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[Skellig Gra]

Let me paint you a picture.

Every day you drive to work, same route, same time, every every day. You get in the car and you start to think about the day ahead, who you are meeting, what deadlines you have etc etc.

One day, your wife can't take the kid to day care for whatever reason. No problem you say, I'll take her, i'll be a bit late but my boss won't mind. You get in the car, put the baby in the back seat (she's fast asleep) get ready to drive to the day care centre and then you get a phone call from your boss, the meeting has been brought forward and the other side have asked for some figures, can you sort that out this morning first thing? Sure you say, no problem. And then you set off, you're thinking about work and the task you have been set. The baby is out of your mind, you're also tired. Off you go and the route is so familiar that you seem to arrive at work without having consciously thought about driving, your head is full of figures and plans but isn't there something you're forgetting? You've got your briefcase, you've got your phone and wallet...just then you see Dave from accounts pull up, you need some figures from Dave so you jump out and walk in with him, discussing the numbers as you go...isn't it hot today, thank god for AC.

Great example. Any variation on that can easily happen.

 

[conpfreak]

Umm, no at anyone suggesting high tech solutions to kids being left in their car. How about actually parenting and always have your kids with you when they aren't of age to leave a car on their own. The parents would be in big trouble if they had just left the kids outside the car with no parental supervision. A car isn't a house or indoors. If you can't be bothered to tend to your child at all times or make sure that they are safe, don't have kids. Lock them up, No excuses. Bet they didn't forget their phone in the car.

 

[InsaneTiger]

such insight.

Trying to say something?

A lot of parents are sleep deprived and incredibly stressed out. This leads to forgetfulness and poor decision making. Irresponsible maybe but not selfish.

Not all are selfish but some are, no excuses.

Guess what? It could happen to you. No matter how much you deny you could ever make that mistake, it still could happen. Some of you are not reading the important posts in this thread.

No excuses. This is a responsibility of the highest order. You may be tired, we are all tired; you may be stressed, we are all stressed. I can't believe there are people trying to make excuses for these parents.

 

[Friggz]

Man, I'm already paranoid during the time between strapping my kid into the car seat and walking around to the driver's seat. People are just wired differently.

this so much. its gotten to a point where in the summer i start my car up 10 minutes ahead of time to cool down the car becuase there is a 15 second window from when i buckle my kids in to when i walk around the car to get into the driver seat and im paranoid af.

 

[SlimySnake]

I really dont understand the point of these threads. i thought these were banned. horrific stuff like this happens everyday. we dont have to keep making threads

i no longer visit news aggregate sites like yahoo because they are full of stories like this. i escape to gaf and same shit gets posted here.

who the fuck wants to start their monday morning reading stuff like this. its every parent's worst nightmare so its not like we will read this and remember to not leave them in the car. the whole point is that we are so used to our daily routine we dont remember in the first place.

 

[crisdecuba]

Umm, no at anyone suggesting high tech solutions to kids being left in their car. How about actually parenting and always have your kids with you when they aren't of age to leave a car on their own. The parents would be in big trouble if they had just left the kids outside the car with no parental supervision. A car isn't a house or indoors. If you can't be bothered to tend to your child at all times or make sure that they are safe, don't have kids. Lock them up, No excuses. Bet they didn't forget their phone in the car.

Trying to say something?


Not all are selfish but some are, no excuses.


No excuses. This is a responsibility of the highest order. You may be tired, we are all tired; you may be stressed, we are all stressed. I can't believe there are people trying to make excuses for these parents.

Please read this article: Fatal Distraction: Forgetting a Child in the Backseat of a Car Is a Horrifying Mistake. Is It a Crime?

 

[slit]

No excuses. This is a responsibility of the highest order. You may be tired, we are all tired; you may be stressed, we are all stressed. I can't believe there are people trying to make excuses for these parents.

When the excuses are backed by science instead of emotion, yes there are valid excuses.

 

[PandaShake]

The capt. shouldn't mentioned that it may have been an accident. Hope it doesn't allow copy cats to think they can stage it.

 

[Violence Jack]

SO, future parents of GAF, just put your water bottle / lunch bag / wallet / phone, something you need to take with you, in the back seat, so you HAVE to turn around and grab it.

This is exactly what I plan to do when my kid is born in 10 weeks. I want to believe that I'll never be able to forget my kid in the car. In fact, I'll probably be paranoid about it to an absurd degree. However, there's no telling how much we'll have going on or how much our daily routine will change once my son arrives. So anything I'll have to take with me wherever I'm going I will just tuck away into the car seat.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Trying to say something?


Not all are selfish but some are, no excuses.


No excuses. This is a responsibility of the highest order. You may be tired, we are all tired; you may be stressed, we are all stressed. I can't believe there are people trying to make excuses for these parents.

The point is it can happen to anyone. You and others are trying to frame it like they don't give a shit about their kids. People make mistakes. That's not an excuse, it's just reality.

 

[Shao Kahn on the Lawn]

I really dont understand the point of these threads. i thought these were banned. horrific stuff like this happens everyday. we dont have to keep making threads

i no longer visit news aggregate sites like yahoo because they are full of stories like this. i escape to gaf and same shit gets posted here.

who the fuck wants to start their monday morning reading stuff like this. its every parent's worst nightmare so its not like we will read this and remember to not leave them in the car. the whole point is that we are so used to our daily routine we dont remember in the first place.

Unlike most shock threads, these have a purpose. Awareness can inspire preventative efforts and it's worth suffering the 'I AM A SUPERIOR PARENT AND NEVER FORGET ANYTHING' types if even one parent realizes they're capable of making the same mistake.

 

[Vyer]

The researcher who is the leading authority on this is quoted there, :

Yeah, you can tell by this thread and a lot of the discussions about the topic that he is right. I use to think the same, and truth be told it's still hard for me to imagine doing that, but actually researching and reading about this stuff has given me a better understanding of the possibilities of it and at least a little empathy for the suffering these people who made an actual mistake are going through.

 

[crisdecuba]

Unlike most shock threads, these have a purpose. Awareness can inspire preventative efforts and it's worth suffering the 'I AM A SUPERIOR PARENT AND NEVER FORGET ANYTHING' types if even one parent realizes they're capable of making the same mistake.

I agree it's worth it, but damn, some of these obtuse responses are infuriating.

 

[Baraka in the White House]

Trying to say something?


Not all are selfish but some are, no excuses.


No excuses. This is a responsibility of the highest order. You may be tired, we are all tired; you may be stressed, we are all stressed. I can't believe there are people trying to make excuses for these parents.

From the WaPo story:

The wealthy do, it turns out. And the poor, and the middle class. Parents of all ages and ethnicities do it. Mothers are just as likely to do it as fathers. It happens to the chronically absent-minded and to the fanatically organized, to the college-educated and to the marginally literate. In the last 10 years, it has happened to a dentist. A postal clerk. A social worker. A police officer. An accountant. A soldier. A paralegal. An electrician. A Protestant clergyman. A rabbinical student. A nurse. A construction worker. An assistant principal. It happened to a mental health counselor, a college professor and a pizza chef. It happened to a pediatrician. It happened to a rocket scientist.

 

[Enduin]

Horrifying. I can be really forgetful sometimes, like leaving eggs boiling in water for so long the water evaporates and the eggs explode like popcorn kernels, but thankfully I am pretty hyper aware of stuff like this. Anxiety can have its uses I guess.

 

[Ryuuroden]

When the excuses are backed by science instead of emotion, yes there are valid excuses.

Gaf only listens to science if it makes a mockery of republicans or Christians. Sorry if that's a bad hot take but there is selective science going on here.

 

[InsaneTiger]

When the excuses are backed by science instead of emotion, yes there are valid excuses.

The point is it can happen to anyone. You and others are trying to frame it like they don't give a shit about their kids. People make mistakes. That's not an excuse, it's just reality.

Man, I don't understand, these are your children. No excuses, I don't feel any sympathy for parents that leave their children in hot cars. Zero. No one here should either.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Yeah, you can tell by this thread and a lot of the discussions about the topic that he is right. I use to think the same, and truth be told it's still hard for me to imagine doing that, but actually researching and reading about this stuff has given me a better understanding of the possibilities of it and at least a little empathy for the suffering these people who made an actual mistake are going through.

It happened to me, very luckily I was just running in to pick up a gift card from a local restaurant as a present for someone so it was less than 5 minutes. The problem was I was on a marathon work conference call remotely even before I left the house. I had my headset on while in the car, in the restaurant, and then back in the car. My son laughed and clapped his hands when I got back in the car. My heart sank so low when I realized what I had done.

Man, I don't understand, these are your children. No excuses, I don't feel any sympathy for parents that leave their children in hot cars. Zero. No one here should either.

Again its not an excuse, no parents who leaves their kid in the car by accident is trying to excuse their behavior. They know they fucked up big time.

Now if you want to talk about the parents who purposely leave their kid in the car then yes, they don't give a shit about their kids.

 

[AEREC]

I'm sure every single person here saying it's BS has at some point in their lives forgotten something, where after realizing it, you wonder how in the fucking hell you managed to forget. The value of said forgotten thing really has no bearing to the horribly unfortunate timing of your brain skipping a beat.

Sure Ive forgotten where I parked my car or that I had to meet someone at some point. But I dont forget that I have a kid or that Im responsible for them.

 

[Vyer]

Man, I don't understand, these are your children. No excuses, I don't feel any sympathy for parents that leave their children in hot cars. Zero. No one here should either.

No, you don't understand. But the information to help you understand is there if you want it. And just because it's likely something you would never think you would do, doesn't change the fact that it happens and that it happens sometimes to good people and that it is possible to feel some empathy for the people who have suffered the worst mistake imaginable.

 

[darkistheway]

Trying to say something?


Not all are selfish but some are, no excuses.


No excuses. This is a responsibility of the highest order. You may be tired, we are all tired; you may be stressed, we are all stressed. I can't believe there are people trying to make excuses for these parents.

You lack basic empathy.

You probably still live with your mom and so have no sense of the weight of responsibility that exists in the real world.

One day, you will do something that will shake your moral certitude; hopefully that moment will not cause harm to anyone else. If it does, maybe you will begin to reflect on how you have judged the world, and maybe your empathy will develop then.

 

[slit]

Man, I don't understand, these are your children. No excuses, I don't feel any sympathy for parents that leave their children in hot cars. Zero. No one here should either.

It's obvious you cannot think rationally about the subject matter because no matter what you won't believe anything that justifies not burning the parents at the stake. Your gut feeling is not what this is about. What you just said is probably going through the mother's mind at this exact moment.

 

[IggyChooChoo]

It happened to me, very luckily I was just running in to pick up a gift card from a local restaurant as a present for someone so it was less than 5 minutes. The problem was I was on a marathon work conference call remotely even before I left the house. I had my headset on while in the car, in the restaurant, and then back in the car. My son laughed and clapped his hands when I got back in the car. My heart sank so low when I realized what I had done.

I'm a dad and I'm terrified it could happen to me, especially in the morning when I'm running around and stressed and sleep-deprived on top of everything. I have nothing but empathy for these parents.

 

[DontBeThatGuy]

Reading some of these articles is about to give me a panic attack, and I don't even have kids. (but sometimes look after my baby niece)

 

[InsaneTiger]

You lack basic empathy.

You probably still live with your mom and so have no sense of the weight of responsibility that exists in the real world.

One day, you will do something that will shake your moral certitude; hopefully that moment will not cause harm to anyone else. If it does, maybe you will begin to reflect on how you have judged the world, and maybe your empathy will develop then.

Nice post dude saying I live with my mom? I lack empathy for parents that leave their kids in the car and kid dies. My wife and I are very serious about our children being in the car, especially living in Texas.

Fuck you.

 

[Skellig Gra]

I'm a dad and I'm terrified it could happen to me, especially in the morning when I'm running around and stressed and sleep-deprived on top of everything. I have nothing but empathy for these parents.

Yeah as I had mentioned earlier in the thread, I use Waze to go everywhere in the car now even if I know where I'm going because it has the child reminder function. It visually and audibly asks you if you have your kid when the route ends.

 

[Lanrutcon]

It's pointless burning the parents at the stake.

If they've got any kind of conscience they'll be wearing this for the rest of their lives.

 

[Shao Kahn on the Lawn]

Man, I don't understand, these are your children. No excuses, I don't feel any sympathy for parents that leave their children in hot cars. Zero. No one here should either.

We're aware.

The impolite take on this is that it doesn't matter if it's your children or anything else. The mechanisms that assign prioritization to memories are demonstrably imperfect and are subconscious. If you can forget one thing, you can forget anything. Your brain is not a computer.

 

[Donos]

Emotional topic but stay classy people.

 

[InsaneTiger]

We're aware.

The impolite take on this is that it doesn't matter if it's your children or anything else. The mechanisms that assign prioritization to memories are demonstrably imperfect and are subconscious. If you can forget one thing, you can forget anything. Your brain is not a computer.

Ok

 

[DarkestHour]

That is not a fucking accident! SOOOOOOOO fucking tired of people using "accident" when something is pure fucking stupidity or negligence.

OMG CRASHED MY CAR IT WAS AN ACCIDENT!
OMG KILLED BABY IT WAS AN ACCIDENT!


Get a fucking clue you God damn pieces of shit.

 

[InsaneTiger]

That is not a fucking accident! SOOOOOOOO fucking tired of people using "accident" when something is pure fucking stupidity or negligence.

OMG CRASHED MY CAR IT WAS AN ACCIDENT!
OMG KILLED BABY IT WAS AN ACCIDENT!


Get a fucking clue you God damn pieces of shit.

Prepare to be told you live with your mom and lack empathy and are wrong.

 

[Zen Aku]

If you read this, then how can you possibly say it's a matter of intelligence? Why do you simply refuse to acknowledge your reaction is incorrect?

Its called an opinion.

It is great that it never happened to you (though you may want to ask sometime, even if you weren't left in a car thankfully, there could have been moments you never realized, even something like forgetting to be picked up from school or practice one day) and it's of course the case for a lot of people. That doesn't change the fact that it has happened. And that some of those cases were just accidents. And that some of those cases they happened to good, smart, caring and hard working parents who now have to live with the worst horror and guilt imaginable.

Never been forgotten to picked up from school or practice either. Late yeah sure. Not forgotten.

 

[Charles Brandon]

Of course it was an accident.

 

[darkistheway]

Nice post dude saying I live with my mom? I lack empathy for parents that leave their kids in the car and kid dies. My wife and I are very serious about our children being in the car, especially living in Texas.

Fuck you.

Your posts in this thread are just embarrassing. Seriously.

 

[Lanrutcon]

Your posts in this thread are just embarrassing. Seriously.

The man's a parent. The topic is stupidly sensitive and scary as hell. Can't blame him for an emotional response.

 

[Vixdean]

2 hours? Seems like a good way to get rid of a kid you don't want and blame it on "negligence". Better to be known as a moron than a child murderer.

 

[Draft]

I truly do not understand how anyone can read that Washing Post article without gaining enormous sympathy for parents that leave their children in hot cars.

No one plans on making mistakes or forgetting things, and most of us are lucky enough to have those mistakes be inconsequential.

 

[Vyer]

It happened to me, very luckily I was just running in to pick up a gift card from a local restaurant as a present for someone so it was less than 5 minutes. The problem was I was on a marathon work conference call remotely even before I left the house. I had my headset on while in the car, in the restaurant, and then back in the car. My son laughed and clapped his hands when I got back in the car. My heart sank so low when I realized what I had done.

ids.

Similar to what happened to my friend, though he realized as soon as he walked into the store. When he told me it suddenly went from 'I can't imagine someone could do that' to 'I know someone who did that'. And he is a hard working, doting father who spends most of his time tending to his daughter. He was pretty shaken up about it.


Personally the only experience I have was suddenly forgetting that my wife had taken my son from me to go to a different part of a Target after I'd been pushing him around in the cart while we were walking around together. I said okay, she took over the cart and went off with him while I went looking for something else we needed. A few minutes later I'm just hit with this horrible wave of panic. I just....forgot somehow. For a brief moment my mind skipped over the 'she took him' part and I thought I went from pushing my son around to walking through the aisles by myself. That momentary panic was one of the worst feelings I've ever experienced.

 

[reggieandTFE]

Parenting is exhausting and doubly so when you're dealing with full time work. Thankfully my little munchkin has the gift of gab and would never let us forget her!

 

[Glendemonium]

Accident my ass...

I know someone who's son did this years ago and is now serving time in jail for murder. Young guy, wanted to go to the gym and left the kid in the car, for four hours. I don't know what it is about Arizona parents but I've seen so much irresponsibility, with them I just want to lose it. Usually it's the really young parents (18-24) that don't know any better.

 

[darkistheway]

The man's a parent. The topic is stupidly sensitive and scary as hell. Can't blame him for an emotional response.

I can, actually. It's not his child that died. He has no right to judge. His words are despicable, along with everyone else talking the same way.

 

[Subpar Scrub]

Accident my ass...

Do you have proof?

Get a fucking clue you God damn pieces of shit.

Oh the irony.

 

[God Dayumm]

Don't drive if the car is making you put lives at risk. If these parents can't even be bothered to check the backseat, I wonder if they even look in the mirrors when backing up or changing lanes.

 

[Subpar Scrub]

Don't drive if the car is making you put lives at risk. If these parents can't even be bothered to check the backseat, I wonder if they even look in the mirrors when backing up or changing lanes.

Do you check the backseat every time you get out of your car?

 

[Glendemonium]

Do you have proof?

Yeah, it's called gross negligence son. There's also irresponsible, and making excuses, no amount of "Devil's Advocate" justifies it.

 

[Monocle]

Trying to say something?


Not all are selfish but some are, no excuses.


No excuses. This is a responsibility of the highest order. You may be tired, we are all tired; you may be stressed, we are all stressed. I can't believe there are people trying to make excuses for these parents.

Do you legitimately not understand the difference between an excuse and an explanation? You sound like one of those unfair parents who accuses a kid of "lying" when they accidentally said something untrue.

That is not a fucking accident! SOOOOOOOO fucking tired of people using "accident" when something is pure fucking stupidity or negligence.

OMG CRASHED MY CAR IT WAS AN ACCIDENT!
OMG KILLED BABY IT WAS AN ACCIDENT!


Get a fucking clue you God damn pieces of shit.

You're being irrational. Read that one article and face up to the fact that you're coming from a place of emotion rather than one informed by the reality of these tragedies. Ranting and raving will not change the fact that the human mind is fallible in many very well documented ways.

 

[Shao Kahn on the Lawn]

Yeah, it's called gross negligence son. There's also irresponsible, and making excuses, no amount of "Devil's Advocate" justifies it.

In this instance, science is the devil's advocate.

 

[Subpar Scrub]

Yeah, it's called gross negligence son. There's also irresponsible, and making excuses, no amount of "Devil's Advocate" justifies it.

Don't call me son, it's condescending.

Anyway, I'm not playing devil's advocate here. I'm playing science's advocate. Are you opposed to that?

Negligence generally relies on there being a duty of care, the duty of care being breached due wholly because of error or some level of contributory error on someone's part and there being damages as a result. Do the facts of the matter show negligence to have occurred? Sure. Is it then justifiable to punish these individuals for said negligence, even when there's strong scientific evidence suggesting otherwise and they have already paid an extremely high price? That's the real question.

I believe that prison should be rehabilitative, not punitive, and in the event that it's found that the death was entirely an accident, there's nothing that prison will do to help those poor parents. More likely that they'd need therapy than to be jailed.

Edit: I love how Monocle has spent the entire damned thread linking scientifically proven facts and distinguished articles, yet people still need to come in here and let loose with raw emotional reactions. It's so odd.

 

[Monocle]

A relevant highlight from the Washington Post article (which is essential reading for anyone who considers these accidents negligence):

“This is a case of pure evil negligence of the worse kind . . . He deserves the death sentence.”

“I wonder if this was his way of telling his wife that he didn’t really want a kid.”

“He was too busy chasing after real estate commissions. This shows how morally corrupt people in real estate-related professions are.”

These were readers’ online comments to The Washington Post news article of July 10, 2008, reporting the circumstances of the death of Miles Harrison’s son. These comments were typical of many others, and they are typical of what happens again and again, year after year in community after community, when these cases arise. A substantial proportion of the public reacts not merely with anger, but with frothing vitriol.

Ed Hickling believes he knows why. Hickling is a clinical psychologist from Albany, N.Y., who has studied the effects of fatal auto accidents on the drivers who survive them. He says these people are often judged with disproportionate harshness by the public, even when it was clearly an accident, and even when it was indisputably not their fault.

Humans, Hickling said, have a fundamental need to create and maintain a narrative for their lives in which the universe is not implacable and heartless, that terrible things do not happen at random, and that catastrophe can be avoided if you are vigilant and responsible.

In hyperthermia cases, he believes, the parents are demonized for much the same reasons. “We are vulnerable, but we don’t want to be reminded of that. We want to believe that the world is understandable and controllable and unthreatening, that if we follow the rules, we’ll be okay. So, when this kind of thing happens to other people, we need to put them in a different category from us. We don’t want to resemble them, and the fact that we might is too terrifying to deal with. So, they have to be monsters.”