a lot with this wider FOV is Radial-G.

Edit: guess it is a little smaller

 

[mrklaw]

For what it's worth, CV1's fov is supposed to be increased.

Didn't expect the DK2 fov to be inferior to DK1, though.

If Cv1 is a 1440p screen, but the FoV is increased, how much will that nullify the increased resolution? I.e what is the effective resolution per arc minute for a 1080p screen with 85 degree FoV, and the same for a 1440p screen with eg 110 degree FoV?

 

[Faith]

If Cv1 is a 1440p screen, but the FoV is increased, how much will that nullify the increased resolution? I.e what is the effective resolution per arc minute for a 1080p screen with 85 degree FoV, and the same for a 1440p screen with eg 110 degree FoV?

The SDE would just stay the same. If they increase the FoV to 110-120 degrees then we will definitely need a 4K display.

 

[YuShtink]

Here's the thing I recalled reading a little while back confirming that the DK2 fov is slightly less than the Dk1, someone just reposted it on reddit:

 

[Soi-Fong]

It sounds like the latest builds of Project CARS are already compatible with the DK2. I'm looking forward to trying that.

That's wicked. Only problem is that the game is so unoptimized. Lol Even in normal gameplay, my computer (2600k + 780 Ti Classified) struggles with it. Then again, that could be because I play with DS4X anti aliasing. Lol

Guess I'll have another demo to try out for the DK2 then.

Edit: YuShtink, have you noticed a difference in FOV with extended window mode?

 

[YuShtink]

That's wicked. Only problem is that the game is so unoptimized. Lol Even in normal gameplay, my computer (2600k + 780 Ti Classified) struggles with it. Then again, that could be because I play with DS4X anti aliasing. Lol

Guess I'll have another demo to try out for the DK2 then.

Edit: YuShtink, have you noticed a difference in FOV with extended window mode?

Just did a test on Kokiri and Spirited Away, switching and relaunching between Direct and Extended modes, and as far as I can tell the fov is exactly the same on either. Tried to stand in the exact same spot and compare objects and the edges of my vision, and I'm not seeing a difference.

Strangely enough that little Matrix Code demo feels like it has a wider FOV than the others, pretty much exactly the same as DK1 (only have run through Direct mode too). But I don't know if that's just because the backdrop is completely black and the black levels on the screen are so damn good that it's near impossible to see where the image ends and the blinders begin. But if I position it so the falling code is right along the edge of my vision, it feels like the edge is indeed wider than the other demos I've done.

Also just to note I have a pretty standard IPD (63.4). I tinkered around with adjusting the IPD to see if it affected fov but didn't really seem to have a substantial effect either way.

 

[Krejlooc]

1,1,1 won't fix the problem since it'll introduce a sort of green hazing because of the majority of the pixels being green.

A temporal strobe of 1,1,1 and 2,1,2 (or whatever would offset the green hue) on alternating frames would solve the problem. The strobe would become increasingly less noticeable as framerates improved, too. At 90 hz, the effect might be completely nullified.

 

[Krejlooc]

Makes me wonder why Oculus didn't go with an RGB OLED.

Jailbar effect. Certain colors will turn off subchannels and produce a jailbar effect, you can notice it extremely clearly if you produce something like 255, 10, 10. The G and B subchannels are nearly off in that instance, and thus you have a 2 subpixel gap between the intensely bright red subchannel.

Pentile arrangements have a better subpixel scatter so that the jailbar effect is minimized.

 

[Soi-Fong]

Just did a test on Kokiri and Spirited Away, switching and relaunching between Direct and Extended modes, and as far as I can tell the fov is exactly the same on either. Tried to stand in the exact same spot and compare objects and the edges of my vision, and I'm not seeing a difference.

Strangely enough that little Matrix Code demo feels like it has a wider FOV than the others, pretty much exactly the same as DK1 (only have run through Direct mode too). But I don't know if that's just because the backdrop is completely black and the black levels on the screen are so damn good that it's near impossible to see where the image ends and the blinders begin. But if I position it so the falling code is right along the edge of my vision, it feels like the edge is indeed wider than the other demos I've done.

Also just to note I have a pretty standard IPD (63.4). I tinkered around with adjusting the IPD to see if it affected fov but didn't really seem to have a substantial effect either way.

Hmm.. Is it demo related then? It's possible. Both Radial-G and the Matrix demo you're talking about we're made natively for DK2.

I'm not really sure. It might be a software issue after all.. I'm really wondering if maybe Oculus really was rushed with this SDK.

 

[Kreunt]

Should be easy to just look at the screen with the eye cups removed to see if it's using more or less screen space.

 

[YuShtink]

Hmm.. Is it demo related then? It's possible. Both Radial-G and the Matrix demo you're talking about we're made natively for DK2.

I'm not really sure. It might be a software issue after all.. I'm really wondering if maybe Oculus really was rushed with this SDK.

Could be. I can't be totally sure with the limited selection we have so far.

 

[GrizzNKev]

I really hope they start shipping more next week. I'm dying seeing so many people with theirs.

 

[Blizzard]

That's wicked. Only problem is that the game is so unoptimized. Lol Even in normal gameplay, my computer (2600k + 780 Ti Classified) struggles with it. Then again, that could be because I play with DS4X anti aliasing. Lol

Guess I'll have another demo to try out for the DK2 then.

Edit: YuShtink, have you noticed a difference in FOV with extended window mode?

DS4X is rendering a very high-end game at what, 7680x4320? That's quite a few pixels for sure.

 

[YuShtink]

Should be easy to just look at the screen with the eye cups removed to see if it's using more or less screen space.

Never taking my lenses off

Once dust gets in it doesn't come out. Learned that with the DK1.

 

[Krejlooc]

Never taking my lenses off

Once dust gets in it doesn't come out. Learned that with the DK1.

I use the B-lense with my DK1. Of the two lenses with DK2, is the pre-installed one more like B or A or C?

I too am weary of ever removing my lenses, for the same reason.

 

[YuShtink]

I use the B-lense with my DK1. Of the two lenses with DK2, is the pre-installed one more like B or A or C?

I too am weary of ever removing my lenses, for the same reason.

They seem like A cups to me and work nicely. Haven't bothered with the others as I have pretty good vision. A cups were best for me with DK1 so why mess with it I guess.

 

[Soi-Fong]

I use the B-lense with my DK1. Of the two lenses with DK2, is the pre-installed one more like B or A or C?

I too am weary of ever removing my lenses, for the same reason.

First set of lenses for the DK2 are meant for 20/20 and slightly nearsighted people. The second set of lenses are for near sighted people and users say they're better than the C cups since they're clearer and provide a wider FOV than the C cups from DK1.

Also I'm not too worried about the dirt issue. You just gotta do it like with a DSLR when changing lenses. Have the inside of the Rift facing down when you change the cups.

 

[Faith]

You just gotta do it like with a DSLR when changing lenses. Have the inside of the Rift facing down when you change the cups.

Lol thanks for the tip xD

 

[Doc Holliday]

Good news on the FOV front.

I downloaded the Titans of Space demo and the fov was much better. Even though there was no headtracking because it hasn't been updated to DK2 the feeling of being there was greater than the included demos. So I'm hopeful this is a weird software related issue.

 

[DunderHassan]

Good news on the FOV front.

I downloaded the Titans of Space demo and the fov was much better. Even though there was no headtracking because it hasn't been updated to DK2 the feeling of being there was greater than the included demos. So I'm helpful this is a weird software related issue.

That's great to hear, thanks for keeping us up to date regarding it!

Edit: BTW, are some of you running Windows 8(.1) with DK2? How's the compatibility?
Need to format my PC and still haven't really decided if I should go with Win7 or Win8.

 

[Doc Holliday]

That's great to hear, thanks for keeping us up to date regarding it!

Edit: BTW, are some of you running Windows 8(.1) with DK2? How's the compatibility?
Need to format my PC and still haven't really decided if I should go with Win7 or Win8.

Running 8.1, it's a little weird because the extended desktop is a little broken at the moment. So you'll times when you'll be using a dk1 demo and all of sudden you can't fine your way around the desktop.

Just to add to the fov thing. I made sure it wasn't just an illusion because that demo takes place in deep space and it's mostly black. When standing in front of jupiter the fov was still better.

 

[Soi-Fong]

Running 8.1, it's a little weird because the extended desktop is a little broken at the moment. So you'll times when you'll be using a dk1 demo and all of sudden you can't fine your way around the desktop.

Just to add to the fov thing. I made sure it wasn't just an illusion because that demo takes place in deep space and it's mostly black. When standing in front of jupiter the fov was still better.

Good stuff. Thanks Doc. Hopefully, it's a software issue then.

 

[Seanspeed]

Curved 4K OLED, believe

I think I remember reading that while curved displays are obviously the answer, it comes with a pretty massive problem of dealing with that from a rendering perspective. You cant just wrap an image and have it look normal still.

I think optics are the other field where this could potentially be improved, but also comes with headaches.

Whatever the deal is, it *cannot* be worse than DK1 when the CV1 comes out.

Good news on the FOV front.

I downloaded the Titans of Space demo and the fov was much better. Even though there was no headtracking because it hasn't been updated to DK2 the feeling of being there was greater than the included demos. So I'm hopeful this is a weird software related issue.

Strange.

 

[Soi-Fong]

Oh snap. On the Frontier forums, people have got the DK2 to work with Elite Dangerous INCLUDING positional tracking!

Impressions:

yep WOW! it works.

looks awesome in DK2, didnt really notice any blur, at least not like the other demos ive tried.

First thing i noticed, space looks gorgeous compared to dk1, inky blacks and you can see the colours of the stars etc now. sent a tingle my spine when i left the station for the first time.

All text is mostly readable now. and positional tracking.. oh my.. its awesome really adds to the "almost" presence feeling. had a few moments where i felt 'funny' wouldnt describe it as presence but something was definitely happening/different from Dk1, i can see the potential of CV1 even more now and im convinced Abrash it right when he sais "people will want it badly", DK2 feels like the next step.

had a moment where i was struggling to read the commodities menu a bit.. then i remembered.. oh yeah positional tracking so just leant forward a bit and problem solved the menus and star map look really cool as well, the screen contrast and blacks just make everything pop.