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Orange County, FL district: parental permission req'd to kneel during national anthem

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I hate to be that guy, but I need to point out that schools already waive a LOT of what we would consider "constitutional rights". That's how dress codes are a thing, for instance. I don't know how legit that lawsuit is gonna be.

However, the principal in the OP is a piece of shit and clearly abusing his power. I hope there can be some way to stop this assholery from continuing further.
 
I still don't understand why it's said in schools anyway. It seems like more of an indoctrination starting as young as possible. As far as I remember, it was a waste of a couple of minutes.
 

Aselith

Member
And I'm proud to be an American
Where at least I know I'm free*
And I won't forget the men that died
To give that right* to me

*Offer not applicable in all 50 states
 
It was like this for me for as long as I could remember. I've lived in FL my whole life, and specifically remember that you needed a note from your parents if you didn't want to stand up and recite the pledge.

Every year there would be at least a couple in my morning class that turned in the note.

I don't see a problem with this. You can opt out if it bothers you so much.

What part of Florida are you from? My teachers barely cared after 3rd grade if you stood up or even recited the pledge. By high school no one even cared, which should be the case anyways.
 

xRaizen

Member
What part of Florida are you from? My teachers barely cared after 3rd grade if you stood up or even recited the pledge. By high school no one even cared, which should be the case anyways.

Orlando. A couple of my high school teachers didn't care but most of us stood up anyway, including the teachers themselves.
 

BigDes

Member
Maybe we should pressure the kids into joining a patriotic youth organisation next. Just to ensure that everyone loves the country properly
 

andthebeatgoeson

Junior Member
It was like this for me for as long as I could remember. I've lived in FL my whole life, and specifically remember that you needed a note from your parents if you didn't want to stand up and recite the pledge.

Every year there would be at least a couple in my morning class that turned in the note.

I don't see a problem with this. You can opt out if it bothers you so much.
That's not how freedom works. Or liberty. Or rights.
 

Yaboosh

Super Sleuth
I hate to be that guy, but I need to point out that schools already waive a LOT of what we would consider "constitutional rights". That's how dress codes are a thing, for instance. I don't know how legit that lawsuit is gonna be.

However, the principal in the OP is a piece of shit and clearly abusing his power. I hope there can be some way to stop this assholery from continuing further.


You mean the guy who doesn't read the op?

West Virginia Board of Ed v Barnette is talked about in the OP.
 

diablos991

Can’t stump the diablos
I like the idea of getting parents permission.
This forces the conversation and shows the gravity to the child before the child imitates what they saw on TV.
 

Da-Kid

Member
You're way overthinking this. Of the kids who don't want to stand, for most of them it's out of sheer laziness.
Some don't for religious reason. Growing up a Jehovah's Witnesses, I didn't for that reason as well as millions of others. That's with any national anthem for Witnesses around the world.
 

XiaNaphryz

LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
Looks like there was a response:

http://www.winknews.com/2016/09/15/lely-principal-regrets-wording-of-anthem-message/

NAPLES, Fla. – The principal who required students “stand and stay quiet” during the playing of the United States national anthem regrets the delivery of his message, a Collier County Public Schools spokesman said Thursday.

Despite the national debate, Nemeth’s timing was only coincidental, he said Thursday. Students in the district are not required to stand during the anthem, he said; what Nemeth was trying to do was respond to a disruptive incident involving students.

“There was a volleyball game at Lely the night before Principal Nemeth recorded the message,” Turchetta said. “There was probably 20 kids that we’re being kids — that were being a little loud during the National anthem at that game, so his message the next day was in response to what had happened the night before.”

The incident at the volleyball game was not a protest, Turchetta said. Collier County schools does not have that “problem” and principals do not scrutinize over how students exercise their freedoms, he said.

“In Collier County, we do not have a problem with national anthem protests. We do not have principals that are patrolling, looking for things. It hasn’t been an issue,” Turchetta said. “Obviously, students have rights to express their freedoms. It really comes back to the issue of disruption.”

Nemeth acknowledges that using the word “stand” was especially controversial, Turchetta said, but his goal was to curb disruptive behavior that violates school policies.

“His message was a little too strong. His word choices could have been better and he acknowledges that,” Turchetta said.

The principal returned to his students Thursday to address the televised announcement and its intent.
 

Arkeband

Banned
I like the idea of getting parents permission.
This forces the conversation and shows the gravity to the child before the child imitates what they saw on TV.

In reality, it allows for ostracization of those who go through the motions to opt out. Even if a family reaches that "aha!" moment, there will be another family that will use it as a bludgeon.

edit: oh you were disparaging people who choose not to stand for the pledge? Shame on you.
 

Link

The Autumn Wind
In reality, it allows for ostracization of those who go through the motions to opt out. Even if a family reaches that "aha!" moment, there will be another family that will use it as a bludgeon.
He's a hardcore Trump supporter. Don't even waste your time.
 
I like the idea of getting parents permission.
This forces the conversation and shows the gravity to the child before the child imitates what they saw on TV.

Lol you make it sound like Kaep's games should carry a parental guidance warning and and PSA saying don't try this in schools without parental supervision.
 

oneils

Member
The statute, as quoted, says the school district "may adopt rules to require." Seems kind of disingenuous to blame it on a state law. Maybe I haven't read the full statute.
 

Krejlooc

Banned
I like the idea of getting parents permission.
This forces the conversation and shows the gravity to the child before the child imitates what they saw on TV.

Then you'd probably love it if you had to have parental permission to stand for the national anthem, and that it was opt out by default, right?
 
“In Collier County, we do not have a problem with national anthem protests. We do not have principals that are patrolling, looking for things. It hasn’t been an issue,” Turchetta said. “Obviously, students have rights to express their freedoms. It really comes back to the issue of disruption.”
"Our kids are too busy getting drunk and high to protest the national anthem."
 

stolin

Member
Fucking Kaepernick man. So simple a gesture causing all this drama. Almost genius really. I continue to applaud him and all who follow him so fuck Florida and this anti-free speech nonsense

South-Park-Season-20-Episode-1-9-7f62.jpg
 

weekev

Banned
I saw my next door neighbor burning a flag last weekend. Should I report it?

Difficult one that. Maybe if you guys had someone to report stuff like that to, just to check. Couldnt be reular police or folks would know it was them. Would need to be some kind of secret police.
 

Yagharek

Member
Yeah, forced nationalism is always a great look

Doubly so when you impose it on minors

It's bordering dangerously on indoctrination and probably well beyond it in some parts.

There should never be unquestioning support for any hierarchy or institution.
 
I thought Kaep's initial protest was kind of silly, but the absolutely ridiculous response it's gotten from conservatives and police apologists has given the gesture WAY more symbolic significance than it had before all of this. It's shocking how they played right into the hands of the very individuals whose agenda they claim to want to counter.

Also, what the fuck kind of adult cares what other people are doing during the national anthem? How can you be past the age of, I don't know, 17 or so and still be so insecure?
 
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